SO.. BUSH WAS AN IDIOT??

[loramin]

Originally Posted by Tasslehofp99 [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Ps, I'm shocked OP had nothing to say bout Obama negotiating with terrorists (and freeing some of them to "return to the battlefield") in order to free an American "POW" who was allegedly actually a deserter.

Ok look we all want the Afghanistan war to end right? It's been 12+ years of fighting in a country where the guy we went in to get (Bin Laden) left like 11 years ago. Well, when wars end, countries exchange POWs; it's part of the whole winding down of hostilities process. So we're doing that now, and it's not some crazy conspiracy, it's a perfectly normal thing for countries to do when they stop fighting each other.

Also, while the dude wandered off base and certainly violated his orders, he'd done it a few times before and had always come back. Now I don't know military law, but if they didn't kick him out those times, it can't be that bad of an offense. I'm not saying he wasn't a dumb fuck; when you're in the military you follow orders. Still, it's not like he went to go fight for the other side or something, so calling him a deserter is a bit off. Plus, America takes care of its own and all that jazz: if a soldier fucks up and then becomes a POW, we still rescue him ... we just court martial his ass afterwards.

Also, there were no "terrorists" freed. I know the word has become synonymous with "anyone we don't like", but that's not its real meaning. Allow me to break it down: Osama bin Laden was a terrorist. Al Quaida is made up of terrorists. The Taliban is a government (a government full of crazy chauvinistic assholes, but a government none the less). That government refused to help us catch terrorists, but members of that government are still politicians, or generals or whatever it is they are; they are not terrorists. Terrorists blow shit up; these guys just pass laws outlawing music and female skin-showing.

So look, I'll be the first guy to pile shit on Obama for everything he's done, but if you're going to hassle him least do it over something that matters like the NSA spying. Swapping POWs (even if one of them left base without permission) as a war ends is not a reason to hate on the guy.

[phacemeltar]

Originally Posted by Jfertal [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

does anyone else i this thread vote?

i voted for obama the second time around

[Tasslehofp99]

I would say you have made a point about the Taliban guys we freed. I don't know shit about them or who they were/why they were detained. I believe I read somewhere that some were convicted of war crimes. Either way though I'm pretty uncomfortable with us releasing 5 "bad guys" in exchange for one soldier who has a history of dereliction of duty. I don't know, this situation seems pretty damn muddy. The Afghan president even criticised the decision to free these guys, maybe they were just political enemies of his? Lol

My main concern is the precedent that has now been set by this "prisoner swap" and the potential danger our soldiers face overseas if enemy combatants know all they have to do to get their buddies out of jail is capture a soldier.

Desertion is usually the word to describe someone who has abandoned their duties/post without permission though, right? Isn't that also exactly what this guy did?

[phacemeltar]

Originally Posted by loramin [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Also, there were no "terrorists" freed.

i know i dont speak for everyone, but my whole issue with this is the whole 5:1 deal. its basically a statement saying that 5 afghans is equal in value to 1 american.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LLBSE5kzM7o

[phacemeltar]

whoops.. here: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LLBSE5kzM7o#t=154

[phacemeltar]

Originally Posted by BigHurb99 [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

its not possible for that to affect our population in any significant way. no one cares. wait until religious crazies from either side embrace science and build a superbug ala the stand

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[Messianic]

Most politicians are basically pseudo-sociopaths who are willing to do whatever it takes to achieve their own shortsighted political ends.

Be agorist.

[Nuggie]

Originally Posted by radditsu [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

That shit was a cheney construct if I ever heard of one.


I tell you what right wing. Get over your conservative christian worldview and start to treat humans like things that deserve respect and compassion. I could really get behind a fiscally sound socially progressive party.

I wish more people would realize Libertarians fit this bill.

[Nuggie]

Originally Posted by loramin [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Can't we all just agree that both parties are horrible? I don't care about your politics, if you have half a brain you've got to admit that Bush was a moron ... but at the same time you also have to admit that Obama's positions are indistinguishable from Bush's on many (most?) important issues.

Both parties are completely corrupt, and if you think otherwise you haven't been paying attention. Sure one side might be a little better than the other on any given issue, but until we take the money out of politics both are going to represent the interests of the rich and not of America.

Vote 3rd party in 2014!

I agree with you on most parts.

However, what if they had found WMD in Iraq? Wouldn't he have been hailed as a hero? A savior of... somebody? Probably not the USA(how they going to realistically get it to us?), but somebody.

[Nuggie]

Originally Posted by phacemeltar [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

i voted for obama the second time around

If we are admitting sins... I voted for Reid last time... because his opponent(Sharon Angle) was a religious zealot that scared the pants off me. Seriously, listening to her gave me the creeps.