A few questions reguarding Classes.

[Blackdog22]

Okay. I know I want to play either a Shaman, Bard, or Shadowknight. I love having multiple roles I can accomplish. My main area of focus right now is damage. I know Shamans can buff and slow, and Bards can Mez, buff, Slow(though not as good), Pull, and Shadowknights can Pull and Tank.

My curiosity is which one of these can effectively take on the role of a damage dealer without being laughed at?

[eqdruid76]

Frankly, none of them. Of course people will argue and cite examples of their own leet damage, but 99 out of 100 PUGs are never going to say "we need a shammie, bard or SK for DPS).

Having said that, there are a ton of shaman on this server who think they are melee dps, and refuse to do anything else in groups. I strongly advise you stay off that list of asshats. :P

[Blackdog22]

Yeah. I figured solely DPS is gonna be hard to pull off. I will narrow my question down to "Which of these classes can DPS decently while fulfilling their roles? Would they all be pretty similiar in damage?

[Skope]

A shaman will never be DPS, though if you're not melee-ing as a shaman if you're not the MH in group then you're doing it wrong. You melee not to be the #1 DPS in the group, but you can certainly help. With a blight and around 160 dex, 200 str a pet i can put in my fair share of damage done to a mob.

The Sk will put in the most dps of those 3, unless you want to count a bard charming, in which case the bard will by far.

[Blackdog22]

Thanks a lot Skope that really helped narrow it down. I definitely know a mage and wizard would destroy a hybrid. (which is why I love this game) I just like to get some damage in their as well. While helping the group in other ways.

[Blackdog22]

You also say Melee as a Shaman. Do they generally not use there nukes?

[eqdruid76]

/agree with Skope.

I would recommend bard based off the completely made-up statistic that SKs outnumber bards 4:1 on this server. At any rate, bards are playable now.

[astarothel]

you better learn to twist real fast if you're gonna play a bard. or you can join the legion of bad bards out there that can't manage to do that.

[Branaddar]

Yeah, frankly, you're gonna probably get kicked out of groups if you're trying to DPS with any of those. Bard would be your best bet for the most DPS-like role. But you'll probably be pulling and twisting songs and crowd control in your average group before you're considered DPS. Though you will still be meleeing and throwing songs that will buff everyone's damage in the long run.

[eqdruid76]

You also say Melee as a Shaman. Do they generally not use there nukes?

Highly mana inefficient. So are the DOTS, imho. Shaman had it rough in the early days.

[Skope]

You use your nukes, but because you can cannibalize/chloro for mana regen it's not needed to sit and med the entire time. In groups where there's a cleric healing i always have more than enough mana to keep the entire group buffed/hasted and melee/nuke and still plenty for off-heals. In classic mobs generally don't hit hard/have enough HP to warrant a slow in a group scenario, so it frees up quite a bit of mana to nuke.

[YendorLootmonkey]

If playing many different roles appeals to you, try a ranger. Hear me out:

You can DPS (dual wield/double attack), tank (in a pinch... not as efficiently as a plate class, but boy you sure won't lose aggro), pull aggro off casters near instantly (yay Flame Lick!), crowd control via rootparking, some buffing ability, track/pull (esp. in outdoors with bow/arrow & harmony & at later levels SoW), snare runners, spot heals, lots of utility spells, etc.

Plenty of ranger haters on the server, but I played a ranger to 65/250AA and never once regretted it, and never died unless it was my own mistake/stupidity.

[guineapig]

Don't ever bother to use dots in a normal exp group. If you do the math and watch the amount of tics before the mob is dead your nuke does way more damage then the dot has a chance to. Same goes for any class that has the option between dots and nukes.

Bard dot is a different story since it's free to cast but you get more DPS out of twisting a Damage shield, strength/haste, mana song, heal song. The last 2 because it gives everyone more mana to work with for casting detrimental spells.

Nuke song is usually reserved for interrupting casters. You could use it to pull as well but the snare/slow is more usefull because it gives the tank a chance to gain aggro before the mob makes it to camp.

And finally, if your a decent bard you can add even more DPS to your group by charming adds instead of mezzing them. That's probably the best DPS you can add to the group in the case of multiple mobs in camp.

[Gorgetrapper]

And finally, if your a decent bard you can add even more DPS to your group by charming adds instead of mezzing them. That's probably the best DPS you can add to the group in the case of multiple mobs in camp.

I've tried that and you know what happens? The group bitches because they try to attack the charmed target and blame it on me for not mezzing instead. Shitty groups I must say.

[guineapig]

I've tried that and you know what happens? The group bitches because they try to attack the charmed target and blame it on me for not mezzing instead. Shitty groups I must say.

Yeah, shitty groups indeed. I tend to get complimented when I do that.
After doing this a couple of times peoples should get the hang of it. Besdies the fact that they should be assisting the main tank to begin with.

[Gorgetrapper]

Yeah, shitty groups indeed. I tend to get complimented when I do that.
After doing this a couple of times peoples should get the hang of it. Besdies the fact that they should be assisting the main tank to begin with.

Lately though, other than paladins, it seems like shadowknights can't grasp the idea of using disease cloud to gain agro and I end up tanking my charmed mob in the end anyway. The main tank is usually the one that is complaining.


Bard dot is a different story since it's free to cast but you get more DPS out of twisting a Damage shield, strength/haste, mana song, heal song. The last 2 because it gives everyone more mana to work with for casting detrimental spells.


I forgot to pick up on this point here. Bard DPS with songs alone is just plain... crazy. If you twist in the two chant songs (53 dmg each with a drum), Fufil's Curtailing chant (I think like 40 dmg or something close) and then the lvl 48 slow + dot song (55 dmg), you're doing close to, or over 200 dmg a tick. Yeah you're not twisting in mana song or haste, but most battles don't last long anyway, and there is always downtime to sing mana song afterwards. Makes it even easier if you have an enc in the group.

I mainly do this in SolB groups (except BnB), because frankly, the mobs have such low hp, they die in about 2 ticks of the dots going off with a mage or wizard tossing in one nuke.

My ideal group with this type of fighting would be a monk for pulling, a paladin for tanking (and off healing), a shaman or cleric as MH, an enc for clarity and haste, a bard (myself) and a rogue, wizard or mage for pure dps. Most fights last about 10-15 seconds (or less), and in this case, mana song isn't even needed during battles.

[guineapig]

Absolutely, if you are just using an instrument and just punching then that's a whole other ballgame with bard dots. My bard is low level still but I have been keeping my hand to hand maxed for when my dots will actually be that useful.

That's the great thing about bards. There are so many right answers.
With blue con mobs we can tank with a Staff of Writhing and (chanter nuke with huge agro generation and procs often) and an obsidian shard in the offhand. Spam in the snare+slow song to keep the mobs attention on you on the offchance that the procs aren't going off (which is rarely).

The staff is a very overlooked bard weapon for when we need to interupt casting and/or hold aggro.

But I digress.

[Arkanjil]

It looks like Guinea and Gorge were ment for each other. :p

[Jete]

I was thinking the same thing, haha

[Uaellaen]

It looks like Guinea and Gorge were ment for each other. :p

Sounds like true love to me ... again, Everquest >>> All!