ASOIAF / Game of Thrones (SPOILERS INSIDE) [Archive] - Page 2

Sirken

04-25-2013, 11:39 AM

I can not believe I forgot all about this. I smoked too much weed last summer. :rolleyes:

Thank you for clearing that up.

did u catch that Tywin was also poisoned by Oberyn before Tyrion gutshot him with a crossbow?

“Where will I find my lord father?”
“In the solar with Lord Tyrell and Prince Oberyn.”
Mace Tyrell and the Red Viper breaking bread together? Strange and stranger.
—Jaime and Ser Meryn Trant, upon Jaime’s return to King’s Landing

“Widow’s blood, this one is called, for the color. A cruel potion. It shuts down a man’s bladder and bowels, until he drowns in his own poisons.”
—Grand Maester Pycelle, during Tyrion’s trial

“To be sure, I have much to thank your sister for. If not for her accusation at the feast, it might well be you judging me instead of me judging you.” The prince’s eyes were dark with amusement. “Who knows more of poison than the Red Viper of Dorne, after all?”
[…]
“Your father,” said Prince Oberyn, “may not live forever.”
Something about the way he said it made the hairs on the back of Tyrion’s neck bristle. Suddenly he was mindful of Elia again, and all that Oberyn had said as they crossed the field of ashes. He wants the head that spoke the words, not just the hand that swung the sword. “It is not wise to speak such treasons in the Red Keep, my prince. The little birds are listening.”
“Let them. Is it treason to say a man is mortal? Valar morghulis was how they said it in Valyria of old. All men must die. And the Doom came and proved it true.”
—Prince Oberyn Martell and Tyrion, in Tyrion’s cell

He found his father where he knew he’d find him, seated in the dimness of the privy tower, bedrobe hiked up around his hips.
[…]
For once, his father did what Tyrion asked him. The proof was the sudden stench, as his bowels loosened in the moment of death. Well, he was in the right place for it, Tyrion thought. But the stink that filled the privy gave ample evidence that the oft-repeated jape about his father was just another lie.
Lord Tywin Lannister did not, in the end, shit gold.
—from Tyrion’s assassination of Tywin during his escape from the black cells

The King’s Hand was rotting visibly. His face had taken on a greenish tinge, and his eyes were deeply sunken, two black pits. Fissures had opened in his cheeks, and a foul white fluid was seeping through the joints of his splendid gold-and-crimson armor to pool beneath his body.
[…]
Red-eyed and pale, Cersei climbed the steps to kneel above their father, drawing Tommen down beside her. The boy recoiled at the sight, but his mother seized his wrist before he could pull away.“Pray,” she whispered, and Tommen tried. But he was only eight and Lord Tywin was a horror. One desperate breath of air, then the king began to sob.“Stop that!” Cersei said. Tommen turned his head and doubled over, retching. His crown fell off and rolled across the marble floor. His mother pulled back in disgust, and all at once the king was running for the doors, as fast as his eight-year-old legs could carry him.
“Ser Osmund, relieve me,” Jaime said sharply, as Kettleblack turned to chase the crown. He handed the man the golden sword and went after his king. In the Hall of Lamps he caught him, beneath the eyes of two dozen startled septas. “I’m sorry,” Tommen wept. “I will do better on the morrow. Mother says a king must show the way, but the smell made me sick.”
This will not do. Too many eager ears and watching eyes.“Best we go outside, Your Grace.” Jaime led the boy out to where the air was as fresh and clean as King’s Landing ever got. Twoscore gold cloaks had been posted around the plaza to guard the horses and the litters. He took the king off to the side, well away from everyone, and sat him down upon the marble steps. “I wasn’t scared,” the boy insisted. “The smell made me sick. Didn’t it make you sick? How could you bear it, Uncle, ser?”
—Jaime, Cersei, and Tommen, during Tywin’s funeral.

GG

Funkutron5000

04-25-2013, 12:15 PM

Turns out, Tywin doesn't shit gold.

Sirken

04-25-2013, 03:03 PM

Turns out, Tywin doesn't shit gold.

nope. actually, he wasn't shitting at all for a lil bit. luckily tyrion helped him loosen those bowels.

Kimm Barely

04-25-2013, 03:39 PM

I did not! I furiously sped red through books 2 and 3 once GoT ended on TV. I was hooked and had to know what happened. Thank you for clearing these details out. Going to reread book 3. It's clearly the best book out of the series. It just shocked me so many times that I just couldn't put it down.

Shit like the Red Wedding stuck with me hard and the red head dying. Didn't notice these major details. I wonder if Dorne will stand with Dany after the idiot son got burnt up.

SavageHenry

04-25-2013, 08:55 PM

Sirken

04-26-2013, 01:05 PM

So I'm curious what the show is going to do with Shae. She's much more of a character than she is in the books so it seems to me they'll do one of two things with her:
1) Let her go with Sansa when she leaves with LF
2) Have Tywin find out Tyrion is still involved with her and he has her hanged

I really don't see her betraying Tyrion at this point. Course the show could just be giving her more development to make her betrayal that much more unexpected, but I don't see it. Just like I don't see them making a great actor like Charles Dance die on the crapper...that scene is gonna be altered a bit I think.

oh man, i lol'd hard, and shared your post with my RL brother, who also lol'd hard.

the whole "you cant kill this person because i love them too much" is what ASOIAF is all about. GRRM treats us as unsullied trainees in a way. instead of giving us a puppy, he gives us characters that we fall in love with, and then he takes them away from us.

Shae is a survivor and at the end of the day, shes with Tyrion for the money. after Tywin finds her, her options become limited, and she does whats needed to survive (until she gets choked out). She cannot go with Sansa because that would throw a wrench in LF's long term plans. even if Shae did manage to leave with Sansa, LF would have her killed. shes in the way no matter how u slice it, and she'll need to go.

as far as Tywin, that whole scene is important to the story and Tyrions char development. First, Tywin is already poisoned and dying when he gets shot. second, its metaphorical/ironic/significant that Tywin Lannister would be killed in a such a non ceremonious way.

Funkutron5000

04-26-2013, 06:04 PM

I was so damned happy when Tywin died and the way in which he died. I laughed really hard. I cannot wait for that scene to be put to film.

Frieza_Prexus

04-26-2013, 07:38 PM

Just like I don't see them making a great actor like Charles Dance die on the crapper...that scene is gonna be altered a bit I think.

I've been killing characters my entire career, maybe I'm just a bloody minded bastard, I don't know, (but) when my characters are in danger, I want you to be afraid to turn the page (and to do that) you need to show right from the beginning that you're playing for keeps.

SavageHenry

04-26-2013, 08:04 PM

oh man, i lol'd hard, and shared your post with my RL brother, who also lol'd hard.

the whole "you cant kill this person because i love them too much" is what ASOIAF is all about. GRRM treats us as unsullied trainees in a way. instead of giving us a puppy, he gives us characters that we fall in love with, and then he takes them away from us.

Shae is a survivor and at the end of the day, shes with Tyrion for the money. after Tywin finds her, her options become limited, and she does whats needed to survive (until she gets choked out). She cannot go with Sansa because that would throw a wrench in LF's long term plans. even if Shae did manage to leave with Sansa, LF would have her killed. shes in the way no matter how u slice it, and she'll need to go.

as far as Tywin, that whole scene is important to the story and Tyrions char development. First, Tywin is already poisoned and dying when he gets shot. second, its metaphorical/ironic/significant that Tywin Lannister would be killed in a such a non ceremonious way.

Oh I'm under no delusions that any of the main characters have to stay alive through this whole series. I've read all the books so I'm just talking about the show. Like the way they've written Shae makes it seem like she is actually with Tyrion for love and the money is secondary. She probably does have to go that is true, but it'll be at the hands of Tywin or possibly LF but not Tyrion. I'm sticking to that...course I guess we won't know until next season I think? =/

I had no idea Tywin was poisoned. I'm still sticking to that actor not being shown on the shitter. I'm sure he'd agree to it and I'll give them props if they go through with it, but no...just no. He has to die by Tyrion's hand, that is important...but not in such an ignoble way.

Frieza_Prexus

04-26-2013, 09:50 PM

...but not in such an ignoble way.

I think dying in a very base way was the entire point. Tywin Lannister, for all practical purposes, was the King of Westeros at the time. He was the singularly most powerful individual in the seven kingdoms, and it was only a matter of time until his power was absolutely cemented.

Then he died on the shitter. It was Martin playing for keeps, and there's no way they'll change that.

Sirken

04-26-2013, 11:33 PM

I think dying in a very base way was the entire point. Tywin Lannister, for all practical purposes, was the King of Westeros at the time. He was the singularly most powerful individual in the seven kingdoms, and it was only a matter of time until his power was absolutely cemented.

Then he died on the shitter. It was Martin playing for keeps, and there's no way they'll change that.

i agree 100%:D

Sirken

04-27-2013, 03:29 PM

anyone else notice how they are completely ignoring the whole "undying" aspect of Beric the Undying?

i know its small, but it bothers me. my buddy is EXTREMELY upset that Dany offered them a dragon and tricked them, as opposed to them requesting a dragon, and Dany turning it against them.

big things tomorrow night folks

Funkutron5000

04-27-2013, 03:45 PM

Well, Beric did lose his eye somehow... It would be kind of weird to hear someone mention "oh this dude has died like 4 times and Thoros keeps bringing him back some how, and it happened off screen so just believe it pls". I think we'll be learning about the Undying part of the Lightning Lord tomorrow evening after his duel with the Dog!

Drayc

04-29-2013, 11:03 AM

I have really really liked the last two episodes. I think Jaime losing his hand is the best thing to happen to him. Reading the books I didn't care for his character I just thought he was an ass from pushing Bran out the window... On. He becomes one of my favorite characters after having his hand taken. I'm really interested to see how his meeting with the grey widow(Lady Stone heart).. I believe they call her now :-) goes...

From phone-

Funkutron5000

04-29-2013, 11:14 AM

Shireen was goddamn adorable and it was awesome having her sing a song made of the words Patchface would say in the book.

Also, the fight between the Dog and Beric was awesome.

Funkutron5000

04-29-2013, 11:42 AM

Just gonna leave this here:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6lz3lAd2nGQ

Sirken

04-29-2013, 11:59 AM

Shireen was goddamn adorable and it was awesome having her sing a song made of the words Patchface would say in the book.
Also, the fight between the Dog and Beric was awesome.

Just gonna leave this here:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6lz3lAd2nGQ

patchface is awesome. Shireen is awesome (i feel so bad for that lil girl). i have been waiting for the beric/hound fight all season. now we shouldnt see him again till he snatches up that lil wolf and they begin their BFF tale.

great video :p

Drayc

04-29-2013, 01:04 PM

yep! last two have been on the money. and now we're in the back half of the season, so i expect lo. of action for the next 5 weeks.. when jamie first lost that hand in the book, i was so happy, cause fuck him. but then by the end of book 5, i really like Jaime a lot. so when i see him lose his hand, its weird because in my head i already forgave him. essentially i was happy he lost it in the book, but sad for him to lose it in the show? nevermind.

as far as Jaime and Lady Stone Heart, you gonna be waiting a long time... we needs that sixth book, fawk.

So I was looking back at the wiki and saw something's I remember but obviously not well... does podric get killed by lady stone heart... Brienne is set out to find Jaime right? At what point does she get her face bit off? I may have to reread the last book it seems like I've lost some of it.

Also what do you think mormonts outcome will be? Think he will make it back to the fold with daeyneres? also mr baristen the bold is about as badass as they come.

From phone-

Sirken

04-29-2013, 02:11 PM

So I was looking back at the wiki and saw something's I remember but obviously not well... does podric get killed by lady stone heart... Brienne is set out to find Jaime right? At what point does she get her face bit off? I may have to reread the last book it seems like I've lost some of it.

Also what do you think mormonts outcome will be? Think he will make it back to the fold with daeyneres? also mr baristen the bold is about as badass as they come.

From phone-

imo, no, Podrick didnt die. in the book, it says he was hanging or choking. when you hang a person correctly they die pretty instant as it breaks your neck. But Brienne sees Pod choking/hanging and is given a choice, "the rope or the sword". Brienne screams a word (the word was confirmed by GRRM to be "Sword"). we assumed she said sword because shes alive in book 5. After Jaime gives Brienne Oathkeeper and sends her looking for Sansa she goes through a bunch of BS, and is eventually attacked by a group of brave companions led by Rorge. she kills Rorge but Biter chews up her face pretty good before she is saved by Gendry, who brings her to the brotherhood (led by stoneheart). Lady Stoneheart doesnt believe Brienne, and names her traitor. Brienne was given the choice of killing Jaime Lannister to prove her loyalty, or to hang (Sword or Rope). Brienne refuses to choose and is sentenced to hang. After seeing Podrick Payne hanging near her, she shouts a single unknown word as they are about to do the same to her. Brienne appears briefly at Pennytree when Jaime camps there, whatever word she shouted apparently making the Brotherhood spare her. She asks Jaime to help her save Sansa Stark from the Hound, claiming they are a day's ride away. She tells Jaime, however, that he must go with her alone, or the Hound will kill Sansa. However we know thats not true because Sansa is in the Vale, and the hound is laying low on quiet isle with the elder brother.

When "Arstan Whitebeard" is revealed to be Barristan Selmy, he reveals Jorah's former status as an informer to Daenerys. Ser Jorah pleads that he stopped sending reports long ago when he fell in love with her, and Daenerys decides to send them both on a dangerous mission into the sewers of Meereen as punishment and a chance at redemption. The mission succeeds, and upon their return to court, Ser Barristan begs Daenerys' forgiveness and she gladly gives it. Jorah, however, insists that she owes him forgiveness on account of his love and history of faithful service. Although Dany wishes to forgive him, she knows that as long as he maintains this attitude she cannot do so without undermining her own authority. She banishes Jorah from her service, swearing to kill him if she ever sees him again. Crushed by her rejection, Jorah leaves.

Jorah captures tyrion, a bunch of bullshit and too many pages later, Jorah is taken as a slave, and is broken down as a man. personally, i think the next time he sees Dany, he will be humbled, and beg forgiveness. and because of Dany's feelings for slaves and slavery, she will take pity on him and grant him mercy. but i think he will server under Barriston. i can not see Jorah ever being her #1 again after his betrayal.

in book 2, Jaime says he thinks theres only maybe 3 people in Westeros that can defeat him in combat. i always figured Barriston to be one of the three (the other two being Gregor and Sandor Clegane).

Fun side note - i think either Brienne is a descendant of Sir Duncan the Tall.

Drayc

04-29-2013, 02:59 PM

Ah hah the stories of egg and dunk the lunk are awesome.. I hope HBO possibly does a spin off with their stories

Sirken

04-29-2013, 08:25 PM

Ah hah the stories of egg and dunk the lunk are awesome.. I hope HBO possibly does a spin off with their stories

Brienne's father has what i think is Duncan's armor. thats why i think this.

citizen1080

04-29-2013, 09:20 PM

Sirken

04-29-2013, 11:41 PM

Read the books 4 times so far..and the show is by far the most accurate book to movie/show conversion I have ever seen. Fantastic show and books. However, I would be tempted to axe the show if it got me the books faster...dear lord Martin is an asshole.

fixed that last bit for you. and yes they do a good job. but you have nerds like me that are noticing every little change, and most of them i do not like, but i do understand.

Noselacri

04-29-2013, 11:46 PM

He's also like 70 years old.

citizen1080

04-29-2013, 11:57 PM

fixed that last bit for you. and yes they do a good job. but you have nerds like me that are noticing every little change, and most of them i do not like, but i do understand.

Lol..true enough. Feast of crows was what..6 year wait? And from what I understand he had it pretty much written from day one cause he split 1 book into two to milk it for more money.

And then made us wait...and wait...

I vote someone just kills the bastard and have brian sanderson finish the series off...his wheel of time books were good and the mistwalker series is one of my favorites.

Safon

04-30-2013, 12:23 AM

Anyone else groan whenever a Brienne chapter comes up?

citizen1080

04-30-2013, 12:25 AM

Anyone else groan whenever a Brienne chapter comes up?

Sansa is worse

Sirken

04-30-2013, 12:40 PM

He's also like 70 years old.
he'll be 65 in Sept. at this point, every year counts.

Lol..true enough. Feast of crows was what..6 year wait? And from what I understand he had it pretty much written from day one cause he split 1 book into two to milk it for more money. And then made us wait...and wait...
I vote someone just kills the bastard and have brian sanderson finish the series off...his wheel of time books were good and the mistwalker series is one of my favorites.
book 1 (Game of Thrones) Aug 1996
book 2 (Clash of Kings) Feb 1999
book 3 (Storm of Swords) Nov 2000
book 4 (Feast for Crows) Nov 2005
book 5 (Dance with Dragons) July 2011
Book 6 (Winds of Winter) Who knows
book 7 (Dream of Spring) Who knows

the book "Feast for Crows" took forever for a couple reasons. firstly, he had planned to have 5 years pass between the end of book 3 and start of book 4 (to allow the younger characters some time to catch up). the five year gap plan was scrapped, and the "flashbacks" were rewritten in to new book 4 (and eventually book 5) chapters. Next, the book 4 manuscript was the largest he ever submitted coming in at or over 2000 pages (originally book 4 = Book4, Book5, and the battles at Mereen and Winterfell). thats why books 4 and 5 take place parallel to each other for most of the time. my problem is that theres really only 350 pages in book 5 after the timeline converges with book 4. so does that mean it took him 5 years to write 350 pages? or does it mean he never really finished the book 4 story for 10 years? Also, he has stated many times that if he should die, he will not allow another author to finish his story. that said Benioff and Weiss (hbo show creators) have been told how the story ends. who wins the throne. and what happens to each main character. so even if he dies, theres a chance HBO can finish the story.

Anyone else groan whenever a Brienne chapter comes up?
aww, i like Brienne chapters a lot. i think she might be Duncan's grand daughter. she might even be related to Hodor (as we only know his grandmother is old nan, we dunno his parents). side note, some people think Hodor is the third dog, a clegane. i personally dont know how i feel about Hodor's heritage. but i really think Brienne is kin to Sir Duncan the Tall.

Sansa is worse
Sansa gets better in book 4. Alayne Stone is becoming a very smart girl that understands how things work, and thinks with her head. Sansa Stark is a very dumb girl, that is oblivious to the ways of the world, and thinks with her emotions. needless to say, im a bigger fan of Alayne Stone. but Baelish is in my top 3.

Elderan

04-30-2013, 01:20 PM

he'll be 65 in Sept. at this point, every year counts.

book 1 (Game of Thrones) Aug 1996
book 2 (Clash of Kings) Feb 1999
book 3 (Storm of Swords) Nov 2000
book 4 (Feast for Crows) Nov 2005
book 5 (Dance with Dragons) July 2011
Book 6 (Winds of Winter) Who knows
book 7 (Dream of Spring) Who knows

the book "Feast for Crows" took forever for a couple reasons. firstly, he had planned to have 5 years pass between the end of book 3 and start of book 4 (to allow the younger characters some time to catch up). the five year gap plan was scrapped, and the "flashbacks" were rewritten in to new book 4 (and eventually book 5) chapters. Next, the book 4 manuscript was the largest he ever submitted coming in at or over 2000 pages (originally book 4 = Book4, Book5, and the battles at Mereen and Winterfell). thats why books 4 and 5 take place parallel to each other for most of the time. my problem is that theres really only 350 pages in book 5 after the timeline converges with book 4. so does that mean it took him 5 years to write 350 pages? or does it mean he never really finished the book 4 story for 10 years? Also, he has stated many times that if he should die, he will not allow another author to finish his story. that said Benioff and Weiss (hbo show creators) have been told how the story ends. who wins the throne. and what happens to each main character. so even if he dies, theres a chance HBO can finish the story.

Most people are expecting book 6 in 2014, but I am not sure I see it. He mentioned only about 300 pages are done of the book and the book is expected to be 1600 pages or so. I think the earliest is 2015.

Sansa gets better in book 4. Alayne Stone is becoming a very smart girl that understands how things work, and thinks with her head. Sansa Stark is a very dumb girl, that is oblivious to the ways of the world, and thinks with her emotions. needless to say, im a bigger fan of Alayne Stone. but Baelish is in my top 3.

Little Finger is teaching Sansa how to play the Game of Thrones right now. I think she is a key character down the road and while I know Little Finger has plans for her he is not telling her (Possibly marrying her) I think in the end she will be LF downfall.

Kassel

04-30-2013, 03:28 PM

First scene in this last episode (trial by combat) made me think of EQ. Never in my life have a seen a better example of Pally vs SK =D

Sirken

04-30-2013, 07:07 PM

Little Finger is teaching Sansa how to play the Game of Thrones right now. I think she is a key character down the road and while I know Little Finger has plans for her he is not telling her (Possibly marrying her) I think in the end she will be LF downfall.
yep. and his plans for her are to kill Robin Arryn and then marry Sansa to Harrold Hardyng (Harry the Heir). because that would unite Stark and Arryn bloodlines, Winterfell and the Vale loyalty, and LF plans on ruling all of it. but i 100% agree that Sansa will be his undoing

Sirken

04-30-2013, 07:07 PM

First scene in this last episode (trial by combat) made me think of EQ. Never in my life have a seen a better example of Pally vs SK =D

LOL well played sir. the pally even had epic

Funkutron5000

04-30-2013, 08:39 PM

Good use of the click stick by Thoros

Sirken

04-30-2013, 09:42 PM

i suspect we'll see Melisandre use her click stick in book 6. that bastard needs to be reborn amidst salt and smoke. at least hes free of the watch.

citizen1080

04-30-2013, 10:22 PM

Shit sir..you're throwing out spoilers to content not yet release. Are you a witch?

i suspect we'll see Melisandre use her click stick in book 6. that bastard needs to be reborn amidst salt and smoke. at least hes free of the watch.

Sirken

04-30-2013, 11:14 PM

Shit sir..you're throwing out spoilers to content not yet release. Are you a witch?

Shit sir! read the thread title and the OP!

citizen1080

04-30-2013, 11:18 PM

Shit sir! read the thread title and the OP!

Ahh but I have read all the books..so spoilers don't matter...unless you are a witch, who is spoiling books not yet released! =p

I joke, my thoughts were along the same lines...Snow/Daenerys hook up...save the world..not sure who the 3rd rider is at this point..tho arya is a contender after her assassin training is finished.

Sirken

04-30-2013, 11:23 PM

lol

not "spoiling" cause i dunno what will happen in book 6, BUT, i like to be a young conspirator when it comes to these books. and since i think Jon is both "PtwP" and "AA", and we know the red priests can rezz peeps, then its a perfect way for Jon to be reborn, as well as be free of his vows, and he can still be his annoying honorable self.

ultimately, i think Stannis will end up as the 1000th commander of the nights watch

citizen1080

04-30-2013, 11:33 PM

Actually read OP...i think you are spot on. However, Stannis may need to die imo. He has sacraficed so much and done some dark things to attain his goal. If John takes that from him I dont know that he will go peacefully into the night. I guess it depends on if he really is drinking the red ladys koolaid or just using her as a means to a end. Namely him on the throne.

Sirken

05-01-2013, 11:32 AM

Poor Stannis. he may need to die indeed. but maybe not. if he actually is Azor Azai, and if lightbringer is actually the men of the nights watch, then its a perfect fit for him to lead the watch.

but more likely, Melisandre (whom i believe to be the least talented of the 3 red priests, thoros and moqorro being the other two) has been seeing future visions of Jon in her fires, and not Stannis.

If Stannis does die, well then we have Gendry and Edric, one (or both) of them can be legitimized, and become the new Lord of the Baratheon house.

If Stannis does not die.. well thats a pickle. firstly because Stannis sees himself as the rightful king, he WILL NOT bend the knee to any one else. if he was willing to kill Renly, hes not pledging fealty to anyone else. he can't be king of the north, because hes not of the north. not to mention Rickon is still alive, and Sansa is to be married to Harry the Heir, which would unite the vale of Arryn and the North, again, leaving no place for Stannis.

at the wall, Stannis can be lord commander, as well as get away with not kneeling before any other king, furthermore, he would not be subject to the whims of whoever the king may end up being.

i just think that from a writing point of view, theres a reason Jon was the 998th commander of the nights watch. more specifically, i think theres a reason we are so close to 1000. i think there will be a short lived interim Lord Commander that will take over after Jon, but will ultimately not last (for whatever reason), and then will be followed by the 1000th Lord Commander of the Nights Watch (ie: Stannis imo)

Elderan

05-01-2013, 01:58 PM

i suspect we'll see Melisandre use her click stick in book 6. that bastard needs to be reborn amidst salt and smoke. at least hes free of the watch.

I am sure you read this http://www.reddit.com/r/asoiaf/ but if not tons of fun stuff in there.

One of my new favorite theories is Jon will be brought back to life by Lady Stoneheart.

I am going off memory here but they say Jon will worg into ghost and then his body will be preserved in an ice cell. Melisandre who has never resurrected anyone and doesn't know how but knows Thoros did will then contact him who will then bring Lady Stoneheart to the wall.

Before she gets to the wall Lady Stoneheart will come across Howland Reed and will learn Jons true parents R+J. Feeling guilty about how she treated him all his life she will forgive Ned and Jon and then she will the pass life from her to Jon which will kill Lady Stoneheart like it did Beric Dondarrion.

Ahai shall be born again amidst smoke and salt to wake dragons out of stone

We know the smoke and salt part.. but could the dragon being woken out of stone be from lady Stoneheart? She awakes the dragon (Jon) out of stone(her).

Anyway I like this theory.

Elderan

05-01-2013, 02:00 PM

Sirken

05-01-2013, 02:23 PM

I am sure you read this http://www.reddit.com/r/asoiaf/ but if not tons of fun stuff in there.

One of my new favorite theories is Jon will be brought back to life by Lady Stoneheart.

I am going off memory here but they say Jon will worg into ghost and then his body will be preserved in an ice cell. Melisandre who has never resurrected anyone and doesn't know how but knows Thoros did will then contact him who will then bring Lady Stoneheart to the wall.

Before she gets to the wall Lady Stoneheart will come across Howland Reed and will learn Jons true parents R+J. Feeling guilty about how she treated him all his life she will forgive Ned and Jon and then she will the pass life from her to Jon which will kill Lady Stoneheart like it did Beric Dondarrion.

We know the smoke and salt part.. but could the dragon being woken out of stone be from lady Stoneheart? She awakes the dragon (Jon) out of stone(her).

Anyway I like this theory.

i dont read reddit at all unless im linked there for a particular thing. so i have absolutely no idea whats in that thread(s) but ill check it out after i post this.

Lady Stoneheart can't bring folks back to life, that's Thoros. Catelyn didnt like Jon, why would Lady Stoneheart? i think it's more likely that Melisandre will be able to rezz, and it's much easier to do geographically/chronologically. Remember that Stoneheart is in the Riverlands waiting for Brienne to bring Jaime to her.

as far as Jon, the prologue informs us that it's possible to worg into your animal, if the worg/person was to die. and then Melisandre foreshadows it in that paragraph in book 5 where she tells Jon to keep Ghost close by. as much as i'm not a fan of Jon Snow, i have accepted him as a central point of the story. that being said, i'm convinced hes not perma dead. hes too honorable to break his vows and abandon the watch, "dying" gives him an out. and yep, the body would be preserved in the ice cell.

SOMEONE needs to bump into Howland Reed. maybe Stoneheart, but maybe not. and if she learned this info, would she even care? shes clearly emotionally damaged at this point. as far as sacrificing herself... why? Beric was killed and rezzed like 5 times before he was to weak to keep doing it, thats why he gave up his life for hers. now granted Catelyns corpse was pretty fucked up, and so maybe shes to weak to even survive one rezz. Personally i think the Howland Reed and his men will pledge to support Jon Snow (however, remember that is R+L=J is true, then Jon comes AFTER Bran and Rickon in the line of succession).

the stone dragon. im not sure. it could be a metaphor for a conqueror that comes from Dragon Stone. it could be a dragon under the wall, or something to do with the wall itself. it could be the fabled dragon under Winterfell. maybe Aegon will get greyscale, and then he would literally be "The Stone Dragon". lots of possibilities, not enough solid info.

personally i havent heard your StoneheartRezzesJon theory before, but its surely possible ;)

Sirken

05-01-2013, 02:25 PM

Not thought about Stannis becoming LC. I do like the idea though, he fits so well with the position.

if he isnt killed in battle, its really the only path i see as viable for him. Hell, if Dany takes the Iron Throne, she could easily sentence Stannis to serve out his days at the wall, and then it's not even Stannis's choice at that point

Kimm Barely

05-02-2013, 12:28 AM

http://25.media.tumblr.com/b60a09be387ed0e8f7638f615aabb90c/tumblr_mky4vegC3M1qlwkdio1_500.gif

<3

Sirken

05-02-2013, 01:35 PM

http://25.media.tumblr.com/b60a09be387ed0e8f7638f615aabb90c/tumblr_mky4vegC3M1qlwkdio1_500.gif

<3

x2

she reminds me of a female version of Tywin.

fawk, imagine if Tywin married Olenna Redwyne (Tyrell) instead of his own cousin Joanna. that would have been the most dangerous couple in westeros. Sadly, Tywinn loved Joanna, and Olenna hated the Lannisters (in SoS, an early Sansa chapter, we learn that in her youth she almost married a member of House Targaryen, but Olenna did everything she could to make sure it never came to fruition).

only thing is, i have no idea how old the QoT actually is.

Funkutron5000

05-06-2013, 03:03 PM

Shocking no one, the Queen of Thorns owned again.

Also, I was a little surprised that Ros already bit it. I figured she was gonna take Dontos' place helping get Sansa out of King's Landing/ dying. At least she died how she lived, full of shafts.

Sirken

05-08-2013, 10:43 AM

lol, she did indeed. i felt Roz was in danger for awhile now, since there was no place for her in the vale, her only chance was to buddy up with Tyrion.

any idea what Melisandre was talking about when she was talking about the "eyes" staring back at her from inside Arya?

also, looks like they are merging Edric Storm and Gendry into one character.

next week.... BEAR PITS!

Funkutron5000

05-08-2013, 11:25 AM

The bear and the maiden fair, indeed.

The eyes? I'm guessing it's either all the people she will kill or all the different faces she will wear while doing the killing. I can't remember if GRRM said that her eye color changed when she changed her face for her assassination.

I can't blame them for a lot of the character merges. They only get ~9-10 hours per season, so limiting the cast isn't the worst thing. It takes time to introduce characters! Also, with them working so closely with GRRM it probably means Gendry doesn't really have an important role left in the books, otherwise untangling this Mereneese knot will be a bitch.

Drayc

05-08-2013, 01:08 PM

Sirken

05-09-2013, 04:41 PM

I'm not sure why but the scene with Thoros talking about losing his faith and how he just didn't want his friend to die has to be one of my favorite scene... Is melisandre jealous of his power? I kind of got the feeling she thinks the power is hers/the priests... Where Thoros trully believes its the one true gods will.

And beric is a badass .... I think one of the best actors to characters IMO...

gotta agree, it was a great scene, and im glad they did that. Melisandre isnt jealous of his power.. i think shes jealous because she thinks the lord of light likes Thoros better. i think Melisandre has been misreading the flames the whole time. i think the strapping blackhaired warrior shes been seeing in the flames this whole time is really Jon Snow. but without knowing exactly what she sees, i cant be certain.

Littlegyno 9.0

05-10-2013, 01:39 AM

gotta agree, it was a great scene, and im glad they did that. Melisandre isnt jealous of his power.. i think shes jealous because she thinks the lord of light likes Thoros better. i think Melisandre has been misreading the flames the whole time. i think the strapping blackhaired warrior shes been seeing in the flames this whole time is really Jon Snow. but without knowing exactly what she sees, i cant be certain.

Melisandre sort of a hack compared to other Red Priests like the black dude with Victorian and Thoros.

Sirken

05-10-2013, 05:09 PM

Melisandre sort of a hack compared to other Red Priests like the black dude with Victorian and Thoros.

100% agree. Melisandre is the least skilled red priest weve seen. Thoros is rezz clicking people, so no need to explain his awesomeness. as far as Moqorro (red priest with Victarion), he is the right hand of the high priest (leader) of that entire religion, so you could argue he is the 2nd most powerful red priest on the planet, at least in Westeros/Essos

i mean.. we still dont REALLY know exactly what that priest did to Victarion's hand.

all we know is that he wants to get to Dany. not sure how truly loyal he is to Vic, but we'll see after Moqorro doesnt need him anymore.

either way, Dany NEEDS victarions 90+ armada of ships to get her new Dothraki army, Unsullied army, and hungry followers back to westeros. i suppose the dragons can fly, so no boat space needed for them.

GRRM needs to stop going to conventions and write book 6. pretty soon im going to kidnap his fat ass and lock him in my basement until its finished.

Sirken

05-13-2013, 01:48 AM

so.. 3 episodes left.

they had a preview for next week with a guy talking to Dany.. is there any chance that was Strong Belwas?

gotrocks

05-13-2013, 04:58 AM

GRRM needs to stop going to conventions and write book 6. pretty soon im going to kidnap his fat ass and lock him in my basement until its finished.

this. 100 times this.

so.. 3 episodes left.

they had a preview for next week with a guy talking to Dany.. is there any chance that was Strong Belwas?

God I hope so.

Overall I liked this episode, btw. Especially the scene with Tywin and Joffrey. That little smirk on Tywin's face spoke volumes.

Sirken

05-13-2013, 12:19 PM

Overall I liked this episode, btw. Especially the scene with Tywin and Joffrey. That little smirk on Tywin's face spoke volumes.

when Joffrey goes, "QQ Stairs QQ"
and Tywin was like "we can have someone carry you"

that was so perfectly priceless

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Drayc

05-13-2013, 02:08 PM

Sirken

05-13-2013, 02:29 PM

Another great episode.

I stand by, Jaime losing his hand is the best thing to happen to him. The first couple books he is just a douche bag... Once his right hand is gone he becomes one of my favorite characters. I think so much happens because of it.. Would Jaime ever tell Tyrion about what really happened with his wife if he didn't? I don't think so... His whole relationship with his sister changes... Maybe he was honorable in ways before.. But IMO the dude turns into Eddard afterwards...

Poor Sansa ... All you can do is feel sorry for her at this point...

I really liked Jon again this episode... You're all going to die...

Rob... Its coming... And it makes me sad.... I never saw that arrow coming in the book... But now that I do I want to fucking slap him before its too late...

i dont think Jaime wouldnt have changed without the incident. i mean, he had zero reason to change until that happened. it changed the way he sees people as well as how he sees situations. he has to have more of a Tyrion approach to life, and that makes him respect his brother more i think. i just hope Brienne isnt leading Jaime into a trap.

fawk Sansa. shes a dumb girl that thinks with her emotions instead of her brain. she should have taken LFs offer to leave. (so, i assume we wont see LF again til towards the middle or end of season 4 after the royal wedding.. but that begs the question, will LF show up himself? will Dontos make another appearance? inquiring minds want to know!)

i think i'm the only person that wants to slap jon snow in the face every time i read a chapter of his or see him on screen. ive accepted him as one of the 3 main points in the story, but i dont like him. he does the same dumb shit that Ned would do. ex: "i cant be lord jon stark of winterfell mr stannis... im a bastard... i swore an oath" BAH!

FINALLY Robbs mother in law is mentioned. in the books, the mom plots with tywin, and "the wife" is tricked to drink moon tea. (popular conspiracy = Jeyne Westerling didnt drink the moon tea, but instead it was given to her sister who was passed off as Jeyne to the Lannisters, based on the differing descriptions of Jeyne by Catelyn and later by Jaime.) Robb should have trusted his direwolf. GG

Drayc

05-13-2013, 03:16 PM

I agree to a point about Jon... He could have changed a lot if he had worked with Stannis a little more. However I don't think he is dead... And I think what has happened will change him for the better.

I can't wait for arya to make it across the narrow sea...

Also the strong belvas(sp?) Shit in the show is pissing me off..is he just now gonna appear outside the gates? I dont like it...

Drayc

05-13-2013, 05:31 PM

Oh one other side note... I loved HBO's Rome so I really enjoy seeing some of those actors in GoT

Sirken

05-13-2013, 05:45 PM

but he couldnt work with stannis because "he swore an oath" bla bla and the nightwatch dont partake in the kingdoms affairs. but i mean... W T F

i am HOPING (keyword here) that Arya is sent to assist Jaqan H'Ghar/Alchemist/Pate - mostly because i really want to know if Jaqan is there to steal that horn.

Strong Belwas. and i have no idea if hes gonna be in the show. but i mean.. who could it be besides him? he would be a pretty shitty Daario. and i doubt Dany will take any more meetings with anyone from Yunkai. and it just looks nothing at all like i pictured Brown Ben Plum. so i dunno. a shitty entrance for Belwas is better than not having Belwas. Strong Belwas strong!

i was 50/50 on Rome, and i still dunno how i feel about Julius Ceasar as Mance

Hasbinbad

05-13-2013, 05:53 PM

Ciaran Hinds is an amazing actor. You're a fool.

Hasbinbad

05-13-2013, 05:53 PM

inb4 ban for questioning GM opinion

Sirken

05-13-2013, 06:25 PM

Ciaran Hinds is an amazing actor. You're a fool.
great actor indeed. but doesnt have the playfully rogueishness that i see mance having.

inb4 ban for questioning GM opinion
you are safe

Lojik

05-14-2013, 01:03 PM

so.. 3 episodes left.

they had a preview for next week with a guy talking to Dany.. is there any chance that was Strong Belwas?

Pretty sure GRRM said that strong belwas would not be in the TV series. I think that guy is Mero.

Sirken

05-14-2013, 04:24 PM

Pretty sure GRRM said that strong belwas would not be in the TV series. I think that guy is Mero.

wow. i forgot all about Mero. how the fawk do you keep Mero. but cut Edric Storm, Mya Stone, and Strong Belwas :( :( :(

Sirken

05-15-2013, 02:52 AM

so... i just read a theory that claims Sir Strong Robert has Robb Stark's head.

Stark = Strong in a few euro languages (according to google)

imagine if Strong Robert has Robbs head and Jaime's hand... FAWK

Drayc

05-15-2013, 11:26 AM

Wow shits getting morbid up in this thread

Sirken

05-16-2013, 02:22 AM

god damned got reddit out that robb strong conspiracy in my head

Drayc

05-16-2013, 10:33 AM

god damned got reddit out that robb strong conspiracy in my head

Maybe its Sir Duncan the Tall! :-)

It has to be the mountain in some form... The question is... Either it isn't his head.. Or they sent someone else's head to Dorn ... I don't recall anyone else his size that has died lately... But who's to say they just didn't go grave robbing.

Im going to go with its just the mountain who lived through the poison but just got completely fucked up by it...

So what do we think little finger is gonna do with his army?

Drayc

05-16-2013, 12:01 PM

To add say it is the mountain in some form and he did die... Is there a new red priest player?... Who would have the power to do such a thing in kings landing?

Funkutron5000

05-21-2013, 04:41 PM

That was a pretty damn good episode. Sam finally got to be the Slayer, and it looked cool as shit.

Sirken

05-23-2013, 01:50 PM

Maybe its Sir Duncan the Tall! :-)
It has to be the mountain in some form... The question is... Either it isn't his head.. Or they sent someone else's head to Dorn ... I don't recall anyone else his size that has died lately... But who's to say they just didn't go grave robbing.
Im going to go with its just the mountain who lived through the poison but just got completely fucked up by it...
So what do we think little finger is gonna do with his army?
Pretty sure Duncan the Tall is killed at the "tragedy of summerhall". i think for sure its gregors body. but i believe his real head was sent to Dorne. i think that gregor survived the poison as well....but was killed by Qyburn.

To add say it is the mountain in some form and he did die... Is there a new red priest player?... Who would have the power to do such a thing in kings landing?
Qyburn has been working on a "Frankenstein" idea for a long time. its part of the reason he lost his maester chain. i dont think Strong Robert will retain his past life in the fashion that that Beric Dondarrion does. Beric remembers everything and knows who he was, he was indeed Rezz'd. i dont think Gregor is being rezzed.. Strong Robert was created out of parts, and through "science". like a Frankenstein.

That was a pretty damn good episode. Sam finally got to be the Slayer, and it looked cool as shit.
i was really expecting to meet Coldhands in that episode. /sigh
now gotta wait two weeks for ep9. fawk.

eqdweller

05-23-2013, 03:02 PM

http://24.media.tumblr.com/66a0bd56cf0ff1350860dfc3c3df4c48/tumblr_mju1s5f0Fc1s7gr9ko1_500.jpg

Sirken

05-23-2013, 04:05 PM

at least SOMEONE noticed the lack of blue hair on Daario Naharis

oh, and this x100

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Littlegyno 9.0

05-23-2013, 04:08 PM

Lojik

05-23-2013, 09:58 PM

I wonder if it was GRRM to decide on Daario not having blue hair, or some of the other producers (or directors? I don't know shit about television.) Maybe for some reason they don't want to introduce tyroshi blue hair to the audience? Maybe they want people to understand why dany likes him? /shrug.

Funkutron5000

05-23-2013, 11:40 PM

Well, with the way he looks Dany's ridiculous <3<3~~~~Dario~~~~<3<3 won't be as absurdly awful, I hope. It'll also help not having to read her thoughts about him.

Dalven

05-24-2013, 08:49 AM

So finally up to date with the TV series. Long post bringing up weeks old topics inc.

did u catch that Tywin was also poisoned by Oberyn before Tyrion gutshot him with a crossbow?

Oh yes - what a bad ass. Can't say I feel sorry for Tywin's undignified end despite how awesome he is in the show. Enjoyed the interactions between him and Joffrey. Looking forward to the Red Viper making an appearance, although that probably won't be until season 4

Stuff about Shae

As Sirken said its essential to Tyrion's development that he kills her. Whether we get any hints prior to Tyrion catching her with Tywin I don't know, but it will certainly change the perspective we've been given off her in the show where she seems almost in love with Tyrion. Will maybe illustrate the effect of her being a whore and the jealousy about Sansa is sheerly a result of a threat to her way of life.

when jamie first lost that hand in the book, i was so happy, cause fuck him. but then by the end of book 5, i really like Jaime a lot. so when i see him lose his hand, its weird because in my head i already forgave him. essentially i was happy he lost it in the book, but sad for him to lose it in the show? nevermind.

as far as Jaime and Lady Stone Heart, you gonna be waiting a long time... we needs that sixth book, fawk.

Yeah one Jaime chapter in ADWD was just a pure tease. I don't think it will be as simple as Brienne turning him in, although I look forward to seeing more of Lady Stoneheart and how dark the BWB have become.

i think the next time he sees Dany, he will be humbled, and beg forgiveness. and because of Dany's feelings for slaves and slavery, she will take pity on him and grant him mercy. but i think he will server under Barriston. i can not see Jorah ever being her #1 again after his betrayal.

Yeah, Jorah has been through some tough times since being banished - I'd like to see him get back on side with Dany but the dude definitely needed a humbling.

Fun side note - i think either Brienne is a descendant of Sir Duncan the Tall.

Definitely - when she gets that shield painted with the tree and falling star because it reminded her of one she saw on Tarth that sealed it for me. Add in the stuff about behaving like a knight but not actually being one (Duncan is most likely a fraud) and there are some nice parallels.

he might even be related to Hodor (as we only know his grandmother is old nan, we dunno his parents).

For sure this is true - next Dunc and Egg is set in the north. Would bet good hard cash he gets fired into Old (Young?) Nan during that time.

yep. and his plans for her are to kill Robin Arryn and then marry Sansa to Harrold Hardyng (Harry the Heir). because that would unite Stark and Arryn bloodlines, Winterfell and the Vale loyalty, and LF plans on ruling all of it. but i 100% agree that Sansa will be his undoing

Sansa is reaching the low point of her arc in the show - her dreams of marrying a king/tall handsome knight have been totally inverted and the final nail in the coffin to her fairytale outlook of the world (which resurged a bit with the Tyrell marriage plans). By the end of AFFC you can definitely see her awakening and I'm fairly certain she knows Littlefinger is setting Robert Arryn up for a death by sweetmilk. Hopefully she'll get Littlefinger put down with some elaborate scheme or use his lust against him.

i suspect we'll see Melisandre use her click stick in book 6. that bastard needs to be reborn amidst salt and smoke. at least hes free of the watch.

Yeah the resolution to that will be interesting. The Warg in the prologue of ADWD seems to set up the possibility for it. Personally I had been hoping that wouldn't be the means of resurrection - directly parallels the Farseer Trilogy by Robin Hobb (who I think is one of Martin's pals). Although I wonder who his Nissa Nissa will be. Arya?

i just think that from a writing point of view, theres a reason Jon was the 998th commander of the nights watch. more specifically, i think theres a reason we are so close to 1000. i think there will be a short lived interim Lord Commander that will take over after Jon, but will ultimately not last (for whatever reason), and then will be followed by the 1000th Lord Commander of the Nights Watch (ie: Stannis imo)

Aye, 998 is a bit of an odd one. Would Stannis do it if Jon was revealed to be AA and a Targaryen to boot? Hard to imagine him bending from this course he has poured so much into. Mance as 1000th commander of the Nights Watch as an alternative point of view?

Lady Stoneheart is likely a being fuelled by vengeance due to the manner she died. I reckon that Beric is the way he is because he died defending the realm in King Robert's name and that is what his undead focus point was. All indications is that Stonehearts is hanging Freys and any others she feels have betrayed her. I don't see her having a positive influence on the rest of the story - just a sad afterlife for Catelyn.

All I have time for just now but likely more later!

Sirken

05-24-2013, 12:57 PM

Looking forward to the Red Viper making an appearance, although that probably won't be until season 4
yep, they didnt wanna do the Martells this season because they didnt want to pay a couple actors for a few appearances. expect them in full force for season 4.

As Sirken said its essential to Tyrion's development that he kills her. Whether we get any hints prior to Tyrion catching her with Tywin I don't know, but it will certainly change the perspective we've been given off her in the show where she seems almost in love with Tyrion. Will maybe illustrate the effect of her being a whore and the jealousy about Sansa is sheerly a result of a threat to her way of life.
honestly, i think it was Tyrion and Sansa getting married that made Shae feel like she was just a whore again. i believe that Shae wouldnt have done the tywin thing if not for that. plus add to that how afraid Tyrion is of Tywin, and that probably gets Shae all hot and bothered (power and respect, oh my!)

Yeah one Jaime chapter in ADWD was just a pure tease. I don't think it will be as simple as Brienne turning him in, although I look forward to seeing more of Lady Stoneheart and how dark the BWB have become.
ive read theories that Jaime will be Azor Azai, and that Brienne will sacrifice herself to him, becoming his Nissa Nissa. personally i dunno if i buy in to that theory. but when Brienne and Jaime show up at Lady Stoneheart, shit is going to get real in a hurry

Yeah, Jorah has been through some tough times since being banished - I'd like to see him get back on side with Dany but the dude definitely needed a humbling.
Dany told Barristan that she would take Jorah back if he apologized and if he would say essentially what Barristan told her. "When "Arstan Whitebeard" is revealed to be Barristan Selmy, he reveals Jorah's former status as an informer to Daenerys. Ser Jorah pleads that he stopped sending reports long ago when he fell in love with her, and Daenerys decides to send them both on a dangerous mission into the sewers of Meereen as punishment and a chance at redemption. The mission succeeds, and upon their return to court, Ser Barristan begs Daenerys' forgiveness and she gladly gives it. Jorah, however, insists that she owes him forgiveness on account of his love and history of faithful service. Although Dany wishes to forgive him, she knows that as long as he maintains this attitude she cannot do so without undermining her own authority. She banishes Jorah from her service, swearing to kill him if she ever sees him again. Crushed by her rejection, Jorah leaves. "

Definitely - when she gets that shield painted with the tree and falling star because it reminded her of one she saw on Tarth that sealed it for me. Add in the stuff about behaving like a knight but not actually being one (Duncan is most likely a fraud) and there are some nice parallels. -- For sure this is true - next Dunc and Egg is set in the north. Would bet good hard cash he gets fired into Old (Young?) Nan during that time.
not to mention, she mentions that her father has a full suit of armor back in Tarth matching that sigil. we also dont know who Hodor's parents were. but Brienne (as u said) also reminds me a lot of Duncan the Tall. But, Duncan is dead by 259AL, we are never told when Brienne is born, BUT book 5 takes place during 299AL. Which would mean Brienne would have to be at least 40 years old. Unless Duncan didnt actually die at Summerhall. but then, GRRM mentioned that A Feast for Crows would feature a descendant of Dunk. In A Feast for Crows, Brienne recalls a shield she saw as a child in her father’s armory. Its description matches Dunk's own shield. Both Dunk and Brienne are uncommonly tall and strong. as far as Hodor, hes dumb and his name is Walder, so he could be a Frey. but also, because of his height and because George R. R. Martin stated that his descendant would be in the book. There is also the vision of Bran's in the cave of the three-eyed crow of a knight as tall Hodor kissing a young woman at Winterfell. The woman is thought to be Nan and the knight to be Ser Duncan the Tall, when he and Egg visited Winterfell in The She-Wolves of Winterfell.

Sansa is reaching the low point of her arc in the show - her dreams of marrying a king/tall handsome knight have been totally inverted and the final nail in the coffin to her fairytale outlook of the world (which resurged a bit with the Tyrell marriage plans). By the end of AFFC you can definitely see her awakening and I'm fairly certain she knows Littlefinger is setting Robert Arryn up for a death by sweetmilk. Hopefully she'll get Littlefinger put down with some elaborate scheme or use his lust against him.
Sansa is the type that needs to hit rock bottom before moving back up. in the show, she still has no idea. in the book, i agree, i think by 5 she is on to LFs plan. and i think she will be the demise of LF. Sansa can hate LF all she wants. facts are, he saved her from the Lannisters, and more importantly, hes teaching her how to play the game.

Yeah the resolution to that will be interesting. The Warg in the prologue of ADWD seems to set up the possibility for it. Personally I had been hoping that wouldn't be the means of resurrection - directly parallels the Farseer Trilogy by Robin Hobb (who I think is one of Martin's pals). Although I wonder who his Nissa Nissa will be. Arya?
maybe Jon isnt AA. or, hell, maybe he is. his Nissa Nissa could be Arya... but couldnt it also be Ghost? i think it could.

Aye, 998 is a bit of an odd one. Would Stannis do it if Jon was revealed to be AA and a Targaryen to boot? Hard to imagine him bending from this course he has poured so much into. Mance as 1000th commander of the Nights Watch as an alternative point of view?
so, SOMEONE is going to be running the show after Jon (you dont have a mutiny without someone to lead that Mutiny). that person will be 999th commander. when the 999th is killed for what they did to Jon, the next person will be 1000th, and he will command for quite sometime. i never considered Mance Rayder, but i could see it (even though it goes against his "i do what i want" attitude of being free. As far as Stannis.. heres why; Stannis can not win the war in the end because he lacks dragons and because i believe it was Jon the red lady was seeing in the fires. but after the war is over, if Stannis is alive, the wall is the only place hed go. he wouldnt return to dragonstone just to serve a king or queen when he believes HE is the rightful king. the ONLY way for Stannis to maintain respect AND be outside the reach of these kings and queens is to be on the wall. and if hes on the wall, he'll end up running that shit.

Lady Stoneheart is likely a being fuelled by vengeance due to the manner she died. I reckon that Beric is the way he is because he died defending the realm in King Robert's name and that is what his undead focus point was. All indications is that Stonehearts is hanging Freys and any others she feels have betrayed her. I don't see her having a positive influence on the rest of the story - just a sad afterlife for Catelyn.
poor cat. people keep thinking shes going to be sweet and nice when she sees her kid or kids again.. but, lets be real, Lady Stoneheart is fucking insane, and tbh, im not even sure if shes capable of emotion. also, Catelyn was dead for multiple days (in the river) before Nymeria pulled her out, and the BWB stubbled upon her. Beric is usually only a couple minutes dead when he gets rezzed up, so minimal damage. But being dead all week = max damage.

Great post btw. keep em coming

Sirken

05-28-2013, 01:42 PM

5 days until we see the RW :) :) :)

Miller

05-28-2013, 01:46 PM

5 days until we see the RW :) :) :)

very excite

Sirken

05-29-2013, 07:01 PM

FAWK
FOUR FAWKING DAYZ

Sirken

06-01-2013, 09:36 PM

tomorrow.

Lojik

06-02-2013, 07:38 AM

tomorrow.

TONIGHT

smokemon

06-02-2013, 09:06 AM

Sirken

06-02-2013, 12:16 PM

TONIGHT

OMFG :eek:

Funkutron5000

06-02-2013, 03:39 PM

The world gets to come down on the sweet, summer, non-bookreading children tonight.

Kraftwerk

06-02-2013, 09:56 PM

I think they did a pretty good job. The moment she got stabbed in her pregnant belly, wow.

Sirken

06-02-2013, 10:40 PM

so much for the "robb's heir" theories.

welcome nonreaders to the post RW world.

Hasbinbad

06-02-2013, 10:50 PM

SavageHenry

06-02-2013, 11:11 PM

lololol @ people crying on FB. Bwahahaha...feel our pain nonreaders!

Sirken

06-02-2013, 11:23 PM

i hopped on reddit as soon as it was over to surf on their tears

Hasbinbad

06-02-2013, 11:42 PM

please post their tears for those of us who do not know what reddit does.

Hasbinbad

06-02-2013, 11:43 PM

Please ser Sirken. I beg of you.

Heywood

06-02-2013, 11:53 PM

OH GOD, OH GOD, OH GOD. OH. MY. GOD.

As soon as she mentioned the name Eddard, I knew that bitch was done for.

Rogean

06-03-2013, 12:35 AM

Absolutely brutal episode...

Heywood

06-03-2013, 12:59 AM

Right in the womb, er, feels.

Hasbinbad

06-03-2013, 01:05 AM

http://i.imgur.com/h5eRnX0.jpg

Hasbinbad

06-03-2013, 01:06 AM

arya best actor besides tyrion, also best character in series.

Heywood

06-03-2013, 01:08 AM

After watching the episode again, with captions on, I noticed that song 'Rains of Castamere' was playing before all the shit went down. Which is why Catelyn was making that stinkeye.

It was also the title of tonight's episode, which i guess foreshadowed this.

Yardcore

06-03-2013, 01:10 AM

Wow...I just watched the "the rains of casts mere"....I don't read books so I'm pretty shock right now....man...

Hasbinbad

06-03-2013, 01:12 AM

the rains of castamere tune is played in earlier episodes too i think

Heywood

06-03-2013, 01:17 AM

I remember Margery and Cersei talking about the song 1 (or 2?) episodes ago.

Yardcore

06-03-2013, 01:30 AM

I still can't get over the kill/off, pretty f up but masterpiece nevertheless.

Sirken

06-03-2013, 01:52 AM

Please ser Sirken. I beg of you.
http://www.reddit.com/r/GameofThrones

Absolutely brutal episode...
i felt worst for the wolf :(

Right in the womb, er, feels.
yea its fucked up, but im glad they did that. for us book readers, the theory of Robb's wife and heirs was a hot topic, because in the books shes not at the red wedding, and then theres mismatching descriptions of her and a whole secret plot between her mother and tywin versus the Starks. but seeing Robbs wife killed like that kinda closes the discussion on the topic of Robbs possible heirs. looks like the moon tea in the book was effective and we have seen the last of Jeyne Westerling

Sirken

06-03-2013, 01:56 AM

the rains of castamere tune is played in earlier episodes too i think
yes. Brawn sings it before the blackwater battle, it plays during S2E9 credits, and Cersei mentions it to Margaery.
Rains of Castamere
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I still can't get over the kill/off, pretty f up but masterpiece nevertheless.
and it's just getting started my friend ;)

Yardcore

06-03-2013, 02:10 AM

Remember this?
She clutched tight at [Robb's] hand. “Nothing will happen to you. Nothing. I could not stand it. They took Ned, and your sweet brothers. Sansa is married, Arya is lost, my father's dead... if anything befell you, I would go mad, Robb. You are all I have left. You are all the north has left.”
“I am not dead yet, Mother.”

Sirken

06-03-2013, 02:11 AM

Remember this?
”

she does go mad too.

"not my hair.. Ned always loved my hair"

Heywood

06-03-2013, 03:37 AM

http://www.reddit.com/r/GameofThrones

i felt worst for the wolf :(

yea its fucked up, but im glad they did that. for us book readers, the theory of Robb's wife and heirs was a hot topic, because in the books shes not at the red wedding, and then theres mismatching descriptions of her and a whole secret plot between her mother and tywin versus the Starks. but seeing Robbs wife killed like that kinda closes the discussion on the topic of Robbs possible heirs. looks like the moon tea in the book was effective and we have seen the last of Jeyne Westerling

Interesting, I just ordered the first book on amazon. I don't think I can't wait for season 4 to come out.

Just out of curiosity, what book is the red wedding from?

Rogean

06-03-2013, 03:43 AM

Storm of Swords

Elderan

06-03-2013, 10:44 AM

I read the books not too long ago so the RW was still fresh in my mind. I thought I was prepared for this episode.

I wasn't...

They did a great job of making it even more brutal with the killing of the unborn child. The moment that Cat was sitting beside Roose and rolled his sleeve up to see he had armor on, and then that look he gave her was just perfect. After Robb was stabbed, the silence before they slit Cats throat was also perfect reflection of the books.

I wish Wind gotten out like in the books and killed a few people though. I also wish they had not wasted the nice Arya cliff hanger.

The North Remembers... I cannot wait for Wyman Manderly.

Funkutron5000

06-03-2013, 11:11 AM

Rickon's goodbye to Bran was pretty soul crushing. I'm so sad that we only get the one event that kicks off the rest of the awesomness in SoS this season and have to wait another damned 10 months for the rest of it to unfold. Here's hoping for a shot of Stoneheart opening her eyes to end the season!

Funkutron5000

06-03-2013, 11:13 AM

I wish Wind gotten out like in the books and killed a few people though. I also wish they had not wasted the nice Arya cliff hanger.

I think the Arya cliffhanger would have been difficult for film. It's hard to show a character taking an axe to the back of the head and living. They would have had to be sure to show that it was the flat of the axe and not the blade and that kind of gives it away as is.

Kraftwerk

06-03-2013, 11:54 AM

My one fault would be, and I may be recollecting wrong, Roose should have said "Jaime Lannister sends his regards" not just "The Lannisters send their regards". I like that small touch, they should have left it in.

Sirken

06-03-2013, 12:28 PM

Just out of curiosity, what book is the red wedding from?
its from book 3. i remember just before the RW goes down in the book, i was complaining about how slow book 3 was. i would tell my brother its just a bunch of assholes walking around talking to each other. and then the red wedding happened.. and then the second half of book 3 is one of the best books ive ever read.

After Robb was stabbed, the silence before they slit Cats throat was also perfect reflection of the books.
I wish Wind gotten out like in the books and killed a few people though. I also wish they had not wasted the nice Arya cliff hanger.
The North Remembers... I cannot wait for Wyman Manderly.
in the book, there was no silence. she was screaming after she murdered jinglebell and literally tearing her face off, a few of the Freys even comment on it by saying "She's gone mad", before grabbing her by the hair and slicing open her throat. as far as Greywind, i'm with you 100%. the only thing that would have kinda softened the blow would have been seeing Greywind eat some Freys, as opposed to being helplessly slaughtered, thanks hbo. fucking Wyman Manderly.... GET YOUR MEAT PIES! i can't wait!

I think the Arya cliffhanger would have been difficult for film. It's hard to show a character taking an axe to the back of the head and living. They would have had to be sure to show that it was the flat of the axe and not the blade and that kind of gives it away as is.
i gotta agree. but maybe, just maybe, they didnt want the viewers to think they lost Robb and Arya in the same episode. people would lose their shit.
My one fault would be, and I may be recollecting wrong, Roose should have said "Jaime Lannister sends his regards" not just "The Lannisters send their regards". I like that small touch, they should have left it in.
you sir, are 1000% correct. i noticed it to after Jaime left Harrenhall, but i let it slide.

Arclyte

06-03-2013, 01:44 PM

good, m̶a̶r̶y̶ ̶s̶u̶e̶ robb stark sucked

long live house lannister

Sirken

06-03-2013, 02:02 PM

good, m̶a̶r̶y̶ ̶s̶u̶e̶ robb stark sucked
long live Tyrionn Lannister

fixed!

Funkutron5000

06-03-2013, 02:38 PM

Why are the asoiaf book readers such douche bags? I've read the books, but I find this nerdy/elitist jargon when it comes to non-book readers and spoiler knowledge extremely annoying. It's okay to just enjoy the show/books or both, nobody cares if you've read the books 100 times and everyone else is a summer child, get a life.

I don't think it's douchey at all if readers aren't spoiling the events from those people. I threw my copy of Storm of Swords when I read the Red Wedding. Everyone I know had a pretty intense emotional reaction to it. Now, we're getting to enjoy everyone else finally getting to see what we've known was coming for a while. It's a good way to relive the gut punch you took when you read it the first time!

Also, the summer child thing isn't an insult. It's just a way of describing the un-spoiled people that are watching the show as innocent and not knowing that bad things were coming.

"War will make them old, as it did us. I pity them, because it will not last. It's a game to you, isn't it. It won't last, because they are the Knights of Summer and Winter is Coming."

Smedy

06-03-2013, 03:05 PM

i love the show, wish more series would follow great books and not sway to much from the story

to many shows don't wanna do drastic turns like this cause eventually they will have to end the show, it pleases me when shit like this happens, feels real ya feel me dawgs

good stuff and brutal as fuck

that king is amazingly cruel but feels real

Ephirith

06-03-2013, 03:40 PM

Sirken

06-03-2013, 05:21 PM

Why are the asoiaf book readers such douche bags? I've read the books, but I find this nerdy/elitist jargon when it comes to non-book readers and spoiler knowledge extremely annoying. It's okay to just enjoy the show/books or both, nobody cares if you've read the books 100 times and everyone else is a summer child, get a life.
bump the brakes there buddy. i knew readers that literally threw their books at their wall when the RW went down, and i enjoyed their reaction just as much. i did not say i enjoy their tears because of some secret knowledge i hoard away like a mystical treasure. no, i enjoy their tears because i blame catelyn for just about everything that happened, and never really got in with Robb. as i said in an earlier post, the saddest thing about it was Greywind. and to be quite honest, your post is the biggest douchebag thing ive seen in this thread for quite some time.
pot. kettle. black.
A+ job pal

edit - also, all you "summer children" should be thanking us for not be actual douche bags and posting spoilers all over the forums (see what i did there?)

Drayc

06-03-2013, 05:35 PM

bump the brakes there buddy. i knew readers that literally threw their books at their wall when the RW went down, and i enjoyed their reaction just as much. i did not say i enjoy their tears because of some secret knowledge i hoard away like a mystical treasure. no, i enjoy their tears because i blame catelyn for just about everything that happened, and never really got in with Robb. as i said in an earlier post, the saddest thing about it was Greywind. and to be quite honest, your post is the biggest douchebag thing ive seen in this thread for quite some time.
pot. kettle. black.
A+ job pal

edit - also, all you "summer children" should be thanking us for not be actual douche bags and posting spoilers all over the forums (see what i did there?)

+1 - Many of us could have spoiled it for a lot of people a long time ago. Here is the thing, every reader went through an emotional roller coaster after the red wedding. We kept reading and you know what? Just like Eddard dying the red wedding is a needed piece to the masterpiece that is asoiaf. We have gotten over it through reading and the viewers will get over it through watching.

Oh... and if you think waiting a year for an episode is bad? LOOT AT THE FUCKING RELEASE DATES FOR THE BOOKS, a year is fucking nothing. 96,98,2000... 2005............... 2011

Sirken

06-03-2013, 05:44 PM

Oh... and if you think waiting a year for an episode is bad? LOOT AT THE FUCKING RELEASE DATES FOR THE BOOKS, a year is fucking nothing. 96..98..2000... 2005............... 2011

/wrist

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Heywood

06-03-2013, 06:07 PM

Sirken

06-03-2013, 06:12 PM

I love this series so far because it's not predictable at all. It's not the norm in shows/books for the good guy to die. It's refreshing really.

Can't say I was a big fan of Rob, really. He let his dick get in the way of being a good lord.

Although I like Tyrionn, the Lanisters don't apeal to me either. The grandfather is a twat, the grandson is worse and a product of the sibling fuckers.

I really became interested in Brann's abilities. I hope he, snow, and Arya don't die foolishly like the rest of the starks.
aww, im a big fan of both Tywin and Tyrionn
Robb on the other hand, sent Theon back to pyke(dumb), tried to ally with Renly instead of stannis(dumb), broke pact to Freys(dumb), Slew Karstark instead of heeding advice from family and friends(dumb).

no offense to any Robb fans, but i mean seriously, how many mistakes does Robb get to make?

Sirken

06-03-2013, 07:35 PM

You thought the "saddest thing" was Greywind's death...hmm you're twisted in the head mate.
Greywind was much more innocent than Robb or Catelyn or Jeyne. Greywind did not make stupid decisions. Greywind didn't deserve that.

edit - and one for the road ;)

http://25.media.tumblr.com/bc0eb5da41392946d20503d7f1d538a4/tumblr_mhdjlzfkDP1r3eqhso1_500.jpghttp://25.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_m8t2dvjh6a1qdtj73o1_r1_500.png

Pringles

06-03-2013, 08:15 PM

http://i.imgur.com/p7JN6jH.gif

Yardcore

06-03-2013, 09:22 PM

http://i.imgur.com/p7JN6jH.gif

guilty!

Hasbinbad

06-04-2013, 03:17 AM

in sirkens defense he probably doesn't realize he is also lumping the unborn child in with the "less innocent than the wolf" crowd because that didn't happen in the books.

Hasbinbad

06-04-2013, 03:18 AM

the wolf dying IS the saddest part about the red wedding in the book, except maybe for arya's pain at being so close, only to lose her entire family .. again.

Hasbinbad

06-04-2013, 03:23 AM

caitlyn and robb specifically, but their entire cohort as well, were people of war and lived and died by the sword.

Funkutron5000

06-04-2013, 03:30 AM

the wolf dying IS the saddest part about the red wedding in the book, except maybe for arya's pain at being so close, only to lose her entire family .. again.

be careful admitting you read the book, HBB. It may or may not mean you're a douchebag.

Also, this is fantastic: https://twitter.com/RedWeddingTears

Hasbinbad

06-04-2013, 03:36 AM

oh dear that really is funny

K|mm Barely

06-04-2013, 04:12 AM

im mad GRRM dindnt have ygritte shoot jon with an arrow

India

06-04-2013, 09:01 AM

Arya Stark Vine :)

https://vine.co/v/b3XZMHmxzxh

Sorry can't embed :/
<script async="" src="//platform.vine.co/static/scripts/embed.js" charset="utf-8"></script><script async="" src="//platform.vine.co/static/scripts/embed.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

Sirken

06-04-2013, 09:07 AM

im mad GRRM dindnt have ygritte shoot jon with an arrow
maybe next week we'll learn that a mystery arrow pegged him in the back

Arya Stark Vine :)

https://vine.co/v/b3XZMHmxzxh

Sorry can't embed :/
<script async="" src="//platform.vine.co/static/scripts/embed.js" charset="utf-8"></script><script async="" src="//platform.vine.co/static/scripts/embed.js" charset="utf-8"></script>
fixed!

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Funkutron5000

06-04-2013, 12:15 PM

GRRM reacts to the episode:

http://www.theonion.com/articles/oh-shit-i-totally-forgot-that-happens,32673/

EchoedTruth

06-04-2013, 12:19 PM

GRRM reacts to the episode:

http://www.theonion.com/articles/oh-shit-i-totally-forgot-that-happens,32673/

lol...

the fan reactions to this are classic!

Sularus Oth Mithas

06-04-2013, 04:09 PM

be careful admitting you read the book, HBB. It may or may not mean you're a douchebag.

Also, this is fantastic: https://twitter.com/RedWeddingTears

I feel sorry for those people. That episode was the best one yet IMO. Robb deserved to die for being such an idiot, I'm glad he and his wench got axed. Here is a guy who against all odds starts a war after his father is killed and is actually succeeding up to the point when he decides fuck everyone, my desires are more important I'm going to be a total fuckwad and marry this tramp.

Only thing I cared about was the poor wolf, it couldn't help that it's master was a retard.

K|mm Barely

06-04-2013, 05:44 PM

http://i.imgur.com/KqCD9kU.jpg

http://i.imgur.com/5QLvbiB.jpg

Sirken

06-04-2013, 06:53 PM

well done Kimm

/applaud

Auvdar

06-04-2013, 11:28 PM

The Red Wedding was very well done, and sealed the episode for me very well.

But, am I the only one kinda bummed on how they did Jon Snow? "Hey wild guys! Please don't kill me. I will join you!"... "Hey hot girl, I will bang you!"... "I actually hate you, die now!"

There really is a lot going on with Jon, but they never really built much of it for me.

And I agree with Sul here. Robb was an idiot. Catelynn was an idiot. But, I never cared much for there plot anyway. When they came on, that would be when I would get up to take a piss.

Jon, Arya, anything with Tyrion glue me to the chair. Robbs story just got tiring.

Sirken

06-05-2013, 02:35 AM

this is long as fawk, but its funny as hell. absolutely priceless

http://www.happyplace.com/24297/game-of-thrones-facebook-recap-season-3-episode-9

Lojik

06-05-2013, 10:55 AM

http://i.imgur.com/xZ98pbs.jpg

Hasbinbad

06-05-2013, 04:23 PM

http://teamcoco.com/video/lena-headey-cersei-hate

Sirken

06-05-2013, 07:03 PM

id bet money Jack Gleeson has had shit thrown at him on the street.

that kid is sooooooo good at acting like an entitled and arrogant little cocksucker. i gotta tip my hat

Hasbinbad

06-05-2013, 07:07 PM

yeah .. i'd still slap either one of them irl

Hasbinbad

06-05-2013, 07:09 PM

Robbs story was not boring, but it was necessary to lull you into thinking that way so that the wedding was unexpected.

Hasbinbad

06-05-2013, 07:10 PM

watch the last few episodes again, knowing what you know now, and notice how pampered he is .. it could have only ended this way.

readers saw and loved that aspect because we knew. oh yes, we knew.

Hasbinbad

06-05-2013, 07:11 PM

the whole story is COMPLETELY different the second time you read it,

Sirken

06-05-2013, 07:25 PM

hbb,
i wasnt a huge Robb fan. he was never a PoV character and he was always fucking up. he was young and naive and he still believed he would win the war simply by winning these small battles. He broke his oath to Walder. He allowed a woman to free the kingslayer in exchange for nothing. He sent Theon back to Pyke. He allied with Renly over Stannis. He straight up lost Winterfell. He lobbed off Lord Karstarks head, costing him those men, and turning Roose against Robb. am i forgetting anything?

Moving on to postBook5 stuff,

im still thinking Victarion and Dany are going to team up (allys, or married, dunno) and be a dangerous fucking pair to deal with. the guy has 90+ ships at the moment, and hes at Slavers Bay.

meanwhile in westeros, Stannis VS Freys & Manderlys (unless the manderlys turn on the freys as expected.) and im pretty sure that the karstark men are planning to murderfuck Stannis and co. as well

Kraftwerk

06-05-2013, 08:35 PM

Yea, I think I'm going to re-read starting from Book 1. I have a lot of travel coming up and flights/airports/hotels at cities I don't live in for business are great times to read. The Red Wedding episode really made me remember how good the story and book details are, time to relive it all.

Drayc

06-05-2013, 08:44 PM

Moving on to postBook5 stuff,

im still thinking Victarion and Dany are going to team up (allys, or married, dunno) and be a dangerous fucking pair to deal with. the guy has 90+ ships at the moment, and hes at Slavers Bay.

meanwhile in westeros, Stannis VS Freys & Manderlys (unless the manderlys turn on the freys as expected.) and im pretty sure that the karstark men are planning to murderfuck Stannis and co. as well

I honestly don't see Victarion making it out of the next book. I don't see Stannis going down very easy to anyone especially from someone trying to trick him. I think he has just the right amount of "I don't trust people" that he needs.

In the end I see only bad things coming to the Frey's... Roose I actually really like his character in the show.. I don't remember if I liked him in the books honestly. I guess they haven't shown him do anything too fucked up(well other then the whole red wedding thing) but honestly Robb was a dumbass... he won every battle but lost the war and pretty much just get the Stark Banner men slaughtered... everyone else had left by then.

Funkutron5000

06-05-2013, 09:24 PM

well, Roose did father that sick fuck bastard of his. Plus, his house sigil is the flayed man and I'm not sure he's very against torture.

citizen1080

06-05-2013, 11:00 PM

I didnt like roose in the books, but I did like him in the show...go figure.

Hasbinbad

06-05-2013, 11:13 PM

blah
shut up nerd, nobody is a robb fan. on purpose. like i said. the whole purpose of that character was dying.

Hasbinbad

06-05-2013, 11:14 PM

dany will kill victarion if he keeps to the old ways

Drayc

06-06-2013, 12:30 AM

well, Roose did father that sick fuck bastard of his. Plus, his house sigil is the flayed man and I'm not sure he's very against torture.

Well are we really upset at what his kid did to Theon? I mean really.... and I understand his house sigil is the flayed man... but did he come up with that as his house sigil? I think not.

Funkutron5000

06-06-2013, 11:59 AM

I wanna see Victarion and his dragon arm destroy the fuck outta things.

I also wanna see Ian McShane play Euron.

Hasbinbad

06-06-2013, 12:25 PM

http://teamcoco.com/video/conan-highlight-red-wedding-reactions/

Hasbinbad

06-06-2013, 12:28 PM

Moqorro will kill Vic before Dany would imo. then they could steal his ships. either way Victarions ships need to take this bitch to westeros.
I think you're seriously underestimating the Ironborn.

You have to remember that only Robert and Ned were able to put them down.

Robert and Ned's real power was sorely understated in the show, and we aren't being given reminders like the books, about all the battles they won by force.

Drayc

06-06-2013, 12:49 PM

I think you're seriously underestimating the Ironborn.

You have to remember that only Robert and Ned were able to put them down.

Robert and Ned's real power was sorely understated in the show, and we aren't being given reminders like the books, about all the battles they won by force.

Out of the ironborn characters I do like Vic the best... I just don't see how it turns out well for him. I think Moqorro is goong to be Danys red priest and deliver her a massive fleet of ships. Whats the game for vic here? Show up with his fleet and go heres your boats dragon lady... Hes going to want something in return and so far that hasnt worked out for the other party when dealing with dany...

Theres a ton of boats most agree this is how dany gets to westeros... I dont see there being room for the ironborn... Unsullied... Mercs...dothraki... And new free men that want to stick with her.

Sirken

06-06-2013, 01:01 PM

Out of the ironborn characters I do like Vic the best... I just don't see how it turns out well for him. I think Moqorro is goong to be Danys red priest and deliver her a massive fleet of ships. Whats the game for vic here? Show up with his fleet and go heres your boats dragon lady... Hes going to want something in return and so far that hasnt worked out for the other party when dealing with dany...

Theres a ton of boats most agree this is how dany gets to westeros... I dont see there being room for the ironborn... Unsullied... Mercs...dothraki... And new free men that want to stick with her.

same, Vic is my fav ironborn. Vic could try to strike a deal with Dany. (ie: make me king of the iron islands, and ill sail your ass back to westeros). it will work because hes not trying to marry or sex her up (ie: disrespectful).

90+ ships in the armada.. plus.. pirates. cram everybody on, and keep taking ships on the way back :)

Hasbinbad

06-06-2013, 01:02 PM

http://www.hbo.com/game-of-thrones/episodes/3/29-the-rains-of-castamere/interview/michelle-fairley?cmpid=ABC794

Hasbinbad

06-06-2013, 01:08 PM

sirken im ignoring everything you say about this chapter. first of all, i don't believe it's not a forgery. second of all, it might be cut outright if it is not a forgery. third of all it might get edited strongly before print even if it does not get cut and that only if it's not a forgery. kind of like jesus being resurrected from the dead.

anyway, im not saying it's wrong, but i think it's wrong to base any conversation on that in the first place, but also especially because only you know about it and so you're the gatekeeper of some kind of fantastical knowledge now, which i'm not down with in principle.

so if you would like to rephrase what you said, specifically in reference to the ironborn and rob and ned and the red priest, without bringing in this other "evidence" which none of us can see..

Hasbinbad

06-06-2013, 01:10 PM

Hasbinbad

06-06-2013, 01:12 PM

oh and bran.

Hasbinbad

06-06-2013, 01:12 PM

bran is gonna mindfuck a dragon.

Sirken

06-06-2013, 02:24 PM

sirken im ignoring everything you say about this chapter. first of all, i don't believe it's not a forgery.
it was released by GRRM on his website. was not a fake.

anyway, im not saying it's wrong, but i think it's wrong to base any conversation on that in the first place, but also especially because only you know about it and so you're the gatekeeper of some kind of fantastical knowledge now, which i'm not down with in principle.
lol im no mystical gatekeeper pal. the entire chapter is posted in this thread somewhere, go back and read it, it waits for you, it should also still be on grrms site. but the mystical places of knowledge are the official asoiaf wiki, and GRRMs page. you can visit these lands. we can even go together and make a date of it <3

so if you would like to rephrase what you said, specifically in reference to the ironborn and rob and ned and the red priest, without bringing in this other "evidence" which none of us can see..
i feel no need to rephrase what ive said. open your eye balls, and you too, shall see

Sirken

06-06-2013, 02:28 PM

In any case, if you're pitting ANYONE against the Ironborn on the sea .. i give 10:1 in favor of the ironborn ripping that entity to shreds. On land, Dany holds sway. I wouldn't put the red god against her.
dragons > ships
BUT they arent going to fight. they need each other. as far as the red priest, i think he was sent to convert Dany, similar to how Thoros was sent to convert Robert. we know the ironborn pwn on the sea because Victarion has 90+ ships. but in the barristan chapter, the men were off the boats and on the land. you know that theres also a victarion and a theon chapter hes released?

bran is gonna mindfuck a dragon.
Bran is going to mindfuck EVERYONE

the North remembers

Sirken

06-07-2013, 03:11 PM

soooooo..

million dollar question..

what will come first...

Book 6 or Season 4?

Drayc

06-07-2013, 03:14 PM

soooooo..

million dollar question..

what will come first...

Book 6 or Season 4?

Season 4... I think it will be closer to season 5... If they catch up and grrm is still around I'd love to see them do a season with egg and Dunc

Sirken

06-07-2013, 03:18 PM

HBO gave GRRM a 2yr dev contract for dunk and egg series.

ill look for a link

Sirken

06-07-2013, 03:22 PM

Season 4... I think it will be closer to season 5... If they catch up and grrm is still around I'd love to see them do a season with egg and Dunc

found the link - http://winteriscoming.net/2013/02/breaking-george-r-r-martin-signs-development-deal-with-hbo/

Drayc, check these out too

http://winteriscoming.net/2013/05/grrm-confirms-red-viper-mace-magnar-being-cast/
http://winteriscoming.net/2013/02/grrm-comments-on-his-tv-deal-with-hbo-says-dunk-egg-being-discussed/

citizen1080

06-07-2013, 10:55 PM

This is horrible news...someone fucking firebomb hbo so grrm will do nothing but finish the damn series of books.

Rain1

06-08-2013, 12:11 AM

I didn't discover this series until 2006 (college friend), but i can't imagine the pain and anger between books. I RAGED until book 5 came out. I read (hate tv) in my free time, so i burned through the series and got really upset that book 5 was not out. Only hope i have is he said both 6 and 7 will be tomes (1200pgs+ each). Makes me happy. Like i read all 3 mistborn in 2.5 weeks. That being said, Way of Kings was one of my favorite books, plz let the rest of the series be good. Don't rush Sanderson...

Sirken

06-08-2013, 12:14 AM

i agree. and thats sad, because id really love a dunk and egg show

citizen1080

06-08-2013, 12:14 AM

Mistborn is one of my favs. Check out codex of aleria by jim butcher...its $$ But so is his dresden series

Rain1

06-08-2013, 12:27 AM

Yep read everything that applies to Tavi. Liked the books very much, but I have never read any of the Dresden series...might have to check that out. I got SUPER disappointed recently because my library didn't have the 3rd and final book of the Auqasilva Trilogy. The 1st book is very well done, and the 2nd did not disappoint me either. But holy fuck i need closure lol!

citizen1080

06-08-2013, 02:16 AM

Dresden files def worth looking into..i just burned through all 14 books back to back. Series has got to be very good to keep my attention that long.

Sirken

06-09-2013, 02:20 PM

season finale tonght!

will we see RobbWind? will they toss Cat out the window?

more importantly, i think tonight is the night we see the first battle at the wall. you know, the one where the red head gets it ;)

Lojik

06-09-2013, 02:57 PM

Sirken

06-09-2013, 03:12 PM

Will we meet coldhands?

i have no idea at this point. i thought we would see coldhands already since Bran is nearly at the god damned wall already. HOPEFULLY they dont cut coldhands out of the show, which they could very well do.

all he really does is guide Sam to the wall, and guide Bran to Brynden Rivers (aka bloodraven, aka 3eyedcrow)

i know ALOT of people think Coldhands is Benjen, and that would make it impossible to cut Coldhands from the show. BUT, Coldhands CANNOT be Benjen, because Benjen has not nearly been dead long enough.

Coldhands seems to be a brother of the Night's Watch: he wears black and calls Samwell Tarly "brother." Therefore the dominant theory is that Coldhands is a dead or missing brother of the Night's Watch. Possibilities include:

Benjen Stark, who disappeared beyond the Wall during a ranging
Lord Commander Brynden "Bloodraven" Rivers
Ser Waymar Royce, who was killed by Others
Will, who was killed by Waymar Royce
The Night's King, who was a known consort of the Others

Evidence Against

Brynden the Bloodraven is very likely to be the Three-eyed crow, and so could not also be Coldhands.

The Night's King was said to be deposed, his name "wiped from the memory of man," which sounds like he was thoroughly destroyed and likely to have been burned if it was known he was consorting with the Others.

Leaf, the child of the forest Bran meets at the cave of the Last Greenseer, says of Coldhands: "They killed him long ago." Will, Waymar Royce and Benjen Stark died/went missing only two years prior, a small amount of time for someone over 200 years old.

Sirken

06-09-2013, 03:15 PM

personally, i think Coldhands = the Night's King

The Night's King is a legendary Lord Commander of the Night's Watch, who lived during the Age of Heroes.

History

According to legend, the Night's King lived during the Age of Heroes, not long after the Wall was complete. He was a fearless warrior, who was named the thirteenth Lord Commander of the Night's Watch. Later he fell in love with a woman "with skin as white as the moon and eyes like blue stars", he chased her and loved her though "her skin was cold as ice", and when he gave his seed to her he gave his soul as well. (Her description matches that of the Others.)

He brought her back to the Nightfort and after the unholy union, he declared himself king and her his queen, and ruled the Nightfort as his own castle for thirteen years. During the dark years of his reign, horrific atrocities were committed, of which tales are still told in the North. It was not until his own brother, the King in the North, and Joramun, the King-Beyond-the-Wall, joined forces that the Night's King was brought down and the Night's Watch freed. After his fall, when it was discovered that he had been sacrificing to the Others (possibly in similar way to Craster), all records of him were destroyed and his very name was forbidden. It is likely this led the lords of the North to forbid the Night's Watch to construct walls at their keeps, ensuring the keeps would always be accessible from the south.

Recent History

While on his way north, Bran Stark recalls stories told to the Stark children of the Night's King and the Nightfort by Old Nan, servant in Winterfell. She said some people believe the Night's King was a Bolton, a Magnar out of Skagos, an Umber, a Flint, a Norrey, or a Woodfoot, who ruled Bear Island before the ironmen came. However, she identifies the Night's King as a Stark of Winterfell and brother to the King of the North and hints his name too was Bran.

Lojik

06-09-2013, 03:52 PM

i have no idea at this point. i thought we would see coldhands already since Bran is nearly at the god damned wall already. HOPEFULLY they dont cut coldhands out of the show, which they could very well do.

all he really does is guide Sam to the wall, and guide Bran to Brynden Rivers (aka bloodraven, aka 3eyedcrow)

i know ALOT of people think Coldhands is Benjen, and that would make it impossible to cut Coldhands from the show. BUT, Coldhands CANNOT be Benjen, because Benjen has not nearly been dead long enough.

I think there are equal chances that Benjen:
is dead,we won't find out what happened
is dead, we find out what happened
is alive
is alive, but will die in the prologue of a future novel.

Sirken

06-09-2013, 04:17 PM

I think there are equal chances that Benjen:
is dead,we won't find out what happened
is dead, we find out what happened
is alive
is alive, but will die in the prologue of a future novel.

supposedly book 6 goes further north than we have ever been before. i suspect we will find out what happened to him in book 6, be it him dead or alive

Hasbinbad

06-09-2013, 05:15 PM

p sure benjen and cold hands part of A League of Extraordinary Nightswatchgentlemen

Hasbinbad

06-09-2013, 05:18 PM

running around in a steampunked airship / submarine

Hasbinbad

06-09-2013, 10:23 PM

so no coldhands

Sirken

06-10-2013, 02:13 AM

nah, looks like they might have cut him from the show

Drayc

06-10-2013, 10:28 AM

It was a slow episode but I thought it was really good...

I think the scene with Bran telling the story about the white rat and after that it cutting straight to walder Frey was perfect... And maybe an hint at what may happen to him.

The short amount Jaime was in the show I really liked... You can tell he is a different person.

Arya.... What more to say that little girls god is death...

Roose... I like him on the show... And he spoke the truth about Robb.. Basically he wouldn't have turned on him if he wasnt so stupid.

.... Um its been awhile what happens with the hound when Arya seperates from him I don't recall if he dies or not honestly.

Drayc

06-10-2013, 10:33 AM

.... Mum its been awhile what happens with the hound when Arya seperates from him I don't recall if he dies or not honestly.

Never mind I got it :-)

gotrocks

06-10-2013, 11:10 AM

so the real question is...

who wins the game of thrones?

Sularus Oth Mithas

06-10-2013, 02:10 PM

so the real question is...

who wins the game of thrones?

The extras. By the end of the series everyone is dead from fighting the whitewalkers and the extras are left to lead to lead the seven kingdoms.

Drayc

06-10-2013, 02:15 PM

so the real question is...

who wins the game of thrones?

Well this is an interesting question really.. I tend to think the major game players are Tywin, Varys, and Little finger ... Now i know there is Stanis and dany.. And we know what happens to Tywin but when it comes to playing the game I think we have yet to see what truely Varys has been up to.. But I think everything he has done has been for the Targaryens.

Ohh and again Davos is a badass

K|mm Barely

06-10-2013, 08:09 PM

Theory clarification time.

In the books I felt it was implied though not outright mentioned that Theon got his dick chopped off.

AMIRITE or reading comprehension fail

pls advise

Funkutron5000

06-10-2013, 08:17 PM

It was pretty heavily implied. Especially in the scene where Reek had to go all mouth-style on Jeyne Poole.

K|mm Barely

06-10-2013, 08:26 PM

thats right

intredasting

Sirken

06-12-2013, 11:51 AM

i enjoyed the finale.

love the "meat pie" foreshadowing. love that they explained guest rights finally.

FUCKING LOVE that Tywin essentially says, "the baby is fussy and needs a nap, escort the king to his room"

really like how they are setting up Shae.

But next season.... omg next season.. Oberyn Martell & Gregor, Purple Wedding, Tywin and Tyrion, Shae, Baelish & Lysa, Alayne Stone, Wildling attack from south, Ygritte. Wildling attack from north, Stannis. Arya & the hound.

oh fawk, im excited

Sirken

06-12-2013, 02:10 PM

And you only have to wait a year...

10months isnt anything compared to waiting on these books

/wrist

Drayc

06-12-2013, 02:37 PM

Sirken

06-12-2013, 04:02 PM

Yep next season is gonna rock

i feel bad for non readers a lil bit here. the first half of book 3 (everything up to the RW) is slow as hell. its a bunch of assholes walking around talking to each other. then the RW happens, and the time for talking was over.. the entire second half should be action packed (except for Dany who has a lot more walking around to do).

but i feel like non readers kinda got cheated this season.

Funkutron5000

06-12-2013, 04:09 PM

i feel bad for non readers a lil bit here. the first half of book 3 (everything up to the RW) is slow as hell. its a bunch of assholes walking around talking to each other. then the RW happens, and the time for talking was over.. the entire second half should be action packed (except for Dany who has a lot more walking around to do).

but i feel like non readers kinda got cheated this season.

Dany doesn't just have to walk. She has to constantly shit her pants in the desert while doing that walking!

Hasbinbad

06-12-2013, 05:17 PM

are they going to split the stories in 4/5?

Sirken

06-13-2013, 05:50 PM

are they going to split the stories in 4/5?

nope! they are recombining 4 and 5 so and the TV series will follow a chronological timeline (as opposed to following geography like the books did). and quite honestly, im glad to hear it.

heard in an interview with D&D that they think the story from books 4 and 5 will be told in 3 seasons on HBO. which means in 4-5 years, the show will have surpassed the books. because theres 0% chance of GRRM finishing 6, and completing book 7 in four to five years. simply 0%.

(i say four or five years because i gotta believe theres a chance that each book (4 and 5) could still be given two seasons each).

Elderan

06-14-2013, 04:40 PM

nope! they are recombining 4 and 5 so and the TV series will follow a chronological timeline (as opposed to following geography like the books did). and quite honestly, im glad to hear it.

heard in an interview with D&D that they think the story from books 4 and 5 will be told in 3 seasons on HBO. which means in 4-5 years, the show will have surpassed the books. because theres 0% chance of GRRM finishing 6, and completing book 7 in four to five years. simply 0%.

(i say four or five years because i gotta believe theres a chance that each book (4 and 5) could still be given two seasons each).

Really? I heard that season 4 will be the second half of book 3 and some of book 4. Season 5 will be book 4 and 5 combined and streamlined. Also that they want to finish the series in 8 seasons.

Season 4 (2014) - Parts of Books 3 and 4
Season 5 (2015) - Parts of Book 4 and 5
Season 6 (2016) - Book 6
Season 7 (2017) - Parts of Book 6 and 7
Season 8 (2018) - Book 7

Book 6 - Late 2014 or early 2015
Book 7 - 2017 to 2018

Noselacri

06-17-2013, 07:51 PM

It'd be pretty weird to have the TV show span a decade when only like a year passes in the story. Imagine a 25 year-old Maisie Williams playing Arya? The biggest obstacle to the TV show will be the insane amount of time that passes between book releases, and the existence of the show only makes the delay longer as the author has to spend a bunch of time on things other than writing. There were like what, seven years between two of these books? It's a really good show, but I think they'll have a hard time continuing it in the long term because they chose a series of books that hasn't been finished yet and is being written by an author who is notorious for taking for-fucking-ever to release new volumes.

gotrocks

06-17-2013, 11:35 PM

sirken, dont you dare say anything about GRRm dying on us before this damn series is finished.

you, me, and every other ASOIAF fan is thinking it, but dont ever speak it lest it may come true.

Sirken

06-18-2013, 12:56 PM

sirken, dont you dare say anything about GRRm dying on us before this damn series is finished.

you, me, and every other ASOIAF fan is thinking it, but dont ever speak it lest it may come true.

haha fair enough

Hasbinbad

06-28-2013, 05:48 PM

http://i.imgur.com/Pfs2Hoa.png

http://moshi-kun.tumblr.com/

Dalven

06-30-2013, 10:56 AM

So have finally caught up on the 20 pages of this thread that I've missed while being behind on the TV show. Moar walls of text.

Rickon's goodbye to Bran was pretty soul crushing. I'm so sad that we only get the one event that kicks off the rest of the awesomness in SoS this season and have to wait another damned 10 months for the rest of it to unfold. Here's hoping for a shot of Stoneheart opening her eyes to end the season!

as far as the GoT show.. i wonder when we see Stoneheart. that bitch appears at the epilogue of book 3, however, Stoneheart is created only a few days after the Red Wedding. so theres no reason why they have to wait til the end

I hope they end the next season with Stoneheart hanging Freys - was an awesome way to ASOS. It doesn't necessarily need to be left that long though, particularly if season 4 runs into AFFC.

fucking Wyman Manderly.... GET YOUR MEAT PIES! [quote]

One of my favourite scenes of ADWD. Manderly stepped up his awesomeness tenfold with that display.

[quote=sirken]id bet money Jack Gleeson has had shit thrown at him on the street.

Guy is awesome as Joffrey.

I honestly don't see Victarion making it out of the next book. I don't see Stannis going down very easy to anyone especially from someone trying to trick him. I think he has just the right amount of "I don't trust people" that he needs.

I don't see his life expectancy being too long but he will be making big ripples. I wonder what effect his mad new hand will have on him. I'm also interested to see how Euron is going to play into this - he clearly knows Victarion hates him yet trusts him on a mission half way around the world. Victarion is planning on betraying Euron, and Euron wouldn't be half the blue lipped clever bastard he is if hasn't predicted and planned for this.

On the subject of blue lips I've heard a crackpot that Euron is actually Pyatt Pree, signified by the blue lips. In AFFC its mentioned that Euron got the warlock juice from 3 warlocks he captured in the East - the theory goes that at this point Pyatt actually killed Euron and is using his form as a means to get to Daenarys in some fashion. I don't know what significance the dragon horn and Victarion's mission plays into this theory. Even if this isn't the case, Euron's end game is something to think about.

i think Moqorro is the strongest red priest we've seen so far as he is the #2 priest in the entire red religion. i've seen a chapter from book 6 (it was a barriston chapter) where Barristan sees the ironborn in Mereen. the problem is that Dany is not in Mereen atm. so that gives Barristan and Victarion a common goal (they are both trying to get to Dany), and will allow them to work together to either find her or kill her harpy husband and his minions. Eventually Dany will return to mereen after her dragon kills Khal Jhoqo (might be spelled wrong) and she takes his khalasar (they follow power and dragons = power). i would believe this would give enough time for the story to some how get Tyrion and Jorah back to Mereen as well so that they can reunite with Dany before she sails off to westeros on Victarion's ships, at which time i imagine Tyrion will tell Dany about Aegon

There have been a number of mentions of the "Demon Road" between Meereen and Volantis - I get the feeling we might see some of this before Dany gets back to Westeros. I'm not convinced that Victarion and however many of his ships survive the battle will be enough to take an all conquering force back to Westeros. Particularly if Dany picks up the Dothraki as well.

i know ALOT of people think Coldhands is Benjen, and that would make it impossible to cut Coldhands from the show. BUT, Coldhands CANNOT be Benjen, because Benjen has not nearly been dead long enough.

I think however we see Benjen he's going to be in a bit of a mess. He's been gone a long time, too long to be running in the far north amongst the Others guerilla style. I don't think he's dead but he's definitely gonna be in some kind of fucked up situation. I like the idea of Coldhands being the Night King.

In the books I felt it was implied though not outright mentioned that Theon got his dick chopped off.

Aye this is the case. I'm not particularly enjoying Theon's descent into Reek, it can be some pretty difficult viewing. I do like that they haven't held back on Ramsay's craziness though. I don't see how they are going to keep this up for another 2 seasons until Reek rejoins the story in ADWD.

and speaking of the show, A+ job on the merging of Edric and Gendry. Edric was sent away to Lys and out of the story. Gendry does nothing for a bit, so he fills in for Edric on dragonstone, and then should end up back with Thoros and the brotherhood and the Gendry story can continue as planned.

Yeah, when they pulled Gendry out I was a bit like wtf, but I can see how they are going to pull this back together and its not badly done at all.

Some other stuff:

Was interesting seeing Robb's wife at the Red Wedding. One of the theories floating around is that Jeyne Westerling is actually pregnant and is being hidden from the Lannisters (based of a lot of vague clues about varying descriptions of hips and numbers of Westerling daughters. What impact it would have relatively I'm not sure, or why her parents who I always thought of as being involved in the Red Wedding would be helping her hid it.)

Robb's proclamation about his heir - in the books he draws up a succession plan in the event of his death and sends it of with one of the Mormont chicks to Howland Reed at Greywater Watch. This is generally thought to be Jon after the discussion he has with Catelyn about it. I don't remember seeing this in the TV series.

Asha (or whatever she is called on the show) is off to the Dreadfort to rescue Theon. This is a bit of a departure from her attitude in the books and a bit of a change to her storyline - I wonder where they are going with this?

Can anyone think of any other examples of changes made to the show which may affect what we know/predict the book storyline will go?

Sirken

07-02-2013, 01:11 PM

I hope they end the next season with Stoneheart hanging Freys - was an awesome way to ASOS. It doesn't necessarily need to be left that long though, particularly if season 4 runs into AFFC.
I "hope" you are right. but from a financial/producer point of view, its a waste of money to have an actress under contract, and only use her for the last 10 min of the last episode. so we shall see.

I don't see his life expectancy being too long but he will be making big ripples. I wonder what effect his mad new hand will have on him. I'm also interested to see how Euron is going to play into this - he clearly knows Victarion hates him yet trusts him on a mission half way around the world. Victarion is planning on betraying Euron, and Euron wouldn't be half the blue lipped clever bastard he is if hasn't predicted and planned for this.
define long. will he grow to be an old man, probably not. but none of Dany's people are sailors, and none of them are pirates. dont forget it wasnt exactly an easy peaceful voyage to sail out to slavers bay. Dany needs Victarion to get back to Westeros. theres simply no other option for her to go to westeros (short of GRRM introducing a new character). on the flip side, Victarion needs Dany as well. Euron's plans do not include Victarion past a certain point and Victarion is well aware of that. im 100% convinced that Vic helps Dany to Westeros in exchange for (fill in the blank).

On the subject of blue lips I've heard a crackpot that Euron is actually Pyatt Pree, signified by the blue lips. In AFFC its mentioned that Euron got the warlock juice from 3 warlocks he captured in the East - the theory goes that at this point Pyatt actually killed Euron and is using his form as a means to get to Daenarys in some fashion. I don't know what significance the dragon horn and Victarion's mission plays into this theory. Even if this isn't the case, Euron's end game is something to think about.
never heard this theory.. but i kinda like it in a "i'm going to look into this" kind of way. ill let u know if i can dig up anything fun/useful.

There have been a number of mentions of the "Demon Road" between Meereen and Volantis - I get the feeling we might see some of this before Dany gets back to Westeros. I'm not convinced that Victarion and however many of his ships survive the battle will be enough to take an all conquering force back to Westeros. Particularly if Dany picks up the Dothraki as well.
i dont recall the demon road :( at the end of book 5, Victarion is in Slavers Bay and can see Mereen. there is nothing between him and the city at that point. the only battle awaiting him is on land, in Mereen (we know this also based on the Barriston chapter (bk6) that GRRM released on his website). we also know that Victarion has over 90 ships, but that most of them are trade galleys being run by skeleton crews. mathematically, and assuming they are using ships from the 1600s or early 1700s, i dont see how you can fit more than 27,000 people into 90 ships. 52,000 if everybody sits in somebody elses lap. Dany should have roughly 8,000 unsullied, 2,000 secondsons, 3 dragons, about ~40,000 Dothraki (assuming Jhoqo kept most of Drogos khalasar together after Drogo's death. Who knows i suppose.

I think however we see Benjen he's going to be in a bit of a mess. He's been gone a long time, too long to be running in the far north amongst the Others guerilla style. I don't think he's dead but he's definitely gonna be in some kind of fucked up situation. I like the idea of Coldhands being the Night King.
haha, to be fair, i never said Benjen would be ok :P i just think we will learn what happened. and Pras the Night King aka Coldhands.

Was interesting seeing Robb's wife at the Red Wedding. One of the theories floating around is that Jeyne Westerling is actually pregnant and is being hidden from the Lannisters (based of a lot of vague clues about varying descriptions of hips and numbers of Westerling daughters. What impact it would have relatively I'm not sure, or why her parents who I always thought of as being involved in the Red Wedding would be helping her hid it.)
i use to subscribe to this. but GRRM said in an interview after S3E9 that the mismatched descriptions could be chalked up to him making a mistake, OR to Catelyn and Jaime having different opinions about what consitutes "good child bearing hips". but yea, in the books, her mom plotted with Tywin because her family is sworn banner of the lannisters.

Robb's proclamation about his heir - in the books he draws up a succession plan in the event of his death and sends it of with one of the Mormont chicks to Howland Reed at Greywater Watch. This is generally thought to be Jon after the discussion he has with Catelyn about it. I don't remember seeing this in the TV series.
this one bothers me a lot, as ive been waiting on word of what happened with this since book 3. i have to imagine it wont come up in the books again if it was cleared to be cut out of the show.

Asha (or whatever she is called on the show) is off to the Dreadfort to rescue Theon. This is a bit of a departure from her attitude in the books and a bit of a change to her storyline - I wonder where they are going with this?
i imagine this is being done so that theres some sembelence of a story to actually tell on the Ramsay/Reek/Theon evolution. aside from toture+torture+moreTorture

Sirken

07-02-2013, 01:12 PM

Can anyone think of any other examples of changes made to the show which may affect what we know/predict the book storyline will go?

yea.. everything to do with Rickon after Ramsay's men burnt down Winterfell

Dalven

07-03-2013, 08:25 PM

I "hope" you are right. but from a financial/producer point of view, its a waste of money to have an actress under contract, and only use her for the last 10 min of the last episode. so we shall see.

Another fair point on the realities of TV production. If Season 4 covers the period of time in the latter half of book 3 and the early part of book 4 I don't really know how they'll fit in more than a couple of dead Cat appearances. Maybe they'll show this from Gendry's perspective if they can get him back to the Brotherhood without it being to contrived.

define long. will he grow to be an old man, probably not. but none of Dany's people are sailors, and none of them are pirates. dont forget it wasnt exactly an easy peaceful voyage to sail out to slavers bay. Dany needs Victarion to get back to Westeros. theres simply no other option for her to go to westeros (short of GRRM introducing a new character). on the flip side, Victarion needs Dany as well. Euron's plans do not include Victarion past a certain point and Victarion is well aware of that. im 100% convinced that Vic helps Dany to Westeros in exchange for (fill in the blank).

True, I'm maybe not giving the Iron Born enough credit here. Victarion helping Dany get back to Westeros is a given - maybe I'm giving Euron too much credit but I would have thought he would anticipate Victarion's betrayal, his hatred of Euron isn't a secret. Euron couldn't have predicted Victarion's smoking hand, I'm interested to see what effect Moqorro's magic will have on Victarion.

never heard this theory.. but i kinda like it in a "i'm going to look into this" kind of way. ill let u know if i can dig up anything fun/useful.

I'm sure I read about it on the Westeros forums - in fairness every possible outcome has probably been debated a thousand times over there. The fact that Euron is drinking warlock juice in the first place has got to be placing some significance behind his plan other than simply conquering/plundering the south.

i dont recall the demon road at the end of book 5, Victarion is in Slavers Bay and can see Mereen. there is nothing between him and the city at that point. the only battle awaiting him is on land, in Mereen (we know this also based on the Barriston chapter (bk6) that GRRM released on his website). we also know that Victarion has over 90 ships, but that most of them are trade galleys being run by skeleton crews. mathematically, and assuming they are using ships from the 1600s or early 1700s, i dont see how you can fit more than 27,000 people into 90 ships. 52,000 if everybody sits in somebody elses lap. Dany should have roughly 8,000 unsullied, 2,000 secondsons, 3 dragons, about ~40,000 Dothraki (assuming Jhoqo kept most of Drogos khalasar together after Drogo's death. Who knows i suppose.

I'm sure it was in the Tyrion chapters - possibly when he was in Volantis or when he was with Connington and Aegon discussing how they were going to get the Golden Company to Meereen or possibly both. Needing to do another read of the books this year to refresh my memory!

i use to subscribe to this. but GRRM said in an interview after S3E9 that the mismatched descriptions could be chalked up to him making a mistake, OR to Catelyn and Jaime having different opinions about what consitutes "good child bearing hips". but yea, in the books, her mom plotted with Tywin because her family is sworn banner of the lannisters.

I've also seen that. Another connection I've wondered about is between the Westerling wife and the witch that curses Cersei - again this is half remembered but if I recall correctly is that its mentioned that the Westerling Lord married beneath himself to a wealthy trader family of foreign descent from Lannisport as the Westerlings are skint. I can't quite remember if the witch fits in with this but I seem to remember making the connection that the Westerling wife was her grand daughter or something. Whether that is the case or if it even has any relevance is debatable.

this one bothers me a lot, as ive been waiting on word of what happened with this since book 3. i have to imagine it wont come up in the books again if it was cleared to be cut out of the show.

It must come up again - with the Reeds connections to the Starks and the possibility of other knowledge about Jon we've got to be getting some input from Howland Reed somewhere down the line.

yea.. everything to do with Rickon after Ramsay's men burnt down Winterfell

I think I'm missing something - not sure what you are getting at here

Sirken

07-08-2013, 03:37 AM

Another fair point on the realities of TV production. If Season 4 covers the period of time in the latter half of book 3 and the early part of book 4 I don't really know how they'll fit in more than a couple of dead Cat appearances. Maybe they'll show this from Gendry's perspective if they can get him back to the Brotherhood without it being to contrived.
i imagine he will get back as thats where gendry is in the books and hes finished with his edric storm role. we shouldnt see too much stoneheart. she needs to be mysterious in way. and i agree we'd see it from gendrys PoV.

True, I'm maybe not giving the Iron Born enough credit here. Victarion helping Dany get back to Westeros is a given - maybe I'm giving Euron too much credit but I would have thought he would anticipate Victarion's betrayal, his hatred of Euron isn't a secret. Euron couldn't have predicted Victarion's smoking hand, I'm interested to see what effect Moqorro's magic will have on Victarion.
i dont think he expects Vic to survive. and if he does, i expect he will continue to send Vic on errands away from the iron islands. the hand will be interesting for sure. but i dont expect Moqorro to stay with Vic. he was sent to seek out Dany, and Moqorro is using Vic to as a way to get where he needs to go.

I'm sure I read about it on the Westeros forums - in fairness every possible outcome has probably been debated a thousand times over there. The fact that Euron is drinking warlock juice in the first place has got to be placing some significance behind his plan other than simply conquering/plundering the south.
didnt look yet, but still really curious on this. really love where your head is at

I've also seen that. Another connection I've wondered about is between the Westerling wife and the witch that curses Cersei - again this is half remembered but if I recall correctly is that its mentioned that the Westerling Lord married beneath himself to a wealthy trader family of foreign descent from Lannisport as the Westerlings are skint. I can't quite remember if the witch fits in with this but I seem to remember making the connection that the Westerling wife was her grand daughter or something. Whether that is the case or if it even has any relevance is debatable.
honestly the first time i heard this, but ill look into it because im interested. but im honestly starting to think we the fans built robbs wife into a much more important person than GRRM did.

It must come up again - with the Reeds connections to the Starks and the possibility of other knowledge about Jon we've got to be getting some input from Howland Reed somewhere down the line.
must it? stannis essentially made the same offer to Jon, so its out there regardless. and honestly, we have all seen how well a piece of paper holds up versus the lannisters (unless of course it was written by Tywin).

ill add to this, just wanted to touch on it and bump the thread ;)

Agatha

07-08-2013, 06:15 AM

this thread has probably been one of the most sperg filled thread i have ever come across and i have only read the last page.

its kinda cute and pretty sexy in a wierd way, sirken you are cute :)

Sirken

07-08-2013, 03:28 PM

I'm sure I read about it on the Westeros forums - in fairness every possible outcome has probably been debated a thousand times over there. The fact that Euron is drinking warlock juice in the first place has got to be placing some significance behind his plan other than simply conquering/plundering the south.

so, in book 4,
Euron returned to the isles the day after Balon's death. The timing of his return was questioned by some. He claimed to have traveled all over the world during his exile, including a trip to the feared ruins of Valyria. He also captured and holds hostage several warlocks of Qarth, who may have coached him in black magic.

couldnt find much on demon road, but didnt really look hard, seems it was only ever mentioned twice, both in book 5. chapters 6 & 16
The Valyrian road that connects Volantis to Meereen, going east from Volantis, is commonly known as the demon road because it is such a dangerous way. It runs through Mantarys and the runes of Bhorash.

as for robbs wife being related to maggy the frog, is it possible that theories got mixed up because cersei went with her friend Jeyne to see the woodswitch?
As a girl, Cersei Lannister sought Maggy after hearing rumours about her magical powers. Cersei and her friends Jeyne Farman and Melara Hetherspoon went to her during the tourney held in honour of King Aerys II's visit to the West, at which Cersei became enamoured of Prince Rhaegar.

Jeyne fled the scene at the sight of Maggy's yellow eyes. Maggy initially refused to tell the futures of the remaining girls, but grudgingly agreed faced with Cersei's threats. She allowed Cersei three questions and made the prophecy of the valonqar (High Valyrian for "little brother"), which haunted Cersei thereafter. When Melara took her turn, Maggy predicted that she would die young, and hinted that it would be by Cersei's hand. Dissatisfied, Cersei threw a jar of potion into Maggy's eyes and fled, leaving Maggy to curse them both.

Prophecies

Cersei's queenship: A younger, more beautiful queen will be Cersei's undoing.
Cersei:"When will I wed the prince?"
Maggy:"Never. You will wed the king."
Cersei:"I will be queen, though?"
Maggy:"Aye. Queen you shall be... until there comes another, younger and more beautiful, to cast you down and take all that you hold dear."

Cersei's children: Cersei will outlast her children and die by the hands of the valonqar.
Cersei:"Will the king and I have children?"
Maggy:"Oh, aye. Six-and-ten for him, and three for you."
Maggy:"Gold shall be their crowns and gold their shrouds," she said. "And when your tears have drowned you, the valonqar shall wrap his hands about your pale white throat and choke the life from you." ”

Melara's marriage: She later fell down a well and drowned.
Melara:""Will I marry Jaime?"
Maggy:"Not Jaime, nor any other man, Worms will have your maidenhead. Your death is here tonight, little one. Can you smell her breath? She is very close."

Dalven

07-16-2013, 11:16 AM

Bumpage

so, in book 4,
as for robbs wife being related to maggy the frog, is it possible that theories got mixed up because cersei went with her friend Jeyne to see the woodswitch?

I haven't had a chance to go digging through the books to answer this properly but the connection I made was that Jeyne Westerling's mother was a descendent from trading settlers in Lannisport, and I had thought the description of Maggy tied into this. I don't think it has a particular bearing on the story although I thought it was a nice little connection. I'll either corroborate or refute myself soon!

Prophecies

Cersei's queenship: A younger, more beautiful queen will be Cersei's undoing.
Cersei:"When will I wed the prince?"
Maggy:"Never. You will wed the king."
Cersei:"I will be queen, though?"
Maggy:"Aye. Queen you shall be... until there comes another, younger and more beautiful, to cast you down and take all that you hold dear."

Cersei's children: Cersei will outlast her children and die by the hands of the valonqar.
Cersei:"Will the king and I have children?"
Maggy:"Oh, aye. Six-and-ten for him, and three for you."
Maggy:"Gold shall be their crowns and gold their shrouds," she said. "And when your tears have drowned you, the valonqar shall wrap his hands about your pale white throat and choke the life from you." ”

Melara's marriage: She later fell down a well and drowned.
Melara:""Will I marry Jaime?"
Maggy:"Not Jaime, nor any other man, Worms will have your maidenhead. Your death is here tonight, little one. Can you smell her breath? She is very close."

While on the subject of Maggy's prophecies it'll be interesting to see how these play out.

Queen: Daenaerys? I have a feeling from Cersei's position at the end of ADWD that Margaery may not be the one, depending on how the trial with Robert Strong goes.

Children dying: Will be sad to see poor Tommen get the chop. Myrcella has also already had it pretty rough.

Valonqar: Surely has to be Jaime - as much as Tyrion would be willing I think this will be one of the culminations of Jaime's arc.

Funkutron5000

07-16-2013, 01:07 PM

I'm just excited for the new Dunk and Egg to come out. She Wolves of Winterfell should be awesome.

Dalven

07-16-2013, 05:48 PM

I'm just excited for the new Dunk and Egg to come out. She Wolves of Winterfell should be awesome.

With you on this for sure - its a shame its been cut from Dangerous Women so who knows when it'll be out now. Bran's vision in ADWD about the tall knight only whets the appetite for this.

Loli Pops

07-24-2013, 10:09 PM

Star Wars vs Game of Thrones

http://imgur.com/gallery/L0FzX

Dalven

07-26-2013, 01:45 PM

This one is my favourite:

http://i.imgur.com/HVgT5cc.jpg

Sirken

08-12-2013, 07:56 PM

I'm just excited for the new Dunk and Egg to come out. She Wolves of Winterfell should be awesome.

i just want to read about the tragedy at summerhall. and how brienne is related to duncan the tall.

Sirken

08-13-2013, 11:32 AM

i just want to read about the tragedy at summerhall. and how brienne is related to duncan the tall.

so this got me thinking what else id love to read about. the #1 answer for me is Roberts Rebellion and the events leading up to it. lets say everything starting at the Tourney at Harrenhal, and then ending pretty shortly after the events that take place at the Tower of Joy.

this is the #1 story i wish i could read about that i currently can not.

and so i ask, what story / events would u most like to read about that arent currently possible (and dont say book 6!)

Funkutron5000

08-13-2013, 11:45 AM

The Night's King and/ or the full tale of the original Azor Azai

Dalven

08-15-2013, 12:19 PM

Robert's Rebellion is definitely up there - must have been an absolute shit storm. I would also like to see Aegon's Conquest and the Doom. Hopefully we'll get some of this in the World of Ice and Fire thing.

On a different note has anyone played the AGOT mod for Crusader Kings 2? Entertaining stuff.

Lu|z Sect

08-31-2013, 07:28 PM

http://i.imgur.com/p23K7Tl.gif

http://i.imgur.com/tZLj5ST.png

Sirken

10-23-2013, 03:32 PM

so it looks like my lil theory (below) was shot to hell this week by HBO producer Frank Doelger.

Season 1 (2011) - Book 1
Season 2 (2012) - Book 2
Season 3 (2013) - First Half of Book 3
Season 4 (2014) - Second Half of Book 3
Season 5 (2015) - First Half of Book 4, Early Parts of Book 5
BOOK 6 RELEASED
Season 6 (2016) - Second Half of Book 4, Middle Parts of Book 5
Season 7 (2017) - Last Third of Book 5 (the timelines reunite around page 700)
Season 8 (2018) - First Half of Book 6
Season 9 (2019) - Second Half of Book 6
Season 10 (2020) - First Half of Book 7
BOOK 7 RELEASED
Season 11 (2021) - Second Half of Book 7

my above theory ^ has been confirmed wrong by HBO

***Taken from http://io9.com/game-of-thrones-will-end-with-season-7-according-to-pr-508275905 ***

We've all been wondering how the Game of Thrones TV show will end. Will George R.R. Martin finish the book series in time? Will HBO try to pad it out? Will it be canceled? Now we have an answer — assuming all goes well. the show will last seven seasons, according to producer Frank Doelger.
"[The number of series] is being discussed as we speak. The third season was the first half of book three, season four will be the second part of book three. . . George R.R. Martin has written books four and five; six and seven are pending," Doelger told Radio Times at the BAFTA Awards last weekend. "I would hope that, if we all survive and if the audience stays with us, we'll probably get through to seven seasons."

This is absolutely a good thing, but the gent at Rolling Stone worries about cramming the events of the fourth and fifth books, A Feast for Crows and A Dance with Dragons, into one season. I wouldn't worry; the show will almost certainly use some of AFfC and ADwD's storylines in season 4, to make sure all the main characters have a story arc; more to the point, AFfC and ADwD are essentially one long book, oddly separated, and are mostly a repositioning of the pieces (if you will) for the final act.

I have little doubt that it can be streamlined, especially given how well D.B. Weiss and David Benioff have been at creating new storylines for the season that still resonates with GRRM's original work. I have zero doubt they'll have all the characters where they need to be, physically and emotionally, once season 6 begins, even if they take different paths to get there.

---------------

*** and then from http://www.pinkisthenewblog.com/2013-05-18/producers-reveal-that-game-of-thrones-will-end-after-7-seasons ***

Seven books, seven seasons – that’s the hope for Game of Thrones producer Frank Doelger. The HBO series based on George R.R. Martin’s fantasy novel series A Song of Ice and Fire has its sights set on seven seasons, which would match the number of planned entries in the book series. “[The number of series] is being discussed as we speak. The third season was the first half of book three, season four will be the second part of book three. . . George R.R. Martin has written books four and five; six and seven are pending,” Doelger told Radio Times at the BAFTA Awards last weekend. “I would hope that, if we all survive and if the audience stays with us, we’ll probably get through to seven seasons.” Seven seasons would create a potentially awkward timeline for Game of Thrones: Season Three and Season Four split the series’ third novel, A Storm of Swords, into two parts, meaning one future season might have to pack in two books’ worth of material to make the fit.

Sidelle

10-23-2013, 04:21 PM

Sidelle

10-23-2013, 04:26 PM

This one is my favourite:

http://i.imgur.com/HVgT5cc.jpg

Haha! Love this. I know, delayed reaction but I haven't lurked in this thread for a long time. :D

Sirken

10-24-2013, 02:17 AM

I really hope they can pull it off. I hate the thought of this story being crammed into 7 seasons. It's such an epic series and it's been my favorite for years. It would be a shame if they mess it up.

another thing i worry about is that the show runners (David and Dan) have constantly said "if we can just get to the red wedding, and pull it off, we can die happy". and thats starting to worry me a bit. what if they lose interest after finishing the awesomeness that is the rest of book 3. i know book 4 is a lot of new people and places and a lot of walking around and talking and other bullshit.

but i just dont see how they can pull it off without cutting out a TON of stuff.

unless they up the amount of episodes to 13, OR if they split seasons like Sopranos Season 6A and 6B

i dunno.

Retti_

10-24-2013, 02:30 AM

Everquest

Tenlaar

10-24-2013, 05:42 AM

Damn, when I took a break from the game I completely forgot about this thread. And now I've read the last 30 friggin pages and I want to talk about stuff, so I'm gonna! Just a couple of things though.

any idea what Melisandre was talking about when she was talking about the "eyes" staring back at her from inside Arya?

I didn't notice anybody else mention this, but I thought that she was referring to Nymeria. I don't think it's ever actually been adressed but I've always assumed that, as the Starks could see through the eyes of their direwolves, so could the direwolves see through the Starks.

And it never occured to me until I read page 51, but...

Cersei's children: Cersei will outlast her children and die by the hands of the valonqar.
Cersei:"Will the king and I have children?"
Maggy:"Oh, aye. Six-and-ten for him, and three for you."
Maggy:"Gold shall be their crowns and gold their shrouds," she said. "And when your tears have drowned you, the valonqar shall wrap his hands about your pale white throat and choke the life from you." ”

It's funny reading the wording of the prophecy now, knowing what we know. She didn't ask "will the king and I have children together", and the answer gives them seperate and unrelated children. But the thing I noticed is "shall wrap his handS." We know valonqar is high Valyrian for little brother, but...only one of her little brothers still has multiple hands capable of wrapping and I find it hard to believe that Tyrion is going to strangle Shae, kill his father, AND choke his sister to death with his bare hands. It made me start trying to think of who else is a little brother, and maybe has a splash of Targaryen blood in them. After looking at the family tree that could include Aegon (if he's a real Targaryen), Varys (if he's a Blackfyre and his sister was older), even Gendry (if he's not the oldest of Robert's bastard children).

I know that's a little random but ermagherd, I haven't talked about this stuff in so long.