Bards and Charisma

zanderklocke · #1 12-10-2012, 11:52 PM

Hello all,

I am looking for some expert advice from higher end bards on how much Cha is enough for a bard that typically spends time mezzing, charming, lulling, and pulling.

My bard currently has 175 cha unbuffed, but I'm debating if I should be removing some of my cha rings/earrings/necklace for other stat boosters.

For instance, I've been looking at the earring of essence for a bit of hp/MR boost and the Hardened Clay Bracelet because it's pretty bad ass all around (however, it has no cha).

I don't have a Tranix Crown, as I can't afford it yet, but I plan to use it if I swapped out my other Cha gear.

I've sort of ranked usefulness of bard stats as: Cha > Dex > Str > Sta (maybe swap this with Str) > Agi
Is my thinking correct on this?

Basic question:
At what point does Cha have diminishing returns that boosting it unbuffed with equipment have diminishing returns? 180, 190, 200, or is my 175 too high? Should I be boosting my HP with HP rings/earrings...this has never made a lot of sense to me since bards are not tanks?

Fael · #2 12-11-2012, 03:13 PM

Charisma matters most with lulls. However, generally, the worry over high charisma only materializes in a few situations where there is a high risk of getting a wipe while breaking. (breaking a 4-7 mob pull). This mostly occurs in a only a few spots in seb and howling stones. For those types of situations I would max CHA, but for everything else i would go with the best in slot item you can get, which gives you good ac, sta, hp, str, dex, etc. I wouldn't be too crazy about maxing cha. Good bard equipment ends up having a lot of charisma on it anyways.

Also, for the real risky pulls, i would recommend just invis or hide pulling with lull/dd. I can pull HS west/south/whatever pretty damn well. But all it takes is one active resist on lull and you're potentially going to wipe and waste a lot of time on CR.

Save for tranix: best 12k you can possibly spend on a bard.

Dolic

zanderklocke · #3 12-11-2012, 03:21 PM

Can someone explain to me how hide/invis pulling works?

I usually equip lute and lull everything except mob I'm pulling, and then I pull using direct damage song or slow, slow if I don't know if the mob is a summoner or not. Is this the best way to do it?

I've noticed that I get a lot of resists in certain areas of Seb like Disco. Perhaps, this is due to my level (55) as opposed to my charisma.

ForeverLost · #4 12-11-2012, 03:24 PM

I may be wrong, and it has been a long time since I played live, but I don't remember CHA being very important at all. It affected lull resist rate, rate of missed notes (along with DEX) and maybe charm duration? My bard always went STA > DEX > CHA > AGI/STR

And Fael is right, even while not going for CHA gear bards end up with a lot of it anyway, because it's on everything :P

SirAlvarex · #5 12-11-2012, 04:03 PM

With just full planar, I believe I have around 135 CHA, and that's been good enough for me in all situations i've come across. Having the jewelry around as a extra bump wouldn't hurt.

I don't lull pull as much though, prefer to just pull'em all then keep them mezzed in the group. That's when I pull, as I'm almost always with a monk in a group and let him do the duties.

The important stats for bards, IMO, are Resists -> STA -> DEX -> CHA -> AGI/STR.

Hide pulling is done as following:

While you are hidden/invis, your mob doesn't pull aggro socially. So you can pull a mob from one end of the zone to the other without getting adds. I don't do it very often, so I don't know if see invis mobs matter here.

For hide pulling, I've just mezzed the target, then keep hitting hide or just invising until things stick, then run back to spawn. I'd be curious if other bards have better strategies, as that isn't great for splitting a full room without lull'ing first.

You can also use sneak to do pulling, but it's slightly riskier since you have to have sneak execute successfully after you've already cast the song. You better be ready to cancel it if it doesn't succeed.

Yibz · #6 12-11-2012, 04:14 PM

Like the other bards said, don't actively look for CHA gear (exception being Tranix Crown). Decent bard gear gives you enough for just about any situation. If you find yourself trying to break a room with 5 or so mobs, the most important thing you can do is learn the mob levels and lull the lowest levels first. This will GREATLY reduce crit resists that could wipe a group.

zanderklocke · #7 12-11-2012, 05:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SirAlvarex [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

With just full planar, I believe I have around 135 CHA, and that's been good enough for me in all situations i've come across. Having the jewelry around as a extra bump wouldn't hurt.

I don't lull pull as much though, prefer to just pull'em all then keep them mezzed in the group. That's when I pull, as I'm almost always with a monk in a group and let him do the duties.

The important stats for bards, IMO, are Resists -> STA -> DEX -> CHA -> AGI/STR.

Hide pulling is done as following:

While you are hidden/invis, your mob doesn't pull aggro socially. So you can pull a mob from one end of the zone to the other without getting adds. I don't do it very often, so I don't know if see invis mobs matter here.

For hide pulling, I've just mezzed the target, then keep hitting hide or just invising until things stick, then run back to spawn. I'd be curious if other bards have better strategies, as that isn't great for splitting a full room without lull'ing first.

You can also use sneak to do pulling, but it's slightly riskier since you have to have sneak execute successfully after you've already cast the song. You better be ready to cancel it if it doesn't succeed.

Yeah,

I have full planar except helm, but I wear the mystic koada'dal instead (except for planar BP) as I think the stats are better for a bard.

However, as to pulling. None of those seems to be a great way to break a room of 4+ mobs. I'm still confused on whether you can pull while invisible; I understand pulling a mob and then going invis. Does throwing a weapon break invis?

Also, how long does lull last on mob?

Nirgon · #8 12-11-2012, 06:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by zanderklocke [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Can someone explain to me how hide/invis pulling works?
.

It's a pretty sweet bug, have someone cast invis on you and have it land before the spell finishes. If none of the mobs around it see invis, it will come single to you regardless of how many other mobs it passes that also do not see invis.

The trolls have been pretty good about pulling the wool over the eyes of the devs here, so it will remain in game. Single pull fungi kings for all!

Oh most of Plane of Hate doesn't correctly see invis here and invis to undead stacks with regular invis too. Pretty cake once you know all this. Completely murders risk vs reward tho if that's your thing.

Halfelfbard · #9 12-11-2012, 08:06 PM

Your thinking like a enchanter, and not a bard it looks like. Think of it this way, everything with a bard is timed...nothing lasts forever. It just matters how fast you can repeat the process.

From a raid bard, i look at it like this...Resists/Sta/Dex

And you should have certain gear sets for what your doing.

Karafa · #10 12-12-2012, 12:41 AM

I agree with HalfElf, although at 60 with a good drum/epic I pretty much just skip resist gear and stack hitpoints/stam/dex.

Have different sets of gear incase you need to put on resist gear but otherwise stacking health benefits you in so many more ways than anything else. The longer you are alive the longer your group stays alive.