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-   -   Are you mortified about President Donald J. Trump? (/forums/showthread.php?t=317375)

DMN 02-14-2019 05:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lune (Post 2861419)
Because they were in the pockets of insurance companies and single payer had little popular support at the time?

They were or they are? Curious choice of words if one was a discerning individual.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lune (Post 2861419)
Obama also never promised single payer. Anyways, it doesn't matter, Obama is gone.

He promised to lower premiums by quite a margin but in fact only raised them. He not only lied he did the exact opposite.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lune (Post 2861419)
What's Trump's excuse?

I hate to break it to you, but Trump can't repeal or replace the affordable care act by executive fiat. And I certainly can't blame republicans for not wanting to touch anything a duplicit media will always propagandize against them.

Lune 02-14-2019 06:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DMN (Post 2861482)
They were or they are? Curious choice of words if one was a discerning individual.

He promised to lower premiums by quite a margin but in fact only raised them. He not only lied he did the exact opposite.

I hate to break it to you, but Trump can't repeal or replace the affordable care act by executive fiat. And I certainly can't blame republicans for not wanting to touch anything a duplicit media will always propagandize against them.

What does Obama have to do with any of this? Is Obama president? It seems like when faced with Trump's incompetence and duplicity Trump's followers can only belt "BUT HILLARYZ BENGAZI EMAILZ"

And just to understand you, the reason Trump and Republicans didn't reform healthcare is because they are afraid of the media? Are you stupid?

DMN 02-14-2019 06:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lune (Post 2861517)
What does Obama have to do with any of this? Is Obama president? It seems like when faced with Trump's incompetence and duplicity Trump's followers can only belt "BUT HILLARYZ BENGAZI EMAILZ"

And just to understand you, the reason Trump and Republicans didn't reform healthcare is because they are afraid of the media? Are you stupid?

Get your ass kicked and then talk in circles while feigning you can't understand basic English? Not impressed, luneytoons.

DinoTriz2 02-14-2019 08:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lune (Post 2861517)
What does Obama have to do with any of this? Is Obama president? It seems like when faced with Trump's incompetence and duplicity Trump's followers can only belt "BUT HILLARYZ BENGAZI EMAILZ"

And just to understand you, the reason Trump and Republicans didn't reform healthcare is because they are afraid of the media? Are you stupid?

No one in the history of the world has ever said, "but her emails!".

Bardp1999 02-14-2019 09:02 PM

Only land owners should be able to vote

America 02-14-2019 09:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bardp1999 (Post 2861629)
Only land owners should be able to vote

this is a interesting idea historically it was racists who held land and produced the great shining beacon of liberalism that saved the world. They would whip their slaves every day so that they were mentally broken. They constantly had blood under their fingernails from the torture. And would do things like bind female slaves and forcibly impregnate them while they shrieked, and make the male Africans watch. They would call the male Africans the period equivalent of cuckboys. This was done to instill the discipline needed to make sure it was safe for the Whites on the plantation. Slaves would routinely track blood all thru the house and it was real nasty stuff, nonstop sound of whipipng and screaming and White portico all drenched with blood and feces. It was like on Game of Thrones. Anyway it wouldn't be smart to only endow landowners w suffrage, after we pried our rights from their blood stained claws.

America 02-14-2019 09:19 PM

^^^u're supposed to read that in a slam poetry kind of pacing, like how one of those black guys they have on Jewish news who rhymes parts of his speech talks. U know what I mean.

Troxx 02-14-2019 09:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Teppler (Post 2861445)
then they want to spend massive amounts on every poor person with healthcare.

I'm a health care professional (MD) working for the US military. I spent the last 3 years of my life abroad in Germany and got to see first hand just how well a centralized health care system actually works. It works ... amazingly well. The closest thing we have to it is what US military members and their dependents have.

In Germany, our landlord's brother lived in the adjacent house. He worked road construction his whole life. He brought home a reasonable living income, had his health care always covered by the government, and retired with a pension and health care that will cover him for the rest of his life. He had disposable income to drink at the pub with his friends, go on vacation (30+ paid days per year), and buy all the things in life he needed to be comfortable. This is true for every working German citizen. Do they pay much higher % taxes? Yes, much higher taxes. Tax % there also appropriately escalates with your earned income, but they have no shortage (believe me) of rich people screaming down the Autobahn in their Ferraris. Is their quality of life higher than the average American? Yes. Do they worry about health care, debilitating injuries, illnesses their kids have, whether or not they will be able to retire? No.

Whether Americans like it or not, a well thought out 'socialist' (everyone works, pays their taxes relative to their income, and reaps mutual societal benefits) approach to 'everyone wins' does work. It really does. It's sad that the party (republicans) whose average 'member' most vehemently oppose this fail to grasp this. I used to be a republican - no more. I'm an atheist, and have unfortunately learned that I don't really have a place in a part that panders to the religious evangelical right.
Republicans are a weird mix of the ultra-wealthy (a minority but very politically powerful sub-group) and the blue collar predominantly white middle to lower-middle class. Most republicans spend a lot more on private healthcare or miss out on a lot of wages and retirement pension in having their paychecks curtailed for the preferred non-centralized health care. They are worried about the poor and people 'free-loading' without realizing that the poor already have their asses covered with Medicaid.

The privatized health care industry is the REASON why health care costs in the US are exponentially higher than every other westernized rich nation on this planet. Yet the average American who works hard has worse health care that covers less in terms of benefits than the average European. For all the hate on 'socialism' and the fear that leeches will steal your hard earned dollars funding their health care ... you are getting far less for YOUR money than every other citizen of every other well-to-do nation on this planet. Health insurance companies make profit. They are your middle men. They pocket the difference. Imagine taking them out of the equation? Yeah taxes are higher but you don't have to pay for health insurance anymore. Your employers don't have to pay for your health plans. That money, if employers are properly regulated, goes back into your pocket.

Look. I don't really have a vested interest in this other than the fact that I want you and your kids to have the same health benefits I and my children have. Your tax dollars pay my salary and pay for my healthcare, my wife's health care, and my kids' health care. I pay nothing for that health care. You do. Your tax dollars do ... and those tax dollars are already covering the cost of health care for the poor and the old. The people left out in the cold from those benefits that already exist? The working lower-middle class and up that make too much money to qualify for medicaid. The only health care not already covered is for everyone else .. and those people are paying exorbitant amounts of surplus money to line the pockets of the private health insurance industry.

I do medicine for a living (Teppler doesn't - he does Hierophant in seb for a living). Every day I take care of people and their health care needs. I see broken systems. I've seen systems that works, and a single payer system that uses tax dollars to cover everyone is a lot more cost effective, efficient, and is more fair to everyone. We in our nation are already paying for poor people's health care (Medicaid). It's the predominantly white middle, lower-middle, and upper middle class that are currently paying a disproportionately huge amount of their income to have less-than-adequate health care. Cut out the middle-men (insurance companies) and we can all win.

Right now we spend more on health care than any other nation - but because of the inefficiencies in our system our health care quality per capita is abysmal.

---------------------------

Food for thought: The nation on this planet with the highest rated quality of life, standard of living, access to health care, and functional/disposable is not the US. When rated on the above things, the US does not even hit the top 10. Those nations that do have higher tax rates ... but it is counterbalanced with significantly better health care systems, pension programs, family maternity/paternity leave ... you name it. The citizens of those nations are living great lives. Us? Us in the US? Well, we pay more money for practically everything. Our rich get richer. Our middle class stagnates. Our poor get poorer. Wage gaps between those at the top and those in the middle keep getting further and further apart.

I personally would like to pay more in taxes so we in the US can experience a similar standard quality of life. I already pay more in taxes than most of you probably do, and I would not for one minute mind paying a hell of a lot more in taxes if it meant every man, woman, and child in America could have consistent access to health care, high quality education, and not have to worry about whether or not they can afford to live past the age they can reasonably continue working.

I really do not know what else to say ...


(other than that it is fucking funny to ready Teppler's posts)

Troxx 02-14-2019 09:22 PM

PS: Expected replies include but are not limited to:

-TLDR; I'm going to just scroll past and ignore

-Lol Troxx claims to be a 'young doctor'

America 02-14-2019 09:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Troxx (Post 2861644)
I'm a health care professional (MD) working for the US military. I spent the last 3 years of my life abroad in Germany and got to see first hand just how well a centralized health care system actually works. It works ... amazingly well. The closest thing we have to it is what US military members and their dependents have.

In Germany, our landlord's brother lived in the adjacent house. He worked road construction his whole life. He brought home a reasonable living income, had his health care always covered by the government, and retired with a pension and health care that will cover him for the rest of his life. He had disposable income to drink at the pub with his friends, go on vacation (30+ paid days per year), and buy all the things in life he needed to be comfortable. This is true for every working German citizen. Do they pay much higher % taxes? Yes, much higher taxes. Tax % there also appropriately escalates with your earned income, but they have no shortage (believe me) of rich people screaming down the Autobahn in their Ferraris. Is their quality of life higher than the average American? Yes. Do they worry about health care, debilitating injuries, illnesses their kids have, whether or not they will be able to retire? No.

Whether Americans like it or not, a well thought out 'socialist' (everyone works, pays their taxes relative to their income, and reaps mutual societal benefits) approach to 'everyone wins' does work. It really does. It's sad that the party (republicans) whose average 'member' most vehemently oppose this fail to grasp this. I used to be a republican - no more. I'm an atheist, and have unfortunately learned that I don't really have a place in a part that panders to the religious evangelical right.
Republicans are a weird mix of the ultra-wealthy (a minority but very politically powerful sub-group) and the blue collar predominantly white middle to lower-middle class. Most republicans spend a lot more on private healthcare or miss out on a lot of wages and retirement pension in having their paychecks curtailed for the preferred non-centralized health care. They are worried about the poor and people 'free-loading' without realizing that the poor already have their asses covered with Medicaid.

The privatized health care industry is the REASON why health care costs in the US are exponentially higher than every other westernized rich nation on this planet. Yet the average American who works hard has worse health care that covers less in terms of benefits than the average European. For all the hate on 'socialism' and the fear that leeches will steal your hard earned dollars funding their health care ... you are getting far less for YOUR money than every other citizen of every other well-to-do nation on this planet. Health insurance companies make profit. They are your middle men. They pocket the difference. Imagine taking them out of the equation? Yeah taxes are higher but you don't have to pay for health insurance anymore. Your employers don't have to pay for your health plans. That money, if employers are properly regulated, goes back into your pocket.

Look. I don't really have a vested interest in this other than the fact that I want you and your kids to have the same health benefits I and my children have. Your tax dollars pay my salary and pay for my healthcare, my wife's health care, and my kids' health care. I pay nothing for that health care. You do. Your tax dollars do ... and those tax dollars are already covering the cost of health care for the poor and the old. The people left out in the cold from those benefits that already exist? The working lower-middle class and up that make too much money to qualify for medicaid. The only health care not already covered is for everyone else .. and those people are paying exorbitant amounts of surplus money to line the pockets of the private health insurance industry.

I do medicine for a living (Teppler doesn't - he does Hierophant in seb for a living). Every day I take care of people and their health care needs. I see broken systems. I've seen systems that works, and a single payer system that uses tax dollars to cover everyone is a lot more cost effective, efficient, and is more fair to everyone. We in our nation are already paying for poor people's health care (Medicaid). It's the predominantly white middle, lower-middle, and upper middle class that are currently paying a disproportionately huge amount of their income to have less-than-adequate health care. Cut out the middle-men (insurance companies) and we can all win.

Right now we spend more on health care than any other nation - but because of the inefficiencies in our system our health care quality per capita is abysmal.

---------------------------

Food for thought: The nation on this planet with the highest rated quality of life, standard of living, access to health care, and functional/disposable is not the US. When rated on the above things, the US does not even hit the top 10. Those nations that do have higher tax rates ... but it is counterbalanced with significantly better health care systems, pension programs, family maternity/paternity leave ... you name it. The citizens of those nations are living great lives. Us? Us in the US? Well, we pay more money for practically everything. Our rich get richer. Our middle class stagnates. Our poor get poorer. Wage gaps between those at the top and those in the middle keep getting further and further apart.

I personally would like to pay more in taxes so we in the US can experience a similar standard quality of life. I already pay more in taxes than most of you probably do, and I would not for one minute mind paying a hell of a lot more in taxes if it meant every man, woman, and child in America could have consistent access to health care, high quality education, and not have to worry about whether or not they can afford to live past the age they can reasonably continue working.

I really do not know what else to say ...


(other than that it is fucking funny to ready Teppler's posts)

damn..*puts on thinking cap*

damn man *scratches under thinking cap*

dam nman im not about to read that *blazes up, huge flame singeing thinking cap*


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