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#1
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Feign Death: Combat Damage Breaks and/or secondary Intelligence Check
Wall of text coming at you! Major changes require major evidence, so here are the findings...
Summary: I came across some interesting guides and comments on how FD worked on live, and actually having a 60 monk on P99 I can say I've never seen these factors in play. I think the mechanic needs some tweaking. It seems the major tests on live that were carried out on 'FD fails' involved hitting macros over and over and logging how many 'Fallen to the Ground' messages you received. These other chances for FD to fail would not have been accounted for. In short, if you FD too close to a combat damage round, the damage should still hit you when you are down and at least have a chance to break your FD. Also, there is evidence to support that mobs were subject to a secondary 'Intelligence Check' based on a successful FD, which would essentially 'see through' your FD. I never played a monk on Live in era, so maybe others can verify / dispute these findings, please chime in. On Combat Damage breaking FD: http://everquest.allakhazam.com/db/spell.html?spell=366 Quote:
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https://web.archive.org/web/20020825...eign_death.asp Quote:
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The Intelligence Check: I came across this dev post from Gordon responding to a user, the link to the poster is gone but comments remain. It appears he is complaining that he had a successful FD on 2 mobs, but a different mob saw him despite not hitting him before hand. Post is from mid-2000: https://web.archive.org/web/20010822...ve/arc76.shtml Quote:
Dev board post from early 2001: https://web.archive.org/web/20010822...ve/arc25.shtml Quote:
An in era quote from an experienced Necro here: Quote:
Late 2001 Monkly Business guide seems to infer higher level mobs are tougher to fool: http://www.monkly-business.net/forum...de-Feign-Death Quote:
http://www.monkly-business.net/forum...ie-to-Disciple Quote:
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I think this makes a good case for Combat Damage breaks and a somewhat good case for an intelligence check. It is very difficult to find completely buttoned up evidence where people say "I had attack off, there were no spell casters, I was not being hit by combat damage so it wasn't that bug, I wasn't lagging out, and I had a successful FD with no 'Fallen to the Ground' message". Also, the original game designers were pretty good on balance, is rare that something should ALWAYS work. It seems like they like putting in failure chances to keep people on their toes (see hide, gates collapsing, spell fizzles, etc). If 'Intelligence Checks' are implemented, I've no idea on a formula, that may need to be a P99 recreation. I had heard through flop testing on monks that the failure rate on FD (i.e. Fallen messages) had no difference from skill of 100 to skill of 200. Would be interesting if your Level + FD skill factored into the equation, as well as the mobs level and some kind of weighted factor. Not sure how caster spells would scale to a possible Intelligence Check. If you want any further information I will be happy to help seek that out, I tapped a lot of resources to find this info, but I'm sure I can find more if I dig harder. Thank you Devs for this wonderful recreation of an amazing game!
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Wedar - Level 60 Grandmaster <Azure Guard>
Check out my Zone Guide to The Hole The Hole wiki now fully updated and accurate: Hole Wiki Page | ||||||||||||||||||||
#2
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On my Shadow Knight I've seen combat damage-related feign fails here on P1999. The dead giveaway is when you feign normally with no fail message and the monster(s) continue attacking anyway. It doesn't happen a lot (quite possibly due to lower net latency nowdays relative to years past) but it does happen. On the other hand, I have never once seen the other behavior described, where a monster continues attacking for several rounds then ceases later on. That sure sounds latency-related though.
I don't have a Monk, so I can't speak for the skill-based rather than spell-based feign ability. As an additional point, increasing blur probability from repeated feigns are pretty flagrantly either unimplemented or not functioning properly here, as most any active Monk/SK/Necro can attest. Danth | ||
#3
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Thanks for the feedback! Perhaps that combat damage bug does in fact have a chance to work on P99, I personally have never had it on my monk.
Looking over the notes, it seemed to be a common practice to try and avoid, so I gather it was a higher probability of happening in era on Live. Not sure if devs would want to simulate this 'mid-swing' effect or just let the ping decide.
__________________
Wedar - Level 60 Grandmaster <Azure Guard>
Check out my Zone Guide to The Hole The Hole wiki now fully updated and accurate: Hole Wiki Page | ||
#4
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=68jNoKRiRoo some like this one
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#5
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When a mob pathed directly over you while fd it would have a chance to "trip" over you and break the fd during the classic era. Otherwise nothing saw through fd.
Source: classic monk experience | ||
#6
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One day I'll do some tests them to see how hard / easy it is to fail with combat damage, but seeing as how it never happened to me in 60 levels and feigning to a large number of mobs beating on me, seems like some measures were taken to prevent it, just my opinion.
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Wedar - Level 60 Grandmaster <Azure Guard>
Check out my Zone Guide to The Hole The Hole wiki now fully updated and accurate: Hole Wiki Page | ||
#7
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Good to know that feature is working then. I do find it odd such a critical thing mentioned in old posts i happened to avoid by chance for 60 levels, but alas it would be hard to quantify a "classic fail rate" anyways without some logs of how soon you could feign before an attack. In your logs what was the time stamp of when you flopped (just look for "auto attack is off" maybe) vs when the melee hit you?
Ever have any run ins with a P99 intelligence check? Meaning, no melee or caster damage and the mob just "sees through" your FD?
__________________
Wedar - Level 60 Grandmaster <Azure Guard>
Check out my Zone Guide to The Hole The Hole wiki now fully updated and accurate: Hole Wiki Page | ||
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