Vanguard: Saga of Heroes also goes F2P

[Tpand]

http://massively.joystiq.com/2012/03/21/vanguard-going-free-to-play-this-summer-beefs-up-dev-team/2#comments

[Eldaran]

Vanguard is a great game and I'm glad it is going to finally get some content developed for it. If I didn't have Project 1999 I would most likely be there playing that game.

[FoxxHound]

OOOOOOOOOoooooooooooooooo

[Nedala]

Soo how good is vanguard? I heard it sucked at first but when it finally got decent the player base was gone.

Will this bring back a decent population? Is vanguard worth a try? Im bored of swtor and eq atm, need something new.

[Visual]

I couldn't believe how bad vanguard was. This after buying the collector's edition and frothing in anticipation for what must have been years.

In early beta, if you set the graphics to minimum on my computer, youd just see a floating head on all the characters.

[Xeliso]

Xeliso - Server first 50 monk, 5th world wide.

What up Vanguard.

Too bad the game was horribad and we sat all level 50 for a few months or more before APW opened.

[Messianic]

So wasn't Vanguard McQuaid's brainchild after he left EQ? Sorry, I'm really not that informed.

How good is Vanguard? Is it very similar to EQ? I remember reading someone explaining on these forums that it was released too early and the playerbase burned through the content in a week, so it got boring fast, but other than that it was a great start to a game...

[Huddaan]

It should have been eq 2, not that pile of garbage they have now.

[Nedala]

EQ2 endgame and pvp was damn awesome from DoF until sentinels fate.

[Duma]

So wasn't Vanguard McQuaid's brainchild after he left EQ? Sorry, I'm really not that informed.

How good is Vanguard? Is it very similar to EQ? I remember reading someone explaining on these forums that it was released too early and the playerbase burned through the content in a week, so it got boring fast, but other than that it was a great start to a game...

WoW fags complained that it took "too long" to level. They reduced XP required by a lot, nerfed most mobs, and made it generally more WoW-like. People burned through to level cap. Fags complained there was nothing to do. People left.

After they fixed most of the bugs, performance issues, and added 1 raid dungeon they essentially abandoned the game. Last time I played was right after the APW came out and there was a huge population surge but the game was just abandoned by Sony because they never had any intention of spending any real time on it after they picked it up from Brad.

[Duma]

Not expecting anything from the "F2P". It's Sony so they're gonna lock out all but a couple races and classes and make it so you can't use raid or dungeon gear unless you actually subscribe making it a waste of time to do anything without a sub anyway.

Oh yeah plus the troll flood all freeload games suffer from.

[stormlord]

I kept watch on Vanguard for a long long time.

There were moments I thought it would be -it-, but those were few.

My original thinking was to give it a year or two to see how it matured. That was good thinking. It didn't require much time for me to see that it was all predictable. Game companies all seem to follow the same rules. And the developers didn't have their heart in it. They didn't believe in what they were doing. Nor could I believe in something that they themselves didn't. So when the game fell in on itself, I was well ahead of it and didn't have to sink with it. I was already too well aware of how EQ1 and other games get old and sink.

I remember equipment expertise. I think that's the name of it. I liked the idea. So they removed it. I hate faceless NPCs in cities that sit like mannequins. So they kept it that way. I like progression and to see the many different places, old and new, in an organized way. So they speeded up leveling, built a new player island, and developed a golden path for players. I liked the different faces on players and the look of some of the armor. So they gutted the facial editor and "sexed" up the armors to show more skin. I liked the idea of wolves and horses to ride and birds to fly and all of this being balanced and tied into progression in some way. So they added Rudolph and ignored balance in favor of development speed. I like the idea of determining how I travel and being an intimate part of it. So they added a simplified riftway system and rentable mounts like it was a 24 hour service center and soulless. I don't like to grind too much and I like lots of content to make me feel like the sky is the limit and I don't want to sacrifice content for leveling speed. So they stopped making lots of content and just made these pocket expansions like Magi Hold and stepped all over everyone.

I could go on and on. Some things they did were good. But, overall, you can see the character of the things they did. Most of it was dirt cheap and insubstantial, and looks like it came from the bean counter or the devil. Well, frankly, it came from the company. This is what companies do when they get nervous about a game: they get cheap and lose all originality in the process. They forget how to take risks and all character is thrown out the window. They become slaves to themselves. They start copying others in a frenzy to escape it.

When will game companies remember PROGRESSION in older content? They always turn to the quick answers when they get nervous. The pocket content. Always a bandage fix. They just ignore all of the beautiful content they have that could really be something. They think like our disposable culture. Everything is just thrown away. Make it and just forget about it. The players won't care. You just gotta always give em a carrot and a nipple and let them suck like a heroin addict. See, if you play the cards right, you're just a drug dealer. You have your formula and if you stick to it then the players slurp it up. You're not an artist. Just a fancy kingpin drug lord.

I may try it sometime. But the past several years are still bitter. I never went to those forums and came away happy. It was always pathetic. I'm more likely to try something else that doesn't stir the emotions.

Overall, Sony reminds me too much of hollywood. It's too fake and gimmicky. But entertainment is a billion dollar industry. So I guess I shouldn't be petulant. But I can't help it if I feel this way.

I will add that Brad McQuaid said in a blog that most players left in the first few minutes, not even having leveled up to see the game. This hints that the game had a fundamental problem early on. He also thought that the map was too big and so on. But every developer is going to have reasons for their failures. I don't take it away from him because I know everyone would defend themselves. But getting it right the first time or sooner rather than later is what spells the difference between a game that does well and a game that doesn't. You don't have to be another WoW to compete, but you have to be able to juggle all of the demands and pressures with your passions. I also think that Brad isn't as good of a designer as people give him credit for.

My advice to developers is don't make content that you can't easily scale and/or update and balance. Save me from YOU. Be responsible and your players won't be bitches towards you. You'll be more satisfied.

[Swish]

My very narrow pool of knowledge on Vanguard consists of:-

It was going to be a great game that was tipped to outshine EQ2...then Sony got involved with the development and effectively shelved it so that EQ2 players would stay with EQ2.

Tr00fax? I'd give it a try sometime but nowhere near finished with P99 :D

[Nanolian]

Going to reactivate my account, been playing on my 2 week free. They fixed a lot of bugs I'm that game. I played back on release and it was horrid.

[Furniture]

I didnt even realize it was F2p, is it any good? hows the population? was thinking about trying it out

[Arclyte]

so is this game shit or what

[GenieHakeem]

I kept watch on Vanguard for a long long time.

There were moments I thought it would be -it-, but those were few.

My original thinking was to give it a year or two to see how it matured. That was good thinking. It didn't require much time for me to see that it was all predictable. Game companies all seem to follow the same rules. And the developers didn't have their heart in it. They didn't believe in what they were doing. Nor could I believe in something that they themselves didn't. So when the game fell in on itself, I was well ahead of it and didn't have to sink with it. I was already too well aware of how EQ1 and other games get old and sink.

I remember equipment expertise. I think that's the name of it. I liked the idea. So they removed it. I hate faceless NPCs in cities that sit like mannequins. So they kept it that way. I like progression and to see the many different places, old and new, in an organized way. So they speeded up leveling, built a new player island, and developed a golden path for players. I liked the different faces on players and the look of some of the armor. So they gutted the facial editor and "sexed" up the armors to show more skin. I liked the idea of wolves and horses to ride and birds to fly and all of this being balanced and tied into progression in some way. So they added Rudolph and ignored balance in favor of development speed. I like the idea of determining how I travel and being an intimate part of it. So they added a simplified riftway system and rentable mounts like it was a 24 hour service center and soulless. I don't like to grind too much and I like lots of content to make me feel like the sky is the limit and I don't want to sacrifice content for leveling speed. So they stopped making lots of content and just made these pocket expansions like Magi Hold and stepped all over everyone.

I could go on and on. Some things they did were good. But, overall, you can see the character of the things they did. Most of it was dirt cheap and insubstantial, and looks like it came from the bean counter or the devil. Well, frankly, it came from the company. This is what companies do when they get nervous about a game: they get cheap and lose all originality in the process. They forget how to take risks and all character is thrown out the window. They become slaves to themselves. They start copying others in a frenzy to escape it.

When will game companies remember PROGRESSION in older content? They always turn to the quick answers when they get nervous. The pocket content. Always a bandage fix. They just ignore all of the beautiful content they have that could really be something. They think like our disposable culture. Everything is just thrown away. Make it and just forget about it. The players won't care. You just gotta always give em a carrot and a nipple and let them suck like a heroin addict. See, if you play the cards right, you're just a drug dealer. You have your formula and if you stick to it then the players slurp it up. You're not an artist. Just a fancy kingpin drug lord.

I may try it sometime. But the past several years are still bitter. I never went to those forums and came away happy. It was always pathetic. I'm more likely to try something else that doesn't stir the emotions.

Overall, Sony reminds me too much of hollywood. It's too fake and gimmicky. But entertainment is a billion dollar industry. So I guess I shouldn't be petulant. But I can't help it if I feel this way.

I will add that Brad McQuaid said in a blog that most players left in the first few minutes, not even having leveled up to see the game. This hints that the game had a fundamental problem early on. He also thought that the map was too big and so on. But every developer is going to have reasons for their failures. I don't take it away from him because I know everyone would defend themselves. But getting it right the first time or sooner rather than later is what spells the difference between a game that does well and a game that doesn't. You don't have to be another WoW to compete, but you have to be able to juggle all of the demands and pressures with your passions. I also think that Brad isn't as good of a designer as people give him credit for.

My advice to developers is don't make content that you can't easily scale and/or update and balance. Save me from YOU. Be responsible and your players won't be bitches towards you. You'll be more satisfied.

+1
I played this and had an alt or two, was wickedly easy. A lot like EQ live was when I left. There was some nice story in it, when you visited villages and things like that, way from the main road. As is stated here, they started cutting lines and throwing in things like raid and little pockets of shit, soon the piles grew and the smell got unbearable.

[Smyd]

Vanguard = Best game i've ever played.
Played from about beta 2 till just after the level cap got increased to 55 with SoD, BoD etc.

Just burnt out on mmo's tbh.
The peeps complaining about it's performance currently or at release are probably poor and cannot afford a decent pc.

Kiss the poor
Kiss you all
Smyd

[Reiker000]

Vanguard was the greatest awful game ever made.