no global ooc in offpeak killed the game

[Vonblund]

Or to be precise...

Yes when there are 600 players on the server, it's fine you can run to EC and buy /sell stuff. You can go to a dungeon and shout LFG

In off peak, which is my play time as well as I suppose the other 200 guys who are on at that time, this just doesn't work.

The game world feels empty, and you bump into a group opportunity more by chance and random fluke than anything else, Might as well play a solo offline game.

I really enjoyed this server while global ooc was one, now much less so.

[Mendrik]

I am an off peak player myself and I hve to say that it indeed got harder to find a group and interact with the low spread population on the server.

Then again, using "/who all", "/friend" and "/tell" to the fullest might work out for most seasoned players, like myself, to prevent the bad effects of removing the global chats.

EC is worthless tho in off peak hours or even in EU peak hours. Global auction raises the availability of items on the market and makes sure the economy really flows in game. Then again the Tunnel is of course a great nostalgic thing.

I am personally most worried that new players will consider the game world too empty and leave the server with a higher probability now that globals are removed.

[Ethanblack]

I would love to see a /World optional chat added, that is world-wide at all times. Just toggle it on at off-hours and there we go! :D

[Tseng]

I am personally most worried that new players will consider the game world too empty and leave the server with a higher probability now that globals are removed.

I won't disagree with your off-peak stuff, I play during all different hours of the day and I just always farm during that time because trying to group is hit or miss. However, about the new players, I've started two alts since the removal, and having people for free buffage in EC tunnel is a boon to new players. Also having random druids/shaman go to Orc1 and buff people is something that'll make those new players stick around IMO.

[Pyrocat]

I'd really like to see chat channels implemented again.

[mitic]

Or to be precise...

Yes when there are 600 players on the server, it's fine you can run to EC and buy /sell stuff. You can go to a dungeon and shout LFG

In off peak, which is my play time as well as I suppose the other 200 guys who are on at that time, this just doesn't work.

The game world feels empty, and you bump into a group opportunity more by chance and random fluke than anything else, Might as well play a solo offline game.

I really enjoyed this server while global ooc was one, now much less so.

its hard to find a group? /who all zone,

its hard to find replacements? /who all lfg (add class if u are searchin for specific classes)

hard to find stuff to buy? try on weekends as i do being an off peak player myself

IF you still have a hard time to find groups by doing the above, then you should start questioning your socializing skills or go play a singleplayer game as u stated already yourself

[Akame]

I hear what you're saying but putting global chat in the game again will force everyone to use them, because people will stop auctioning and going lfg in the normal routes again. Which means we've got to listen to mandatory douche baggary to get groups.

[Smyd]

I was forced to level trade skills up for various quests on my characters because sitting in EC for days looking for someone willing or even just someone with the skillz was futile and a waste of my play time.

I play for accomplishment, not to sit around a zone, spamming something and hoping that one of these days someone might respond to my spam and help me out. I don't see how that makes the game any more fun or challenging?

Yes, ooc as it is now is classic, but lets go further then... if you want a classic game, why don't we med with our spell books open up till level 35? Come on people, there are TONS of aspects to the game that aren't classic - why should this MINOR aspect be changed to suit this??? OOC should be changed back to global as it was, because this world is a LOT smaller and frankly, a lot less fun due to time constraints. It was easy for any of you to disable OOC and make use of shout.

[Taxi]

I see the pros and cons but It does feel empty during off-peak hours, even as a porter who can pretty much go to lavastorm/Guk as i please to check on groups, its an annoyance.

Are those channels Rog was working on on the test server will ever be implemented? I thought it was the idea, kill global OOC but add channels we can decide to join or not.

[YendorLootmonkey]

It is the year 2010. People generally have computers powerful enough to run EQ in windowed mode while having an IRC client up. The IRC #project1999 channel can replace global OOC if everyone really wanted it to. Yes, it's a tad more inconvenient to switch out of window and ask/respond to something, but since obviously it's game-breaking for some of you to not have some sort of global chat, I would think that would be a minor inconvenience.

Other than that:

/who all unrest
/who all oasis
/who all crushbone

/who all LFG
/who all 10 20 LFG

send tells, make friends, stop being anti-social, maintaining a good rep is important now

Use these forums for WTS/WTB... you don't even have to be online to advertise!

There are workarounds... once people get desperate enough, they'll get used more often.

[Bumamgar]

Every day the server continues to reach new population records.

The removal of global channels has revitalized several classic aspects of the game. Not only has the EC Tunnel trading hub been recreated, but people who take the time to run to a zone and look for a group are much more likely to be given group spots (even if they aren't the absolutely most optimal choice) due to their availability. With global channels it was far more common for the dude LFG at the zoneline to get passed over in preference of someone LFG in global chat.

The game world feels larger now, and a stronger community is forming as people are forced to interact with each other more to achieve their in-game goals. All in all, the removal of global channels has had a net positive effect on the server.

I recommend people get used to it, as it is extremely unlikely that global channels will ever return to p1999.

[Agecroft]

I only just started last week so I have very little perspective on what the global channels were like here on Project 1999. I did play SOE EQ back before and after they added the global chat system and can say I did not prefer it over the zone-based ooc/shout/auction system.

I have to say that since coming to Project 1999 and seeing the lively EC tunnel and LFG system that I remember, I feel like I've found EQ again. Love live Project 1999.

I, for one, am glad it was changed.

[Omnimorph]

People keep complaining about the lack of global channels, but did you ever think about the other aspect of keeping it? 600+ people on peak times, let's say 10% of those people want to auction things, that's 60 people auctioning their junk repeatedly in a chat channel. Same with ooc. I only have my chat windows allowing 12 lines of text at a time and people were saying things and it was gone before i even read it.

My friends list is a mass of people i've grouped with maybe once who i recall being decent players, as well as people who said if i ever need a port to send them a tell. Not the sorts of friends you /tell whenever you see them online, but just one of the steps i've taken to ensure people are available to me if i need them.

If you're posting on the forum, why not post your class / level, play times, see if there's anyone else around that you could look to group with etc. add them to friends list and try and make something happen.

[Zephys]

Everyone shut up.

Need a healer your level?

/who all cleric 33.

Send tells. Get rejected.

It's classic, AND its no different than not being able to find a healer when there was global ooc.

Need a port? /who all wizard or /who all druid.

Want to sell things? Yeah, go to EC. Find a port with /who all druid.

You're welcome.

Btw, sending random tells was classic, and is acceptable.

"Looking for a croc group?"
"No ty"
"Alright."

[Skaff]

Personally, I think buying and selling is much less of a hassle. Sometimes I play prime time hours and sometimes I play very off peak hours. Has anything changed pre/post chat changes overall? Not much... people buy and sell more often during the prime time hours and its rough during the other parts of the day. At least right now there is an agreed upon location to make transactions. Now I don't have to deal with a situation like the one below...

them: /auction WTS blah blah blah
me: How much are you looking for?
them: xxx plat.
me: Sounds good, where do you want to meet?
them: I am in a group Lguk atm. I can meet you in NFP in a couple hours?
me: yeah.... never mind.

In terms of finding a group... It is not that hard. When I was leveling in in my early levels I hung around Crushbone. Sometimes times were spent ungrouped and I would assist other groups from the outside and eventually get invited. After more time, most of the general "crushbone population" knew me and group invites got a lot faster. After that, I did the same thing in Unrest, Highkeep, Oggok, Solb... ect. Sometimes I put up a LFG tag (it helps when you don't roll with an anon tag on either) and I would eventually get a tell from someone I knew, or did not know, for a group. I occasional used the global chat as a means of finding a group, but it was my least effective means. I applied my general knowledge from finding groups from EQ and it worked pretty good for me.

I am glad the zones feel a bit more empty. It helps give a more spacial realness to the game. One that has been lost in current titles. I welcome the incentive to make efforts to communicate with other players in a non "everyones connected" way.

[mixxit]

Seems to be doing fine, there were ~750 online last night

[oldhead]

Spread the word on your time zone... get more people involved.

I have better luck finding groups off hours or twilight hours as the camp zones arent packed with players

[Branaddar]

As much of a convenience as global channels are, I hate the way they can destroy the micro-communities that form.

Some of the best friends I made in EQ back in the day were people I grouped with all the time in the Overthere and Dreadlands. Because we tended to go there and shoot the shit in /ooc while LFG and usually ended up grouping together.

Global channels means I'm shooting the shit with 200-700 other people at once. The name gets lost in the shuffle and chaos.

I think one of the things that has killed my like of MMOs in recent years is that people aren't looking to make new friends or take a risk in their socialization. Like others have said... if you need something, send a tell! If you get a douchebag reply, then move on.

Chances are most people who remember the old ways will be courteous. You will make a lot more friends and have a lot more fun with the game if you take those risks.

I'll probably get hate for saying this, but the modern-day MMO players are spoiled rotten and fed with a silver spoon. Automated auction houses, insta-travel, clique-y guilds and players that pretty much ignore the people they're grouped with... ugh.

I want a community again, dammit.

[Kraftwerk]

As someone who's playstyle wasn't affected at all by this change (Magician farmbot does not require groups) but who's enjoyment of the game diminished greatly as a result of the change (the market slightly crashed and is currently a buyers market and very difficult for sellers) I still think no global ooc is a positive thing. People need to converse and build reputation more, the world is larger now with travel distances just to talk/see people. I think our server is better for the change.

That being said I've taken a break in the wake of EQ Market Crash '10 until A) A set trading time in EC becomes more established or B) more than a fraction of the server uses the trading forums. As someone who loved being able to pick a farmspot for a few items and sell them for several thousand pp over a 1-2 day period, that is impossible to have happen now. With global I was never in surplus of my normal farm stock and was able to keep buyers lined up for certain items. Now I don't get nearly the same exposure of what I'm selling. I auctioned items for 75-55% of pre-global removal prices for 5-7 hours in EC week and half ago (on weekend) and couldn't even empty 10-20% of my stock, it was horrendous and no fun.

In summation: no global is good for playing the game, bad for anyone who enjoyed playing the market. At least from my experience.

[YendorLootmonkey]

In summation: no global is good for playing the game, good for anyone who hated farmers monopolizing camps and playing the market. At least from my experience.

FIFY ;) hehe

[Dantes]

It's really too bad that global ooc/auction was ever active in the first place. If people hadn't gotten used to using it, they would have nothing to complain about. Oh well.

From my perspective, the change is awesome. My main on the server is a 20th level Dark Elf warrior. Not only do I have absolutely nothing to help me travel, but to top that off I'm also evil and KOS in several zones. I can't even walk from 1 side of High Pass to another without either causing a huge train or ending up dead. Yet still, I am happy to see global OOC/auction gone.

First of all, people actually LOOK now and see who's on LFG. If they need a tank and they see me on that list, they'll send me a tell. I get those tells all the time, in fact I haven't really had to wait more than 10 minutes for a group since I dinged 15.

For selling, again from my perspective I think this change is actually useful for me. I cannot compete with the loot farmers. I already mentioned the travel difficulties. Removing global /auction actually gives me a zone full of people who might actually buy my items, rather than a bunch of folks who I can probably never make it to anyway. All I have to do is make it to the tunnel. I have also noticed more frequently that items are being auctioned in the zone where they drop, meaning I can get them for real cheap. When your main character is a warrior you take whatever opportunity you can to save plat because it doesn't come easy.

[Taxi]

Yea i didnt mean to say it was a total bad thing, I love EC the way it is now, i dont agree with the hyperbolic title of "Killed the game" thats for sure.

[Excision Rottun]

Snape kills Dumbledore.

[Toony]

Yea i didnt mean to say it was a total bad thing, I love EC the way it is now, i dont agree with the hyperbolic title of "Killed the game" thats for sure.

I logged in right before I left for work, I can confirm game not "killed".

[Ropethunder]

Ahhhh. The silence is golden.

[Xumosa]

Snape kills Dumbledore.

+1

[stormlord]

I'm a classic fan, no doubt about it, but I had my reservations about removing /ooc this soon. If it were me, I would have done it when peak was 1000+. Nonetheless, I'm a classic fan. Now that global chat is removed, I play the game that way. There's the /who command, which I try to refrain from using, and then there's irc and the forums for auctioning, both of which I've also refrained from using. Why? Because they don't feel classic to me, even though they were available in 1999. It's not the way I want to play the game. Still, it would help me to find what I'm looking for if I did. Lord help me! You can't treat an old dog new tricks. Don't pity me.

So I have sat in EC for a long time. I never went to EC in 1999. In fact, the only trading zone I knew in my career on live was the bazaar. So being in EC these past couple days was a completely new experience for me. My thoughts are mute. I don't know whether I hate it or like it. I suppose it has opened the door for people to try new things to keep others entertained. It's boring sitting in a zone trying to find what you want because you refuse to use irc or the forums. One options for me is to adventure in other zones and try my luck at finding the items I want. The other is to stay here and either: a) attempt to find ways to entertain myself in-game b) browse the web. So far, I've mostly browsed the web with "/log on" for searches. However, the opportunity to create new amusements in EC so that people don't get excessively bored is there for enterprising souls.

I almost wish EQ had a card game or something that we could play in EC while waiting, but that's not the only thing that could be fun. Honestly, there's no rulebook on how to create an mmorpg. Nothing says we have to kill things when we're logged in or play card games when we're not killing things. D&D is combat-oriented, but mmorpgs could be anything we want them to be. They just have to be interesting. Personally, I don't think EQ was developed for non-combat related fun. So people have to get clever to make it fun. I wish sometimes that the new mmorpgs would revisit some of the things EQ did, but add a framework that's more friendly to creative people so that they can create new forms of entertainment to occupy us when we're not in combat. Imagine a new mmorpg that had corpse runs, but did it in such a way that it's fun. Corpse runs don't have to be automatically a bad idea. It's all in how you implement the idea. Same for everything else. Nothing necessarily has to be boring. There just needs to be a developer ready to make it fun. Which costs money.

Things I can think of off the top of my head to fend off boredom in EC:
1) Tell a story
2) Gamble
3) Make a game for people to play
4) /duel someone or manage a series of matches and reward the champion
5) Tell a story, but this time use actors (players) and a scene that exists in the zone
6) Find a creative way to reward new players

I'm sure there're many others. It's a pity that we have to invent ideas though. It'd be so much easier if they gave us a way to create new card games, or new games for that matter. There're many players who have the skill to accomplish something like that. An arena in EC would be a nice attraction for duels and fights, but it's hard to manage something like that. You get what I'm saying? There's no limit to what could be done to occupy people while they wait for a trade.

[Agecroft]

I'm a classic fan, no doubt about it, but I had my reservations about removing /ooc this soon. If it were me, I would have done it when peak was 1000+. Nonetheless, I'm a classic fan. Now that global chat is removed, I play the game that way. There's the /who command, which I try to refrain from using, and then there's irc and the forums for auctioning, both of which I've also refrained from using. Why? Because they don't feel classic to me, even though they were available in 1999. It's not the way I want to play the game. Still, it would help me to find what I'm looking for if I did. Lord help me! You can't treat an old dog new tricks. Don't pity me.

Just curious. Why no /who?

[Maggok]

hmmmm was actual sitting 3 hours sitting /LFG today. and yes, i did /who all lfg and /who all *Zonename*..... and tried up to build a group

during the peak-times, this would work, but when only a few people in the range of lvl 20 - 30 are LFG - u ve no chance to build up a group. as a casual / player with familiy / player with long working-times the actual situation is realy disappointing. oh yes, "its classic" - how could i forget that - so it must be gold, or?

btw. we r doing lots of polls - may be, we should do a poll, how many time each of us can play per day during a normal week - than we would see, if 1 or 2 hours time to find/build up a group, like today its often the case, is the thing we should working for...

Greetings, maggok

[stormlord]

hmmmm was actual sitting 3 hours sitting /LFG today. and yes, i did /who all lfg and /who all *Zonename*..... and tried up to build a group

during the peak-times, this would work, but when only a few people in the range of lvl 20 - 30 are LFG - u ve no chance to build up a group. as a casual / player with familiy / player with long working-times the actual situation is realy disappointing. oh yes, "its classic" - how could i forget that - so it must be gold, or?

btw. we r doing lots of polls - may be, we should do a poll, how many time each of us can play per day during a normal week - than we would see, if 1 or 2 hours time to find/build up a group, like today its often the case, is the thing we should working for...

Greetings, maggok

But this begs a question. Even if you could find someone with global chat, that might mean they're too far away to reach you. I mean, you can '/who <zone>', right? That even lists anonymous players. The other /who method won't list anon players. All global chat would do is better open you up to anonymous players and players who're too far away already to make it practical. Anon players, many of them, don't want anonymous /tells. For example, a lot of druids will go /anon to avoid getting lots of tells for ports. Even if a player doesn't use '/lfg on' because they don't know about it, you can still use '/who <zone name>' to find them.

It's a little less convenient to do it this way, but keep in mind some players don't even use these tools. Like me for example. I actually go to the zone. I don't like to use /who or irc or the forums. When you're lower level, it's not that hard to find groups. I can understand that it's harder at higher levels. It's also easier to solo at lower levels and get a corpse. So I'm not fooling myself into thinking that you can do it the way I do it.

I wasn't cheerleading for removing global ooc, but you need to use your options. And you need to decide whether you want to live angry at this game or whether leaving is better for your sanity. Alternatively, play a class that can exist better on its own. A warrior is a horrible class to play at off-peak hours, but it's not so bad once you've got a guild and have a main character at level 50. At that point, you can just twink a warrior alt.

If I were you, I'd try PEQ. But leveling up, even with the extra bells and whistles of PEQ, is still not the easiest thing. On the plus side, you can box at PEQ. You have options. Stop complaining and use them.

And i have no doubt in my mind they'll enable global chat if population falls. I'm sorry if me telling you to use your options is getting you mad. I've been there. I've complained. But if you can't cope with the set of classic features on this server, the best statement you can make is not to play.

[Excision Rottun]

I almost wish EQ had a card game or something that we could play in EC while waiting, but that's not the only thing that could be fun.

/gems

[Xenephex]

I don't mean this as snide, but welcome to their world. It's hard, it's inconvenient and it's tedious in a multitude of ways - just like it was when we all started. And back then, the devs did not care about our opinion; they really did not want to know what we wanted.

We bitched, we moaned, we groaned - and we kept playing. And we rushed back here when we found out about this server.

I can think of a bunch of things every day that I wish were different; would it really kill the game to leave the translocators up all the time? How about... well, you get the idea.

As soon as they start running this according to polls, we're headed downhill. Because what most of us are going to want is to make it easier - just little things that won't really affect things all that much. Just because that is really inconvenient.

And eventually, we'll get what we want, and then discover that we're just not enjoying it that much anymore, and we probably won't even understand why.

[stormlord]

I don't mean this as snide, but welcome to their world. It's hard, it's inconvenient and it's tedious in a multitude of ways - just like it was when we all started. And back then, the devs did not care about our opinion; they really did not want to know what we wanted.

We bitched, we moaned, we groaned - and we kept playing. And we rushed back here when we found out about this server.

I can think of a bunch of things every day that I wish were different; would it really kill the game to leave the translocators up all the time? How about... well, you get the idea.

As soon as they start running this according to polls, we're headed downhill. Because what most of us are going to want is to make it easier - just little things that won't really affect things all that much. Just because that is really inconvenient.

And eventually, we'll get what we want, and then discover that we're just not enjoying it that much anymore, and we probably won't even understand why.

I think we had it easier with our higher population and p2p service. I don't know about what others thinks, but I remember a lot more people in the zones in 1999.

But stop making this an 'easy vs hard' argument. That's the root cause of all this confusion. This is less about easy vs hard, and more about classic vs live. They're different games. That's what matters. When EQ lost population over the years, the developers were forced to make some things easier, but overall, the difficulty or tediousness of the game remained the same. That's what so many people don't understand. The reason people want classic, the reason project 1999 exists, is because it's a different game compared to live. So all of the changes over the years to compensate for falling rates of new players and because of attrition made EQ, gradually, over time, into a completely different game. It was not a change of opinion. It was necessary!

Let me restate: classic is a different game compared to live.

I'll give an example. Global chat. We all know the connection between population and global chat (or i hope so). If there're enough people, we don't need global chat. If there're too few people, we need global chat to compensate. Understand? Same thing applies to everything else in the game. When population falls, the game necessarily must be easier, but that doesn't mean it's easier for players!!! Understand? I hope so! It's all relative. Hard at 200 population is not equal to hard at 1000 population. Stop thinking in absolute terms.

[Taxi]

Im thinking more in terms of whats healthy for the server, trying to get the EC tunnel is great, but is it at the expense of new players feeling the server is empty and giving up? For me thats the first thing that struck me different from VZTZ, the auction channel, the chitchat in OOC, made it a lively place.

Now the number of players is still high, i guess this is a good thing if people go with it and use EC alot, just hope it stays that way.

[stormlord]

Im thinking more in terms of whats healthy for the server, trying to get the EC tunnel is great, but is it at the expense of new players feeling the server is empty and giving up? For me thats the first thing that struck me different from VZTZ, the auction channel, the chitchat in OOC, made it a lively place.

Now the number of players is still high, i guess this is a good thing if people go with it and use EC alot, just hope it stays that way.

Well then reread my post because I 100% agree. The last paragraph is especially important to understand.

Let me give another example. If you have a huge landmass, and only 10 people, you're widely distributing them and thus isolating them. If you have 1000 people distributed over the same landmass, they're more closely scattered and less isolated from one another. If the game requires players to work together to accomplish things, then players that're isolated will be unable to play the game. Understand? This rule, or concept, exists in all mmorpgs, in different forms. It doesn't matter how you travel or move around. The rule still applies.

[Toony]

Im thinking more in terms of whats healthy for the server, trying to get the EC tunnel is great, but is it at the expense of new players feeling the server is empty and giving up?.

They were going to give up anyway. Anyone who's played classic eq can do a /who and realize the zone isn't empty and start using the local channels.

[girth]

/who <zone>', right? That even lists anonymous players.

I don't get that when I do it. I also don't get anon people when I do for instance a /who all 50 cleric - yet I have people I know that see anon when they do both...

Whats up with that?

[stormlord]

I don't get that when I do it. I also don't get anon people when I do for instance a /who all 50 cleric - yet I have people I know that see anon when they do both...

Whats up with that?

I'm not 100%. I know that /who returns anonymous players. I'm not 100% that /who <zone> returns anonymous players. But the rest of the points still stand. All global chat does is (more conveniently, but at the cost of increased spam, especially during peak hours, and of, as some say, unique communities) better connect you with anonymous players and those who're probably already too far away to make it practical. And anonymous players are probably not the ones actively looking to group with you or talk with you, or they wouldn't be anon.

If you can't find a group locally, the fault is not on lacking global chat, the fault is on population. Because if you have to run across the world to get a group, then this game is broke. One way to resolve that is to add world teleporters or pok books. Another way is to increase population. There're infinite ways.

At some point, we reach a population where we don't need global chat. There're arguments for and against. When I voted, I voted against removing /ooc until population increases. Now that it's removed, I'm doing what I can adjust and make it successful. These points, which i've made a thousand times, are separate from the fact that if you can't find a group unless you run across the world then the game is broke. Global chat won't save us if we have to run across the world to get a group because at that point, it's a matter of distance, not chat.

When the number of zones exploded in live, and population steadily (slowly) fell, they added luclin spires and pok books and guild hall portals. They did that to overcome the vast distances between players (lots of zones!). In fact, even without a falling population, they still would have had to add teleportation methods. Either that or they could make some zones hub zones, and have multiple connections to zones from multiple zones. A live developer recently stated that every zone in live is about 5 zones away from any other zone (2008-09).

[JayDee]

I'm not 100%. I know that /who returns anonymous players. I'm not 100% that /who <zone> returns anonymous players.

anonymous players do not show when you /who all [zone identifier]

[girth]

correct, but I've seen somebody do a who all 50 cleric and see like 4 50s and 4-5 anon 50 clerics.

[Branaddar]

I know it sucks trying to build a group during non-peak periods. I've been there. Back in the old days I worked an evening job, so most of my game time was morning-afternoon.

Honestly, global chat wouldn't have done much to fix the issue. It's an issue of not enough people playing during those times. Or people not putting up LFG. Or people not being adventurous enough to ask non-LFG people if they want to do something.

All I can suggest is try to get more people that would game on your time to play. Re-enabling global OOC may get you one more group spot filled out of ten play sessions. But people need to stop leaning on /role and /anon so much and just accept that they're going to get tells and that it's part of the game.

I've played a chanter and a wizard and the only times I put /role on were when I was running through a low level zone to avoid a billion tells for crack. Worse things have happened than having to "/r sorry, I'm busy at the moment."

[eqdruid76]

Aye, record number of players on P99 since serverwide chat was discontinued.

Yep, this game is obviously dead.

You monkeystick.....


The only thing around here that's dead is a lot of players' adaptability and ability to play the game themselves without having everyone else play it for them.

To quote Benjamin Franklin:

It's fine. L2Play.

[jilena]

I miss having random global chat when I am doing boring things. EC tunnel is a shitty horrible pain in the ass compared to global auction. I would gladly give up the tiny bit of "oh look a bunch of people standing around selling crap" nostalgia for convenience. Otherwise this doesn't really effect me.

[gruumsh]

I feel that the population of this server has increased lots since they announced the end to global ooc/auction. Population was around 600, and now that global chat is gone, I see the amount of players growing quickly (we almost hit 800 last nite I saw).

I also do like the EC tunnel being used as an auction hub, you can auction and you know that the buyer/seller is in the same zone as you are. Even when there was global auction, there were times when people who offered an item that you wanted could very well be on the other side of the world, and I really doubt that some people would like to run across the world/ask for a port to get an item (I've heard of people getting duped doing that also, running really far only to see that the seller logged or something like that).

[girth]

I feel bad for people not in peak hours, though some of my best groups/trading has been off hours.

But, all we can do is advertise more - tell your friends - tell your old guilds - especially those aussies/euros.

[nicemace]

there are some days where i can sit LFG for 10+ hours and not get a single tell regarding it, as an enchanter.

other days i get pestered non stop when im trying to solo.

as its been said its hit or miss. some times its painful as fuck and you want to slit your wrists, other times its a breeze.

i play both peak and offpeak (new zealand is kinda in the middle of both) and it is /MUCH/ (as much emphasis as possible) easiser during peak time for people to play.

[Kainzo]

Stop going role playing or anon and start using the LFG function - Classic isn't suppose to be "Easy" and if you dont remember I remember SEVERAL times on a "Full" pop server waiting forever to get into groups / camps.

It's part of the game - suck it up or go back to WoW

[gedeost]

Stop going role playing or anon and start using the LFG function - Classic isn't suppose to be "Easy" and if you dont remember I remember SEVERAL times on a "Full" pop server waiting forever to get into groups / camps.

It's part of the game - suck it up or go back to WoW

They aren't role playing or anon and they are using the lfg.

Are you stupid or something?

Just because you can't find a group in a computer games doesn't make it hard, it just makes it a extremely crappy game.

[Vonblund]

Thanks to all those who replied with constructive arguments and refrained from personal attacks (ie "monkey stick" "L2P" and other douchebaggeries)

A few things I'd like to add:

- I am talking OFF Peak, so if you play in peak time this does not concern you as you probably have enough people on to group / buy / sell / tradeskill / socialise with... In my play time I see 200 players on.. I remember on live server in 2000 we had about 700 on in the same timezone, and that was not peak time. Later in Kunark, the popular grind zones such as OT had 50 to 80 players easily. Last night... SOLB = 0, Najena = 0, Lavastorm = 3, etc etc ...
there was not even enough players in Oasis to form a group because 3 out of the 7 present were mages / necros who wanted to solo and 2 were high levels, either running past or Pling someone soloing.

- Add to this that the server pop is becoming a bit top heavy, so out of the 200 online, a good number are either active raiders or AFK Raid target campers.

- The benefit I saw in global chat (again in OFF PEAK I repeat for the ADD Anonymous members of this forum) is that if I went LFG somewhere and saw nothing is happening, I can still get a feel the server on /ooc, and check if there is a grouping opportunity for ant alt.. ok no tanking Guk today but they need a dps in Oasis or a healer in Crushbone.. cool!

- the /who zone seems a good idea, any link to a list of the zone names for /who would be appreciated.

- Again I repeat, I have NO PROBLEM with the current system in peak time or on week end when there is a population of 500+ as it is perfectly viable.

[Maggok]

hmmm hat a look on the actual (thursday, 10:49 am, german time) situation and think, its not so bland. Currently the server population is the following:

- 34 necros online
- 11 warrior
- 6 palis
- 13 wizards
- 13 shamans

only to pick up some classes for example. So i ve the question: why does alle the people player Necros? Ok, its a nice class! True, but i think the solo-ability of the class is one of the most important arguments. so u dont ve to search a group to play. u can log in and start to fight. and thats fine (i also ve a low lvl necro). but in the opposite, whey we try to make it harder as it has to be, to build up groups? we dont play EQ to sit there and searching for groups/players! we play EQ to fight, doing adventures, getting loot (or what ever we all do when we r online)...

[eqdruid76]

hmmmm was actual sitting 3 hours sitting /LFG today. and yes, i did /who all lfg and /who all *Zonename*..... and tried up to build a group

during the peak-times, this would work, but when only a few people in the range of lvl 20 - 30 are LFG - u ve no chance to build up a group. as a casual / player with familiy / player with long working-times the actual situation is realy disappointing. oh yes, "its classic" - how could i forget that - so it must be gold, or?

btw. we r doing lots of polls - may be, we should do a poll, how many time each of us can play per day during a normal week - than we would see, if 1 or 2 hours time to find/build up a group, like today its often the case, is the thing we should working for...

Greetings, maggok

So you pick a zone, sit at the zone-in and spam /shout LFG until a spot opens up. That's how it was done 11 years ago. That's how it's done today.

Geez, serverwide chat spoiled so many people.

[nicemace]

So you pick a zone, sit at the zone-in and spam /shout LFG until a spot opens up. That's how it was done 11 years ago. That's how it's done today.

Geez, serverwide chat spoiled so many people.

done that, dosent work... you guys who play peak times have it nice and you actually have NO idea how bad it gets during off peak times.

sure when a zone is rammed full during peak you can sit there and spam LFG and something will pop up cause the turnover in a group is generally pretty good, people going having dinner, going to sleep and what not.

in offpeak times youre lucky if you have only one group going in the zone, they are all locked in and just doing their thing.

as i have said, i have spent 10+ hours multiple days where i have been ACTIVELY looking group (doing the / all shit blah blah blah) spamming in zones n shit.

its not viable during offpeak, period.

and this is a perfect example of people being selfish twits. it works all good for them cause they only play when 600 - 700 online. they arent the ones who have to play with 150 - 200.. so they couldnt care less. as long as its good for them they'll just shut everyone else down.

[Mleh]

Just a quick 2 cents, when I logged on P1999 for the first time, and saw global ooc/auction I thought "Wow this is ridiculous this entire client is probably new eq crap", As I played more and more I relised how much effort had been put into removing handicaps and I appreciated the game more.

QQ.

[Omnimorph]

So you pick a zone, sit at the zone-in and spam /shout LFG until a spot opens up. That's how it was done 11 years ago. That's how it's done today.

Geez, serverwide chat spoiled so many people.

Or you form your own group.

[eqdruid76]

done that, dosent work... you guys who play peak times have it nice and you actually have NO idea how bad it gets during off peak times.

sure when a zone is rammed full during peak you can sit there and spam LFG and something will pop up cause the turnover in a group is generally pretty good, people going having dinner, going to sleep and what not.

in offpeak times youre lucky if you have only one group going in the zone, they are all locked in and just doing their thing.

as i have said, i have spent 10+ hours multiple days where i have been ACTIVELY looking group (doing the / all shit blah blah blah) spamming in zones n shit.

its not viable during offpeak, period.

and this is a perfect example of people being selfish twits. it works all good for them cause they only play when 600 - 700 online. they arent the ones who have to play with 150 - 200.. so they couldnt care less. as long as its good for them they'll just shut everyone else down.

You're doing it wrong.

Classic Everquest is a game of patience. It's SUPPOSED to be a challenge to find a competent group, advance, and get loot. It's time to take off the diapers, remove the training wheels, stop complaining and learn how to play the game. Join a freaking guild. And if you're already in one, and there's never anyone on, join a bigger guild. Guildies who are never on can't say too much about you doing so.

You're whining about the loss of the ease of grouping as it existed on live in 2006. This isn't Project 2006, it's Project 1999, where finding a group, finding upgrades, and selling your wares is supposed to emulate live in 1999 as much as the mechanics, graphics and content. And Classic Everquest was not a game for whiney people who needed someone else to hold their hand and play the game for them.

Serverwide chat is not going to be reinstated just because you refuse to adapt, do the footwork, make the contacts, establish the rapport, and participate in the same game the majority of us experienced, remember, and are glad to see again.

There is absolutely no reason you can't find a group at any hour of the day, other than you're just not trying hard enough. I understand your hesitation..."what if I go all the way to Guk, spend 2 hours /lfg, finally get in a group that wipes and disbands after 3 pulls, and spend 2 more hours doing a CR?"...Reality check: this occurs thousands of times a day to ALL players, regardless of time zone. That's the challenge of this game. Anyone can log on, push 3 buttons for 6 hours and gain a level. Finding 5 other players who don't suck is the challenge. And it's an even bigger challenge during peak hours. When in a group, you're only as good as the other people in the party.

If you want an easy game, I encourage you to man up, pay the 15 bucks a month, and log into Live. You don't need to find a group there anymore, and you'll be afk selling thousands of plat worth of gear in less than 2 weeks. There is absolutely no challenge left in the live game. That's why server populations are so low. That's why servers are merging. Right now, on the Luclin/Veeshan server, there are less than 1000 characters online. At least 500 of those characters are /afk in the Bazaar. The majority of the at the keyboard players are multi-boxing.

There are more active players on Project1999 at this very moment than there are on any one live server. That should tell you something. We're not here for the ease of play, or the instant gratification of uber gear by level 10 or automatically being level 51. We're here to play Everquest, as it was designed at its inception, where players had to actively research and socialize to advance.

Welcome to Everquest. You're in our world now.

[nicemace]

youre just flat out wrong, i know its meant to be hard blah blah blah. and it is hard to find solid groups even during peak times.

we are talking about offpeak times when groups are virtually non-existent.. currently at this very moment i think there are around 150 logged in.. of that 150 there are currently 45 in perma camping vox, so there is only 105 players with a level range of 50 for people to group with. and i bet a lot of them would be afk sleepers too.

there is absolutely nothing i have done wrong, its just theres no one around.

i myself dont have an issue. i solo'd my last lvls from 40 to 50, as i did with most my levels prior to that. gg charm. but i can understand what it is like for the other players who cant solo.

i played 9 straight years on live, no need to go back, im here for the classic raid content, not the current on live.

[Uaellaen]

218 people online at the moment ...

[SpartanEQ]

youre just flat out wrong, i know its meant to be hard blah blah blah. and it is hard to find solid groups even during peak times.

we are talking about offpeak times when groups are virtually non-existent.. currently at this very moment i think there are around 150 logged in.. of that 150 there are currently 45 in perma camping vox, so there is only 105 players with a level range of 50 for people to group with. and i bet a lot of them would be afk sleepers too.

there is absolutely nothing i have done wrong, its just theres no one around.

i myself dont have an issue. i solo'd my last lvls from 40 to 50, as i did with most my levels prior to that. gg charm. but i can understand what it is like for the other players who cant solo.

i played 9 straight years on live, no need to go back, im here for the classic raid content, not the current on live.

If you are here for raid content, are you in a guild? If you're in a guild, is it a guild that is from your timezone? If you're in a guild that is from you're timezone, can you not communicate globally with your guild and form groups that way?

If you're not in a guild, how do you expect to raid? I don't know what level you are or anything so I'm just asking out of curiosity. Please understand, I'm not criticizing you.

[slayith]

Never was the pop this low on live in the middle of the night, as there were far more Europeans playing on the live servers as i remember.

Before i start, I am a mage that doesn't need gear or groups to have fun. That being said global ooc and EC tunnel do not affect me in the slightest. Still i cant help but feel utterly sadface for all the kiwi/Aussie melee players.

One can use all of the regular channels; actively /LFG on /who "classname" ect. with no luck for weeks on end. Live would have its bad days anyone that was there can attest to that. This is not an issue of putting in the work, or sucking it up and learning, as many of you seem to think it is, this is an issue of there not being enough population at those hours that there is no group turnover, and the only available groups would be the 1 random person here or there that a global ooc would reach.
Before you all flame for having an opinion that differs from only 50% of you and the devs, you should only try to play during the low pop and see how "exactly" like live it seems to you again.
If you play those twilight hours and you cannot solo good luck. There is NO guild with populations on high enough to support leveling all ranges, other than a bunch of 50's rotation camping some rare spawn. Checking all the areas with people in them will not get a group. These people are spending ALL of the play time every night to accomplish nothing, even though they use all the available in-game means of finding a group. The only surefire cure is to tell them sorry, you have to wake up and play in the middle of your night.


As a side note the world seems empty unless you go to a handful of zones, but at least you don't have to hide ooc anymore.

Its just my opinion no "sky falling" prediction crap. I thank the devs for all the effort they place into project1999. Just like live there will be changes i like and changes i hate, and i will roll with the punches.

[nicemace]

If you are here for raid content, are you in a guild? If you're in a guild, is it a guild that is from your timezone? If you're in a guild that is from you're timezone, can you not communicate globally with your guild and form groups that way?

If you're not in a guild, how do you expect to raid? I don't know what level you are or anything so I'm just asking out of curiosity. Please understand, I'm not criticizing you.


are you in a guild: not currently no, am apping as i have just hit 50.

is the guild from my timezone: no, im neither US or euro timezone, im in the middle, so i have apped to US guild... but still play a lot of offpeak too.

3rd question: no groups needed, im lvl 50.

if im not in a guild how do i expect to raid?: to app to a good raiding guild now im lvl 50 which i did most of solo.

as ive said, i dont have any issues, ill always make sure i have a way to play by myself because thats the most reliable way for me to be efficient... but not everyone plays classes like mine (ENCH).

so im one of the few people who can actually understand what others are going through and not just thinking about themselves.

[Vonblund]

You're doing it wrong.

Classic Everquest is a game of patience. It's SUPPOSED to be a challenge to find a competent group, advance, and get loot. It's time to take off the diapers, remove the training wheels, stop complaining and learn how to play the game. Join a freaking guild. And if you're already in one, and there's never anyone on, join a bigger guild. Guildies who are never on can't say too much about you doing so.

You're whining about the loss of the ease of grouping as it existed on live in 2006. This isn't Project 2006, it's Project 1999, where finding a group, finding upgrades, and selling your wares is supposed to emulate live in 1999 as much as the mechanics, graphics and content. And Classic Everquest was not a game for whiney people who needed someone else to hold their hand and play the game for them.

Serverwide chat is not going to be reinstated just because you refuse to adapt, do the footwork, make the contacts, establish the rapport, and participate in the same game the majority of us experienced, remember, and are glad to see again.

.

Just a question dude,... What is your time zone?

[Tseng]

Preface: I was not in favor of removing global ooc and would support it coming back.

However, I was grouped from 1AM - 5AM EST last night.

[Vonblund]

Or you form your own group.

No you dont ...
Maybe (real example here) because you are a healer and when you do a a /who lfg in your level range you find 3 clerics and 1 druid....

and thats on a good day ... I repeat for those who didn't get it yet ... OFF PEAK, when there are 200 odd players on is NOT the same as peak when there is 500+

Thanks for your attention

[Hiragawa]

Okay, you know what Von... You keep saying "OFF PEAK, OFF PEAK!" First off, make some friends in off peak hours.

Wanna know what I did during off peak hours back on live? Tradeskills. /gems Played an alt that could solo. You keep arguing that people aren't getting what you're talking about, but it was the same in live. You would roll up about 4am EST trying to find a group, but because there were fewer players, all the groups were full up, and we wound up sitting at a zone line shouting for hours and hours.

Join a larger guild, if you're american off-peak, look into Europa (I know nothing about them, just heard they're a European Time zone guild). And bloody 'ell... It seems you'll be damned to go you of your way and make friends in the time frame that you play. If you can manage that, then maybe when you're online looking for these groups, you'll have two or three people online with you that can group with you.

I've been here about a week now, and I can safely say that if I logged into global chat, I would have said "Well, this isn't what I'm looking for" and logged off.

[Vonblund]

Okay, you know what Von... You keep saying "OFF PEAK, OFF PEAK!" First off, make some friends in off peak hours.

Wanna know what I did during off peak hours back on live? Tradeskills. /gems Played an alt that could solo. You keep arguing that people aren't getting what you're talking about, but it was the same in live. You would roll up about 4am EST trying to find a group, but because there were fewer players, all the groups were full up, and we wound up sitting at a zone line shouting for hours and hours.

Join a larger guild, if you're american off-peak, look into Europa (I know nothing about them, just heard they're a European Time zone guild). And bloody 'ell... It seems you'll be damned to go you of your way and make friends in the time frame that you play. If you can manage that, then maybe when you're online looking for these groups, you'll have two or three people online with you that can group with you.

I've been here about a week now, and I can safely say that if I logged into global chat, I would have said "Well, this isn't what I'm looking for" and logged off.

I have friends in off peak ,and when they ar eon its great, we own SOLB and pull everything we can think of. Thanks for your suggestion however I would never have thought of it myself.

Now you advertise yourself as having a lvl 5 and a lvl 6... how about you tell us your experience in off peak when you are 30 +?

[Hiragawa]

Sure Von... when I hit 30+ I'll come back and tell you about it. Because as I said, it's probably going to be tradeskilling and /gems. I went through it on live, and I'm prepared to go through it here.

[Vonblund]

Sure Von... when I hit 30+ I'll come back and tell you about it. Because as I said, it's probably going to be trade skilling and /gems. I went through it on live, and I'm prepared to go through it here.

Ah trade skilling and /gem... yes that's the massively multi-player experience one is looking for here. for sure.
Try again...

[Hiragawa]

*shrugs* It passes the time while trying to find a group in the off hours. I do like your retort about it though. You make it sound like the only thing to do in Eq is group and grind. Hope you're not using player crafted jewelry, they're not from a 'massively multi-player action' ^.^

[YendorLootmonkey]

If you can't use the in-game tools like /who all class or /who all LFG or /who all zone and find groups or whatever in off-peak because there's just no one around, not enough players, or whatever... global ooc is not going to fix that.

If off-peak players are looking for more people for their group, they are either going to /who all LFG or not. If they do, and you aren't a member of the class they are looking for in the level range they are looking for, that would not have changed with global ooc on. If they don't, then I guess they didn't need a replacement for their group that bad, and global ooc would not have changed that either.

Players' inability/reluctance to use the LFG flag aside, the only way I can think of that global ooc actually improved the ability of people to find groups was if someone was looking for a particular level/class for a group and you had a different character that fit that and you were interested in logging on and taking them up on their offer. You can't do *that* with the /who commands.

[Vonblund]

the only way I can think of that global ooc actually improved the ability of people to find groups was if someone was looking for a particular level/class for a group and you had a different character that fit that and you were interested in logging on and taking them up on their offer. You can't do *that* with the /who commands.

Spot on!... see my previous post about that.
That's just one particular aspect of it.

There is more to it, but I'll let the denial prone peak time players ignore that a bit longer.

[AR3151]

i have said this on other threads, stopping the global ooc will hurt alot of players. it didnt bother me, would like the ability to turn it off.

i mainly liked the global auction, like other players waiting around in EC sucks just for never find what you were looking for.

[JaVeDK]

It's really quite simple:

The majority (incl. devs) agreed that global chat was a necessity in the early days of the server due to low server population (150-300 average at peak hours). The average population at off peak hours now is 150-300, so the same reasons / arguments are still just as valid now as they were then in regards to the situation for the off peak players.

The problem is, that the majority (mainly US players) couldn't care less about the woes of the minority (Europeans, Asians, Australians etc.). They are happy (most of them anyway) so fuck everyone else...

Sad...

[nilbog]

The majority (incl. devs) agreed that global chat was a necessity in the early days of the server due to low server population (150-300 average at peak hours)

Actually, if you read back, my reasoning for it being kept on was so newer players could get technical assistance. Players that might have installed EQ out of the box, but can't get eqemu running out of the box. I have heard nothing about people having problems, so I assume it wasn't even that big of a deal. People seem to be able to read.

Never was it to maintain global conversations, try and find groups in ooc, or globally auction wares.

[km2783]

The problem is, that the majority (mainly US players) couldn't care less about the woes of the minority (Europeans, Asians, Australians etc.). They are happy (most of them anyway) so fuck everyone else...

Sad...

It goes both ways. If global was reinstated, then players during peak hours get to deal with either the Super Spam Window of Death, or nothing at all if they filter the channels or shunt them to another window.

But after reading 8 pages of this, it seems nobody in the Off-Peak crowd seems to care about that ;) Unless I missed something along the way.

Personally, I'll adapt to whatever changes are made. Global OOC went away; so I either solo if I can, work on a Stein of Moggok run to fund my jewelcrafting, or sit in nice, central EC with /LFG on with a description of where I'd like to go and then either watch TV until I get tells, solo, craft, read, write, whatever. Sometimes I'll sit in the zone I'd rather play in. This is if I can't build a group after seeing who all is LFG and in the levels I'm looking for.

I really think if more group leaders would use /who lfg and a level range, and more people would use /lfg this could be a mitigating factor in not finding groups. but it will take an effort from both sides of the table.

[Shurid]

The only reason global ooc/auction is still on is because of the population difference from live versus our server now... and the fact that chat channels are not functioning properly.

So if chat channels still don't function properly and off-peak population is much less than "live" global OOC should be implemented.

From your fingers to the forums. The off peak players have a valid argument, the population is under 200 in off peak.

[Hiragawa]

So if chat channels still don't function properly and off-peak population is much less than "live" global OOC should be implemented.

From your fingers to the forums. The off peak players have a valid argument, the population is under 200 in off peak.

So what are you suggesting? That the channels only turn on at a certain point each day?

[nilbog]

In context, that was 3 months ago. Since then I have also read a 55 page thread concerning the matter.

I also said this:

The only resonating validity I can see for global chats is the helping of new people. They probably got eq to work out of the box.. but might not be able to get eqemu working without assistance.So if chat channels still don't function properly and off-peak population is much less than "live" global OOC should be implemented.I still don't get the point, of why you need global ooc? Is it for your entertainment, groups, or auctions? Someone thoroughly explain this, instead of "I need/want this". If you're playing with 200 people, you're still going to be playing with 200 people with global ooc and auction.

How many people do you really think were in East Commons at 2 am, prekunark?

[Hiragawa]

Also... Read the rest of his post from that quote you pulled.

The only reason global ooc/auction is still on is because of the population difference from live versus our server now... and the fact that chat channels are not functioning properly.

I don't want people thinking it "won't go away", because it will eventually. That time cannot be determined by polling or arguing. It's a development decision that will be made.

There have been discussions that global chatting benefits this or that.. but honestly, all it does is give people the global ability to speak, which is non-classic. Since this is an emulated server and there are constant questions for installation/spells help, it has remained active.

There is a non-classic aspect that I would be willing to live with.. and that is the chat channels. If people could just /join general, it would alleviate some problems. The chat channels are broken, so that's not an option currently. Will they be fixed? Probably. Do I think people should "default" log on to global ooc/auction? No.

You quoted him saying the population limit was why it was still going back then, but you totally left out the next part (And the bit that he came in saying in this thread) about it being active for the technical help bits.

EDIT: Bah.. I'm so slow today. Nilbog is so speedy o.o

[Taxi]

In context, that was 3 months ago. Since then I have also read a 55 page thread concerning the matter.

I also said this:
I still don't get the point, of why you need global ooc? Is it for your entertainment, groups, or auctions? Someone thoroughly explain this, instead of "I need/want this". If you're playing with 200 people, you're still going to be playing with 200 people with global ooc and auction.

How many people do you really think were in East Commons at 2 am, prekunark?

I think its an issue of logistics and communication. Like if youre looking for a group at 2am, you can almost see at a glance whats goin on in terms of grouping, some guys looking for a tank, some other group lookin for a CC. I dont have to be logged to my 18SK to see that a group is looking for a tank, so if nothing is happening on my druid, i can hop on my SK and say hey. That kind of thing is not going to happen with the way its currently working.

Theres also that ports are way easier to get with global. I think thats why the population dropped so drastically in SolB, went from a population that looked like non-raid 30+ often late at nights to 3 people last time i was there.

Groups are way easier to maintain if you can add in Global group looking for so and so class, and then the guy who needs a port can add for it in global and get there more easily.

For me the loss of OOC is no biggie, cuz im a porter. I can just go and check whats going on instead of askin in OOC, but thats not a luxury that other classes have.

I also have to admit that i dont log at nights anymore, cuz im bored, at least when OOC was there i could chat with people joking around until something happened, now its just dead. I just hang in the forums instead lol...

Having said all that, im not sure id want OOC back to global, i just hope it will work out and all that isnt gonna set a chain in motion that is going to make the pop drop more and more.

To be frank i didnt think the pop was high enough to cut global off, i thought the idea was to chop OOC but then add the custom channels Rog was working on on the test server, is that still planned to be implemented? Or did i misunderstand something?

[jilena]

I play at all hours of the day. Peak, off peak, in between, whatever. I definitely think the offpeak people have a valid argument. Being able to "/ooc 20 rogue LFG" and have every group on the server be able to see that you are LFG, let people who are thinking of logging see that they might have a replacement, or maybe have some shaman see you and think "hey maybe we can duo"... Well that makes things a lot more convenient. Then when you find your group, being able to "/auction Paying 100pp for port to XYZ from ABC" means you can actually get to your group in a reasonable time without annoying the piss out of every druid on the server with tells.

Can the same be accomplished with LFG? Probably. If someone is sitting there spamming /who all lfg nonstop. Is it as efficient? God no.

Auction is now a chore on peak or off peak. Before I could /auction while I was farming something and then if I had a bite arrange to meet up with the player. Now I have to sit in a boring ass zone and hope the people wanting to buy my items or who are selling the items I want to buy is in the zone. EC tunnel was neat for about 30 seconds. Now it is a waste of my life (please note that when I am enjoying everquest I do not consider it a waste of my life).

Also the person who said something about afk campers was quite correct. The offpeak hours 200 people is 40-50 people AFK camping a raid encounter, 20-30 necros, enchanters, mages, and a few other random solo'ers, 20-30 people afk in the tunnel, 15 people afk everywhere else... And a remaining levelling population of about 75-100 people across 50 levels. Is it possible to consistantly find a group? Damn straight. Is it likely? Not really. Does global OOC change this completely? God no, but it certainly softens the blow a little.

Also, I don't give a shit personally for grouping purposes, I have a 50 necro and less people on means I have more shit to farm. I just like having people to chat with when I am doing it. The people QQing about spam need to grow up. You don't HAVE to read everything, you can ignore people, and if you are that incapable of just blocking that shit out, you can always disable the channel. *shrug*

[Shurid]

So your for global channels but against global OOC? There is an incredibly simple way to please everyone on both sides of the argument.

Turn on Global OOC / auction, if you like it use it, if you don't like it simply use your filters to turn it off.

Why take such a hard stance on an issue that can be resolved with EVERYONE's interest in mind? To say If you don't like it leave, or I have the final say is such a childish stance. Especially when you can just turn it back on and please everyone.

Reasons for OOC:
Entertainment
Yes, this is a massive multiplayer online game and people log in to interact with others.

People enjoy chatting actively with many people while actively playing their character. In a chat room style setting.
Some people enjoy reading the arguments or convo's as they are happening. It's like listening to talk radio, every now and then someone will here a topic that compels them to call in and participate.
Sometimes you have a quick question and you don't want to alt+tab to search for the answer, you would rather throw it out to the community for a quick response. Hell if they don't respond then go find the answer yourself.
Some people hope to score that sweet deal from a seller thats trying to get rid of a lore item quickly.
You just scored a sweet piece of loot for the first time in a dungeon, nobody in the group knows the value so you can quickly PC it in auction to see what it is worth.
Some people aren't level 50 with unlimited plat, they can't waste the alloted time they have to play EQ on sitting in EC tunnel trying to sell some spider silk so they can buy their level 12 spells.


The whole point of my argument is:
If global chat channels will eventually be implemented then why take away OOC/auction. It's almost the same exact thing with 1 minor difference. Chat channels need to be joined, while OOC/global need to be filtered out.

Make everyone happy, turn on the OOC/auction and /MOTD please turn off auction/ooc filters if you do not wish to see it.

[Ihealyou]

Filtering OOC isn't the same as turning it off. With OOC off, people play differently. They run to dungeons to get groups, auction in ec, etc. Filtering OOC makes chat classic, but it wouldn't change the way people play. By forcing OOC off for everyone, people have to adapt their playstyles, giving the server a more classic feel.

Yes, it does suck trying to find people to group with late at night. I've had good groups break up because when I need to log there are no replacements lfg. But would global OOC change this? I think its safe to assume that people use lfg when they want to join a group now. If there is no one lfg, then there is no one lfg, regardless of whether or not there is global OOC.

Socializing is harder now, but there are ways to still talk to people without OOC. Between my guild, friends, and mumble, there is usually always someone for me to talk to until at least 3 AM EST. I do miss some of the OOC converstations from when it was global, but the social atmosphere is much more similar to how it was when I played EQ now. There were always times when you had no one to talk to. Chatting with hundreds of people was nice, but it was never how EQ actually was.

[nilbog]

If global chat channels will eventually be implemented then why take away OOC/auction. It's almost the same exact thing with 1 minor difference. Chat channels need to be joined, while OOC/global need to be filtered out.


No. That isn't what I said at all. I think I said, 3 months ago, that chat channels would be something I would be "willing to live with". This was at a time when ooc/auction was also global and roaring strong. At that time, you're right, they would have been about the same.

Make everyone happy, turn on the OOC/auction and /MOTD please turn off auction/ooc filters if you do not wish to see it.That doesn't make everyone happy.

[Thac0]

I still don't get the point, of why you need global ooc? Is it for your entertainment, groups, or auctions? Someone thoroughly explain this, instead of "I need/want this". If you're playing with 200 people, you're still going to be playing with 200 people with global ooc and auction.Well whats the explanation for having global chat in the first place? Not enough population during certain times of the day? Harder to trade? Looking for groups? Newbies need a channel to ask questions?

If the answer to why it was added in the first place was yes to any of the above then you still have that issue.

Also consider the swell in population comes when "another" game hasn't released content for a while and people are looking for something to do. When they finally release that content and people head back to "that" game I hope the population of this server will be able to take it, putting us in a worse position than before.

At that point your off peak population starts looking like a Neverwinter Nights Persistant World server instead of an MMORPG. And that is a bad thing in my opinion. :(

[nilbog]

Well whats the explanation for having global chat in the first place? Not enough population during certain times of the day? Harder to trade? Looking for groups? Newbies need a channel to ask questions?

If the answer to why it was added in the first place was yes to any of the above then you still have that issue.I don't owe you an explanation. We make the best decisions when we see fit to make them. When the server launched, I was also told that only "30-40" people would be playing, and that boxing would be necessary. Things change.
Also consider the swell in population comes when "another" game hasn't released content for a while and people are looking for something to do. When they finally release that content and people head back to "that" game I hope the population of this server will be able to take it, putting us in a worse position than before.We're making classic Everquest, not trying to content race competition? I think you have the wrong idea of this project.

[Malrubius]

Easier said than done, I know, but why don't the off-hours folks (or the off-hour folks who see this as a problem) get together and form a guild?

This seems like the classic solution.

Global channels (opt-in or otherwise) would be a blow to the "classic-ness" of the server, imo.

EDIT: And I think such a channel would be roundly abused since a lot of people are still addicted to the global chat, and would instantly join such a channel to the detriment of the ooc and auction channels.

[Thac0]

I don't owe you an explanation. We make the best decisions when we see fit to make them. When the server launched, I was also told that only "30-40" people would be playing, and that boxing would be necessary. Things change. You are correct that you don't own any one any kind of explanation over why you make any choice in regards to server health. We just ask because we are genuinely concerned with the server growth and playability. Many players here including myself click on the adds here and/or even donate cold hard cash because we enjoy the server that much.

We're making classic Everquest, not trying to content race competition? I think you have the wrong idea of this project.I think you misunderstand. People will leave when other games release their content lowering server population. If your decision to remove global was based on server population.. even partially, then the move to remove it may have been to soon.

On the flip side of the coin... the staff here seems pretty adept at making changes in regards to server health, so I have confidence that you will do what you need to make the server the best it can be. The recent GM events and PVP stuff is a case in point that you guys want to make it fun for everyone and we really appreciate that.

[Toony]

Filtering OOC isn't the same as turning it off. With OOC off, people play differently. They run to dungeons to get groups, auction in ec, etc. Filtering OOC makes chat classic, but it wouldn't change the way people play. By forcing OOC off for everyone, people have to adapt their play styles, giving the server a more classic feel.

Exactly, its a fundamental difference not just one of convenience. Like you said, leaving it on but hidden will have the exact same effect as just leaving it on and visible, further fragmentation of the established grouping system.

To be honest in the last couple of days playing, I've realized how incredibly smart and or incredibly lucky the original dev/decision making team was to happen up on such a naturally social method of group making. Groups in other games are a take it or leave proposition to a point, i.e. you can solo, group, craft, pvp etc. The shared goals element of EQ encouraged grouping, the death penalty discouraged boneheaded players with no regard for the party, the loot system and free for all nature of the world encouraged bargaining and even sometimes refereeing.. .

To those who want a global ooc/trade system I have to wonder, why are you even on a "classic" eq server, the second a channel goes global it shrinks the world. If what you really want to emulate is just about any other modern day/bland mmo, why not just play one? EQ was/is special for a reason, why strip it of that uniqueness?

[gedeost]

In context, that was 3 months ago. Since then I have also read a 55 page thread concerning the matter.

I also said this:
I still don't get the point, of why you need global ooc? Is it for your entertainment, groups, or auctions? Someone thoroughly explain this, instead of "I need/want this". If you're playing with 200 people, you're still going to be playing with 200 people with global ooc and auction.

How many people do you really think were in East Commons at 2 am, prekunark?

Firstly i suggest you try spending 2 hours in the EC tunnel @ 200 people.

Then you will realize that yes its for general entertainment. People discuss random things and help newbies out, makes the server feel alive when you die to a unkillable lvl 1 snake. Insert loading screen and 10 minutes of empty void.

Who even bothers trying to sell anything around 200 pop? You know it's just going to be a waste of your time anyway. It's the same with grouping.

Before you could be semi afk on your tailor alt in south karana cleaning your room and still catch some lowbie looking for a grotesque mask, sell your spider silk stacks, try to start/join/rep a group or jump into the ooc chat. The only one chatting right now during those hours is Sergeant Slate and he likes to kill more then talking if you know what i mean.

Atleast before those 200 people had a decent cellphone, now they have to write letters. It's slow and inconvenient.

It's like asking you why do you need forums and irc? If you're hosting a server with 1000 people, you're still going to be hosting a server with 1000 people with forums and irc.


Exactly, its a fundamental difference not just one of convenience. Like you said, leaving it on but hidden will have the exact same effect as just leaving it on and visible, further fragmentation of the established grouping system.

To be honest in the last couple of days playing, I've realized how incredibly smart and or incredibly lucky the original dev/decision making team was to happen up on such a naturally social method of group making. Groups in other games are a take it or leave proposition to a point, i.e. you can solo, group, craft, pvp etc. The shared goals element of EQ encouraged grouping, the death penalty discouraged boneheaded players with no regard for the party, the loot system and free for all nature of the world encouraged bargaining and even sometimes refereeing.. .

To those who want a global ooc/trade system I have to wonder, why are you even on a "classic" eq server, the second a channel goes global it shrinks the world. If what you really want to emulate is just about any other modern day/bland mmo, why not just play one? EQ was/is special for a reason, why strip it of that uniqueness?

You can't really be serious in saying that Everquest is a better game, more special and unique then any other mmorpg, just because you can't global chat or auction? They probably just didn't know how to code it or didn't have the time, that's all.

That's like saying 98% of humans are bland because they have televisions instead of radios or cars instead of horses.

[Toony]

You can't really be serious in saying that Everquest is a better game, more special and unique then any other mmorpg, just because you can't global chat or auction? They probably just didn't know how to code it or didn't have the time, that's all.

That's like saying 98% of humans are bland because they have televisions instead of radios or cars instead of horses.

Sorry, where did I say that again?

[JayDee]

I must say, I was for the removal of global ooc/auction at first.

But now, it just seems more of a ghost town and it's more difficult to find ports and to trade.

Finding myself less interested to log in on my free time in general and I know a few people who feel the same way.

[nosto]

Since the modification from global to localized chat has been implemented what kind of peak player loss has occurred? Are we really seeing some doomsday prophecy /ragequit that was forcasted or was there little impact. Since I started two weeks ago I've seen nothing but higher numbers when I log in so I personally feel the vision the developers had was what players wanted.

I also think that a lot of us old school eq players have really forgot a lot of the patience factors that existed in classic everquest.

I appreciate the fact that chat is no longer global and that the EC tunnels thrive with life. But I think if some form of metrics showing that the population didn't take a nose dive might also hush some of the people so concerned.

Maybe as a part of the guide starting up, some helpful hints for those who are not used to having to play eq classic style should be provided. Such as /who all 10 20 lfg, /who all zonename, /who all dru/wiz. Commands that can be used in aiding with certain situations. If you have a question about a quest, that is what the internet is for if you can't find the answer in your local ooc. When I played in 2000 if I didn't know what to do I just checked out zam or some other site that provided the information. That is what made eq different was that things weren't handed to you, and in the long run it builds a more competent player base that KNOWS its stuff as opposed to the game carrying them.

[nilbog]

But I think if some form of metrics showing that the population didn't take a nose dive might also hush some of the people so concerned.

Sure.

Global ooc/auction was turned off 5/23/10.

Max players went up to 741 on 5/25/10.

Max players went up to 776 this week.

http://www.eqemulator.org/index.php?pageid=serverinfo&worldid=787

[Phallax]

Sure.

Global ooc/auction was turned off 5/23/10.

Max players went up to 741 on 5/25/10.

Max players went up to 776 this week.

Lol nice.

[Hiragawa]

I also think that a lot of us old school eq players have really forgot a lot of the patience factors that existed in classic everquest.

This, this is a big thing. I think my biggest aversion to the global chat channels on a classic server, is what live has become today. Every zone is a ghost town. People just sit in the Guild Lobby and use the channels to find a group, then use one of the many automated porting services to get where the group is going. The only time you see people shouting for a group in a zonewide channel, is when one of the Hotzones is really good, such as Plane of Fire.

And if you do go out and about in the zones on your own, the people you run across are either already grouped because they shouted a bunch in the global chat to find their group and took over the camp etc, or they're boxing/soloing and don't want to be bothered.

There's no patience, there's no social aspect, and if you don't use the global chat to find a group, you'll be damned if you'll get one by going zone to zone.

[eqdruid76]

youre just flat out wrong, i know its meant to be hard blah blah blah. and it is hard to find solid groups even during peak times.

we are talking about offpeak times when groups are virtually non-existent.. currently at this very moment i think there are around 150 logged in.. of that 150 there are currently 45 in perma camping vox, so there is only 105 players with a level range of 50 for people to group with. and i bet a lot of them would be afk sleepers too.

there is absolutely nothing i have done wrong, its just theres no one around.

i myself dont have an issue. i solo'd my last lvls from 40 to 50, as i did with most my levels prior to that. gg charm. but i can understand what it is like for the other players who cant solo.

i played 9 straight years on live, no need to go back, im here for the classic raid content, not the current on live.

SO let me get this straight. You're not even LOOKING for groups, and you're on here complaining about how hard it is to find a group?

Wow. Just.....wow.........

[Vonblund]

SO let me get this straight. You're not even LOOKING for groups, and you're on here complaining about how hard it is to find a group?

Wow. Just.....wow.........

It's more likely.. he's tried to group, and when he found out it was not working he found some other way to progress, which is fine when you play a soloable class.

But of course you interpret whichever way suits you... selective reading.

[jilena]

The population has continued to increase since the loss of global OOC. I don't think that is going to change. As more and more people are made aware of this server it's population growth will continue as this growth is somewhat exponential. I.e. someone tells 5 of their friends they each tell 2 of their friends who tell two of their friends who tell two of their friends etc. Even if 5 out of the first batch of 6 quit here you are still left with 31 players instead of 6...

The real question of the effect would be how many established players are now playing significantly less? How many no longer log on? Of the new people who play, how many make it over level 30? Has the growth expanded into the off peak hours? Is the population large enough at these times to sustain a reasonable classic experience from level 1 to 50?

The areas I see hit the hardest by this are the folks who are brand new and the people who have well established characters. Some areas of this server are flat out dead. People know where the good areas are and those who know their shit GTFO out of places like everfrost, qeynos hills, west karana, etc as quickly as possible. New people will be stuck soloing and not get the community feel they might have otherwise experienced with the bustling global ooc.

For those who have one or more max level characters, or at least have been around long enough to be comfortable with their characters place may find themselves now annoyed with things being more tedious and time consuming at a point where their interest in the game is already waning. *shrug*

[frefaln]

I hear what you're saying but putting global chat in the game again will force everyone to use them, because people will stop auctioning and going lfg in the normal routes again. Which means we've got to listen to mandatory douche baggary to get groups.

I completely agree with this. The integrity of the original game is what's at stake here, and you know a world channel is just going down the same path as the latter stages of the original iteration.

Fire up IRC in a separate window if it's that important to have features beyond the scope of classic EQ.

[nicemace]

SO let me get this straight. You're not even LOOKING for groups, and you're on here complaining about how hard it is to find a group?

Wow. Just.....wow.........


you just dont read anything do you.. lol.

in previous posts i said i have done the lfg thing for 10+ hours. sitting in zone spamming blah blah blah

didnt work.

solo'd most of it.

l2read.

[nicemace]

The population has continued to increase since the loss of global OOC. I don't think that is going to change. As more and more people are made aware of this server it's population growth will continue as this growth is somewhat exponential. I.e. someone tells 5 of their friends they each tell 2 of their friends who tell two of their friends who tell two of their friends etc. Even if 5 out of the first batch of 6 quit here you are still left with 31 players instead of 6...



there is no direct correlation between population growth and global ooc, to think that there is...well....

correct me if im wrong, but wasn't the population increasing before the global got taken off? so its pretty pointless to bring growth into the argument.

[eqdruid76]

It's more likely.. he's tried to group, and when he found out it was not working he found some other way to progress, which is fine when you play a soloable class.

But of course you interpret whichever way suits you... selective reading.

If that's true, then why is he complaining about a social issue that doesn't even affect his playstyle?

Very much more likely....he soled all the way to 50, made no friends or contacts, pissed a lot of people off on the way, and is being ignored by the players that are having no trouble whatsoever grouping during off peak hours. I seriously doubt that serverwide chat would aid his quest for a group at all, and he simply wants EVERYONE to read his QQ about how hard the game is for him.....

[eqdruid76]

Ultimately, serverwide chat is not coming back, and very few players quit over it. Those that did....good riddance to bad rubbish. People simply need something to complain about. Which is fine, their tears nourish me....

[nicemace]

If that's true, then why is he complaining about a social issue that doesn't even affect his playstyle?

Very much more likely....he soled all the way to 50, made no friends or contacts, pissed a lot of people off on the way, and is being ignored by the players that are having no trouble whatsoever grouping during off peak hours. I seriously doubt that serverwide chat would aid his quest for a group at all, and he simply wants EVERYONE to read his QQ about how hard the game is for him.....

lol.. made a bunch of cool mates that i grouped with while leveling.. problem is we werent in same time zones so grouping with them wasnt always viable.

you really don't put much consideration into thinking about middle ground or anything do you. its the extreme of both ends or nothing is possible.

PS. the game isnt hard. i was doing levels between 40 - 50, 5 hours per level. better than what most people will get :D

[holkan]

If that's true, then why is he complaining about a social issue that doesn't even affect his playstyle?

Very much more likely....he soled all the way to 50, made no friends or contacts, pissed a lot of people off on the way, and is being ignored by the players that are having no trouble whatsoever grouping during off peak hours. I seriously doubt that serverwide chat would aid his quest for a group at all, and he simply wants EVERYONE to read his QQ about how hard the game is for him.....

lmfao i like how you dont like his opinion so you pile on a bunch of bullshit about how hes pissed off alot of people and how terrible he is and has no friends and being ignored by players. You are something else and its quite pathetic.

[nosto]

there is no direct correlation between population growth and global ooc, to think that there is...well....

correct me if im wrong, but wasn't the population increasing before the global got taken off? so its pretty pointless to bring growth into the argument.

Well actually its not any sort of "...well...." and to use a word like correlation would have been correct had you used it correctly. I would say that there is a correlation for higher numbers but not a causation. And its probably too soon to tell how many people will quit due to not being able to use the functions in game that global was such a crutch for in the first place. If the population continues to rise, obviously the removal of global channels was not a poor choice as the amount of incoming exceeds the amount of outgoing.

For a more personal example, when I joined the server and saw channels were global I thought "eh its ok" but when I referred several friends and they saw the channels were global they were actually turned off. When I told them the goal was to eventually have the global chat removed - they said "ok i'll bite" so in a lot of ways a lot of people wanted that.

[Malrubius]

there is no direct correlation between population growth and global ooc, to think that there is...well....

correct me if im wrong, but wasn't the population increasing before the global got taken off? so its pretty pointless to bring growth into the argument.

The theoretical correlation we were presented with over and over (and over and over) is that the population would surely go DOWN if global OOC were taken away.

Pointing out the fact now that the population in fact continues to go up is merely demonstrating that the earlier argument was completely and utterly wrong.

So you are right - there is no direct correlation between population growth and global ooc. So we can drop that as any kind of argument to bring it back. Ever.

[eqdruid76]

lmfao i like how you dont like his opinion so you pile on a bunch of bullshit about how hes pissed off alot of people and how terrible he is and has no friends and being ignored by players. You are something else and its quite pathetic.

Serverwide OOC isn't coming back. You lose. Good day sir.

[eqdruid76]

I SAID GOOD DAY!!!!!!!!!!

[Zithax]

It is the year 2010. People generally have computers powerful enough to run EQ in windowed mode while having an IRC client up. The IRC #project1999 channel can replace global OOC if everyone really wanted it to. Yes, it's a tad more inconvenient to switch out of window and ask/respond to something, but since obviously it's game-breaking for some of you to not have some sort of global chat, I would think that would be a minor inconvenience.

All that does is circumvent the issue creating a band-aid type solution, when it would be easier all around just to implement chat-channels.

Global channels didn't destroy the EC experience on the Combine server on live. They enhanced it. Don't ask me how or why, but people still used a global auction channel AND used EC as a hub.

Ask yourself, does it make sense to not have global chat, but allow people to /tell others across the world? or /guild across the world? Quit being hypocritical.

[Reiker]

They still used EC cause it's retarded when people expect you to come to Frenzy to buy their FBR.

[Shawk]

Player base reached 800 today..

But title says the games been killed, stats must be lies.

Sell during daytime, loot during nighttime?

Or vice versa depending on your timezone.

[Zithax]

Player base reached 800 today..

But title says the games been killed, stats must be lies.

Sell during daytime, loot during nighttime?

Or vice versa depending on your timezone.

Clearly you misunderstood the title of this thread!

[Reiker]

Zithax you gonna play prog 2.0 bro?

[eqdruid76]

All that does is circumvent the issue creating a band-aid type solution, when it would be easier all around just to implement chat-channels.

Global channels didn't destroy the EC experience on the Combine server on live. They enhanced it. Don't ask me how or why, but people still used a global auction channel AND used EC as a hub.

Ask yourself, does it make sense to not have global chat, but allow people to /tell others across the world? or /guild across the world? Quit being hypocritical.

Yes, it makes perfect sense, because that's how it was on live. I will use capital letters, might even bold them, so you'll read it and process it. THERE WAS NO SERVERWIDE CHAT IN CLASSIC EVERQUEST. THIS SERVER EXISTS TO EMULATE CLASSIC EVERQUEST. HENCE, THERE IS NO LONGER SERVERWIDE CHAT ON THIS SERVER.

Nothing more to say about it, really, because that's all you need to know.

[Zithax]

dumb shit

You're one of those people who doesn't understand reason or logic, so I won't bother repeating myself.

@Reiker: Yes

[Goobles]

They still used EC cause it's retarded when people expect you to come to Frenzy to buy their FBR.

FBSS

[Reiker]

FBSS

wut

[Shawk]

Clearly you misunderstood the title of this thread!

Title of thread = "no global ooc in offpeak killed this game."

That means, changing global ooc to local ooc killed this server, no? or is there a hidden meaning in there only cool people understand?

If by killed off the server you mean killed off the servers epeen driven douchehats that sat in ooc then yes, I agree.. but it didn't, "kill this server.." even in the slightest sense.

[Taxi]

The theoretical correlation we were presented with over and over (and over and over) is that the population would surely go DOWN if global OOC were taken away.

Pointing out the fact now that the population in fact continues to go up is merely demonstrating that the earlier argument was completely and utterly wrong.

So you are right - there is no direct correlation between population growth and global ooc. So we can drop that as any kind of argument to bring it back. Ever.

Thats just short term... EC tunnel is still new... it creates something novel... wait a week or 2 or 3 before you can pass final judgement.

[Zithax]

Title of thread = "no global ooc in offpeak killed this game."

I bolded it for u

[holkan]

Serverwide OOC isn't coming back. You lose. Good day sir.


I dont care how its done server wide or zone doesnt bother me either way I just found your post to be incredibly stupid and felt I should laugh at it since you felt the need to randomly attack someone because you hated his opinion.

[eqdruid76]

I dont care how its done server wide or zone doesnt bother me either way I just found your post to be incredibly stupid and felt I should laugh at it since you felt the need to randomly attack someone because you hated his opinion.

I don't hate his opinion. I'm merely stating his opinion is flawed, invalid, and, at this point, moot. Serverwide chat is gone. And it's not coming back. There is a perfecty good mIRC channel, though. If you really need someone to hold your thingie while you tinkle, use that.

[holkan]

I don't hate his opinion. I'm merely stating his opinion is flawed, invalid, and, at this point, moot. Serverwide chat is gone. And it's not coming back. There is a perfecty good mIRC channel, though. If you really need someone to hold your thingie while you tinkle, use that.

nah you're just trolling thats why you added all the extra bullshit instead of just saying your peace, hence why you just said "If you really need someone to hold your thingie while you tinkle, use that". You just wanna make someone angry so you can masturbate to it, its pretty funny.

[eqdruid76]

nah you're just trolling thats why you added all the extra bullshit instead of just saying your peace, hence why you just said "If you really need someone to hold your thingie while you tinkle, use that". You just wanna make someone angry so you can masturbate to it, its pretty funny.

The only troll here is you. It's not my fault you don't know how to play the game without serverwide chat.

Standing by for the "I didn't want serverwide chat anyway lol" retort, in which case I'll go ahed and reply "See, you're a troll. You don't even care about this thread.".

[Vonblund]

nah you're just trolling thats why you added all the extra bullshit instead of just saying your peace, hence why you just said "If you really need someone to hold your thingie while you tinkle, use that". You just wanna make someone angry so you can masturbate to it, its pretty funny.

I concur, Eqdruid76 is pure troll.
Now it's just a matter of ignoring him.

[Taxi]

Nilbog asked for some feedback about global OOC, and eqdruid76 is attacking people like OOC IS NOT COMING BACK, SORRY IF YOU CANT MAKE FRIENDS, STFU ABOUT IT
making it a fucking headache for skimming for non-troll replies, thats whats going on here.

[gedeost]

If you hadn't removed global ooc/auction, you would have had a 1500 population peak now.

But grats, you got like 50 more people playing now, wow!

[Tseng]

If you hadn't removed global ooc/auction, you would have had a 1500 population peak now.

But grats, you got like 50 more people playing now, wow!

And exactly what are you basing this statement on? Your imagination?

[eqdruid76]

I concur, Eqdruid76 is pure troll.
Now it's just a matter of ignoring him.

Common sense really pisses you off, doesn't it?

Too many players like you STILL playing Everquest, even after all this time...

[eqdruid76]

Nilbog asked for some feedback about global OOC, and eqdruid76 is attacking people like OOC IS NOT COMING BACK, SORRY IF YOU CANT MAKE FRIENDS, STFU ABOUT IT
making it a fucking headache for skimming for non-troll replies, thats whats going on here.

Attacking? No. But that is exactly what I'm saying. It's done, there's nothing you can do about it, get over it, move on, learn to play the game or GTFO.

And no one is making you read my posts, or anyone else's. So any headache you suffer is your own doing.

[Tseng]

I agree with your points eqdruid, but you're a complete dick about it. Maybe just tone it down. Just a thought.

[eqdruid76]

I agree with your points eqdruid, but you're a complete dick about it. Maybe just tone it down. Just a thought.

I'm not being a dick. If these were rational, reasonable human beings with any sort of valid point or arguement, then yes, I'd be a dick. But these people are simply whining because they're not able to spam their ignorant, inane, juvenile bile at everyone that's trying to enjoy the game. They're making up scenarios and statistics that are simply lies. They're not even trying to find groups, they're saying that because they can't discuss politics and religion with players throughout the server, the game is too hard.

If I'm going to be labelled a dick for "saying out loud" what everyone else is thinking, then so be it. But that's not going to change the fact that serverwide chat is gone, and the only thing any of these trolls are going to get out of whining is me telling them to L2Play or go away.

[Taxi]

I'm not being a dick. If these were rational, reasonable human beings with any sort of valid point or arguement, then yes, I'd be a dick. But these people are simply whining because they're not able to spam their ignorant, inane, juvenile bile at everyone that's trying to enjoy the game. They're making up scenarios and statistics that are simply lies. They're not even trying to find groups, they're saying that because they can't discuss politics and religion with players throughout the server, the game is too hard.

If I'm going to be labelled a dick for "saying out loud" what everyone else is thinking, then so be it. But that's not going to change the fact that serverwide chat is gone, and the only thing any of these trolls are going to get out of whining is me telling them to L2Play or go away.

shut the FUCK up

[eqdruid76]

shut the FUCK up

Oh, did I step on your tender little toes?

[gedeost]

And exactly what are you basing this statement on? Your imagination?

The same imagination that makes people somehow believe removing global ooc/auction has been the reason for the 50 or so more people playing within a month.

I laughed.

[gedeost]

Oh, did I step on your tender little toes?

Nah.

<3

[Uaellaen]

Nah, you're just stupid.

<3

right back at you! Requesting a lock of this rants and flames thread btw .. or at least a move int he appropiate forum section ...

[gedeost]

i dont like global ooc/auction so i request a gm to delete the topic so no one will ever see that people actually care.. or atleast do something so i can sit afk in ec tunnel the next year

fixed

[Taxi]

right back at you! Requesting a lock of this rants and flames thread btw .. or at least a move int he appropiate forum section ...

Or just do something about EQ and gedeost, they are obvious trolls

[gedeost]

I'm not being a dick. If these were rational, reasonable human beings with any sort of valid point or arguement, then yes, I'd be a dick. But these people are simply whining because they're not able to spam their ignorant, inane, juvenile bile at everyone that's trying to enjoy the game. They're making up scenarios and statistics that are simply lies. They're not even trying to find groups, they're saying that because they can't discuss politics and religion with players throughout the server, the game is too hard.

If I'm going to be labelled a dick for "saying out loud" what everyone else is thinking, then so be it. But that's not going to change the fact that serverwide chat is gone, and the only thing any of these trolls are going to get out of whining is me telling them to L2Play or go away.

You have no rational arguments.

You make up scenarios and statistics that are simply lies.

Only you is thinking it.

Btw I own you in Everquest.

[eqdruid76]

You are a dick with no rational arguments.

You make up scenarios and statistics that are simply lies.

Only you and your mother is thinking it.

Btw i own you in Everquest.

l2play and resubscribe wow please.

Sorry, I've never played wow.

And you're getting desperate with your retorts. The only thing you own me in is acting like a spoiled little kid, which I'll concede you've got me beat there.

[eqdruid76]

Or just do something about EQ and gedeost, they are obvious trolls

Says the port bot that violated terms of service with his last post.

I was going to let it slide, but not now...

[gedeost]

Sorry, I've never played wow.

And you're getting desperate with your retorts. The only thing you own me in is acting like a spoiled little kid, which I'll concede you've got me beat there.

Yes, you played WoW.

And you're getting desperate with your retorts. The only thing you own me in is acting like a spoiled little kid, which I'll concede you've got me beat there.

[eqdruid76]

Yes, you played wow stupid n00b.

And you're getting desperate with your retorts. The only thing you own me in is acting like a spoiled little kid, which I'll concede you've got me beat there.

Sigh.

You can change your screen name all you want, but I know exactly who you are. Your defense mechanism of being a whiney little copycat when you've been served betrays you.

Your insignificant gripe about a game mechanic that should never have been included on the server in the first place is finished. I'm tired of stooping to your level. You are not getting your way. And you can open new email accounts to register alt names and complain about it until you're blue in the face. You're still going to have to learn to get along with players ingame to enjoy Project1999. If you're unable to do so, then that's your problem.

But by all means, QQ more. Except next time, post it in Rants and Flames, where it belongs.

Have an exuberant day, Ebay. :)

[gedeost]

Sigh.

You can change your screen name all you want, but I know exactly who you are. Your defense mechanism of being a whiney little copycat when you've been served betrays you.

Your insignificant gripe about a game mechanic that should never have been included on the server in the first place is finished. I'm tired of stooping to your level. You are not getting your way. And you can open new email accounts to register alt names and complain about it until you're blue in the face. You're still going to have to learn to get along with players ingame to enjoy Project1999. If you're unable to do so, then that's your problem.

But by all means, QQ more. Except next time, post it in Rants and Flames, where it belongs.

Have an exuberant day, Ebay. :)

You can write all the bullshit you want, but I know exactly what you are. Your defense mechanism of being a pro everquest noob when you've been served betrays you.

Your insignificant gripe about a game mechanic that was required for the server to grow should never have been removed. I'm not tired of stooping to your stupid level. No one is listening to you. And you can post new posts and complain about it until you're blue in the face. You're still going to have to learn to get play the easiest and most boring game ever. If you're unable to do so, then that's your problem.

But by all means, QQ more. Except next time, post it in Rants and Flames, where it belongs.

Have an exuberant day, Ebay. :)

[gruumsh]

lol @ this debate, you'd think this was a discussion about healthcare reform :rolleyes:

[Branaddar]

making it a fucking headache for skimming for non-troll replies

Quoted for STFU (to the trolls, I mean.)

We're here to discuss the issue, not your issues with another player. Stay on topic, get the fuck over yourselves or take it to flames and rants. Nobody wants to hear your bullshit, and frankly it's fucking annoying.

Personally, I can see an advantage to global ooc. Yes, I haven't played here much because my PC is slowly dieing. (Power supply and/or video card are borked.) But I can commiserate with the off-peakers, because I remember playing in off-peak on EQLive back in Velious days. At the time, I was a wizard so soloing was an option.

But something people need to realize is that on these emu servers, SO many people choose to play a class they don't need to group with, and will often tell you to bugger off if you do invite them, because soloing is more profitable for them.

Regardless of how server population compares to anything, the times have changed, and a lot of people are more interested in soloing than grouping. Myself, I prefer grouping and meeting people, which is why I am playing a shaman and a paladin. I want to fill needed roles in a group, I want to help other people out and make new friends.

But I am far from the majority, unfortunately.

So quote "how it was in the old days" as much as you want, decry the offpeak hour players as lazy or whatever, but of those 200 people playing in offpeak, I'm betting you about half of them have never and will never group.

I was originally against the idea of global chat because, as has been said numerous times, the level of douchebaggery one has to endure to do anything relevant with the channel sucks.

Any workaround we can think of will involve either a minor bandaid (IRC, how many people would really join it?) or a full fix that introduces new or old headaches all over again.

It would be nice to say "hey, make an LFG channel" but that would be turned into the new global chat faster than you can say LFG.

One potential solution I can think of is to do something that breaks the "classic" in a minor way.

Bring in the EQLive LFG window, or make something similar. Allow people to be on their level 50s farming plat/gear while LFG with a comment of "26 PLD or 37 CLR LFG" Allow groups to LFP so people on those 50s can check for their alts.

Yes, it's not classic, and no it's not perfect, but I think it's a decent middle-ground to the frustrations a lot of people are dealing with.

[jilena]

there is no direct correlation between population growth and global ooc, to think that there is...well....

correct me if im wrong, but wasn't the population increasing before the global got taken off? so its pretty pointless to bring growth into the argument.

Someone had asked earlier in the thread if the population had stopped growing since the ooc change. I was stating that it had not and that it probably would not for a while as more new people means even more new people because of word of mouth.

My point was in fact that these numbers were completely useless for determining the effect the OOC change had on the server. You instead need to look certain groups and see what has happened with them due to the change. Just looking at total population is not really a great way to measure the health of the server. Retention imo is more important. If 50 new people start playing every single day... But only 2 of them play for more than a few weeks having 10000000 level 15s on the server doesn't really make for a great classic experience imo... *shrug*

[pickled_heretic]

Someone had asked earlier in the thread if the population had stopped growing since the ooc change. I was stating that it had not and that it probably would not for a while as more new people means even more new people because of word of mouth.

My point was in fact that these numbers were completely useless for determining the effect the OOC change had on the server. You instead need to look certain groups and see what has happened with them due to the change. Just looking at total population is not really a great way to measure the health of the server. Retention imo is more important. If 50 new people start playing every single day... But only 2 of them play for more than a few weeks having 10000000 level 15s on the server doesn't really make for a great classic experience imo... *shrug*

I was going to come eventually to making this point.

[frefaln]

Ironically I think this thread is a perfect illustration of why global /ooc should never be implemented. I don't want this kind of childish nonsense polluting my screen at all times from every corner of Norrath, and no, I shouldn't have to rob myself of /ooc just to avoid it. If kids want to bicker, at least in the current system I'll have the latch-ditch option to leave the zone.

[Vonblund]

Frefaln, you can /ignore these annoying players in game and problem is solved.

At the moment /who is seriously bugged, adding to the difficulty created by lack of global channel in NON PEAK time.

Also, I don't think that looking at the number of players in PEAK time, is argument for non peak time issues.

[SpartanEQ]

Frefaln, you can /ignore these annoying players in game and problem is solved.

At the moment /who is seriously bugged, adding to the difficulty created by lack of global channel in NON PEAK time.

Also, I don't think that looking at the number of players in PEAK time, is argument for non peak time issues.

Like it or not it is an argument because peak = majority and off-peak = minority. Take it from someone who is in the minority in real life; sometimes you just have to deal with it. I doubt global /ooc is coming back. I don't know if chat channels will ever be created either. Unless global /ooc magically turns itself on somehow when the population of the server goes below a certain number and turns back on when it goes above, you're going to have to find other solutions to your problem(s).

Fair? No. Reality? Yes. Even though I'm in the same timezone as the server, I play at strange times too because of my schedule (weekends are a different story). I feel your pain, really, but the back and forth arguing that seems to pop-up in not only relevant threads like this one, but other totally non-related threads isn't solving anything.

I couldn't care less one way or the other; it's just a game to me. I understand being passionate about something you like to do and to be perturbed when it gets changed in a way that is detrimental to your fun level, but at some point you just have to move on.

[Oogmog]

I was pretty impartial on the decision to keep or remove global ooc, however, when I sit LFG for hours upon hours on either my druid or warrior and receive 0 tells on either due to no global /ooc, it is frustrating. It seems my era of nonstop finding groups died the day the global ooc went away.

[Malrubius]

Man, this thread has gotten almost as ugly as global OOC was.

[Thrymm]

Frefaln, you can /ignore these annoying players in game and problem is solved.

At the moment /who is seriously bugged, adding to the difficulty created by lack of global channel in NON PEAK time.

Also, I don't think that looking at the number of players in PEAK time, is argument for non peak time issues.

Wasn't there a limit of like 10 people you could have on ignore in classic? I forget for sure.

[Jify]

Killed the game? Just logged on, almost 700 players. OP is crazy 8D

[girth]

If you cannot get a group, try making one. Works for me. If not - try again another time, do something else.

Or join a leveling guild.

[jilena]

So doing a /who all LFG at 5:22am central, 14 non-anon people LFG. Of those 1 23 druid is a healer. Lemme just throw that mid 30s group together haha.

[JaVeDK]

Everyone who does not play in off-peak hours really should stay out of this debate. Your opinions are simply not valid here. Don't worry though, no one is trying to force global chat on you. What we're trying to accomplish is some sort of compromise, a fix, during off-peak hours. I'm certain everyone understand very well what makes this game great and that more convenience isn't necessarily better. What many seem to fail to understand is, that we're not looking for handouts or easier gameplay. The fact is, that the game for the off peak crowd is far more difficult now than it ever was on live, because the population then was as high off peak as it is here at peak hours. We're simply asking for a way to balance it out - the game is difficult enough as it is, this situation is just making it even more so, which is taking the enjoyment out of it for many.

While the argument that people can just be more pro-active in their search for groups is in theory valid, but it's not realistic. We could stop climate change if we all recycled, and poverty if we all gave more to charity - those are the same kinds of arguments, but they will never work because people are not that way. This is something to be understood, not used to point fingers and assign blame.

As it stands now, the lack of global communication is making the game off-peak much harder than et ever was on live - please can we find a solution?

[Taxi]

While the argument that people can just be more pro-active in their search for groups is in theory valid, but it's not realistic. We could stop climate change if we all recycled, and poverty if we all gave more to charity - those are the same kinds of arguments, but they will never work because people are not that way. This is something to be understood, not used to point fingers and assign blame.

Identifying the source of the problem is the major component of fixing it. You give such bad analogies i cannot help but think your analysis of the problem here is similarly flawed XD.

Im sorry but global poverty is not gonna get fixed with the average joe donating money to charity and not caused because the average joe is not donating money to charity. Global warming is not caused by people not recycling. Ill leave it at that cuz i dont wanna derail the thread more than it already has been. XD

[JaVeDK]

Identifying the source of the problem is the major component of fixing it. You give such bad analogies i cannot help but think your analysis of the problem here is similarly flawed XD.

Im sorry but global poverty is not gonna get fixed with the average joe donating money to charity and not caused because the average joe is not donating money to charity. Global warming is not caused by people not recycling. Ill leave it at that cuz i dont wanna derail the thread more than it already has been. XD

I think it is you who completely misunderstood what I meant. Of course global warming etc will not be changed as a result of people recycling - only an idiot would think so, that's why I thought it would be obvious that it was only meant as an example of the kind of flawed logic used in the argument that "if only people [x], then [y]" and why things don't work that way in the real world. The analogies are completely valid, because they all concern problems that to a very large degree can be fixed if people change behaviour (although those issues are obviously much more complex, but as this isn't a debate on how to fix the climate or poverty it isn't relevant to go into detail). Making people change behaviour is much easier said than done, illustrated in abundance by human history.

[Lyrren]

Or to be precise...

Yes when there are 600 players on the server, it's fine you can run to EC and buy /sell stuff. You can go to a dungeon and shout LFG

In off peak, which is my play time as well as I suppose the other 200 guys who are on at that time, this just doesn't work.

The game world feels empty, and you bump into a group opportunity more by chance and random fluke than anything else, Might as well play a solo offline game.

I really enjoyed this server while global ooc was one, now much less so.

I completely disagree, I have no problem finding groups in off peak time, in fact I find it easier than during peak times when everyone is competing for that last slot in the most desired group.

Turn on LFG and you will get an invite sooner or later, just be patient.

[girth]

The only thing global chat really helps is people LFG for their alts or characters they aren't on at the moment, which may alleviate some of the issues, but it won't be a panacea like some of you want. The only thing that will really help is more recruiting of people that play those odd hours. If you don't help this server grow, who will? They(devs) can't really advertise the server themselves since most EMU communities have unwritten rules not to recruit from each other - and thats normally the best place to advertise on the internet for stuff like this. I went around to old guild forums from guilds on my old Live server and posted threads about this game. No telling if it helped but it cannot hurt.

PS I play in non peak hours.

[abcd]

The only thing global chat really helps is people LFG for their alts or characters they aren't on at the moment, which may alleviate some of the issues, but it won't be a panacea like some of you want. The only thing that will really help is more recruiting of people that play those odd hours. If you don't help this server grow, who will? They(devs) can't really advertise the server themselves since most EMU communities have unwritten rules not to recruit from each other - and thats normally the best place to advertise on the internet for stuff like this. I went around to old guild forums from guilds on my old Live server and posted threads about this game. No telling if it helped but it cannot hurt.

PS I play in non peak hours.

The global chat is not only just to help people find groups. I'm not sure how you came up with that idea?

One of the first things I did when I logged in was to ask a simple question in ooc. Now I can't and im stuck in a silent void.

It's kinda like some of those really old computer games you have fond memories of. Mine could be my first lan experience playing Doom and Warcraft 2, those games were beyond AWESOME back then. Today they just suck.

Another classic is the "man i could play diablo 1 all night" and you download the game, install it, load it up and you just stare at that 640*480 resolution for a few seconds before you ALT + F4 / CTRL + ALT + DLT.

Kinda like were this game went.

[girth]

The global chat is not only just to help people find groups. I'm not sure how you came up with that idea?

One of the first things I did when I logged in was to ask a simple question in ooc. Now I can't and im stuck in a silent void.

It's kinda like some of those really old computer games you have fond memories of. Mine could be my first lan experience playing Doom and Warcraft 2, those games were beyond AWESOME back then. Today they just suck.

Another classic is the "man i could play diablo 1 all night" and you download the game, install it, load it up and you just stare at that 640*480 resolution for a few seconds before you ALT + F4 / CTRL + ALT + DLT.

Kinda like were this game went.

I 'came up' with that idea because its almost the only reason people spout off when they are supporters of global chat.

If you want to ask a question, try the forums? Send a tell to somebody? Ask your guild? Your zone you're in? Why does it have to be a question that EVERYBODY logged in has to see?

[Malrubius]

The global chat is not only just to help people find groups. I'm not sure how you came up with that idea?

One of the first things I did when I logged in was to ask a simple question in ooc. Now I can't and im stuck in a silent void.

It's kinda like some of those really old computer games you have fond memories of. Mine could be my first lan experience playing Doom and Warcraft 2, those games were beyond AWESOME back then. Today they just suck.

Another classic is the "man i could play diablo 1 all night" and you download the game, install it, load it up and you just stare at that 640*480 resolution for a few seconds before you ALT + F4 / CTRL + ALT + DLT.

Kinda like were this game went.

Can I have your stuff?

[Vonblund]

Jify... read my post again... OFF PEAK... not PEAK time when there are 700 people on.
OFF PEAK, has typically 200 odd players, with a good chunk of lvl 50 AFKs camping a raid target... a completely different situation to your 700 in peak time.

Benefits of global ooc in low pop times:
- Yes for finding groups for yourself or an alt.
- LFM.. that chanter who is trading town might no have his LFG flag on but could be interested to join a Magus group if he sees it advertised.
- Buying / selling, because with 200 people on server EC isn't really exciting
- General help / questions etc... with 200 people on, you are likely to be lonely in your zone, if you are not in one of the 6 or so zones that are the most popular or SOLB / Permafrost when Naggy/Vox are being camped.

Channels would help a lot. And why not have a global channel that is disabled when the population (in a perfect world it would actually be the non afk population) of the server reaches a certain limit.

[stormlord]

right back at you! Requesting a lock of this rants and flames thread btw .. or at least a move int he appropiate forum section ...

I agree with this, but being that global chat was enabled because of low population, at least initially, I think the debate is a valid one because this is about off-peak hours. As we all know, population is low at off-peak hours and is like a thorn in the side of those who like this game without global chat. But for some people, it's not a question of like or dislike. Instead, it's do or die. It can be game breaking.

The tension that's going on here is similar to the one that happened on live. In 1999, the game experienced its highest rate of incoming new players. In the years that followed this rate shrunk in response to a crowd of new mmorpgs. People want to play new games. EQ code and gfx were getting old as well. This all resulted in a shrinking total population. SOE had to make a choice. Either they find a way to reduce the difficulty of the game so that people can play it in a lower population environment, or they attempt to increase the population. They chose to reduce the difficulty, and no one can blame them because who wants to invest in an old product? At that time, they were putting their hopes in everquest 2. It's infinitely easier to reduce the difficulty a slight amount than it's to pay for advertising.

So this led to a game that had the appearance of reduced difficulty even though the difficulty, from a relative standpoint, had not changed at all. Most of the veterans in this forum, while I respect them and value their opinions, often mistake the changes to live, that were necessary, as an example of soe dumbing the game down. That's not what happened, and anybody who thinks that is fooling themselves.

Now we face similar circumstances here. Do we attempt to increase off-peak population, or do we give them global chat or make similar changes that can reduce some of the difficulties that make their lives hard? Keep in mind this is a group-based game, and in a low population something like this can be game breaking. Reducing the difficulties means finding a way for them to survive in a group-based game in a low population environment.

If you want to be proactive and do something about this without the help from developers, be generous and help out off-peak players somehow. Save some items for them. They need the help. The game they play is more difficult than the one you play at peak-hours. Have some sympathy.

Note: When I say 'low population environment', that also includes indirect processes that lead to something similar (i'll call it low population mechanics). For example, if you increase the number of zones in the game then you also spread out players more widely, thus putting them into a position where they experience low population mechanics. So when new zones entered into the game over the years in the many expansions, they had to respond to this. Their answers tended to be new traveling mechanisms, like the luclin spires or the pok books or the guild portals or the guild lobby summoners. Sure, if they could have increased the population by a significant amount, than people could have got ports from casters, but it would have to have been a large increase, thusly making it expensive and even risky. All of these things had (and have) the effect of lessening the difficulties, but the difficulty itself, from a relative perspective, was (and is) still the same. Players still had to work a long time to reach max level, max aa, max gear, and so on. Faster ways of traveling and leveling mean little when there're more places to go and more levels to gain.