MOTD: Consider rolling red

[jbs89]

Should be a MOTD about rolling Red. I quit Blue when I heard Red was coming. The most complex combat is done by players and their abilities. to actually use your skills in PvP is epic. You'll see your character totally differently than just as a raider. So consider a new class/race to start that won't be ruined by twinking.

If you've ever tried WoW you'd know how amazing raid abilities make for amazing pvp

[loserofgame]

Should be a MOTD about rolling Red. I quit Blue when I heard Red was coming. The most complex combat is done by players and their abilities. to actually use your skills in PvP is epic. You'll see your character totally differently than just as a raider. So consider a new class/race to start that won't be ruined by twinking.

If you've ever tried WoW you'd know how amazing raid abilities make for amazing pvp

From a fellow Red player:

No. This type of thread, and advertisement, is just troll bait. People on Blue who wished to play on Red will already have done so.

Out of courtesy to Blue players, please don't make threads like this here.

[Xanthias]

No. This type of thread, and advertisement, is just troll bait. People on Blue who wished to play on Red will already have done so.

Out of courtesy to Blue players, please don't make threads like this here.

[Jimes]

reds ran out of people to grief off the server it seems

[Swish]

Totally not through this but I did make a character on red in the last hour :D

What are the better classes to go for? It's not swimming with rogues like I thought it would be on a "/who all rogue count". XP seems quicker and that's definitely a bonus.

Any general tips?

[Faywind]

Should be a MOTD about rolling Red. I quit Blue when I heard Red was coming. The most complex combat is done by players and their abilities. to actually use your skills in PvP is epic. You'll see your character totally differently than just as a raider. So consider a new class/race to start that won't be ruined by twinking.

If you've ever tried WoW you'd know how amazing raid abilities make for amazing pvp

I don't think a server with 100 max players at peak times is going to attract anyone. And if it does, you reds will just grief them off the server and say "You Mad?".

[Scavrefamn]

If you've ever tried WoW you'd know how amazing raid abilities make for amazing pvp

WoW sucked, why would you even reference it here?


EQ pvp is pretty hardcore though... survival of the fittest and all of that.

[Destan]

Recently joined, started my first character on p99 Red with a buddy. After two days of not seeing another human being we decided it wasn't worth it. If I wanted a two-player emu with nothing but empty zones I'd have started one myself...

[jbs89]

Because your raid abilities in WoW also made amazing pvp. Do all Blue players ALREADY know this and have abandoned Red? I dunno

As for it being empty, it is while your lower level but once you really need groups (30) there are plenty of Guilds. Much closer community not just randoms logging on and over camping. If its not your raid night try playing a Red alt.

[Kika Maslyaka]

MOTD for the RED server: Your server suck. Consider rolling BLUE :D

[sbvera13]

From a fellow Red player:

No. This type of thread, and advertisement, is just troll bait. People on Blue who wished to play on Red will already have done so.

Out of courtesy to Blue players, please don't make threads like this here.
^

this are sense making

reds ran out of people to grief off the server it seems
^

this are what every blue player sees whenever red is mentioned in any fashion. You may as well give up, our decision was made long ago and won't change because you whine a little.

[Stealin Dragons]

WoW pvp is leaps and bounds ahead of EQ pvp. (even in WoW's current state)

EQ pvp is blue with the added benefit of being randomly griefed by strangers.

EQ pvp = who has the most friends online at any given time

WoW pvp = If I know wtf I'm doing I can kill 10+ people.

[kazroth]

this are what every blue player sees whenever red is mentioned in any fashion. You may as well give up, our decision was made long ago and won't change because you whine a little.

You'd be surprised how one person with some sense, reason, and ethics can alter the viewpoint of all those around them. People are generally good, they just need to be reminded sometimes - especially when they go into 'mob mentality mode'.

With that in mind, I think I'll be creating a character on the red server in order to bring some harmony to an otherwise barren landscape.

This post has been the cause of that, thank you OP.

The rest of you, take it for what you will! ;)

[kazroth]

WoW pvp is leaps and bounds ahead of EQ pvp. (even in WoW's current state) - even though you need to join a predefined arena or BG to find it.

EQ pvp is blue with the added benefit of being randomly griefed by strangers, which is honestly why WoW pvp sucks these days. There's no element of danger in the open world, because no one really cares about it (there are no rewards)

EQ pvp = who has the most friends online at any given time, which promotes teamwork and a sense of shared responsibility among the community.

WoW pvp = If I know wtf I'm doing I can kill 10+ people, because they're wearing PvE gear in a BG... they're really just here for the points - most of them are probably AFK, anyway.

Fixed that for you! :p

[Stealin Dragons]

Fixed that for you! :p

hey, remind me how much fun you have while getting chain CC'd as a melee.

EQ pvp is so much fun.

[Messianic]

Join the pvp zerg guilds or get griefed off the server by former vztz malcontents, it's more fun than blue

reds ran out of people to grief off the server it seems

WoW pvp = If I know wtf I'm doing I can kill 10+ people.

[druidWTT]

bakers be posting in a roll thread

[Danyelle]

EQ PvP is, quite literally, not a contest of skill but rather a contest of who can be the biggest douchebag and closely replicate the attitude of a 3-5 year old.

Facts. Let the hate bashing and "fix'd that for you" commence.

[Messianic]

EQ PvP is, quite literally, not a contest of skill but rather a contest of who can be the biggest douchebag and closely replicate the attitude of a 3-5 year old.

Doesn't need fixing

[kazroth]

hey, remind me how much fun you have while getting chain CC'd as a melee.

EQ pvp is so much fun.

I'm not saying EQ PvP is any better - it all has its problems, but your WoW rose-colored glasses don't really help...

And getting chain CC'd as melee is standard in WoW, as well.

[kazroth]

EQ PvP is, quite literally, not a contest of skill but rather a contest of who can be the biggest douchebag and closely replicate the attitude of a 3-5 year old.

Facts. Let the hate bashing and "fix'd that for you" commence.

I'm not going to fix your post for you, as you didn't really explain anything. You simply stated it as a fact. Do you have any anecdotal evidence to prove your point?

[Messianic]

I'm not saying EQ PvP is any better - it all has its problems, but your WoW rose-colored glasses don't really help...

And getting chain CC'd as melee is standard in WoW, as well.

Getting ramrodded by some melee in near-perfect gear after attempting to CC him repeatedly to survive is pretty standard too...

[kazroth]

Getting ramrodded by some melee in near-perfect gear after attempting to CC him repeatedly to survive is pretty standard too...

So if gear is the answer here, what does the melee player do when the caster has near-perfect gear as well?

And only Blizz knows what PvP is gonna be like when they drop resilience and pen in the next xpac.

[Stealin Dragons]

I'm not saying EQ PvP is any better - it all has its problems, but your WoW rose-colored glasses don't really help...

And getting chain CC'd as melee is standard in WoW, as well.

Everyone get's chained CC'd in WoW, not just melee.

The difference between WoW and EQ is, In WoW the Melee can get out and kill someone. in EQ, 1 druid can fuck multiple melee without a problem.

[Kope]

So if gear is the answer here, what does the melee player do when the caster has near-perfect gear as well?

Kill him in 2 shots with a huge delay high dmg bonus weapon (like that 50/150 axe).

EQ PVP is all about jousting as melee.

[Messianic]

So if gear is the answer here, what does the melee player do when the caster has near-perfect gear as well?

I haven't played in the Cata era, but itemization for melee was almost always superior in BC (That brief period where you could pop a crapton of charms and boost spell power so high you'd 1-shot people from afar was somewhat of an exception) and still mostly in WotLK - so mostly the melee won when gear levels were both equally high.

I played a Paladin when they initially made them Gods before somewhat nerfing their ret abilities...

But EQ PvP simply has massive engineering problems and imbalances that require you to zerg. Maybe that's part of the magic for you - but to me it's a massive incentive for griefing. WoW's system of instancing and selfish gains kept people apart and basically disorganized. EQ creates gang warfare.

[Danyelle]

I'm not going to fix your post for you, as you didn't really explain anything. You simply stated it as a fact. Do you have any anecdotal evidence to prove your point?

Allow me to explain then.

EQ PvP literally consists of people who do shit like this:

"Hmmm I'm level 60 and this guy is level 20. He provides absolutely no challenge to me. I don't know him. Never met him. Not even in a rival guild. Fuck this I wanna kill him. Oh he's coming back to the camp to loot corpse? Not even saying a word? Hahah fuck that I'm gonna sit here and kil lhim every time he comes back."

Or

"Just another bored day being a top raid geared 70..Think I'm gonna go to Crushbone and use my pet to one shot every level 10 player there over and over until they either rage quit or, if they even have one, log on their mains and start shit with me."

Or any other variation of "how much of an asshat can I make myself look like today?"

Now you tell me how the above isn't being a total douchebag or show that the player has the attitude and mindset of a 5 year old, and tell me how any of the above provides that player with a challenge.

EQ PvP would be fun if people conducted themselves maturely and like adults and actually fought for the sake of challenge or even for something like a guild rivalry (Akin to using the Arena in Blue EQ) but they don't. Instead you get 85-90% if not more of the playerbase that acts like the above examples.

Inb4 "lol he mad" because that just proves my point.

[kazroth]

EQ creates gang warfare.

MAN! That's what was epic about PvP back in WoW Vanilla! Open world PvP!! Sometimes we'd fight for hours on an open plain out in Hammerfall or something, constantly jumping back into the fray after a ghost run. Eventually someone would be pushed off the field.

I remember piling our guild into that barn just outside Darkshire and killing everything that moved, until the Alliance got wind of it and slowly started to call in reinforcements.

You don't get that anymore... you get the click on queue button, then the pop, then the grind for the pixels.

I don't know, man. To me, it's not EQ itself that fucks up PvP, it's the community. You can either be good sports about it, or just degenerate into 'gang warfare' as you call it.

[Messianic]

A lot of those things apply to WoW PvP as well - again, eq pvp is more about gang warfare than it is individual acts of douchebaggery.

[Messianic]

MAN! That's what was epic about PvP back in WoW Vanilla! Open world PvP!! Sometimes we'd fight for hours on an open plain out in Hammerfall or something, constantly jumping back into the fray after a ghost run. Eventually someone would be pushed off the field.

I remember piling our guild into that barn just outside Darkshire and killing everything that moved, until the Alliance got wind of it and slowly started to call in reinforcements.

You don't get that anymore... you get the click on queue button, then the pop, then the grind for the pixels.

I don't know, man. To me, it's not EQ itself that fucks up PvP, it's the community. You can either be good sports about it, or just degenerate into 'gang warfare' as you call it.

Tarren Mill/Southshore (or similar) wasn't gang warfare. It was more akin to trench or pure open warfare - and yes, the Southshore/Tarren Mill battles were truly freaking epic. I really miss those battles.

Gang warfare is a group of 6 max-level people rolling around griefing everyone they find.

[kazroth]

Allow me to explain then.

EQ PvP literally consists of people who do shit like this:

"Hmmm I'm level 60 and this guy is level 20. He provides absolutely no challenge to me. I don't know him. Never met him. Not even in a rival guild. Fuck this I wanna kill him. Oh he's coming back to the camp to loot corpse? Not even saying a word? Hahah fuck that I'm gonna sit here and kil lhim every time he comes back."

Or

"Just another bored day being a top raid geared 70..Think I'm gonna go to Crushbone and use my pet to one shot every level 10 player there over and over until they either rage quit or, if they even have one, log on their mains and start shit with me."

Or any other variation of "how much of an asshat can I make myself look like today?"

Now you tell me how the above isn't being a total douchebag or show that the player has the attitude and mindset of a 5 year old, and tell me how any of the above provides that player with a challenge.

EQ PvP would be fun if people conducted themselves maturely and like adults and actually fought for the sake of challenge or even for something like a guild rivalry (Akin to using the Arena in Blue EQ) but they don't. Instead you get 85-90% if not more of the playerbase that acts like the above examples.

Inb4 "lol he mad" because that just proves my point.
I challenge you to insert 'WoW PvP on a red server' wherever you typed EQ PvP, and come up with any differences between the game or some members of the community.

The cool thing about that is when the little guy is getting camped and calls in his guild for reinforcements, then a real zone war starts happening, then even more guilds get called in. After an hour or two, you have all the large PvP'ing guilds on the server fighting over a zone because that little dude was getting camped.

I don't see how there is a difference.

[kazroth]

Gang warfare is a group of 6 max-level people rolling around griefing everyone they find.

Again, how is this any different from what happens/ed in WoW?

[kazroth]

Removing the PvP from the world and putting it in its own little box helps alleviate the little man's problem, but you immediately destroy any sense of community when you do so.

I prefer the community and to deal with gang warfare than to click on 'queue' so I can face the next team with zero social commitment.

EDIT: Read Envino's latest post as to how I belong to a dying breed, however.

[Danyelle]

I challenge you to insert 'WoW PvP on a red server' wherever you typed EQ PvP, and come up with any differences between the game or some members of the community.

The cool thing about that is when the little guy is getting camped and calls in his guild for reinforcements, then a real zone war starts happening, then even more guilds get called in. After an hour or two, you have all the large PvP'ing guilds on the server fighting over a zone because that little dude was getting camped.

I don't see how there is a difference.

Granted, I'm sure it'd be the same and I never really implied there was a difference. In case you got me mixed up with someone, I'm not one of the people defending WoW PvP in this thread. Though that point is moot at any rate. Just because you see the other kids on the playground punching the nerd in the back of the head does that mean you should too?

[Swish]

WoW PvP was great, particularly Warsong Gulch. Having alliance scum log over just to tell me that shamans are OP, I shouldn't be able to run a WSG flag in ghost wolf because paladins don't have anything similar... used to love all that ;)

P99 Red is always going to attract criticism from Blue players, and Red players are always going to be on the defensive about their server because if we're honest it has yet to be a true success. Who do you blame for that?

I have yet to experience it but if I was corpse camped I wouldn't last long on Red, therefore maybe it isn't for me...if they can knock 10 new players off the server a week with that behaviour I really do hope they aren't among the protesters if, in the future, Rogean decides he's got other plans for the server due to a low population. The number online is enough of a bad advertisement, I hope the Red community can encourage new players to join, stay and even enjoy the server <3

[kazroth]

Granted, I'm sure it'd be the same and I never really implied there was a difference. In case you got me mixed up with someone, I'm not one of the people defending WoW PvP in this thread. Though that point is moot at any rate. Just because you see the other kids on the playground punching the nerd in the back of the head does that mean you should too?

Then why are you coming in here and hating on one side of the argument when your opinions apply to both? Meanie! :p

[Stealin Dragons]

you'd prefer to shit on the little guys and hope they have friends to call in. Gotcha


Even tho, that supposedly "helps the community" even tho if the "little guy" has no friends to call in he just quits. I guess it's all perspective.

[Messianic]

Again, how is this any different from what happens/ed in WoW?

This didn't happen even in vanilla - i'd get ganked or corpse camped often even in vanilla, but it was usually individuals or there just happened to be 2 alliance in the same place I was trying to level.

It seems like EQ PvP is just far more geared for this because many classes simply cannot hold their own in pvp - so it creates worse individual ganking and gang warfare ganking.

Maybe that's preferable - I haven't argued that, I just find it more douchey to corpse camp someone just because you and your friend = 2 and he = 1. It was far more frequent to 1v1 in world pvp on WoW *in my experience*.

[kazroth]

you'd prefer to shit on the little guys and hope they have friends to call in. Gotcha


Even tho, that supposedly "helps the community" even tho if the "little guy" has no friends to call in he just quits. I guess it's all perspective.

Whoa, whoa... I never shit on the little guy. I preach for fair play and sportsmanlike conduct.

I'm saying when the little guy does get shit on, if he is part of the community, he can do something about it. That's team building at its finest. And community is what truly makes an MMO great.

[kazroth]

This didn't happen even in vanilla - i'd get ganked or corpse camped often even in vanilla, but it was usually individuals or there just happened to be 2 alliance in the same place I was trying to level.

So the same thing happened to you in WoW that happens in EQ, but you enjoyed it more?

I dunno man, I'm not really sure what your argument is here. Getting ganked is getting ganked, no matter the numbers.

[Stealin Dragons]

Whoa, whoa... I never shit on the little guy. I preach for fair play and sportsmanlike conduct.

I'm saying when the little guy does get shit on, if he is part of the community, he can do something about it. That's team building at its finest. And community is what truly makes an MMO great.

you have no world /ooc tho.

The little guy gets shit on, has no way to communicate with anyone and then leaves.

I bet most of them get grief'd off the server and never even speak up about it.

The "community" on red = a BroBox.

[kazroth]

you have no world /ooc tho.

You didn't have this in WoW, either. You'd tell your guild, who'd whisper a friend in another guild, who'd tell his guild, who'd tell another guild. It was a community then, it can be a community here, too.

[Messianic]

So the same thing happened to you in WoW that happens in EQ, but you enjoyed it more?

I dunno man, I'm not really sure what your argument is here. Getting ganked is getting ganked, no matter the numbers.

It's entirely an opinion thing - but my argument is that eq pvp is more conducive to creating douchebaggery.

Think of it this way - if you lose a fight in EQ PvP, the time loss is fairly substantial - so you have higher incentive to find protection from ganking, i.e. running with a consistent group or gang warfare. Likewise, you know that ganking or griefing others is a substantial loss for them, and corpse retrieval is equally as difficult, so the incentive is higher for jerks to corpse camp because they know it causes even more "pain" (loosely speaking).

Similarly, the incentive to be prepared for pvp constantly is much higher. You can't just log in and do something, you have to log in and be connected to a guild for your very survival - again, totally an opinion thing, but I find this detrimental in pvp, beneficial in pve, which is why I also agree with the post by envino in the other thread - just not for the pride-fest that pvp always is.

So if you're in the king of the hill guild and someone griefs you even once, you can grief their asses right off the server. You actually have the power to systematically destroy someone else's playtime. So those who actually do not have or choose to ignore the natural "do unto others" mentality tend to rise to the top - those who don't give a crap about anything except winning.

In WoW it was much harder to corpse camp to any real avail, and deaths didn't mean that much. So ganking someone was no big deal, kind of like getting hit by a bicycle as opposed to a truck.

So in one sense, there's less at stake in WoW PvP. You get beaten, no biggie. Doesn't take up too much of your time once you lose and you're back in the action.

It's the same principle behind why hardcore/permadeath is kind of a silly concept for a pvp mmo. Too much at stake.

[kazroth]

Ok, I can definitely get on board with you there. It does appear that tribal warfare has broken out on the red side. I'm not going to say anarchy, because it appears that there is a definite 'system' in place. I love bein an underdog who comes out victorious, we shall see what happens :D

[Stealin Dragons]

You didn't have this in WoW, either. You'd tell your guild, who'd whisper a friend in another guild, who'd tell his guild, who'd tell another guild. It was a community then, it can be a community here, too.

WoW had more than 100 people online at all times too.

[fischsemmel]

You didn't have this in WoW, either. You'd tell your guild, who'd whisper a friend in another guild, who'd tell his guild, who'd tell another guild. It was a community then, it can be a community here, too.

WoW world PvP.

Lol.

[Safon]

Red99 has failed as expected, please don't try to leech from Blue's population to keep Red afloat.

[Humerox]

Several things have changed over the past couple of months.

1) The griefers ran out of people to grief, so they left. There are a few random griefers left, but it's not the crapfest it was at server up.

2) Exploits are fixed. No rechargeable wands, etc. Level exploits have been taken out.

3) There wouldn't be just 100ish people...which is probably closer to 150 really but w/e...if everyone on the fence tested it out.

4) The new XP rate is awesome. Guard /assist has been fixed, so you won't get ganked at the bank anymore.

If peeps can think of more feel free to add to...

A lot of people quit blue too...and still lurk. Bringing people to a higher quality red that they'd rather play instead of not having a chance at all unless they're in the big 2 or 3 on blue isn't leaching. Yes Nihilum has the upper hand atm, but things will change, they always do. Besides, Hate is soon and Nihi can't be in Hate and Fear at the same time. There's not a huge difference in the gear if skilled people are playing.

[kazroth]

So guys, what's a good class for red 99? Just starting up, no gear, nothing. I need a solid class that can hold its own out there in this dog eat dog world - without any backup. Any advice?

[Tasslehofp99]

How about all of the WoW players just leave p99 red/blue and go back to WoW. That would make things lots better.

[kazroth]

So guys, what's a good class for red 99? Just starting up, no gear, nothing. I need a solid class that can hold its own out there in this dog eat dog world - without any backup. Any advice?

Still deciding on class, no advice out there? I hear the server has a ton of Druids already.

[Ssleeve]

Still deciding on class, no advice out there? I hear the server has a ton of Druids already.

Putting a little video together to try and attract some p99 blues over.

Should be done in about 2-3days depending on how much content I wanna put in it.

[kazroth]

Sounds good man, but I'm trying to make a character right now, lol - literally at character select screen.

[Ssleeve]

Sounds good man, but I'm trying to make a character right now, lol - literally at character select screen.

Depends... do you have friends? Do you have alot of pvp experience? Do you play casually or "hardcore" (i.e. daily)

If you respond quickly I have an answer for you.

[kazroth]

I have no friends on this server. (was thinking shaman or druid for that reason)

I have very little high level experience with pvp on EQ - spent most of my time in the 20s on a paladin 12 years ago.. =/

I play daily, for the most part, a couple hours here and there.

[Angkar]

Sounds good man, but I'm trying to make a character right now, lol - literally at character select screen.

There are not that many mages, necros, enchanters, or shm... That I see anyway.

Basically you cant play a melee, play anything that can solo. Besides a druid, like half the server is a druid.

[Angkar]

Also not sure why there is so much R99 hate.

PvP makes the gear you farm worth having. Otherwise, its all scripted gear progression.

Big +++++, no variable timers... so mobs spawn on the $$$$.

[Angkar]

I've seen the end game on this server. To be honest putting my dick into a meat grinder is more fun than competing for raid targets here.

Sounds like you need to come to R99 pal.

[kazroth]

Aight! Kazroth - Ogre Shaman - is up and running on red 99 - bring on dem ganks!

[kazroth]

good for u pal

ill be loookin for u in da ferrot and hook u up wit some plats

Sounds good, brudda!

I logged for now, will be on late tomorrow night.

[Razdeline]

If I wanted to play on red, I would have. But due to the infestation of douchebaggery and scumbags I wont.

[jbs89]

Y'all talk too much. Just play Red lol!!

[Messianic]

Several things have changed over the past couple of months.

1) The griefers ran out of people to grief, so they left. There are a few random griefers left, but it's not the crapfest it was at server up.

2) Exploits are fixed. No rechargeable wands, etc. Level exploits have been taken out.

3) There wouldn't be just 100ish people...which is probably closer to 150 really but w/e...if everyone on the fence tested it out.

4) The new XP rate is awesome. Guard /assist has been fixed, so you won't get ganked at the bank anymore.

Interesting. This post just might convince me to play on red at least a little. I tried to play red back when it was only a month or so old and it seemed like just what I expected.

How do monks/rogues/rangers fare in pvp? I have very little eq pvp experience.

[Destan]

Also not sure why there is so much R99 hate.

PvP makes the gear you farm worth having. Otherwise, its all scripted gear progression.

Big +++++, no variable timers... so mobs spawn on the $$$$.


I think it's split between some people who had some bad experiences with a selection of players there (I didn't, but I see a lot of references to "douchebaggery") and those that just find it uninviting in-general. I like the idea of the red server, and would enjoy playing there if it actually had any community at low levels. However, at the moment it's more like a small lan-party. Start a toon in Greater Faydark on p99 blue at 10am and you'll have 27 people, 25 of them in your groupable range (was the case yesterday). Go to red, and it's you and the buddy you brought with you for three days straight (my first three days there).

What red needs is some super helpful high-levels butt kissing the new recruits to keep them, a huge influx of alts, or to raid EQ Live's Zek server and just mass advertise.

And I'm aware nobody high-level on that server feels it's warranted to kiss up to new players. But when you are a fledgling guild looking for a player base, you go above and beyond to fill ranks because it's a neccessity, not because you need or want to. And with that every-time-I-check-sub-100 population, it's got that small guild feel to it.

[Hitchens]

The red forums are pretty entertaining to read while bored at work, but I don't see myself playing there.

Sort of like how car crashes are really neat in movies, but not so much fun to experience first hand.

[Angkar]

I think it's split between some people who had some bad experiences with a selection of players there (I didn't, but I see a lot of references to "douchebaggery") and those that just find it uninviting in-general. I like the idea of the red server, and would enjoy playing there if it actually had any community at low levels. However, at the moment it's more like a small lan-party. Start a toon in Greater Faydark on p99 blue at 10am and you'll have 27 people, 25 of them in your groupable range (was the case yesterday). Go to red, and it's you and the buddy you brought with you for three days straight (my first three days there).

What red needs is some super helpful high-levels butt kissing the new recruits to keep them, a huge influx of alts, or to raid EQ Live's Zek server and just mass advertise.

And I'm aware nobody high-level on that server feels it's warranted to kiss up to new players. But when you are a fledgling guild looking for a player base, you go above and beyond to fill ranks because it's a neccessity, not because you need or want to. And with that every-time-I-check-sub-100 population, it's got that small guild feel to it.

If you post on the forums, you will usually get 3-5 that not only say they will help you get some levels / plat / gear, but that will show up and do it. So we do help the lower level guys.

The real key to R99 is being able to socialize. If your someone that has serious social anxiety, and need all 27 of those people in Gfay to find 1 to talk to, then your going to have a hard time. But, there are guilds with a ton of lower lvl guys, you just have to put in enough effort to find them, then find people that play when you do, and start leveling.

I started on R99 with 2 friends from P99, met a ton of people, joined a guild, and have no issues at all. Just dont be shy. Even us "shitheads" in Holocaust will help out a newbie. Well, some of us. Lol

[Humerox]

Interesting. This post just might convince me to play on red at least a little. I tried to play red back when it was only a month or so old and it seemed like just what I expected.

How do monks/rogues/rangers fare in pvp? I have very little eq pvp experience.

The best advice I can give is that if you decide to test the waters as a melee bring a friend to play a healing class with you...and play a monk. Do not come to red as a solo melee and expect to make it. Most players on red are 50 now, and there are a couple guilds with a good 30ish element, but there are no lowbie guilds anymore. Brotherhood takes low people, but most of the lowbie toons in the guild are alts.

Monks are much less gear dependent, and gear on red is HARD to come by unless you camp it or continuously check the forums. They are also godly in PvP at high level and geared...especially once Kunark rolls out. You can make a good amount of cash early at a couple camps, but both are mid-teen and you're going to be a cloth-wearing superman until then.

If you go solo...and this is going to sound crazy...but it's true. There is a high demand for MAGES in guilds. Wizzies, druids and shammies are all over the place. I don't see many necros either, tbh...but guilds want mages pretty badly.

[Lazortag]

A lot of guilds on red want melee dps too though, especially for Sky where you won't have charmed pets.

[Angkar]

Just remember, if you do start on R99. Bring friends, or post on the PvP forums your starting, and I am certain someone will either toss you some items or PL you a bit to get you into group range.

And dont be shy. We are all shitheads, but we are nice... until you hit 42 and join Nihilum.

[fahlen]

And only Blizz knows what PvP is gonna be like when they drop resilience and pen in the next xpac.


They're dropping resil next expansion? Best news I've heard from that game in a long time if its true.

[mwatt]

To the OP:

The "added complexity" of PVP in EQ does not enhance the game, it alters it radically -and not in a good way if Fantasy MMORPG is what turns your gears. When you must engage another player, the entirety of what EQ is, aside from your class attributes, falls to the way side. You might as well be playing a shitty version of Quake.

The fact that on someone else's whim, you must instantly play an entirely different game, makes acheiving many PVE goals difficult and annoying. If one enjoys PVE more than PVP, why would one want to allow that to be forcibly halted for PVP?

If one enjoys PVP more than PVE, why would one want to play EQ for their PVP experience? There are other, better suited, more popular games for PVP.

If one is in the middle, and enjoys both PVE and PVP, why would one wish to experience a compromised version of either type of play?

If PVP were electable, that would be better. But wait... it IS electable on the blue server. Funny, hardly anyone ever does. I dont' see many red names and I dont see many players in PVP areas on the blue server. I didn't see many before there was a red server either. To me these facts just reinforce my assertion thats that most people either lean one way of the other, and those that don't experience two "half loaves" from one game, instead of playing two different games and getting the "full loaf" from each.

[Haul]

Recently joined, started my first character on p99 Red with a buddy. After two days of not seeing another human being we decided it wasn't worth it. If I wanted a two-player emu with nothing but empty zones I'd have started one myself...

+1

[Humerox]

To the OP:

The "added complexity" of PVP in EQ does not enhance the game, it alters it radically -and not in a good way if Fantasy MMORPG is what turns your gears. When you must engage another player, the entirety of what EQ is, aside from your class attributes, falls to the way side. You might as well be playing a shitty version of Quake.

That's cool, but it's an opinion...and those of us who enjoy EQ PvP are at the other end of the spectrum. Not all of us are knuckle-dragging buffoons, either.

The fact that on someone else's whim, you must instantly play an entirely different game, makes acheiving many PVE goals difficult and annoying. If one enjoys PVE more than PVP, why would one want to allow that to be forcibly halted for PVP?

That's what makes the PvE goals so much more rewarding. It's not a crime to enjoy both PvE AND PvP...I know I do. There's little in the way of strategy when it comes to EQ PvE...I mean, what don't you already know? Throw in the human element and it's a whole different story.

If one enjoys PVP more than PVE, why would one want to play EQ for their PVP experience? There are other, better suited, more popular games for PVP.

And none of them are EQ. We're all here because we enjoy the game...we on red are reaching out again because a lot of the red act has been cleaned up thanks to the hard work of the server guides and devs...we're simply asking those that may have an interest in a clean red experience to try it again.

If one is in the middle, and enjoys both PVE and PVP, why would one wish to experience a compromised version of either type of play?

Blue PvE is already compromised. A crapload of content is denied to the average player on blue...most blue players will never see VP. A much larger percentage of red players will see much more content, especially when the content can be directly contested. No squabbling, no poopsocking, and no batphones. We KNOW when the content is up, and it takes both skill and strategy to win in group PvP (and - btw - THAT is where EQ PvP shines. In solo EQ PvP is imbalanced and impracticable. Group PvP is the sweet cherry in EQ.)

If PVP were electable, that would be better. But wait... it IS electable on the blue server. Funny, hardly anyone ever does. I dont' see many red names and I dont see many players in PVP areas on the blue server. I didn't see many before there was a red server either. To me these facts just reinforce my assertion thats that most people either lean one way of the other, and those that don't experience two "half loaves" from one game, instead of playing two different games and getting the "full loaf" from each.

Servers were dedicated to PvP in original EQ because there was a market for it, and they did quite well. Rallos, Tallon, Vallon, and Sullon all did well until general interest in EQ itself waned.

You do get the "full loaf" of PvE on red. You just have to fight for it, and everything gained is a battle...not a 12-year old strategy that anyone can look up on the web. The dynamics of PvE are completely altered, and in such a way that gaining that Cloak of Flames (for example) means so much more than it ever could on a PvE server.

There were lots of people that sampled red and had problems with it. A lot of those problems have been fixed...we're just asking that if you thought you might like it and tried it...try it again. The best argument I can give is a direct quote from one of your fellow blues, in a completely unrelated thread.

As a fan of The Big Bang Theory, I found the episode where Penny got addicted to Age of Conan to be especially insightful. Particularly this line:

Leonard: Well, i-i-i-it’s just if a person doesn’t have a sense of achievement in their real life it’s easy to lose themselves in a virtual world where they get a false sense of accomplishment.

It's not hard to see the sad state of surrogate accomplishment for P1999 players -- look no further than the wiki to find that people on this server tout "server firsts" for nearly everything as if it were an accomplishment. Since experience in this game is acquired by mindlessly pushing the same buttons over and over then levels are essentially the sum of committing a lot of time and surviving long hours of boredom (often by creating drama). Epics have a step by step guide with strategies attached - how is acquiring one an accomplishment? It doesn't require thought - just time, luck, and following instructions. In many cases it also involves sucking up to a guild leader and doing the bitch work for them like tracking mobs (again, only a time investment, no skill involved in hitting the track button). Then the people willing to wake up at 5am before work (if they even work) in order to kill a raid boss is damn near the pinnacle of patheticism. In truth, however, the sadness peaks when you see members of high-end guilds sit AFK in EC thinking everybody will see his 1337 gear and think he is awesome. It's really sad...

The drama and problems on this server is because most of the server is full of these hardcores who, after returning to a 13 year old emulated MMORPG, have no other means of obtaining a sense of accomplishment but "winning" at pixels here. On P1999, winning is generally defined as having better gear than everybody else. Since supply of gear is low without instances and content is trivial with 100's of guides of how to win, success is obtained here by playing long hours and participating in guild politics as alluded above. In other words, drama IS PART of the competition aspect of the game. Whether it be creating entertainment for social acceptance, driving other players to breaking the arbitrary server-imposed rules, cultivating amicable relationships with GMs as to leverage the lack of formal rulings on rule violations, or inciting conflict between players as to avoid them creating an alliance -- this game and ruleset is designed such that players succeed by socially and emotionally manipulating others. This is the real challenge on P1999.

In short, P1999 is designed for drama and sad lowlifes. Better to just accept it and move on and let them revel in their depravity.

[jbs89]

If you die during PvE it's not much different than PvP is it? They have an exp boost too.

To above: cloak dropped off Nagafen yesterday

http://i706.photobucket.com/albums/ww70/acidshamanNramen/photo.jpg

[Witness]

As a new player on red let me sum up my less then 1 week experience. Started out in Freeport and 2 holo were killing guards, they buffed me gave me some bronze and some plat and i quickly got to level 5, then i soloed to level 10 and went to unrest, found some nihilum druid there pling someone on the right side, he buffed me and told me to move to the left side and would keep me buffed. Got to level 12. Then some people level 15-17 came in and let me join them. Xp flows fast and im now 21. There's nearly always someone to group with in unrest. I also wanted to mention I had good runins with founding fathrrs as well. i have enjoyed the server so far and will continue leveling.

[kazroth]

Great post, Humerox, and good news, Witness. Will see you online.

[mwatt]

@Humerox

You made a show of addressing my comments on a point by point basis. Unfortunately, you discourse like a politician. When you answer a question or address a point you answer only as much of it as is convenient then you use the rest of your answer to talk about what you want to talk about.

I am not going to rebut other than to say I stand behind what I already said. I don't hold out any hope of influencing you though - not sure why I bother. Your ilk does not see the beauty in the original game. What you are doing on Red is an abomination IMO. But to each their own I suppose. I'd just as soon keep red posts out of the blue areas however. It's annoying.

[Humerox]

@Humerox

You made a show of addressing my comments on a point by point basis. Unfortunately, you discourse like a politician. When you answer a question or address a point you answer only as much of it as is convenient then you use the rest of your answer to talk about what you want to talk about.

I am not going to rebut other than to say I stand behind what I already said. I don't hold out any hope of influencing you though - not sure why I bother. Your ilk does not see the beauty in the original game. What you are doing on Red is an abomination IMO. But to each their own I suppose. I'd just as soon keep red posts out of the blue areas however. It's annoying.

My ilk? I played just about from server up on P99 and was an original member of Divinity. Still am afaik...I haven't logged on in a while...but my reputation on blue was impeccable...save a little trolling I did (on a forum alt) early on in the server timeline against DA. Which, btw...is the point I consider that what I loved about EQ on P99 was being lost, but that's another story.

I get it that you don't like PvP in EQ...that's OK. This post is directed at people that are on the fence, frustrated at the dramafest in the raid scene, and uninformed about the changes on red lately. We've had some results, which is cool.

I'm sorry you're annoyed.

:(

[mwatt]

Previous comments aside I do respect the tenor and rationality of your writing. You do not spin out into emotional tirade and name calling when someone presents an opposing point of view. Instead you take the high ground, something that I usually pride myself on but you have gone me one better in these exchanges I think.

In short, though I don't agree with all that you say, you at least say it in an adult fashion - something that in my observation is not so common among PVP advocates. I stand corrected on my "ilk" remark. I was stereo-typing you and I was wrong.

If there were more folks like you on the Red server, it would have a much higher population IMO. However, as you have surmised, you still wouldn't find me there. :)

Finally, PVP promotion in the Blue forums does in fact annoy me, but perhaps that isn't fair. When someone like you posts rationally and thoughtfully (and this is rare), it is more palatable.

[kazroth]

If there were more folks like you on the Red server, it would have a much higher population IMO.

Not to toot my own horn, but I'm logging in as we speak. :D

[Haul]

My ilk? I played just about from server up on P99 and was an original member of Divinity. Still am afaik...I haven't logged on in a while...but my reputation on blue was impeccable...save a little trolling I did (on a forum alt) early on in the server timeline against DA. Which, btw...is the point I consider that what I loved about EQ on P99 was being lost, but that's another story.

I get it that you don't like PvP in EQ...that's OK. This post is directed at people that are on the fence, frustrated at the dramafest in the raid scene, and uninformed about the changes on red lately. We've had some results, which is cool.

I'm sorry you're annoyed.

:(

+1

[Lazortag]

I played just about from server up on P99 and was an original member of Divinity. Still am afaik ...

Pretty sure you still are. You should log in for a ragefire every now and then.

[Messianic]

My ilk? I played just about from server up on P99 and was an original member of Divinity. Still am afaik...I haven't logged on in a while...but my reputation on blue was impeccable...save a little trolling I did (on a forum alt) early on in the server timeline against DA. Which, btw...is the point I consider that what I loved about EQ on P99 was being lost, but that's another story.

I get it that you don't like PvP in EQ...that's OK. This post is directed at people that are on the fence, frustrated at the dramafest in the raid scene, and uninformed about the changes on red lately. We've had some results, which is cool.

I'm sorry you're annoyed.

:(

Humerox = class act

[FoxxHound]

From a fellow Red player:

No. This type of thread, and advertisement, is just troll bait. People on Blue who wished to play on Red will already have done so.

Out of courtesy to Blue players, please don't make threads like this here.

[Destan]

This post is directed at people that are on the fence, frustrated at the dramafest in the raid scene, and uninformed about the changes on red lately.(


This is 'grass is greener' point of view right? In my boredom at work I'll look through posts on both red and blue, and it seems like the raid scene on both servers is a dramafest. In fact, it would be accurate to say the raid scene on any server, in any game with raiding, is usually a dramafest.

However, I do wish you guys on Red luck in getting your numbers up. All you need is a solid approach to cultivating new members and a method for keeping them. One of the things you'll often see long-time EverQuest players mention when explaining what every MMO has lacked since is that sense of community. That's really the biggest issue for Red, it doesn't feel like EverQuest. It looks like it, has the same features, but you almost need to get five buddies to start with you in order to guarantee you'll have a group. I know you guys are petitioning for global ooc, and while it's not classic, it WOULD probably help. Although even then, if lonely guy A is in Greater Faydark and lonely guy B is in Blackburrow, it still won't help them do much besides sympathize with each other's struggles.

I think you should start up a padawan program. New person joins, posts a message on the forums, and a high level takes them under their wing. If said new person is struggling, that high level can lend a hand to get them through the rough spots.

[Angkar]

This is 'grass is greener' point of view right? In my boredom at work I'll look through posts on both red and blue, and it seems like the raid scene on both servers is a dramafest. In fact, it would be accurate to say the raid scene on any server, in any game with raiding, is usually a dramafest.

However, I do wish you guys on Red luck in getting your numbers up. All you need is a solid approach to cultivating new members and a method for keeping them. One of the things you'll often see long-time EverQuest players mention when explaining what every MMO has lacked since is that sense of community. That's really the biggest issue for Red, it doesn't feel like EverQuest. It looks like it, has the same features, but you almost need to get five buddies to start with you in order to guarantee you'll have a group. I know you guys are petitioning for global ooc, and while it's not classic, it WOULD probably help. Although even then, if lonely guy A is in Greater Faydark and lonely guy B is in Blackburrow, it still won't help them do much besides sympathize with each other's struggles.

I think you should start up a padawan program. New person joins, posts a message on the forums, and a high level takes them under their wing. If said new person is struggling, that high level can lend a hand to get them through the rough spots.

Half bump, half quote.