No problem with you bards until tonight, what you guys should understand.

[kenzar]

Originally Posted by Champion_Standing [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Training is training, it doesn't matter what you are "trying" to do when it happens.

We aren't talking about people attempting to claim camps on outdoor mobs, this thread didn't start because ___ killed the sarnak that someone was camping in OT. You are the one taking things out of context here. Not being able to claim a specific wanderer spawn as a camp does not = being allowed to pull everything in the zone when other players are there trying to exp.

Newsflash: Pulling mobs is training and will result in ban lol.

Outdoor pathing mobs are specifically labeled as a first to engage. If a bard is able to pull 100% of the outdoor pathing mobs before anyone else pulls anything 1) everyone else sucks and should just quit or try harder. 2) no rules have been broken.

[SCB]

Originally Posted by kenzar [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Newsflash: Pulling mobs is training and will result in ban lol.

Outdoor pathing mobs are specifically labeled as a first to engage. If a bard is able to pull 100% of the outdoor pathing mobs before anyone else pulls anything 1) everyone else sucks and should just quit or try harder. 2) no rules have been broken.

But if his pull kills them, he trained them. This is what you're missing.

[kenzar]

Originally Posted by Weekapaug [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Keep lawyering.

The GMs have already stated more than once that you can't monopolize entire zones or even multiple spawns within zones.

When referring to indoor dungeon mobs the rules are clear. You can hold more than 1 camp as long as you can maintain a presence at the camps you wish to hold. If you have 6 camps in a dungeon, and your group of 6 can put 1 person on each camp, and each single player can hold that camp without leaving then you can in fact hold multiple camps.

Originally Posted by Weekapaug [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

One, as recently as another thread, yesterday, and another from like a year ago specificly talking about bards doing it could result in suspensions.

...The name of the thread is "Mass pulling in INDOOR dungeons"... again realize there is a difference between INDOOR(first in first out) and OUTDOOR(first to engage) within the camp ruleset.

I've played on the server 3.5 years and never have I ever seen a bard get in trouble for swarm kiting. Never have I ever seen anyone in trouble for training outside of a raid. I'm not arguing that it was never said, just that it was never enforced; at the end of the day what is the difference between unenforced and never said?

Originally Posted by Weekapaug [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

You made a blanket statement in your earlier post about "this is eq" or something and I was pointing out that not only is what you are saying not the case here, but it wasn't the case on live either. What gave you the impression FTE was a license to disrupt entire zones? Because it's not here nor was it ever on live.

I don't know what gave you that impression. My original statement was more to the tune of: "If you think eq is fair, you must have never played it." What I've said is the case here, and it was the case on live in my experiences.(again this isn't live; its dumb to compare the two either way) Bards swarm kite; cry harder.

[kenzar]

Originally Posted by SCB [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

But if his pull kills them, he trained them. This is what you're missing.

Been here a long time, I've never heard or seen a training petition(outside of a raid) yield anything. Isn't the existence of swarm kiters 4 years into the server's life proof enough that you're wrong? They've been here since day 1, and are still here 4 years later, obviously no one is getting banned; even threads like this are as old as the server and still...nothing. Hell, I've been in groups that kited the entirety of Skyfire and the only GM interaction we got was a "/shout Wow, thats really clever." followed by some illusions cast on us.

[kenzar]

Originally Posted by Splorf22 [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

If the OP had been talking about the Dreadlands or South Karana I would have been ready to get my pitchfork, but OT is just designed for bards.

^

[Weekapaug]

I've played on the server for 3.5 years, also, and I've never seen this bard situation like it is now. Personally, I've never had any problems with them because I don't tend to play in the particular zones that they tend to kite in. And, for the record, the bard is one of my favorite classes and I love to kite...I just don't do it here because I got into other classes shortly after I rolled my bard (my first toon) and never really played it. Bards are fun to solo, they are fun to group with, and they are fun to have in groups, if they are good. Many aren't, but that's a whole other conversation.

But there is most definately a problem of late because of the sheer number of people doing it now (and the sheer number of people affected) and the sheer number of people trying to do it and failing, which is probably where most of the problems lie...Sooner or later it's going to have to be addressed. Just ignoring it because of what the posted rules say, that are 4 years old, by the way, when the topic comes up multiple times daily, is talked about constantly in-game, and has created a general disdain for an entire class as a whole, while the GMs are commenting more and more on it, is just a little naive, dontcha think?

This is going to end badly for some people and I highly doubt it's the ones you are telling to "cry harder."

[Buma]

Originally Posted by thieros [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

stopped reading here. high exp there? perhaps im mistaken but its blah exp in a volatile bard zone. why group here when there are much better places to group! OT = roughly 75% exp. Check out the following for a more adventureful, and less bardy, time. Most of the below places have better loot as well (unless you are legit earning your OT hammer)

• Kaesora 110%
• Solusek's Eye 130%
• Any city's guards throughout the city(i hate erudites) 100%
• Kedge Keep 150-175%
• Castle Mistmoore 90%
• Frontier Mountains 75%
• Crypt of Dalnir 100%
• Estate of Unrest 130%
• City of Mist 85%
• Kurn's Tower 150%
• Permafrost 90%

*all exp bonuses in classic timeline, but should be somewhat reflective of current rates, also, i dont know OPs level range so i posted great zones for anyone who might be in OT(15-45). There are also many more alternatives that have the same exp rates. sooo. jus sayin there are options for ya.

Yes the exp is good here. Other people posting go to dungeon x y z, it's not that easy guys. Dungeon groups are hard to find, they generally are all taken up by the main guilds who are generally camping stuff for profit. You would be lucky to get into a group in places like this for exp and loot if you're outside the box (circle).

What I don't understand is opinions like this, like EQ is suppose to be a LINEAR game, when in fact players tend to do and go where they can easily exp and get groups like OT. I am sorry if it is easy for you other players to get groups in places like solA and solB. Trust me you have no idea how hard it is to get into a exp grp in these places where loot also drops, let alone just a exp group capable of keeping any camp in one these zones if you're not in one the so called top guilds.

[kenzar]

Originally Posted by Weekapaug [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I've played on the server for 3.5 years, also, and I've never seen this bard situation like it is now. Personally, I've never had any problems with them because I don't tend to play in the particular zones that they tend to kite in. And, for the record, the bard is one of my favorite classes and I love to kite...I just don't do it here because I got into other classes shortly after I rolled my bard (my first toon) and never really played it. Bards are fun to solo, they are fun to group with, and they are fun to have in groups, if they are good. Many aren't, but that's a whole other conversation.

But there is most definately a problem of late because of the sheer number of people doing it now (and the sheer number of people affected) and the sheer number of people trying to do it and failing, which is probably where most of the problems lie...Sooner or later it's going to have to be addressed. Just ignoring it because of what the posted rules say, that are 4 years old, by the way, when the topic comes up multiple times daily, is talked about constantly in-game, and has created a general disdain for an entire class as a whole, while the GMs are commenting more and more on it, is just a little naive, dontcha think?

This is going to end badly for some people and I highly doubt it's the ones you are telling to "cry harder."

I don't know what gives you the impression that anything has changed or will change, this same argument gets rehashed every few weeks for YEARS. People have always complained about bards swarm kiting; they always will and nothing has ever been done about it; what in the world makes you think this is any different? Swarm kiting is within the ruleset for outdoor zones, period.

[Buma]

Originally Posted by spoils [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Op confirmed Perun alt

I'm not Perun or whoever that player is, please try again. I'm a highly adventurous and amazing person who resides currently on P99. I don't start trouble, nor am I a hater, and I always help my fellow player out. Hell I even gave over 4k away in items to noobs a few days ago. So please don't call me someone I am not. As you know some people make threads here discussing things in a mature manor while trying to give constructive criticism, if nothing more than being anon because a lot of players like myself don't care to let others know who we are.

[Lyra]

Sometimes I wonder if you are all on a different server. The game is HUGE. Do you go looking for bards? I'm leveling a character in East Karana right now. I haven't seen another player in days.

As I've said several times, I leveled from 30 to 50 exclusively in OT on my druid (within the last 4 months). Bards were there pulling constantly. Some how I managed quite well. It's been said a bunch of times, but if a bard is annoying you ALL YOU HAVE TO DO IS SEND A POLITE TELL AND BE WILLING TO NEGOTIATE.

I think there is something else going on. Maybe it has something to do with level 30. Since it's rare new players stick around past level 30, maybe the reality of the time commitment sets in and the player becomes agitated about the time they hit OT and have to cohabitate with bards. That certainly would fit with the time line of the last big boom to hit the server and all of these bard posts. This is why I wanted the player data base someone was working on to show specific character information. My theory could be analyzed.

I leveled my cleric in Droga from 30 - 40. I formed the groups. Sure it was annoying when we just got to camp and someone bailed, but eventually I made friends with reliable, solid players who enjoy dungeons. We moved to City of Mist after.