Rolled a mage with my wife and...

[Infuriati]

Many of you know me on my main, Infuriati. A lot also know my wife plays (barely), so we can enjoy gaming together. But today while in oasis someone accused us of boxing, and petitioned. Thats fine because we have absolutely nothing to hide. But after being petitioned the gm claims to have seen her autofollowing me, and simultaneous casting...which is an absolute lie.Now again, I'm not worried about it because after their investigation they will realize everything is good, but I just wanted to give all those who enjoy gaming with their partners a heads up. Hope everyone enjoys their weekend!

Morterapido and Morterapida

[Pringles]

So you got busted for 2 boxing and came here to try and cover it up eh?

[Itap]

heads up about what exactly?

[Infuriati]

Busted? No sir. Im still in game if you want to send me a tell.

Heads up that gaming with your partner can look like boxing.

[fullmetalcoxman]

How would that look any more like boxing than any other duo? Besides the similar names.

[kruzchek]

Don't play togeather and go AFK or Sirken will ban you. If you don't respond in 60 second he'll say you are both logged on the same computer and you are tabbing between you and your wife. So don't go AFK Siken the Unjust P99 God will BAN you both.

[Kritimus]

One of the great things about duoing especially with a close friend/partner is that one player can be lazy if he/she wishes....let people play the fu*king game the way they want!

Why would you petition someone for supposedly boxing when you have no real clue what the scenario is.

And you CANT prove someone is or is not boxing because they dont respond to your tell within 60 seconds, thats strait up stupid.

Hope this clears for you OP.

[Jokesteve]

I just want to say to people we look into boxing pretty extensivly before taking action. That being said, we are human to, and make mistakes. If your accused of boxing, then you need to be able to prove it to us. Autofollowing is a huge red flag.

I play with my husband so I understand frustration.

Im surprised auto follow is a basis of accusation, considering this tool is classic and most people use it. MY GF included who is fucking lazy and plays with me on occasion in the same house. lol

I must say though, that choosing similar names probably put you at a higher risk of being falsely petitioned.

[Tenlaar]

Yeah, assuming auto follow is a sign of two boxing seems pretty silly to me. When I'm grouped with somebody on my bard I almost always auto follow them while we run.

[Snagglepuss]

Im surprised auto follow is a basis of accusation, considering this tool is classic and most people use it. MY GF included who is fucking lazy and plays with me on occasion in the same house. lol

I must say though, that choosing similar names probably put you at a higher risk of being falsely petitioned.

I agree with autofollowing being suspect to abuse, but when my gf plays, she almost always autofollows here and did on live because she doesn't play too often and doesn't know the zones. It's more of a, "Here you drive honey. I'll play your little game with you when we get to where we need to go," type of thing.

Just my two copper pieces.

[Swish]

I know this doesn't help the OP but I'd rather the GMs were too tight on it than too relaxed. I've reported a few suspicious duos in my time on P99 and won't apologise for it... IP exemptions are made to be exploited and I linked a chat box recently with someone selling an account, stating that it "includes IP exemption!!!!".

Would still love to know the running total of exemptions that have been given out since the good old days, but I suspect the answer is probably near 1000 if not greater and its just not talked about.

[Infuriati]

My wife auto follows because she has no clue where were going. Funny this is, today she hadn't and still hasn't done it once. Doesn't matter though, the gm says its true, so its true! Even if shes an arm reach from me.

[Swish]

Yeah, assuming auto follow is a sign of two boxing seems pretty silly to me. When I'm grouped with somebody on my bard I almost always auto follow them while we run.

Yeah but you're not sharing the same IP address, so there's no issue :p

[Tenlaar]

Somebody who sees two characters run by with one autofollowing doesn't know if they're sharing the same IP address or not. I'm just surprised that people would actually report based on that.

[Tenlaar]

And reading back, the OP said the GM mentioned autofollowing. For some reason I was remembering the person who reported him saying something about auto following.

[Swish]

Somebody who sees two characters run by with one autofollowing doesn't know if they're sharing the same IP address or not. I'm just surprised that people would actually report based on that.

No but by the same logic the people that are auto-following on the same IP address have nothing to hide as they're genuine...so even if they are reported they should be fine.

I've mentioned this on the forums but its a humorous anecdote I feel the need to repeat... :

Way back when, Amelinda did a broadcast saying words to the effect of "I'm watching you boxing, I suggest you stop"

...within a minute, 12 people logged out. Going back to 2010 :p

[kruzchek]

Well i can promise you that my wife and I have been banned for over two weeks now and the only reason is Sirken being a Dick. I went afk and when i came back there were two tells, I know your there. Second one You have 60 second to respond before i ban you. I got back in time to say : do what? and i'm gone turned and looked at my wife to tell her and poof shes gone. How fair is that? He didnt watch us or he would have seen me and her playing. So now we are liars and No One will help.

[Infuriati]

I've been nothing but honest. Next week our better internet will be installed, and maybe ill just live stream to "provide the proof" that the gms need :)

Infuriati - Lighthawk - Morterapido

[Kevynne]

to OP
me and my group reported you both for suspicious activity.
The similar names, simultaneous casting time, and the auto-follow were cited as reasons why.
Forgive me If I am actually wrong, and that you are not a 2 boxer and just trying to enjoy the box with your partner, I just cannot tolerate boxers anymore. I sincerely apologize if this is the case.

[Swish]

Well i can promise you that my wife and I have been banned for over two weeks now and the only reason is Sirken being a Dick.


Well, I'm sure insulting the GMs on the forums is doing your case for unbanning the world of good :/

Reckless Sirken is a loose cannon, right? Just bans who he likes and does what he pleases..there is no rulebook. As has been said they look at everything, I'm sure they didn't just conjure it out of the air.

[Kevynne]

[/QUOTE]Way back when, Amelinda did a broadcast saying words to the effect of "I'm watching you boxing, I suggest you stop"

...within a minute, 12 people logged out. Going back to 2010 :p[/QUOTE]

rofl xD i remeber this. i was in paw with my brother. She caught our warrior and cleric 2boxing and second that got broadcasted both went ld and never seen again. But then she went all power crazy and started rmt to unban x_x

[Infuriati]

Hey its cool man, maybe next time you could just ask right? You've jumped to conclusions and thats fine, the gms will investigate and see nothing illegal is going on.

We would have liked to have a gaming weekend, but apparently not this weekend. I wish you the best of luck on finding the two boxers.

[Kevynne]

The whole similar names thing was just one giant red flag since alot of boxers tend to do that.
You could try to petition the gms for namechange on one of your guys's characters to avoid the OMGBOXING spam
(yes i did jump to conclusions, I'm hot off the red99 server where boxing seems to be rampant)

[Swish]

Sorry for a slight derail, but if you do want to play multiple accounts at once... take a look at the EQemu server list - I think P99 is about the only server on the list with rules on boxing, THF/EZserver/others all have boxers on, enjoy it over there :p

[webrunner5]

to OP
me and my group reported you both for suspicious activity.
The similar names, simultaneous casting time, and the auto-follow were cited as reasons why.
Forgive me If I am actually wrong, and that you are not a 2 boxer and just trying to enjoy the box with your partner, I just cannot tolerate boxers anymore. I sincerely apologize if this is the case.

Jesus Christ we have big brother watching us. "suspicious activity" wow this guy must be some dick head cop in RL. Get a grip! Really don't think it is your job to be the WATCHER of us all.

Auto Follow as a Red Flag? Have you EVER PL'ed someone. Didn't think so.

[kruzchek]

I've talked to Sirken he never responds. I have send messages to everyone else on the staff asking for help,so I'm about over it anyway.When he calls my wife and I liars I took that as an insult along with never getting replys back from any of the staff not just Sirken. So if i stay banned so be it. Just know what goes on is not always fair and it doesn't seem to matter to anyone on the staff.

[Infuriati]

My wife thought it would be cute to have similar names and gear, mostly the names. But now its biting me in the ass. Ah well lesson learned I guess.

[kinadarra]

Same thing happened to my husband and I in DL when he was trying to teach me how to kite with the Yetis. Pringles, why do you automatically assume that he is trying to cover something up. Expressing frustration does not prove or disprove anything. Alovi, the only way you could possibly understand the frustration is if you were in fact accused of this same thing. I hope you are more fair in your judgements than the GM that accused my husband and I. If autofollowing is a sign of boxing, then why is it even part of the game code. There is no way to truly prove guilt or innocence once a GM has decided they think someone is guilty of boxing. Make sure if you are playing from the same IP that you give your comuters different names. Something we never realized to be an issue, but that seems to be one of the reasons the GM in our situation won't believe us. Who new lack of creativity when setting up my computer would lead to me not being able to play this game? Good luck Infuriati

[kruzchek]

You alway start that same stuff Swish. So you don't have friends or family that plays with you, it doesn't mean that everyone who gets IP exempt is boxing. I have a wife and two boys that use to play so I'm sorry you don't.

[Kevynne]

Auto Follow as a Red Flag? Have you EVER PL'ed someone. Didn't think so.

why would you use auto follow to pl? That's something new to me. Never heard of anyone doing it before

[Infuriati]

Bards use it for PLing no?

[kinadarra]

I autofollowed my husband because I could not always keep him in my line of vision on my monitor. I'm not as quick with using the keys and mouse to change my view. It really came in handy when we were levitating in mountainous regions.

[Safon]

Sirken is one of the best gm's this server has had, if he banned you 99 percent chance you deserved it. The rest of the CSR staff are great too from my experience

As for the boxing whistle blowers, better to be a bit to zealous than too lax. Boxers suck

[kinadarra]

I thought the game was called Everquest, not Boxingquest. For everyone out there passing judgement on Infuriati, Kruzchek, myself, or anyone else who has ever been suspended or accused of boxing, I sincerely hope you never have to deal with it. Because you cannot PROVE to me that you are not boxing any more than I can PROVE to you that I wasn't boxing. Unlesss we are sitting in the same room, you cannot say with certainty, you can simply make judgemen calls. If certain GMs have been kind to you, that's great, but understand that not everyone is treated the same.

[kruzchek]

100 percent i didnt. All they have to do is let us back on and look. Serkin said we were on the same PC.So if we come back on and it still looks like that, then there is your answer. I have 2 PC's 2 foot apart going into the same router. Would that look like the same computer? I dont know, but thats what i was told and banned wrongfully for.

[Infuriati]

<a href="http://s37.beta.photobucket.com/user/irishblood777/media/Bobjetta.jpg.html" target="_blank"><img src="http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e70/irishblood777/Bobjetta.jpg" border="0" alt=" photo Bobjetta.jpg"/></a>
A bit blurry, sorry about that.

[Swish]

Jesus Christ we have big brother watching us. "suspicious activity" wow this guy must be some dick head cop in RL. Get a grip! Really don't think it is your job to be the WATCHER of us all.

Auto Follow as a Red Flag? Have you EVER PL'ed someone. Didn't think so.

GMs can't be everywhere at once, so some element of self-policing is required...and isn't a bad thing in the case of those who do genuinely 2-box for their own benefits.

As mentioned as mentioned... one does not simply ban for auto-follow, they take other things into account - some of which I'm sure they won't mention due to alerting the bad guys to their "tell tell signs".

[formallydickman]

props on the pic

[Safon]

Be honest and patient with the CSR staff, they do their jobs for free. Many people forget that fact in their dealings with them.

[Swish]

lol, nice pic guys.

Is there a time perhaps where one of you would be tempted to log the other one in while he/she is at work? Not saying you do, but some might fall foul of quickly wanting to buff account 1 with account 2 to do some soloing :p

[Infuriati]

She doesn't play unless I play. I also don't have any toons that I use or could use to PL myself.

[Kevynne]

<a href="http://s37.beta.photobucket.com/user/irishblood777/media/Bobjetta.jpg.html" target="_blank"><img src="http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e70/irishblood777/Bobjetta.jpg" border="0" alt=" photo Bobjetta.jpg"/></a>
A bit blurry, sorry about that.

I stand corrected. I'm very sorry I have cause you this mess again, and am willing to get you some levels on my Cleric or buff from my Enchanter.

[Swish]

I have 2 PC's 2 foot apart going into the same router. Would that look like the same computer? I dont know, but thats what i was told and banned wrongfully for.

Certainly the same IP address. Not sure whether they have access to things like a MAC code (unique code for all electronics these days) or dynamic IP and such data... but if so, they'd be able to see if you're running 2 PCs or 1 PC with 2 windows. If the latter, you're out of luck.

I doubt they just decide to ban without some kind of evidence on the connection side.

[jkfranklin]

so you do 2 box?

[kinadarra]

not unless he magically skrinks and turns into a woman sitting next to him at the same time... oh wait, is that 2 boxing, or playing the game with someone from the same house.

[Pscottdai]

Lol, not saying they did or didn't box but posting a pic of the two systems beside each other with a person at each doesn't prove one way or the other that there was/wasn't only one person at the systems at the time the GMs observed them. Just proves they have two systems. I have two systems sitting beside each other as well and could easily have one of my kids sit next to me and snap a pic of it claiming he was there at the time of said incident.

Bottom line is like has been previously said, it is near impossible to prove one way or the other therefore GMs call. I recommend that you simply do nothing on one system while your partner is afk from the other system that way there can be no assumptions/accusations.

Again, I do not know if you were/were not boxing and could personally care less either way, but the pic is really irrelevant to the case unfortunately.

[formallydickman]

With all this 2-box drama lately, I'm glad my bro and I don't share an apt anymore. We've never been accused, but it seems like a lot of drama and stress I'd rather not deal with.

[Infuriati]

The pic was to make light of the situation. I know the truth, and eventually they will too :)

[SamwiseRed]

i could get my wife to take a pic with a sign too. not saying you were boxing but a pic is hardly proof other than you have a significant other. good luck and hopefully you arent a boxing scumbag.

[Pscottdai]

The pic was to make light of the situation. I know the truth, and eventually they will too :)

Hope so :) but my comments were more to Kinadarra and not you.

[webrunner5]

Hey, I agree Serkin is one of the Best GM's we have had no doubt in a LONG time. But this big brother is looking over your shoulder stuff is a bit scary for me.

I am all most 66 years old. Have done and seen things you don't want to know about. Been in Vietnam, guns and knifes, and in more than a few Bar fights, guns and knifes, a few Marriages, knifes, etc and I am not fond of just any Joe Blow throwing people under the bus trust me. I have been playing this game since 2000. And IT IS A GAME. Nobody is going to die, nobody is going to jump off the roof, or lose their job etc. I have been on P1999 for close to 2 years now and have over 700 posts and this is just a stupid thread as far as I am concerned. Quit being a RAT and play the game and help others out like I have tried. Life is short trust me. Try to give everyone the benefit of the doubt. It could be you down the road.

[Bubbageo]

.

[Groo]

Nice pic. This seems like a huge waste of energy when the bigger and more obvious problem is people powerleveling in popular dungeon camps...every single goddamn day. I honestly do not care about someone 2-boxing as long as they're not doing it in the middle of a dungeon, killing all the mobs...while other people who came to actually take on the challenge appropriate to their level range are sitting around LFG, chasing after scraps, or logging off.

[Bubbageo]

The population seems to have blown up very recently, and there seems to be quite a lot of hostility going around, since competition for camps and creatures is pretty crazy almost anywhere you go. Everquest is heads and tails above any other game I've played for the community it fosters, and it's disappointing to see so much spitefulness.

"Quit being a RAT and play the game and help others out like I have tried. Life is short trust me. Try to give everyone the benefit of the doubt. It could be you down the road."
-webrunner5

About to make this my sig ;)

[Infuriati]

Hey, I agree Serkin is one of the Best GM's we have had no doubt in a LONG time. But this big brother is looking over your shoulder stuff is a bit scary for me.

I am all most 66 years old. Have done and seen things you don't want to know about. Been in Vietnam, guns and knifes, and in more than a few Bar fights, guns and knifes, a few Marriages, knifes, etc and I am not fond of just any Joe Blow throwing people under the bus trust me. I have been playing this game since 2000. And IT IS A GAME. Nobody is going to die, nobody is going to jump off the roof, or lose their job etc. I have been on P1999 for close to 2 years now and have over 700 posts and this is just a stupid thread as far as I am concerned. Quit being a RAT and play the game and help others out like I have tried. Life is short trust me. Try to give everyone the benefit of the doubt. It could be you down the road.

Well said sir.

[Safon]

so you do 2 box?

Glad to see you caved and removed your vile gif, scumbag.

You should probably ditch using Down Syndrome pics too, but baby steps

[Dark Team]

i could get my wife to take a pic with a sign too. not saying you were boxing but a pic is hardly proof other than you have a significant other. good luck and hopefully you arent a boxing scumbag.

Samwise, normally I like you and appreciate what you have to say. This is one of those rare opportunities where I feel I must disagree with you.

I seriously doubt this person is boxing, and I am must assure that they are just gaming normally. It's unfortunate, but with the technology that is currently available to us you really must suspend your moronic vendetta and let this couple play.

Unfortunately, even if they are the same person (I don't believe you are, and I apologize for all of this trouble), you need to prove so before the people can be affected by your evidence.

Honestly, if Samwise allows himself to be affected by such "who cares, 3rd party" players, then they have already won. Samwise; if you ever ask me, I would never lie to you. Nihilum made popcorn and invited no one else; are you surprised? Everyone knows that N is the bad guy; they exploit and cheat as they need to advance.

[Dark Team]

Also I am drunk, so if anything happens or matter please remember that I am inebriated.

[Bubbageo]

Quote:
Originally Posted by eadric
EQ at its best is about cooperation and community, not about stomping on each others throats and being complete douchebags to each other.

This^

[Dweed]

I've played with a dozen RL friends from the same town for a couple years on this server including a brother and a roommate. With many lans playing alongside each other. We've never had problems with GMs jumping to conclusions.

Not saying anyone is guilty, just that I believe they know what to look for.

[Norok]

When I read Sirken's post yesterday I wondered how long before something like this would happened.

It only took one day.

[Bubbageo]

.

[SamwiseRed]

Samwise, normally I like you and appreciate what you have to say. This is one of those rare opportunities where I feel I must disagree with you.

I seriously doubt this person is boxing, and I am must assure that they are just gaming normally. It's unfortunate, but with the technology that is currently available to us you really must suspend your moronic vendetta and let this couple play.

Unfortunately, even if they are the same person (I don't believe you are, and I apologize for all of this trouble), you need to prove so before the people can be affected by your evidence.

Honestly, if Samwise allows himself to be affected by such "who cares, 3rd party" players, then they have already won. Samwise; if you ever ask me, I would never lie to you. Nihilum made popcorn and invited no one else; are you surprised? Everyone knows that N is the bad guy; they exploit and cheat as they need to advance.

Not saying there was boxing going on but it has been getting bad lately. It would be very tempting, if my wife played or w/e, to use her char to port/buff/heal me as well. I dont have an exemption nor does my wife play just saying people dont think they will get caught and do. Obviously something seemed off or the GM's wouldnt have bothered them. I know this because ive grouped with couples on blue for hours with no problems. if they werent boxing, i hope they get their exemption back, if they were i hope he/she just mans up and faces judgement.

sorry i dont give everyone the benefit of a doubt.

[Sirken]

i feel anyone that posted in this thread should owe me roughly 35 seconds, form a line to the left.

that said, we do not suspend or ban people on a whim. if you were suspended, we had a reason to do so. every staff member has to make a thread every time they ban or suspend a player, so that I or another staff member can look up the situation.

now, i noticed two sets of players crying that they were suspended. i have no doubts in the world that these people have wives that play EQ. that being said, players need to be aware of their situations as well. on the off chance that ALL of our detectors were giving false positives (near impossible, but whatever) i still like to send a tell. if you /q out, or, if you fail to respond to me for a few minutes, i have no choice but to assume that the time delay is due to nothing more than the husband running off to get his wife to sit at the computer.

having a wife and an exemption does not mean that if your wife doesnt feel like playing you get to 2box until a GM /tells you (at which time you go to get your wife).

also, believe it or not, how I treat players is based on how they treat the staff.

lastly - petition forum. if u want to discuss something, you need to make a petition. contrary to popular belief, nothing we read in the server chat or rnf is taken too seriously.

[Splorf22]

In my experience Sirken has been great. Certainly far better than Amelinda.

Also I would like to point out that boxing is classic. It makes me just a little bit sad that boxing isn't allowed, because if it was I would use MQ to write some scripts. Everquest is pretty repetitive and ripe for automation; I think it would be a fun challenge to have scripts so that I could box 50+ characters while sitting back and playing general. Oh my god the neckbeards on the pvp server would hate me.

[senna]

My buddy who I used to play on live had me over at his house one day and showed me this server originally. He boxed a war/shm all the way up to 50.

Anyways, the day he decided to log in and show me around Uthgaard (sp) ports in on him and suspects him of boxing.

So Uth is sending tells to my friend who is replying on both chars, then he has my friend doing all sorts of different things, running in circles, running opposite directions and zig zagging etc

I had no idea what was going on at the time, but it was pretty hilarious to see my buddy stretching his arms between two different keyboards and trying to run all these drills at the same time. It was like watching an athlete. He did get away with it though.

[Taffan]

So, if I setup a computer next to mine, get my GF to hold up a sign and take a pic - I can two-box? :P

[Jokesteve]

Certainly the same IP address. Not sure whether they have access to things like a MAC code (unique code for all electronics these days) or dynamic IP and such data... but if so, they'd be able to see if you're running 2 PCs or 1 PC with 2 windows. If the latter, you're out of luck.

I doubt they just decide to ban without some kind of evidence on the connection side.

Mac codes can be clonned via router to appear the same for all pcs on the same network. Id hope thats not one of their methods of detection.

[Infuriati]

So, if I setup a computer next to mine, get my GF to hold up a sign and take a pic - I can two-box? :P

Give it a shot man.

Let me know how that goes.

[Vladesch]

I know this doesn't help the OP but I'd rather the GMs were too tight on it than too relaxed

So you're ok with innocent people getting the boot. All for the greater good eh?
Careful someone doesn't accuse you one day.

[Jokesteve]

i feel anyone that posted in this thread should owe me roughly 35 seconds, form a line to the left.

that said, we do not suspend or ban people on a whim. if you were suspended, we had a reason to do so. every staff member has to make a thread every time they ban or suspend a player, so that I or another staff member can look up the situation.

now, i noticed two sets of players crying that they were suspended. i have no doubts in the world that these people have wives that play EQ. that being said, players need to be aware of their situations as well. on the off chance that ALL of our detectors were giving false positives (near impossible, but whatever) i still like to send a tell. if you /q out, or, if you fail to respond to me for a few minutes, i have no choice but to assume that the time delay is due to nothing more than the husband running off to get his wife to sit at the computer.

having a wife and an exemption does not mean that if your wife doesnt feel like playing you get to 2box until a GM /tells you (at which time you go to get your wife).

also, believe it or not, how I treat players is based on how they treat the staff.

lastly - petition forum. if u want to discuss something, you need to make a petition. contrary to popular belief, nothing we read in the server chat or rnf is taken too seriously.

Ive said it before and Ill say it again, I think Sirkens one of the best GM's this server has to offer. With that being said, I do have a question for you Sirken. Is it possible by any stretch of the imagination that you decide to pop people with these tasks to verify themselves not AFK during say, autofollow'ing my gf to another place in the zone as I got to the restroom?

The scenario I'm playing out in my head is you've watched us for about 30 mins, and due to the autofollowing and little interaction from her shaman makes you decide to ask us both to do tasks as Im off using the restroom while autofollowing her. So obviously not going to see your tell right away, and quite possibly could result in a ban before I ever get back to my keyboard? (my gf is pretty lazy, rarely looks at chat even when we do play together I normally inform her of anything group says that is relevant) - this is also something that worries me if we were ever to have such situation.

What it really sounds like is that the staff makes you run in circles, do this and that while the other is doing something different or answering questions. And if we don't dance to your liking it will end up in a ban?

Its sad others have to ruin it for people like us who duo legitimately and thus force the staff to harass legit players.

[Duckforceone]

it's quite simple guys..

if you got an ip exemption, you have to play extra clean. If you are afk, put on an afk sign and stop moving around or xp'ing on the other character

if you got an ip exemtion, always check your chat, and have your chat windows turned on.

if you do the above, you should not be mistaken for a two boxer...

[Alovia]

Ive said it before and Ill say it again, I think Sirkens one of the best GM's this server has to offer. With that being said, I do have a question for you Sirken. Is it possible by any stretch of the imagination that you decide to pop people with these tasks to verify themselves not AFK during say, autofollow'ing my gf to another place in the zone as I got to the restroom?

The scenario I'm playing out in my head is you've watched us for about 30 mins, and due to the autofollowing and little interaction from her shaman makes you decide to ask us both to do tasks as Im off using the restroom while autofollowing her. So obviously not going to see your tell right away, and quite possibly could result in a ban before I ever get back to my keyboard? (my gf is pretty lazy, rarely looks at chat even when we do play together I normally inform her of anything group says that is relevant) - this is also something that worries me if we were ever to have such situation.

What it really sounds like is that the staff makes you run in circles, do this and that while the other is doing something different or answering questions. And if we don't dance to your liking it will end up in a ban?

Its sad others have to ruin it for people like us who duo legitimately and thus force the staff to harass legit players.

I can tell you that I don't target followers. I get lazy to when my husband is running. I afk run to. But af the tank in the middle of a battle is stupid, and a sign of boxing, but that's not going to be the reason for suspension.

We don't just watch you for af. We look at several things and for the most part they are pretty accurate.

Most boxers I have caught legitamently are really.2 people. They make a poor choice to box once without the person because they think they can get away with it.

[Swish]

Mac codes can be clonned via router to appear the same for all pcs on the same network. Id hope thats not one of their methods of detection.

Well a router has its own MAC code. I'm no techie, but there's nothing to say they can't see the PC MAC codes that are playing EQ, or the dynamic IPs (xx.xx.xx.1 and xx.xx.xx.4 for example).

The point is, they have their detection methods - so the best way to not get caught is to not pull any quick tricks like buffing one account with the other, auto-following, and any other more subtle tell tell signs.

...if duos are unable to do this its a case of first world problems. Auto follow = laziness, buffing each other with only one at the computer is nice, yet unfair on the rest of us who don't have access to that, and there's probably all kinds of signs with poorly timed heals and such stuff.

[Swish]

So you're ok with innocent people getting the boot. All for the greater good eh?
Careful someone doesn't accuse you one day.

They're all innocent right? I don't box, I don't want to box, and I don't like 2-boxing. The fact that there's IP exemptions in the first place should be seen as a privelige, not a right.

Hate on me, I'm not bothered...you get caught being lazy or trying to get an edge on the rest of us, don't come crying on the forums - chances are you know what the "trigger" moment was when the GMs were onto you.

Give EQmac a try, they'll welcome more people and you can box to your heart's content.

Also, reposting:-

http://i.imgur.com/ysgY0.jpg

http://i.imgur.com/VhEesdw.jpg

[Spoonerism]

I thought if you were suspected of 2 boxing they ported you to some magic land and made you and your partner run figure eights to prove that two different people are playing?

[Jokesteve]

I can tell you that I don't target followers. I get lazy to when my husband is running. I afk run to. But af the tank in the middle of a battle is stupid, and a sign of boxing, but that's not going to be the reason for suspension.

We don't just watch you for af. We look at several things and for the most part they are pretty accurate.

Most boxers I have caught legitamently are really.2 people. They make a poor choice to box once without the person because they think they can get away with it.

This really is dancing around my question.

[Itap]

In order for the GMs to prevent and enforce boxing, casualties of war are going to happen. If my wife ever decided to play, I would advise against it, just in case this scenario ever happened. Maybe I was momentarily afk while my wife was playing, but since i couldn't prove it at the time, i could potentially be banned.

It's just a risk that i wouldn't really want to take. Boxing is against the rules and STRICTLY enforced on this server, I wouldn't want to lose my character because I auto-followed my wife while i went to take out the trash.

[SamwiseRed]

temptation is too great for some. lets say you and your woman are playing in KC. wife goes to make a sandwich when all of a sudden a huge train comes your way. your wife is a druid with evac up, do you cast it to save yourself and her (boxing) or do you gate and let wife die? personally id let wife die then corpse camp her but thats me. clean whistle for life.

[Itap]

clean whistle for life.

<3

[jerok88]

temptation is too great for some. lets say you and your woman are playing in KC. wife goes to make a sandwich when all of a sudden a huge train comes your way. your wife is a druid with evac up, do you cast it to save yourself and her (boxing) or do you gate and let wife die? personally id let wife die then corpse camp her but thats me. clean whistle for life.

This is like the question, would you steal to eat. Holy uptight paladin 4life lol

[Calabee]

two boxing was a classic legit feature, selling account for items / plat wasn't.

Just sayin~

[Bubbageo]

.

[Thulack]

two boxing was a classic legit feature, selling account for items / plat wasn't.

Just sayin~

My parents both played and had their Pc's next to each other. When 1 went to go get food or do something around the house the other would play them. If i had a significant other that wanted to play p99 with me i wouldnt let them due to this rule and the way its hard to enforce.

[Sadre Spinegnawer]

playing w/ wife is very not-classic. not saying it didn't happen, but I wouldn't believe it. lots of those husband-wife teams back in the day was just an ambidextrous neckbeard.

[Danth]

playing w/ wife is very not-classic.

Yeah, the wife and I weren't married yet in 1999. Classic is "girlfriend."

My own personal rule on P1999 is simple enough; I don't go near the wife's computer when we're both logged on. If she goes AFK, her character sits there--no buffs, no heals, and if someone trains then she gets killed and finds a rez. It's all the easier for me since our PCs are on opposite sides of the room anyway.*

P1999's community has something of a witch hunt mentality with respect to boxing, but the witch hunters tend not to be so clever as they think. My wife and I received plenty of silly accusations from self-appointed internet sleuths when we played our characters that shared the same surname. Surprise, surprise--none of these Poindexters ever say anything to us when we play characters with unrelated names. I suspect a few of those player allegations are actually motivated by buried jealousy: lonely, single nerd types lashing out at folks who aren't equally as alone. Odds are most of them are just paranoid.

The server GMs, on the other hand, seem to take things seriously. We've never had a bit of trouble with them (quite the opposite, we tend to get along pretty well with any GMs we meet). In three-plus years here I've never had a negative interaction with a staff member.


Danth

*I recall one occasion circa 2003 where the wife was AFK, someone trained, and in a rush to get to her PC to save her character I frantically jumped out of my chair only to hook my foot on the leg of my desk and faceplant myself. Didn't feel too good. P1999's strict rule gives me better occupational safety.

[Shadin]

People seem to be getting just hostile lately with false accusations. My girlfriend and I were accused of boxing when I was helping her Warrior level up to my Druid in Unrest yard (I was level 23, we're not talking serious PL going on). No AF, both running around, both speaking in /say and /ooc, basically they were accusing us just because they were claiming that yard trash was a claimable camp now and we were intruding.

[stormlord]

I've never been bothered by boxxing all that much. On EQ Live I knew some people who boxxed and even group with em. I only think it'd be a serious problem when people use third-party programs to automate everything. Otherwise, they're limited in their effectiveness to control a large group. But if boxxing is allowed then almost everyone will box, since p1999 has very low system requirements. This could easily lead to a situation where nobody is grouping for most of the game, except in the later stages. Why group when you can just make a box? And wouldn't this overload the server with toons? If 1000 players are 6-boxing then that'd be 6000 online players. I don't think the content was made to support that many. Wouldn't it look weird if every group or pair of players was using /follow? Or wouldn't it be weird everytime you send a /tell to someone that there's a long pause because the other person didn't notice it until they brought up that client? Etc Etc Etc.

There're lots of little things that would change how the game plays and the impression it gives. When people can solo either by boxxing or because it's built-in then it becomes common to go out on their own. The thing that makes EQ1 different is it wasn't a solo-dominated game; you had to group. So people couldn't be anti-social. Now, I'm not saying soloing is bad. I've soloed a huge amount in the mmorpgs I've played. I tend to like it because I can go afk whenever I want and do not have to meet the demands of others. But I'm not kidding myself that allowing boxxing or making a game extremely solo-friendly is not going to change things. Anybody who thinks it won't change things is not thinking about it. It definitely will. When you can play most of the game on your own, you come to expect it and there's no real reason to be social with others. And the quickest way to kill a community is to kill the skills of interplayer communication. If players are all busy doing their own thing and not talking to each other, they won't have the necessary social skills. By this I don't mean they can't communicate as people IRL.. I mean the tools and means of expression in-game. Like how to /tell or how to /say or how to hotkey something or how to do all this quickly when a group is under attack. I'm speaking in a generalized manner. Communication is complex. It's not as simple as typing "/say Hello!"

There should be solo and group games. I think some games should also be hybrids that offer both. Not every game has to be the same. We shouldn't expect that every game can meet our individual needs either. There's a plethora of games out there for us to choose from. A person that looks can normally find something that suits their particular needs. Unless you've invested a lot of time and money in a game, I see no substantial justification to complain when it fails to meet your specific needs at some juncture. And lets say it does. Nothing in the EULA says that a game cannot change. Sure, it hurts sometimes, but that's life.

[Infuriati]

Just to clarify something, some people thought I was suspended or banned that day. This is false. No action has been taken against me so far. Just wanted to clear that up.

Oh PST Lighthawk if you need any jewelry combines :)

[tanknspank]

But if boxxing is allowed then almost everyone will box, since p1999 has very low system requirements. This could easily lead to a situation where nobody is grouping for most of the game, except in the later stages.
There's a huge leap from "let's not jump on the report/ban button because a character is on /follow" to "everyone will be 6 boxing".

I accidentally stumbled on the P1999 reddit today and it reminded about this project (I loved classic EQ and played P1999 a few years ago). I was thinking it'd be cool to pick it again and see if I could convince my wife to play a tank/healer duo with me so I could show her what EQ was all about in the good old days (she's a great healer!). Jumping through hoops to get an IP exemption is understandable, but playing under the constant threat of being banned for no reason just makes this completely unappealing.

We play WoW together and the 2-seater mounts and /follow are a huge reason of why we managed to get any quests done. She has a horrible sense of direction / location and that is in a game where the night is as dark as a slightly cloudy day and that has maps, minimap and a million arrows and markers leading you to the next action you must perform.

[Kevynne]

I thought if you were suspected of 2 boxing they ported you to some magic land and made you and your partner run figure eights to prove that two different people are playing?

my friend and her sister had this happen to them on live. You get ported to the kitty room and stand in front of a gm and have to do figure 8s and such to prove it's 2 people

[Lyra]

Jumping through hoops to get an IP exemption

Guess you've been playing WoW too long if you think posting one thread in a forum is jumping through hoops.

constant threat of being banned for no reason just makes this completely unappealing.

Yes, don't play a FREE game with a slight chance you may not be able to play the FREE game. I call BS.

We play WoW together and the 2-seater mounts and /follow are a huge reason of why we managed to get any quests done. She has a horrible sense of direction / location and that is in a game where the night is as dark as a slightly cloudy day and that has maps, minimap and a million arrows and markers leading you to the next action you must perform.

Maybe she just isn't cut out for gaming, and you could share a hobby she is capable of full participation. As a female gamer, I took offense to this description of your "gaming wife"

[Lambparade]

Nice pic. This seems like a huge waste of energy when the bigger and more obvious problem is people powerleveling in popular dungeon camps...every single goddamn day. I honestly do not care about someone 2-boxing as long as they're not doing it in the middle of a dungeon, killing all the mobs...while other people who came to actually take on the challenge appropriate to their level range are sitting around LFG, chasing after scraps, or logging off.

This...unrest is just full

[Kevynne]

unrest should never be leveled in anyways. it's such garbage. go to guk.

[Norok]

Boxing prohibition on P99 I have observed to be synonymous with Drug Prohibition.

You have a large set of the population that believes that it is the most evil thing in the universe and must be stopped by all means. Another subset that generally doesn't believe it's that big of a deal because they don't do it and it has never directly effected them. And a government that engages in haughty rhetoric and institutes Draconian means of stamping it out that ultimately ends up frightening rule-abiding people.

[Meeper]

Maybe she just isn't cut out for gaming, and you could share a hobby she is capable of full participation. As a female gamer, I took offense to this description of your "gaming wife"

That's an elitist remark, if ever there was one. To be "cut out for gaming" all someone needs is to be having fun.

[Lyra]

People seem to be getting just hostile lately with false accusations. My girlfriend and I were accused of boxing when I was helping her Warrior level up to my Druid in Unrest yard (I was level 23, we're not talking serious PL going on). No AF, both running around, both speaking in /say and /ooc, basically they were accusing us just because they were claiming that yard trash was a claimable camp now and we were intruding.

It's hostile to send you a tell while your sitting, and then wait for a response while standing in front of you, while your "g/f" was running around?

In my experience, the sides of Unrest are recognizable camps by the players on P99. You chose not to play nice. My group of SIX players had been in that area when you decided to move right in and "PL your g/f". I called you rude, which you were. I didn't bother GM's with a petition.

Odd how your "g/f" had to log out too when you went to get the earring to sell. Maybe she was just done for the night, right?

In my opinion, a defensive post in this thread is admission of guilt.

Carry on.

[Lyra]

That's an elitist remark, if ever there was one. To be "cut out for gaming" all someone needs is to be having fun.

Hey, it wasn't me saying his wife isn't capable of playing the game...it was him.

[Lyra]

Boxing prohibition on P99 I have observed to be synonymous with Drug Prohibition.

You have a large set of the population that believes that it is the most evil thing in the universe and must be stopped by all means. Another subset that generally doesn't believe it's that big of a deal because they don't do it and it has never directly effected them. And a government that engages in haughty rhetoric and institutes Draconian means of stamping it out that ultimately ends up frightening rule-abiding people.

This server doesn't allow boxing. Did you miss that somewhere?

It doesn't matter what the "population" believes. It's against the rules.

[Meeper]

Hey, it wasn't me saying his wife isn't capable of playing the game...it was him.

Having a poor sense of direction in a game doesn't mean that someone can't play it. I played with a few people on live, back in the mists of time, who were excellent players but they could get lost in a small room. They solved the direction problem by being druids, and porting everywhere. :)

[Kevynne]

Having a poor sense of direction in a game doesn't mean that someone can't play it. I played with a few people on live, back in the mists of time, who were excellent players but they could get lost in a small room. They solved the direction problem by being druids, and porting everywhere. :)

I roll only elves for the nightvision. I'm too half retarded to see in the dark in this game ;p

[Lyra]

Having a poor sense of direction in a game doesn't mean that someone can't play it. I played with a few people on live, back in the mists of time, who were excellent players but they could get lost in a small room. They solved the direction problem by being druids, and porting everywhere. :)

You made a log in to post in this two boxing thread? Nice forum boxing.

[Meeper]

You made a log in to post in this two boxing thread? Nice forum boxing.

You appear to have won the Idiot of the Day award. Please look under my name at the side, and it says when my account was made.

[Lyra]

You appear to have won the Idiot of the Day award. Please look under my name at the side, and it says when my account was made.

Name calling always gets you big points. Maybe you can farm this thread for some more post counts on that OLD log in account.

[Meeper]

Name calling always gets you big points. Maybe you can farm this thread for some more post counts on that OLD log in account.

I do apologise. It was an awful thing for me to do.

There, now you can apologise for asserting that I am another person "forum boxing", and we can be friends and invite each other round for tea. :)

[tanknspank]

Guess you've been playing WoW too long if you think posting one thread in a forum is jumping through hoops.
Last time I played P1999 (about 2010) I wanted to get my wife and a friend that was crashing at our place to try it. I posted a thread and that didn't go anywhere as they lost all their (mild) interest by the time it was addressed (can't find it now so I'm not even sure if it was ever approved/denied).

Yes, don't play a FREE game with a slight chance you may not be able to play the FREE game. I call BS.
Free or not, classic EQ is a large time investment. Spending all the time to level a character only to risk being banned on a whim is not worthwhile. Also, EQ is a hard enough sell to someone who wasn't a gamer back in '99 and has no nostalgia without going into the whole "make sure not to use /follow or go AFK without logging out or we might both get banned".

Maybe she just isn't cut out for gaming, and you could share a hobby she is capable of full participation.
Not everyone enjoys all aspects of a game, doesn't mean they can't enjoy the game itself. She's an awesome healer/DPSer in dungeons but just has poor sense of direction which would be only compounded by dark nights and lengthy, map-less runs. Step our of your elitist EQ vet perspective and realize that there's a huge number of people for which a game without maps and quest markers is alien enough without the threat of random banning for using /follow.

As a female gamer, I took offense to this description of your "gaming wife"
I never said you, or female gamers in general, can't handle a game without using /follow or AFKs. If you're stellar at all aspects of MMOs, great! Most of us, myself included, have areas we are not great at or have RL things that pop up requiring AFKs and /follow.

[Kagatob]

Maybe she just isn't cut out for gaming, and you could share a hobby she is capable of full participation. As a female gamer, I took offense to this description of your "gaming wife"

Confirmed basement dwelling male.

You elitist 'gamers' are all the same. My girlfriend plays a druid (Just hit lvl 16) and she's still new so occasionally she gets me killed because she forgets to tell me when she's out of mana until it's too late, or forgets to re-snare a mob if it's running. I'd still rather play with her any day of the week over one of your kind in my group.

[Vladesch]

Hate on me, I'm not bothered...you get caught being lazy or trying to get an edge on the rest of us, don't come crying on the forums

You know perfectly well what you were being picked up on, and it wasn't legitamite cheaters getting banned (as you seem to be making a point of now to change the subject)

Let me requote you.

I know this doesn't help the OP but I'd rather the GMs were too tight on it than too relaxed

I say again, You are alright with innocent people getting banned. It's all for the greater good right? If you got banned for the wrong reason, you would just take it on the chest and not come onto the forums or say anything right?

Thing about bullies is they deal it out but they can never take it.

[Galelor]

People even mentioning AF, similar names, and late heals being signs of boxing have zero clue how EQ is played.

These things have zero to do with boxing, especially on a server where boxing is not allowed.

By the way, to the genius that mentioned late healing, (on maybe page 2 or 3,) in general healing gets much tighter when you box. Think about it...

Instead of petitioning people you believe are 2 boxing, how about you all just play the game...

[SamwiseRed]

^boxes

[Lyra]

^boxes

Vboxes

[Xadion]

I figured simul casting would prove no box, can't tab and cast tab and cast at the exact same time hehe

[kinadarra]

This game has characters that are better for grouping and characters that are better at soloing. Why should anyone be punished or reviled for choosing to play a character that is quite capable of soloing? And why is it that people are getting so upset that someone would choose to play this game solo rather than group. I do not box, but I did choose to play a druid for the simple fact that I would NOT HAVE to rely on groups to play this game. I tried to help other players out when I could, I was never rude to anyone on this game, I would port, bind, etc. I did not demand payment for ports, binds, heals,etc.
I simply preferred to either play solo or with my husband. I was not ported to a magical world to jump through hoops before my account got suspended, I had turned to look at the TV while I was medding up when I got the boot. Not everyone is afforded the same opportunities when they get the boot. As for proof, does anyone here have conclusive evidence that the people you are accusing of boxing actually did or did not do it. I can provide IP codes, Mac codes, etc. all day long, but it boils down to this...If the GM that accuses you of boxing does or does not want to believe you that is your fate. In my experience there is no true way to petition, you just deal with the fate that you are handed. Now you all can sit here all day long and pass judgement on my post and you can believe what you want. But the people who have been wrongly accused of boxing know they didn't do it, just as the people that did box know they did. But don't sit here and expect those of us that did not box to confess to or apologize for something we did not do.

[SamwiseRed]

dont expect everyone to take your word for it. confirmed boxer ^

[kinadarra]

I don't expect anyone to, which should be obvious if you really read my post. And just because you insinuate in your post that I am confirmed boxer, does not make it any more true that me making insinuations about you. Pass all the judgement on me that you like, but I know who I am and how I play. If you are so sure of who is and who isn't boxing, just by reading the forums, maybe you should be a GM so that you can pass your judgement on more people. It's a lonely life for the people who "know everything" without truly knowing the people you are typing to.

[SamwiseRed]

more IP exemptions than people playing the server. i know there is a shit load of IP exemptions on red yet I've only known 2 people that actually have a significant other that plays. usually it is abused to insta-log or port/buff themselves. if you want to box there is always eqmac, why try that shit on the only server that its illegal. justice was served.

[kinadarra]

Well, I didn't try it. I'm sure there are others that do, but I would assume the people that do so are playing characters that are not able to do damage and heal themselves. I still do not understand why someone would choose to box on this game anyway. I was always able to find someone willing to help me out on the game if I asked, but I prefer to play solo. Contrary to what you believe that does not make me or anyone else a boxer. There is no rule anywhere that I've read that says that it is a requirement for me to group with others on this game. The main reason I chose a character that could solo is because I'm not an elite gamer, I'm not quick when it comes to playing in groups and I don't want others relying on my character to keep them buffed or healed if I don't believe I can do a good job of it. So if you would have preferred for me to get groups killed because I'm not good a grouping rather than playing with my husband or by myself an only getting myself killed, I will apologize for that. However, since you obviously don't play with someone in the same house, let me tell you, it is much easier to communicate with your group when your group mates are sitting in the same room and you dont have to try to type tells and cast at the same time. If that's such a crime, then IP exemption just should not be offered on this server, period...end of story. Then you will not have to worry about who is and who is not boxing.

[Chokan]

Not sure it's worth arguing with a known troll kina... Just petition and hope for the best.

[zs3000]

along these Line I was just banned for 14 days for playing with my wife. When the GM asked if I was boxing I said no I could prove it, by loading up my livestream (which has a webcam so he could see us both at 2 computers) which I guess he does not care b/c Im still banned. So yeah kinda messed up.

[Infuriati]

I figured simul casting would prove no box, can't tab and cast tab and cast at the exact same time hehe

[SamwiseRed]

u can easily simul cast with 2 comps next to each other lol

[SamwiseRed]

have suspected boxers each send you tells saying the pledge of allegiance. should be interesting if they are boxing.

[Meeper]

have suspected boxers each send you tells saying the pledge of allegiance. should be interesting if they are boxing.

Especially if they don't know it.

[Sithel1988]

are you the dark elf mage with the dark elf cleric or something that was in ecommons killing stuff in like the worst spot, catching aggro every 3 mins. i think i gave you some summoned weapons for your pet or something

[Galelor]

^boxes

Correct, just not on this server.

[tanknspank]

more IP exemptions than people playing the server. i know there is a shit load of IP exemptions on red yet I've only known 2 people that actually have a significant other that plays.
How many of those are unused though? I imagine that aside from a core set of players, there's quite a lot of turnover with old EQ players stopping by for a few months for a nostalgic fix, possibly to show off the golden days of MMOs to their SO/buddy/roomie then move on.

Look, I understand the desire to keep 2+ boxing off the server, so why not have a formal set of criteria on which accounts are investigated and certain items of proof that are considered acceptable proof?

For example 2 live-streams that show the two game screens + cam of the respective players is something that should be acceptable as indisputable proof. A GM could verify the game screens are showing the characters in question and could see the players pressing the keys (or that an AFK really is an AFK and the player isn't there when the character isn't doing anything).

Hell, make the IP exemption a premium service (personally I'd pay 2x$15 in a heartbeat to play P1999 with my wife without the threat of random banning), register a streaming URL to the account and add a little app that only enables dual IP login when the stream is live. A GM could just secretly pull up the registered stream and check in on players if there's any complaints/suspicion. Easy to see if an AFK really is an AFK and if it's not can always ask the player to verify with a verbal answer on the stream.

[Treats]

If you have an IP exemption and are playing with someone else from the same IP there is a simple thing you can do to most likely never get reported for boxing:

If you have to afk log out to the character select screen.

It's highly unlikely that anyone would ever report you for boxing if you explained to the group that was what you were doing and what was happening.

I have no sympathy for anyone that gets banned for doing this.

Just one time is all it takes of swapping over and trying to play both.

It's kind of like speeding, you think you're fine one moment then the next BAM pulled over and ticket (except it's not a ticket here, it's a ban and you don't get to play anymore).

[senna]

Seems kind of a hassle. Me and my brother both play here and live together so sometimes we will group up to have some fun.

But if I had to camp every time I was afk to smoke, shit, or grab a bite to eat, I might as well not even play. Because I smoke shit and eat constantly.

[Kagatob]

If you have an IP exemption and are playing with someone else from the same IP there is a simple thing you can do to most likely never get reported for boxing:

If you have to afk log out to the character select screen.

It's highly unlikely that anyone would ever report you for boxing if you explained to the group that was what you were doing and what was happening.

I have no sympathy for anyone that gets banned for doing this.

Just one time is all it takes of swapping over and trying to play both.

It's kind of like speeding, you think you're fine one moment then the next BAM pulled over and ticket (except it's not a ticket here, it's a ban and you don't get to play anymore).
This is rediculious, going AFK and staying logged in is against the server rules all of a sudden?

I don't understand your analogy. Speeding is illegal no matter what reason you are doing it or where you are (where there is a posted limit). Are you going to start saying that any bard who AFK's in their group with mana/heal song playing should get banned too? I don't think the rest of the group they were in would appreciate that.

[Treats]

This is rediculious, going AFK and staying logged in is against the server rules all of a sudden?

I don't understand your analogy. Speeding is illegal no matter what reason you are doing it or where you are (where there is a posted limit). Are you going to start saying that any bard who AFK's in their group with mana/heal song playing should get banned too? I don't think the rest of the group they were in would appreciate that.

If you have two different accounts logged in from the same IP and you go AFK thats the risk you take if you are reported for boxing/suspicious behavior.

My post was not meant to imply that everyone that AFK's is boxing.

Logging out would give them absolutely NO TEMPTATION to box if their partner was AFK.

I'm sure a GM will make a mistake once or twice, but given their lengthy assessment of who was or was not boxing I simply find it hard to believe everyone in this thread is completely innocent.

[Kagatob]

If you have two different accounts logged in from the same IP and you go AFK thats the risk you take if you are reported for boxing/suspicious behavior.

My post was not meant to imply that everyone that AFK's is boxing.

Logging out would give them absolutely NO TEMPTATION to box if their partner was AFK.

I'm sure a GM will make a mistake once or twice, but given their lengthy assessment of who was or was not boxing I simply find it hard to believe everyone in this thread is completely innocent.

Put away the tin foil hat and look at what you're saying.

Look back at your speeding analogy and read that post. Temptation? Ok, next will you recommend that nobody drive their cars because not driving will result in you not getting the chance to be tempted to speed?

Rediculous.

[Jetlag]

Hi gentlemen,

Forgive me for slightly de-railing, but this topic seems to garner a lot of attention and I wanted to ask:

Does the petition process for IP Exemption take long? I don't want to rush the administration, I am simply asking out of curiosity so I have a ballpark estimate.

Also, I haven't tried, but I assume without exemption, I will not be able to log-on simultaneously with my S.O.?

Thanks for your attention fellas. Any and all insight is most welcome.

[Kagatob]

Hi gentlemen,

Forgive me for slightly de-railing, but this topic seems to garner a lot of attention and I wanted to ask:

Does the petition process for IP Exemption take long? I don't want to rush the administration, I am simply asking out of curiosity so I have a ballpark estimate.

Also, I haven't tried, but I assume without exemption, I will not be able to log-on simultaneously with my S.O.?

Thanks for your attention fellas. Any and all insight is most welcome.

My first try I got a response within 72 hours.

[Jetlag]

That's very fast!! Thank you Kagatob.

[Treats]

Put away the tin foil hat and look at what you're saying.

Look back at your speeding analogy and read that post. Temptation? Ok, next will you recommend that nobody drive their cars because not driving will result in you not getting the chance to be tempted to speed?

Rediculous.

I didn't think it would be so hard to comprehend but apparently it was.

You are taking the Speeding analogy and blowing it way out of proportion.

You are driving your car
You are late being somewhere so you speed thinking you won't get pulled over
You get pulled over and get a ticket

You are playing with another person in the same place with an IP exemption
Your friend/spouse/etc steps away from their computer and you are about to die
You decide to play their character thinking you won't get caught
You get caught and then get banned

Boxing is illegal on this server no matter what you are doing just like speeding.

Come on, don't be so daft.

[tanknspank]

Death is not that big a deal, even in classic EQ, as to be worth loosing weeks, months or years of work on an account. What you are saying is like saying people should get ticketed because they have a job and might be tempted to speed and that if they are driving while having a job they should go 30 mph / 45 kph under the posted limit just because they have to be above suspicion. And even that is not a guarantee because someone could complain they cast too in sync, or have names/gear that are too similar.

But all that aside, since this is obviously such a huge deal to people that they immediately assume anyone who could be guilty is guilty, why not accept streaming (under certain criteria) as an official way to prove you didn't just jump over to the other computer, that your SO really is AFK and on follow, or that you both are sitting at your respective computers and casting your own spells and your 'synced casting' is just a result of random chance?

[Danth]

The use of vague or unrelated analogies often represents a sign that a person has difficulty expressing himself. Just say what you mean.

Guilty until proven innocent represents a poor mentality that isn't conductive to a good community or a healthy server. Usually it merely indicates a person who doesn't care about problems not directly affecting himself. I'm glad the staff knows better than to think that way.

I don't think there's any risk involved with going AFK in and of itself. My wife or I take multiple AFK's per hour (we have a small child in the house; we play mostly during sleep time but the baby often wakes up or whatnot). Of course when a character of ours is AFK it's really AFK--just sits there and doesn't do anything. Sucks for me when the wife has to AFK because then *I* have to sit there twiddling my thumbs since I can't really solo the kinds of monsters we fight. C'est la vie.

Risk appears when an AFK character mysteriously gets up to cast buffs or heals before going back AFK. While not necessarily proof of anything, such behavior seems shady as all heck. It gets all the shadier when the two characters never seem to use abilities at the same time. While such behavior doesn't absolutely prove anything, it's also living awfully dangerously. If you push the boundaries of the rules often enough, eventually the rules will push back.

If you're afraid of being potentially banned, I'll just say this: The wife and I have been here since the server opened (well, since "beta" technically"). That's more than three years ago. We're quite open about being a couple and as such attract some suspicion from cynical players. Despite that we've only ever had positive interactions with the staff.

It doesn't shock me that there are more exemptions than active players. A great many players apparently use a separate account for every character*, meaning a couple might end up with many exemptions. Figure for player turnover and add in a moderate number of genuine rule-breakers and you have a lot of exemptions.

*apparently I'm not too creative because all my characters are on the same account.

Danth

[Lagaidh]

I've gotten to page 3 and I see nothing has changed on the witch hunt front. I coach my wife on how to behave when we duo anymore. I've always been paranoid about us being painted as 2 boxing because of how it can look: I'm a paladin, she's a druid. One of us will be sitting an awful lot in a tank n spank scenario.

"Make sure you respond to any tells right away even if it's just to say "No. Sorry"".

"I have to go pee. Make sure you keep an eye for any tells and mention that I am physically afk, to return in just a sec..."

I'm always mentally sweating bullets if she needs to afk and I'm the only one of us that's at the keys.

It's a shame to need to worry so much. Hm. Could be a subject where I should quit reading the forums. I've not heard of one witch hunt scenario in-game... but then again... they'd be banned already.

[Lagaidh]

The wife and I have been here since the server opened (well, since "beta" technically"). That's more than three years ago. We're quite open about being a couple and as such attract some suspicion from cynical players. Despite that we've only ever had positive interactions with the staff.

Ah. We've been around since 8/2010...

I should just chill. Our experience mirrors yours save that nobody has accused us of boxing. I've seen players get still and watch us without speaking when one or the other is on autofollow, but that's it.

[tanknspank]

If you're afraid of being potentially banned, I'll just say this: The wife and I have been here since the server opened (well, since "beta" technically"). That's more than three years ago. We're quite open about being a couple and as such attract some suspicion from cynical players. Despite that we've only ever had positive interactions with the staff.
That is really heartening to read. The earlier parts of the thread painted a very disheartening picture of what to expect if I convinced my wife to play P1999.

Risk appears when an AFK character mysteriously gets up to cast buffs or heals before going back AFK.
What classes do you guys play? I was considering a warrior+cleric or SK+cleric (my wife's an excellent healer in WoW and we like doing dungeons), but from what I remember cleric gameplay in EQ is very much CH, sit-and-med, repeat which may look extra suspicious.

A great many players apparently use a separate account for every character*, meaning a couple might end up with many exemptions.
What is the benefit of that?

[Swish]

What is the benefit of that?

Using an IP exemption to sell accounts potentially? PL using 2 computers, sell the PL'd character. If the restrictions on boxing are ever lifted, expect 100s of new accounts to appear on the market. All the people that moaned about not being able to box will find themselves the victims of inflation unless they go along with it.

[Danth]

I don't know why many folks seem to use multiple accounts. Even folks who game alone seem to do this; they simply don't need IP exemptions for obvious reasons. Swish is probably right when he says it has a lot to do with account sales. On P1999 it's permitted to sell a character for in-game currency or trades. Maybe people plan ahead for the contingency of being able to sell off characters they don't use anymore.

Danth

[enr4ged]

I don't know why many folks seem to use multiple accounts. Even folks who game alone seem to do this; they simply don't need IP exemptions for obvious reasons. Swish is probably right when he says it has a lot to do with account sales. On P1999 it's permitted to sell a character for in-game currency or trades. Maybe people plan ahead for the contingency of being able to sell off characters they don't use anymore.

Danth

In case you want to have your friend resurrect your own character, buff your own character etc.

[Dirtnap]

Both my brother and I have played here since launch, and have not once been talked to by GMs about boxing. I don't think we have even been accused of it by other players.

I think if you aren't doing anything wrong, you won't have any trouble.

(I have AFKed with my bard doing healing song, and my bro killing crocs in oasis on his monk.)

[Infuriati]

Did you have almost the same names, same gear, and a brother following you around completely clueless? Probably not.

To top it off someone in the zone who is just waiting to catch someone 2 boxing.

[Tiggles]

Only read first half of this thread.

But the banned people are 100% boxing

They dont need to do a test or check your IPS your IP doesn't mean shit.

Everyone downloads a .dll (i'm not going to anymore detail because fuck cheaters) that gives them an almost 100% detection tool against boxers.

[Dirtnap]

Did you have almost the same names, same gear, and a brother following you around completely clueless? Probably not.

To top it off someone in the zone who is just waiting to catch someone 2 boxing.

I didn't meant to sound like I was incriminating you. I believe most people are being honest when they say they aren't boxing.

You didn't get banned, because you weren't doing anything wrong. Which is what I meant.

[Infuriati]

I didn't meant to sound like I was incriminating you. I believe most people are being honest when they say they aren't boxing.

You didn't get banned, because you weren't doing anything wrong. Which is what I meant.

Ah gotcha, my bad.

[Kagatob]

I don't know why many folks seem to use multiple accounts.

You aren't thinking outside of the box(ing). huehue.

First and foremost would be having someone else rez you if your group wipes, the benifits of taking an extra three minutes to play hot potato with the cleric to get everyone rezzed vastly outweighs the amount of time it'd take to grind that xp back.

Not to mention Buffs, Power leveling, porting, corpse summoning, Multiquesting for an alt are all things that would be impossible to do for a character that's on the same account.

[Kevynne]

if i could box my enc and clr for buffs all of my groups would jsut level retardedly fast.
but i cant cause they're (as well as my alt im leveling) are all on the same account.
lol people using multiple accounts imo should be a flag for boxing. me and my brother and our friends used to have 4-5 accts each when boxing on PEQ

[Kagatob]

if i could box my enc and clr for buffs all of my groups would jsut level retardedly fast.
but i cant cause they're (as well as my alt im leveling) are all on the same account.lol people using multiple accounts imo should be a flag for boxing. me and my brother and our friends used to have 4-5 accts each when boxing on PEQ

That's A) your choice, B) your decision and because of A and B, C) your fault.

I'm still worried one day I'll end up kicking myself for having my necro/bard on the same account. Besides laziness there's absolutely no reason to have more than one character per account. It has nothing to do with boxing, it's common sense.

[Vladesch]

Only read first half of this thread.

But the banned people are 100% boxing

They dont need to do a test or check your IPS your IP doesn't mean shit.

Everyone downloads a .dll (i'm not going to anymore detail because fuck cheaters) that gives them an almost 100% detection tool against boxers.

That's got to be the biggest load of horse **** I've read in this thread so far.
And that says a lot.

[Duckforceone]

i would hazard a guess that the true boxers have 2 computers, one slaved to the other, and running on different ip's and internet lines.

would love to know how one could catch that besides watching for signs ingame...

[kruzchek]

Sirken can do it. How he does it is he just ban's everyone, right or wrong, ignores their petitions then extends those suspensions because he thinks your lying, which i never saw this in any of the posted rules,Sirken's I guess, then with the help of trolls combing the boards people will finally give up on the time they put into playing and just quit out of frustration with Mr. Smith because he is the Matrix don't ya know.

[Swish]

Not to quote myself from earlier in the thread, but boxing is a privelige not a right...if you want to box you can do it on EQmac or any other EQemu server other than P99 (afaik, certainly THF and the other big servers).

The allure of P99 is the fact that boxing is banned, and if you're taking liberties with the IP exemptions and get caught...then that's just hard luck. Play straight 100% of the time with your wife/girlfriend/brother and you have nothing to hide.

That said, I think the whole thing is being overplayed - people have posted here that they've played as a duo with someone else since 2010 and not had an issue. Those caught must have done something to arouse suspicion, stop acting like there wasn't something that gave you away.

A server free of RMTs, boxers and anyone else wanting the edge... we can dream.

Perhaps this thread is a conspiracy by Platlord to sweep RMTs under the carpet and get everyone more angry about boxing ;)

[Swish]

...people will finally give up on the time they put into playing and just quit out of frustration with Mr. Smith because he is the Matrix don't ya know.

Smith is right about one thing, you're a disease on this forum Kruzchek...

[kruzchek]

And your A TROLL Swish who must sit in his mom's basment and waits to judge people and their post. I can only hope that the way I have been treated by Sirken never happens to you. As for my rants on here as of late it's just to let others know how i was treated and how it has come to me acting like a child because the staff doesn't give care. So this is the only way to get attention to one's problems or in the case of you Swish the only way for you to get attention from anyone at all. Say what you must after this because I think I'm done talking to you. Jesus loves you Swish hang in there man.

[Swish]

And your A TROLL Swish who must sit in his mom's basment and waits to judge people and their post. I can only hope that the way I have been treated by Sirken never happens to you. As for my rants on here as of late it's just to let others know how i was treated and how it has come to me acting like a child because the staff doesn't give care. So this is the only way to get attention to one's problems or in the case of you Swish the only way for you to get attention from anyone at all. Say what you must after this because I think I'm done talking to you. Jesus loves you Swish hang in there man.

*you're
*mum
*basement
*don't care / do not care

I just think posting your gripes on the same thing in every thread is getting old and isn't going to get any decision overturned. Go to Rogean's house and stand outside with a sign, state your demands... short of that I think you'll have to suck it up.

EDIT:

Also I should say I got an unannounced 24 hour suspension for an unsavoury surname on my troll SK. No GM response in the black hole forum, just tried to log back in and got told the account was banned. Little did I know other than for the want of trying that a day later it was unbanned...and therefore just a suspension. I'd participated in numerous GM events with Hobby and Uthgaard who had either not spotted it or were fine with it, so I put it down to someone in EC reporting it. At one point I even thought I'd picked up a ban due to some of the forum tags I was putting up ;)

Shit happens, I learnt my lesson. Are you able to make another account and start again? If so, try and wipe the slate clean...ask some friends if they've got any lowbie gear they aren't using and see if you can restart.

[Dirtnap]

*you're
*mum
*basement
*don't care / do not care

I just think posting your gripes on the same thing in every thread is getting old and isn't going to get any decision overturned. Go to Rogean's house and stand outside with a sign, state your demands... short of that I think you'll have to suck it up.

EDIT:

Also I should say I got an unannounced 24 hour suspension for an unsavoury surname on my troll SK. No GM response in the black hole forum, just tried to log back in and got told the account was banned. Little did I know other than for the want of trying that a day later it was unbanned...and therefore just a suspension. I'd participated in numerous GM events with Hobby and Uthgaard who had either not spotted it or were fine with it, so I put it down to someone in EC reporting it. At one point I even thought I'd picked up a ban due to some of the forum tags I was putting up ;)

Shit happens, I learnt my lesson. Are you able to make another account and start again? If so, try and wipe the slate clean...ask some friends if they've got any lowbie gear they aren't using and see if you can restart.

I miss the forum tags. They were so fun.

[tanknspank]

Everyone downloads a .dll (i'm not going to anymore detail because fuck cheaters) that gives them an almost 100% detection tool against boxers.
If you have such a fool-proof method please get in touch with [every MMO company out there], I'm sure they'll all line up to pay for it considering the amount of resources and manpower needed to get much less reliable results in catching bots.

[Slave]

forum tags

[Tiggles]

If you have such a fool-proof method please get in touch with [every MMO company out there], I'm sure they'll all line up to pay for it considering the amount of resources and manpower needed to get much less reliable results in catching bots.

Doesnt catch bots just boxers

and I'm not entirely sure its legal anyways.

[tanknspank]

Most farmers who use bots use a bunch of them at a time. So detecting large multibox operations would narrow down the pool of clients to investigate a lot. Unfortunately since the end user has full control over the hardware/software/OS of the client it's impossible to protect any .dll/.exe from being neutralized.

[Vladesch]

This is pretty delusion stuff about dll files to detect multiboxing.
This is sony's client we are using, and they didnt care about multiboxing, so where does the dll come from.
Perhaps someppl think the p1999 devs hav access to the source code of the client and spent their time making something something to detect multiple instances of a client. Yeah suuuure.
Remember there's no dll's downloaded to make eq titanium compatible with p1999, or modified exe' to make use of this mythical dll.
And of course be totally defeated by anyone with multiple PC's.

sheesh.

[Slave]

This is pretty delusion stuff about dll files to detect multiboxing.
This is sony's client we are using, and they didnt care about multiboxing, so where does the dll come from.
Perhaps someppl think the p1999 devs hav access to the source code of the client and spent their time making something something to detect multiple instances of a client. Yeah suuuure.
Remember there's no dll's downloaded to make eq titanium compatible with p1999, or modified exe' to make use of this mythical dll.
And of course be totally defeated by anyone with multiple PC's.

sheesh.

Read the forums much?

[Danth]

This is pretty delusion stuff about dll files to detect multiboxing.
This is sony's client we are using, and they didnt care about multiboxing, so where does the dll come from.
Perhaps someppl think the p1999 devs hav access to the source code of the client and spent their time making something something to detect multiple instances of a client. Yeah suuuure.
Remember there's no dll's downloaded to make eq titanium compatible with p1999, or modified exe' to make use of this mythical dll.
And of course be totally defeated by anyone with multiple PC's.

sheesh.


If I was more motivated I'd draw an MS-paint picture of an ostrich sticking its head in the sand. Everyone who plays on P1999 has to patch the client; one of the files you replace is dsetup.dll. Anyone who wants to take a few seconds can check this for himself by checking the contents of the recent patch files linked in the news section. Since I'm nice I'll provide you with an out; perhaps you use the automatic launcher and don't pay attention to what it does to the client?

At the time this modified .dll was originally added to P1999, it was fairly well known to the folks playing then that it did some fairly shady things. It also played havoc with anti-virus programs. I don't know what changes have been made to it since then.

Danth

[SupaflyIRL]

If I was more motivated I'd draw an MS-paint picture of an ostrich sticking its head in the sand. Everyone who plays on P1999 has to patch the client; one of the files you replace is dsetup.dll. Anyone who wants to take a few seconds can check this for himself by checking the contents of the recent patch files linked in the news section. Since I'm nice I'll provide you with an out; perhaps you use the automatic launcher and don't pay attention to what it does to the client?

At the time this modified .dll was originally added to P1999, it was fairly well known to the folks playing then that it did some fairly shady things. It also played havoc with anti-virus programs. I don't know what changes have been made to it since then.

Danth

still have to disable nod32 to patch because of this file