Grouping...

[Kindarian]

Hey just like to say I am glad to see the pop higher and back in playable numbers. What I don't love is being skipped over for a spot in a group when I see 4 who say they are ok but then after 10-15mins of waiting my turn they allow another person in and skip right over you...said person who just enters the zone and ask for a group.

[Ephirith]

Sounds like you might be playing a ranger.

Just go anon and tell them you're a warrior. Crit with your bow every once in a while so they don't get suspicious.

[Kindarian]

oh I am but in a server like this skipping over someone because they are a ranger at mid lvls just seems like a dumb reason .. only to watch their excuse that they already have a hybrid leave and they are now down to 3 ppl.. and still nothing guess I can't wait for EQC.. what goes around comes around

[Thana8088]

Sounds like you might be playing a ranger.

Just go anon and tell them you're a warrior. Crit with your bow every once in a while so they don't get suspicious.

http://i51.photobucket.com/albums/f351/charonn0/smiley_rofl.gif

I would totally give you a rep point for that!

[Thana8088]

oh I am but in a server like this skipping over someone because they are a ranger at mid lvls just seems like a dumb reason .. only to watch their excuse that they already have a hybrid leave and they are now down to 3 ppl.. and still nothing guess I can't wait for EQC.. what goes around comes around

Sometimes you get groups tho, right? Stick with it; rangers can be awesome at higher levels. (I've heard)

[Kindarian]

im trying I really really am but they new ppl seem lovely... is it wrong I am now watching the 3 of them waiting for them to wipe so I can laugh?

[Adachi]

What I don't love is being skipped over for a spot in a group

Sounds like you might be playing a ranger.

oh I am

/Thread

[Kindarian]

/Thread

lol thanks for the support danger rangers ftw!!!

[Vladesch]

Ranger isn't that bad.
You have a nice cheap snare which is great for fear kiting which is preferred by many over having a tank and a dedicated healer.
A lot of groups probably don't consider it though.

[Duckforceone]

well are you applying for said groups as dps or tank?

[Dualform]

You get denied a group one or two times and you put down all of p99? that's silly. I can guarantee you'll run into similar things on EQC, as-well.

[Brimacombe]

I feel pity for rangers. It's the only class where it will start raining in the Karanas and they will start losing hit points. :(
JK. Rangers are very difficult to play. They are paper tanks, and are better dropped in a DPS slot. I never care what class joins my groups provided they are the type we have an opening for. Needless to say, if I have a cleric and a druid, I am not going to invite another healer. It's just how things go.

- Brimacombe

[LiQuid]

Played a ranger main on live and I loved that character so much but I'll be damned if every other person in EQ didn't go out of their way to make my life as miserable as possible. It was tough going but in the end I got lightning swords so those people can sit and spin.

I got a lot of respect for anybody that mains a ranger on this server, but after all that time on Live I don't have the stomach for it anymore. They're always welcome in my groups though. All five of them.

[Feralspec]

good call on the ranger

[Swish]

oh I am but in a server like this skipping over someone because they are a ranger at mid lvls just seems like a dumb reason .. only to watch their excuse that they already have a hybrid leave and they are now down to 3 ppl.. and still nothing guess I can't wait for EQC.. what goes around comes around

This happens to a lot of hybrids. My troll SK was quite the undesirable from about 40 onwards due to the hybrid/racial combo (68% penalty). Min/maxers just refuse to allow you into a group.

I had a good reputation for tanking as well, and some great connections from my days in Unrest/MM.

You've picked probably the hardest hybrid to get grouped. Monks/rogues are better dps, bards make better pullers generally, shamans/druids are usually the backup healers so have sow covered. In most areas you've got someone else doing part of what a ranger can do.

But as mentioned, sheer willpower will get you to 60. If you get friendly with a cleric you have the makings of starting your own group... screw all those naysayers, be the puller, pull more than the group that forsook you, keep the tank thorned, everyone sow'd and the dps flowing. A good ranger shouldn't be shunned...

[webrunner5]

Rangers just totally suck on here and I have one. Just give it up now and start another class. As a Healer I just hate them. They are a mana sinkhole. People don't want them in groups. End of story.

[Swish]

It's not so bad after 39. If you've got an enchanter for clarity/CC, rangers can tank single targets and CH's aren't too draining if everything is mezzed.

Quite conditional though - good enchanter, good group dps generally, and all damage going to the ranger :p

[Kindarian]

You get denied a group one or two times and you put down all of p99? that's silly. I can guarantee you'll run into similar things on EQC, as-well.

I wasn't putting down the entire server just those who simply seem to take this 10yr+ old game on a free server way to seriously. I mean to take a camp that for 2-3 ppl (specially when they can't clear the entire camp by themselves) when there are others not just myself lfg in zone getting passed over because they picked the wrong class really? That's my complaint everyone is here to play a game the have memories playing to get that feel again and just have a good time at it. That is why I joined up at least...:p

[Swish]

I wasn't putting down the entire server just those who simply seem to take this 10yr+ old game on a free server way to seriously. I mean to take a camp that for 2-3 ppl (specially when they can't clear the entire camp by themselves) when there are others not just myself lfg in zone getting passed over because they picked the wrong class really? That's my complaint everyone is here to play a game the have memories playing to get that feel again and just have a good time at it. That is why I joined up at least...:p

The best piece of advice I can think of is to network as much as possible with people. If you're known for starting/leading groups then people will log on and look for you. In some cases you can get a steady group going. Find a healer and start something awesome...be there before the zone gets busy if you can.

[thieros]

Rangers can be a solid utility class. The other day in CoM our ranger was invaluable. I'm an DE SK so I run in to it occasionially, so I'm always down to include another hybrid. no descrimination. So with an SK(me), a ranger, a rogue, a monk & an enchanter, we were clearing from ent-arena/houses no problem. ranger was on heals and snares, I feared/agrokited/lifetapped and chanter would mez adds. Also, i just duoed with a ranger to get my seb key using the same method. My opinion, rangers are awesome in their own right man

[Ravager]

When I first started on this server on my druid there was a ranger that sent me a tell almost every time I logged on asking if I wanted to help get a group together. It was great, he'd do all the leg work of finding people and I'd port them to wherever we were going to level. He doesn't play anymore, and I don't remember his name, but he was never without a group. After a few groups like this, he had a lot of regular players he could make groups from too.

[Lambparade]

Well based on your level. Maybe we could group up sometime. I have a solid group of players between 22-30 that I have been grouping with. I'm a 23 cleric. We have a 29 wiz and 29 ench for groups aswell. Would love to have a solid ranger for some good times :)

Send tell to Lambpar if your interested.

[Malone88]

If you can't consistently find groups in dungeon type zones, then move to outdoor zones and partner up with somebody. Find a necro or enchanter and provide snare/dps/pulling for fear-kiting and eliminate the pet penalty for them as a duo. I always prefer a duo over soloing any day...

It's a tough road as a ranger trying to get groups. I played one on live to 65...

Selenia (Enchanter)
Taimah (Ranger)

[Itap]

I feel like every new player always rolls a ranger. Weird.

Best advice? Become best friends with a Necro. You snare, I fear, dot, and you and my pet can go at it to see if you can out damage jibekn. :p

[Galelor]

I feel like every new player always rolls a ranger. Weird.


No joke! It was like this on live too! The sky rained rangers and druids...

[fuark]

We all roll rangers because they are fun hybrids, not because they are the best. In a dungeon exp group, the reality is you will get passed up a lot. Between the choice of a rogue and a ranger, very few people would pass up the rogue, and everyone is trying to maximize their own play time, which is understandable.

My advice would be to figure out some of the things that make rangers really fun, and put their utility to good use. Dungeons are great, but it's not exactly what rangers were made for.

Rangers duo AMAZINGLY well with monks and rogues in outdoor zones, as well as enchanters and druids. That exp alone is better than most dungeon groups you'll ever get. At 45 you get Tolan's gloves and it's even better.

Rangers are absolutely incredible pullers in outdoor zones. Show a group your pulling skills and I guarantee they will always want you. No one likes being grouped with some guy who pulls a mob, waits for it to die, then goes and grabs another mobs -- its inefficient.

Rangers are not at all bad at soloing either if you figure out how to be efficient. If you're sitting around waiting for a group, figure out a solo spot that works for you (whether just an outdoor zone, a single respawning mob, etc). Do things to minimize your down time (only heal between med tics, use thorns and heals not nukes for most mana efficiency, etc)

That being said, if you still want a dungeon group, try to make some friends where you are leveling and it should never be a big deal trying to find a group as long as they know you don't suck.

[Vladesch]

My enchanter would duo with a ranger any day. You snare it, you get rid of the pet xp penalty. You pull. I do the rest.

[webrunner5]

Rangers are great if they don't tank. One of the better pullers in the game with Harmony in outdoor zones. And pretty good DPS. But they are Paper Tanks pure and simple. But yeah with a Nerco outdoors killer combo.

[SCB]

Don't understand the ranger hate when SK's get groups NP. People on this server tend to be kind of dumb about how they think xp works, even though a wiki is available.

Haven't seen the discrimination first-hand though.

[Swish]

In an average group with sub-par dps rangers tend to bankrupt cleric mana if they're the main tank. Not to say I wouldn't want one as a cleric but its under certain conditions. It'll never happen but they should take the hybrid penalty off rangers, would help them a ton :)

[Tecmos Deception]

SKs are top-notch XP-group tanks + amazing pullers.

Rangers are mediocre melee DPS + good pullers (if outdoors) and spot CC.

Classes with CC abilities or good sustained DPS are a dime a dozen on this server. Tanks are pretty rare.

What's so hard to understand about why a group would be more willing to deal with a SK's xp penalty than a ranger's?

[SupaflyIRL]

It'll never happen but they should take the hybrid penalty off rangers, would help them a ton :)

Velious right?

[SCB]

SKs are top-notch XP-group tanks + amazing pullers.

Rangers are mediocre melee DPS + good pullers (if outdoors) and spot CC.

Classes with CC abilities or good sustained DPS are a dime a dozen on this server. Tanks are pretty rare.

What's so hard to understand about why a group would be more willing to deal with a SK's xp penalty than a ranger's?

Because at the end of the day there is almost no group content hard enough to need min/maxing, and if you're willing to handle one class's exp penalty, it makes no sense to not be willing to handle another's.

On this server, even "mediocre" dps outgears whatever content it's doing by a substantial amount in almost all situations, and you're talking maybe individual seconds longer to drop a mob.

I have the same shock when people say they don't want a wizard in the group. Makes no sense to me at all.

[Tecmos Deception]

Lemme know how your xp group of 3 rangers and 3 wizards in HS west works out for you.

[Oaks the Ranger]

SKs are top-notch XP-group tanks + amazing pullers.

Rangers are mediocre melee DPS + good pullers (if outdoors) and spot CC.

Classes with CC abilities or good sustained DPS are a dime a dozen on this server. Tanks are pretty rare.

What's so hard to understand about why a group would be more willing to deal with a SK's xp penalty than a ranger's?

So let me get this right, if someone plays an SK, they are instantly a great tank and an amazing puller ? But that same person then rolls a Ranger they suddenly become only a good puller if they are lucky enough to be in an outdoor zone ?

So none of it is gear dependant or player skill based ?

thanks for you insight..

[SCB]

Lemme know how your xp group of 3 rangers and 3 wizards in HS west works out for you.

Because insanely non-conventional groups in arguably the "hardest" groupable area of the game is at all the discussion point here.

I'll be happy to let you know how a SK, Ranger, Wizard, Necro, Cleric, Druid group did though, because that group can clear it despite being 80% full of classes that are "terrible for grouping".

[Splorf22]

So let me get this right, if someone plays an SK, they are instantly a great tank and an amazing puller ? But that same person then rolls a Ranger they suddenly become only a good puller if they are lucky enough to be in an outdoor zone ?

So none of it is gear dependant or player skill based ?

thanks for you insight..

Rangers rely on Harmony to pull. Outdoors with tracking and harmony a ranger can deliver a stream of single pulls easily. Indoors they have 0 ways to split (well aside from the perennially OP invis pulling, but literally any class can do that). Skill has nothing to do with it.

Meanwhile SK tools (FD/CoS/dots) work fine indoors. Splitting is trivial; cast darkness on something, CoS, run away for 20 seconds, FD, stand up, CoS, run back, wait for mobs to reset (snared mobs don't reset), check aggro, go.

[Brimacombe]

Rangers just totally suck on here and I have one. Just give it up now and start another class. As a Healer I just hate them. They are a mana sinkhole. People don't want them in groups. End of story.

Meh, any DPS that wants to fap so hard to their parser that they are aggro magnets and mana pits pretty much find their way to another group... don't open with Ice Comet, yaknow?

And as far as min/maxing goes, I don't do it. I think it dehumanizes players into a set of stats. If they want to play XYZ, I don't care, as long as they know their job an do it well. The game is about people, otherwise you run the risk of turning into another content locust, and find your game turning into an uphill treadmill.

- Brimacombe

[Kevynne]

I've met shit rangers and good rangers

Good rangers CAN tank. Just gotta play the class right. Would tak a paladin over anything for a tank thou tbh

[Swish]

Velious right?

Ages away yet...and I meant just rangers :p

[HeallunRumblebelly]

Lemme know how your xp group of 3 rangers and 3 wizards in HS west works out for you.

eh, 3 rangers 2 wizards 1 donals cleric. works fine :3

also: rangers / sk's are pure titties for VP. Shit just does not work in there w/o em :p

[Splorf22]

There are times when I wish I had made Sakuragi a shadowknight. I figured warriors were more useful for raiding though.

[khanable]

There are times when I wish I had made Sakuragi a shadowknight. I figured warriors were more useful for raiding though.

I bite my thumb at thee! :mad:

[Tecmos Deception]

This thread has turned 100% stupid.

[Sithel1988]

when in doubt you do not /qq. you /who

[Ephirith]

There are very few situations where I'd prefer a shadowknight tank over a monk or warrior. Tbh, a decently proccing warrior or a monk can provide more than enough agro for a stable, functional group in the majority of situations.

Yes, rangers are mana sponges... but at least they can put out some dps. Even in sebilis etc, a slowed mob with a ranger tanking xp content isn't going to bankrupt the cleric, and if it does, your group probably has deep-seated issues beyond the presence of a ranger.

People overstate the usefulness of knight snap agro when capable monks and warriors are involved. I find it disputable whether knight agro is worth the loss of dps. As for rangers, everyone knows they are turds with some ability to shine in certain uncommon situations... but still just shiny turds. Hell, I was able to tell OP was a ranger because groups were rejecting him. Who gives a shit? I had fun playing mine, and people were usually pretty impressed with my root CC and outdoor pulling.

[Swish]

Warriors have an easier time now than they used to. I remember going through MM as a cleric a good while back and every greater heal was guaranteed to draw aggro with a couple of poorly geared warriors.

It's probably still the case that the majority of people don't roll a warrior as their first character on P99 unless they know someone that can gear them up a bit first.

A good SK (or paladin) in an everyday group was always my preference as a cleric. Having to root mobs for warriors to hold aggro was just embarrassing. Things have improved since then I'm sure.

SK with Ebon Mace (or similar), not much loss of DPS... and its not the tank's job to put out uber DPS anyway :p

[Ephirith]

SK with Ebon Mace (or similar), not much loss of DPS... and its not the tank's job to put out uber DPS anyway :p

I parsed this stuff a ton on both my sk and ranger, and knight dps is just pathetic even with nice weapons (epics). A monk and warrior mitigate equal or better, and they bring twice to three times as much dps, with satisfactory agro when geared/handled properly.

Which is more conducive to the efficiency of a group: a tank who holds agro and provides 60 dps, or a tank who holds agro and provides 30?

I still like having knights around, and I'm not constantly trying to min/max until my balls are swollen with efficiency, it just bothers me when people don't bash sk's and paladin's as much as they bash rangers when, imo, they are equally bad for most content.

[Oaks the Ranger]

Rangers rely on Harmony to pull. Outdoors with tracking and harmony a ranger can deliver a stream of single pulls easily. Indoors they have 0 ways to split (well aside from the perennially OP invis pulling, but literally any class can do that). Skill has nothing to do with it.


Meanwhile SK tools (FD/CoS/dots) work fine indoors. Splitting is trivial; cast darkness on something, CoS, run away for 20 seconds, FD, stand up, CoS, run back, wait for mobs to reset (snared mobs don't reset), check aggro, go.

Total nonsense... why do you even need a FD puller when you have an Ench, or Bard ? of in fact any class that can root ? I have sat in groups and watched time and time again monks and SKs die trying to split camps when it would have been easier to mezz or root park them...even in outdoor zones trying to agrue the point that its easier for me as a Ranger to harmony pull them falls on deaf ears due to ignorance ..

Once most camps are split any class could pull !


Again nonsense, as you are assuming the SK player knows how to play !
Its about the player and how they know their class..
Anyways, I have played a Ranger since 1999, I certainly ain't the best and am actually learning still but would rather try to educate you than ignore the twaddle talked about here..

Final point.. skill has everything to do with it !

[Kagatob]

I could pull virtually any pre-PoP camp with a wizard using Staff of Temperate Flux.

Root does wonders for crowd control, it's not hard to set up a macro that tells your group to back away from the mob once it's rooted, in some cases (pets/DoT's) it can be even more effective than mez, the opposite is true with caster mobs though so it goes either way.

[senna]

I still like having knights around, and I'm not constantly trying to min/max until my balls are swollen with efficiency, it just bothers me when people don't bash sk's and paladin's as much as they bash rangers when, imo, they are equally bad for most content.

Agreed 100%

IMO knights and rangers didnt begin to shine until PoP hit.. they rode the shortbus from vanilla to velious

Sks sure look pretty though...style points.

[sdp00888]

I can tank just as good as a warrior at my lvl (40)on my SK. I can pull 100% than any warrior with FD and CoS. even with my xp penalty in the group the ability to pull with ease makes up for that.