I wonder how much of that had to do with in game maps being released. The maps were notoriously bad for zones with any verticality.

Luclin models really were a departure, being too exaggerated for the old world in a breast implant sort of way. Even looking back at alpha/beta screenshots and footage, however clunky those models were, a rough impression of the same artistic style still remains present, like the very first Simpsons episodes.

To be fair tho Tacvi is a raidzone not really a dungeon like lower guk.

An observation I have read many times in DOOM communities. Something happened to level design when graphics engines got more powerful. You would think the opposite would have happened, like today we should be discussing some of the most complex, useable and overall beautiful works in level design.

You know what's cool, a dungeon like Permafrost where you have to click levers and such to open gates. That swing blade trap in SolA. Heads on pikes at the entrance to Befallen and a well that takes you straight to the bottom if you are dumb enough to fall in.

Something was also lost when games became focused on maps and specifically quest markers. You can toggle that stuff off but the game world is not setup for it. Everquest is a sweet spot in design and player involvement (with other players sharing knowledge).

The penetrable rock crevice leading into the Hole; whether intentional or not, it was a nice perk for small races and those able to shrink themselves. The shortcut dropdowns and zoneout pads in the Hole. The bookcase door leading to the basement of Unrest. The icy terrors in Permafrost, how with bad positioning and one knockback, players will get flung into the bear pits. NPCs that knockback/grav flux in Plane of Sky. An epic fight that requires group members submerge themselves in lava. Dragons spawning at or in the vicinity of Druid rings, which are still preferable to the Skyfire Wizard ring. All nice touches. It's easy to see the devs' minds at work and imagine them laughing as they built these zones that would later grief/reward players for being too curious or too careless. AE dispels were the cruelest though. Unforgivable.

This post makes me smile.

Welp, who's ready for some spit polished Unreal Engine mobile games? Raid: Shadow Legends. Millions of players.

Everyone agrees gates, but they got it back at omens and kept it till seeds

then it was gone for good

The penetrable .... crevice leading into the Hole....

Well, I quit not too long after velious so you know my answer. You could tell they were walking down the Monty Hall path.

That was probably the most fun raid ever for me.