Quote:
Originally Posted by DeathsSilkyMist
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This is easy, because the math you keep claiming is "invalid" that I have been using has the exact same principle.
If you agree 20 x 10 x 60 = 12000 mana per hour via meditation is correct, then you will also agree with these DPS breakpoints:
100 DPS will kill a mob with 8000 HP in 80 seconds.
200 DPS will kill a mob with 8000 HP in 40 seconds.
400 DPS will kill a mob with 8000 HP in 20 seconds.
If we are in agreement with this, then I am not sure where my argument was dishonest, my math incorrect, or my data invalid. You haven't explained any of this, and just keep dismissing everything I say.
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I literally addressed this multiple times and you just seem to ignore it. Or once again your opinion disagrees and obviously your opinion is correct and nobody elses is so you dismiss it. Or you move the goalpost again.etc.etc
Your entire "DPS breakpoint" argument is retarded for a long list of reasons. First of which being that DPS varies. No combination of classes and/or pets will ever do exactly 200 dps to every mob. You keep trying to precisely math out everything and act like everything is going to be exactly the way you math it even if you change conditions or variables. This tells me you have absolutely zero experience in programming or any kind of software development. Unexpected things happen all the time. This is the entire point of things like unit tests. No human being can 100% accurately predict the outcome of such a complex system with all the different variables and conditions present. Despite what you may think the code running behind the scenes in a game like everquest is fairly complex. Not to mention introducing the unpredictability of human behavior into the equation.
All of that set aside. Even if you were 100% correct about your assessment. You'd still be wrong in assuming that just because you don't get an extra named/PH spawn in a short play session that additional DPS is completely worthless. This is just straight up factually incorrect. It's nothing but your opinion that you've been spewing as fact for dozens of pages. There are tons of people that play this game for super long periods of time per session. I used to regularly play 12-16 hour days at one point in my life. Back when I was younger and unemployed. If I'm not mistaken your own calculation said an extra named cycle would be gained at 11 hours. There are many people that play that long or longer per day. Even if you DON'T get an extra named/PH cycle you can still kill additional mobs per hour. Many many camps (including fungi king that we use as an example often here) has A LOT of mobs within pulling range. I don't know about you but I prefer to play the game and not kill 3 spawns and go AFK for 25 minutes. More trash kills = objectively better. Even if its only a minimal benefit.
Ultimately I think the main crux of the disagreement is that you place an insanely high value on the utility and "safety" aspect that you feel a shaman brings. This isn't backed by data or math. This is simply your preference/opinion being asserted as fact. So far everyone here except you agrees (If you quote fucking argumentum ad populum one more time I swear to fuck) that a group with a cleric and 2 enchanters has MORE than sufficient utility and safety. This is why everyone keeps saying "redundant" in reference to shaman. They don't really bring anything the group doesn't already have. I leveled a enc/enc duo with no healer and we legitimately died like less than 5 times the entire leveling process. I honestly think it was 2 or 3 times over dozens of LONG sessions. It's not an exaggeration to say a cleric is the only safety net this group needs. You don't need to be gods gift to everquest or a pro player or any of that nonsense. 2 reasonably well played enchanters and 1 halfway decent cleric is an unstoppable killing machine. You're kind of an insane person if you really think that group is like "Oh man I really wish we had a shaman so we don't wipe". That's fucking ridiculous man. I know how much you love your class but get fucking real.
Summary: Enc/Enc/Clr doesn't NEED anything. The only real benefit to be gained is more DPS or perhaps some utility the group doesn't already have. Shaman DPS is pretty mediocre and almost all of their utility the group already has. Thus they would not be anyone's (except DSM's) first choice as the 4th filler for this group.