Raid mob rotation idea, and Teirs

[Kelven]

There's just too much bickering on these forums, and no ideas/solutions. I quickly wrote this one up in notepad.

Kelven's Non-poopsocking rotation suggestion.

Certain guilds wanted to get away from the carebear rotation because they felt they were more "hardcore" and deserved loot more then casual players who are
unable to play as much as them. While this holds some merit, it has driven the raiding scene into one big boring campfest lasting on average 3-4 days
straight.

I am under the impression that 95% of the server, or more, does not actually like to poopsock-camp mobs all week, and would like the chance to do other
activities, whether that be on or offline.

Yes this is just like the old server boss rotation we had in place when guilds first started raiding, with some minor tweaks.

Rotation:
The first issue is how will everyone determine WHO is allowed into the guild raiding rotation.

Right now the "raiding" guilds that I know of are as follows:

Dark Ascension
Inglorious Basterds
Divinity
Wrathful Inquisition
Transcendence
Remedy/Europa

Alliances will always be counted as 1, regardless of numbers.

Now lets break the boss targets down by how hard they are.
My reasoning behind this is also to allow the more "hardcore" and larger guilds a smaller list on the most sought after raid bosses.

Teir1: Draco, Maestro
Teir2: Vox, Nagafen, Innorruk, Cazic Thule.
We could possibly even break Vox/Nag into a Teir 3 and increase the *player-online requirement*

About how many people should be required to kill each boss. I know you can probably do CT/Inny with 12-15 people depending what classes you have, but lets
keep these numbers realistic - and let them reflect the size of the guild that should be allowed to tackle a certain raid mob.

Required raid force ( Tagged ) for Teir1 bosses: 15
Required raid force ( Tagged ) for Teir2 bosses: 20
Required raid force ( Tagged ) for Teir3 ? bosses: 25 ?

If a guild cannot produce such a raid force, they will be unable to compete for certain Teir bosses. These are just guestimated numbers, but I feel they are pretty accurate on what type of raid force the larger raiding guilds would have.

Suggested spawn timers.
Teir 1, 3 days - that's about what they are already?
Teir 2, 5-6 days - that's about what they are already?

Remove the +/- 48 hours so that guilds can plan to have people online for their kills.

How the rotation works: *Example*, this does not account for every possible occurrence.

week 1

Guild-A : Vox - Maestro
Guild-B : Nagafen - Draco
Guild-C : CT
Guild-D : Inny

Guild-E : Sits out

week 2

Guild-E : Vox
Guild-A : Nagafen
Guild-B : CT - Maestro
Guild-C : Inny - Draco

Guild-D : Sits out

week 3

Guild-D : Vox - Draco
Guild-E : Nagafen
Guild-A : CT
Guild-B : Inny

Guild-C : Maestro

I would like to note that Draco/Maestro will be passed through the list much faster, leading to some guilds having two targets per week, or none.
The amount of guilds allowed to try the Teir1 targets will also be on a larger list.

How long do you have?

Guild-x is allowed 24 hours to kill said mob. This allows people who aren't online 24/7 to get a shot, and not attach socks to their asses.

IF a guild cannot kill the boss target within the 24 hours allotted, they will forfeit their spot, and said boss will transfer to the next guild on
rotation. The failing guild will also forfeit there rotation for THAT SPECIFIC BOSS, on their immediate following rotation, but be allowed to attempt
again after 1 full rotation.

IF this guild cannot defeat the boss on their 2nd attempt/rotation they will forfeit there spot on that boss for the remainder of the month or X amount of rotations. This will be an attempt to keep the list small, so we don't have new guilds popping up like weeds trying to claim bosses.

Determining who gets to be on the list will take some sitting down between guild leaders. Smaller and newly formed guilds will, and should be skipped from the list until they can prove they can handle the targets - although the rules to determine this are a bit vague in my head at the moment.

I'm sure there will be people who trash this idea, because they can be online all day / everyday camping bosses - but that's just not what I envisioned this server would become.

This is my original draft, but if we were going to adopt a raid rotation again between guilds - I think this is a good start.

[Coalrymer]

Not to poopoo on what you put here but, uhh. It won’t work. That would only allow the certain number of guilds in there to raid. Without them getting too feisty. New guilds are popping up all the time.

Good post though

[nicemace]

im all for rotation, but change the 24 hour window to kill to 1.5 hours, maybe 3 at the max, but keep it short. especially if you remove variance since guilds should be able to plan for the pop of a mob.

no wipes, you wipe you lose your spot.

both of the above result in FFA. mob, dosent pass off to next guild.

aside from that i'd be happy.

[Toony]

Originally Posted by nicemace [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

im all for rotation, but change the 24 hour window to kill to 1.5 hours, maybe 3 at the max, but keep it short.

I agree on a smaller window, 8-12 hours max, if you can't field a raid force by then you just aren't in the mix imo.

p.s. my reasoning on 8-12 hours is, if you're already agreeing to a rotation, you need to factor in server outages, restarts and time zones.

And yes, absolutely, new guilds have to be considered.

[Humerox]

Same problem we had in the beginning. No allowance for new guilds.

The server has been through this entire process before. We're repeating history here. We went from rotation to spawn-variance and new server rules, to player-made rules, and now we're talking rotation again.

If rotation is a solution, it must be dynamic. It must allow for new guilds that come up. It must allow for the future, so all guilds that are capable can enjoy content.

Even as Sky, Kunark and Velious come up...I think server population will always be growing. It wasn't so long ago we were peaking 200. No it's almost 900...and when Kunark opens, the floodgates will open, I can promise you that. So we'd need to deal with rotations through real tiers.

I still want to see what Nilbog and Aeolwind have come up with.

Up and comers?

Eminence
Vesica Dei
Sapientia

Forgive me if I forgot any, but the list keeps growing. They may not all be raid-capable yet, but that doesn't discount the fact that they may be soon.

[Kelven]

There is nothing about this rule set that does not allow for new guilds.

Here.
Guild-Newbie wants to raid.

Guild-Newbie's guild leader makes a post on the forums (raid guilds section?), Hey - We have 15 raiders ready to get on the rotation for this boss, and that boss. Guild - Newbie's GM then informs the current raiding guilds that they will be able to raid in the next rotation.

Guild-Newbie is inserted at the TOP of the sit-out rotation

Raiding guild - raid targetX
Raiding guild - raid targetX
Raiding guild - raid targetX
Raiding guild - raid targetX

Guild-Newbie
sitting out guild
sitting out guild

(all guilds flow down in the list rotation)

Guild-Newbie will be responsible for notifying their surrounding raiding guilds of their request for a spot. Just because a post is made - don't assume everyone trolls the forums all day.

I included a part in my original write up that states - if you can't kill your target in XX hours, then you forfeit - you also lose your spot for a full rotation. I thought this would help with too many new guilds trying to cram themselves into the rotation too fast.

Now 24 hours might seem too long, it would give almost everyone a guaranteed shot. 12 hours would at least give you a chance - and would also allow for the "hardcore 24/7" raiders to be right there waiting when mid-day bosses are sitting up.

However if the window is shortened to 12 hours, forfeiting your spot for a full rotation seems a bit harsh.

[Humerox]

I like the idea.

+1

[Amra]

I'm new to the server and not even 50 yet, but I still don't get what the big deal is here.

Why is FFA such a bad option?

So the more hardcore guilds get more targets...that's why we call them hardcore. It would still allow smaller guilds a chance at said targets. If there was one guild dominating people might step up and challenge them by beating them to targets or just flat out ksing them with numbers.

This happened all the time on live servers. We'd go to a raid target and we'd be buffing and going slow(my first guild wasn't amazing) and along comes elite-guild_001 and just runs in and engages/kill/loots/leaves. There wasn't any notion of holding mobs cause I had X people in the zone before you did.

The whole training each others raids does seem to kinda go to far, but whats with all these rules? First team to engage and kill wins.

[Allizia]

I want FFA just so I can watch shit implode, no one would back down and take an ego hit to their raid tactics. Would have 3-4 guilds clawing each others eyes out while gangbanging some poor bastard dragon in a first to engage/killsteal/train fest

I just need someone to fraps it for me

[Evorix]

I like the idea, but 24hrs is way too long to down a boss. I'm thinking more like 1hour for draco, vox, naggy, inny, and maestro. 6hrs for ct.