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Originally Posted by Orruar
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I was talking about correlation/causation because that is all about showing how your statistics don't show any kind of causal link. I even gave an example of how causation could be the reverse of what you believe (people who live in countries with less crime feel less of a need for a right to carry weapons).
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Feeling the need to carry a weapon is different than feeling the need to kill someone with one. I said murder rates with firearms, and murder rates period, were lower in most countries with stricter gun laws. A lower crime rate overall would certainly be a factor for why gun crime would be lower. And I said that in no way do I view gun laws as the only factor when evaluating the causes of higher murder and other crime rates. In fact, I would hazard to guess the biggest factors would again be education and poverty, for which these countries also have better numbers. However, since we don't seem to be too concerned about combating those issues as we continue to cut funding for education and programs aimed at alleviating poverty, gun control (such as background checks and assault weapons bans), is an alternative place to start. Also, while it may not be the biggest factor in crime, I think it would certainly be hard to justify stricter gun laws making the situation worse.
There are several other devil statistics to consider as well, such as accidental death and injury, number of people killed/injured at a single shooting, rate of injury/death when owning a gun vs those who don't, what percentage of people who own guns are criminals, list goes on. All of this to consider when determining causality and how to move forward with gun control.