Best 4 person all caster/priest group - Page 332

Gloomlord · #**3311** 09-17-2022, 06:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PatChapp [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Let's get this to 5000pages

Actually, let's not.

God, it's mentally exhausting talking with this guy. But I suppose that's the point, isn't it?

His insanity is a wonderful boon for him. As soon as we tire of him, he'll mentally proclaim "I won this argument fair and square".

Troxx · #**3312** 09-17-2022, 06:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gloomlord [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

You know what? Just let him have the win

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Nah I’m really enjoying this. Every time he copies and pastes that long ass drivel of a post with the preface plea to the silent masses to ignore the all the trolls … followed by the listing of literally all the other people actually reading the thread …

My heart is like …

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… because it reinforces that we have already won.

DeathsSilkyMist · #**3313** 09-17-2022, 09:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PlsNoBan [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Short circuited him back into copy pasting cause he has no counter point to what I'm saying lol. He either doesn't believe we're all trolls and keeps using that label to dismiss our arguments OR he DOES believe we're all trolls but still posts 1100 times in direct response to troll posts. Those are literally the only 2 options and neither of them is good for DSM. Makes him look extremely foolish either way. Backed into a corner he resorts to copy pasting nonsense again lol

I am not sure how you got me. You have yet to disprove anything in that post. Trolling doesn't count unfortunately.

All I can do is repost the facts because you can't be bothered to do anything other than troll.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gloomlord [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Actually, let's not.

God, it's mentally exhausting talking with this guy. But I suppose that's the point, isn't it?

His insanity is a wonderful boon for him. As soon as we tire of him, he'll mentally proclaim "I won this argument fair and square".

You really have this strange idea I am trying to "win". I am just keeping the facts from being drowned out by trolls like yourself. You can stop posting or prove me wrong via evidence at any time.

DeathsSilkyMist · #**3314** 09-17-2022, 09:22 AM

Please ignore PlsNoBan, Troxx, Cyxthryth, Gloomlord, Karanis, Toxigen, Ripqozko, cd288, and Chortles Snortles in this thread. They are just trolling. They have accumulated over 1000 posts that are literally just memes and insults between them. They shouldn't since this isn't RnF, but they seem to enjoy being silly in this thread.

Reposting the current state of the discussion:

Thanks for the logs Allishia! It is much easier to do parsing this way. Based on the logs the Epic Pet is doing 80-90 DPS. For strong manning the argument, I will use a 90 DPS parse that also had a good number of damage shield hits. This is a mana dumping situation, not a situation where you are conserving mana between fights:

======Mage DPS Parse======

In the logs the pet is confirmed to have Burnout IV and a Muzzle.

Pet DPS Parse:

Pet Damage: 3805 in 42 seconds = 90.6 DPS

Scars of Sigil Parse:

Scars of Sigil Damage: 3150 in 42 seconds = 75 DPS

======Epic Mage DPS No Damage Shield======

3805 in 42 seconds = 90.6 DPS

3150 in 42 seconds = 75 DPS for 1225 mana in 14 seconds (no specialization bonus due to spell being Evocation) 1225 - 200 mana from meditate = 1025 mana lost in the minute.

6955 in 42 seconds = 165.6 DPS

======Shaman DPS Parse======

In the logs the pet is confirmed to have Celerity, Maniacal Strength, and Focus of Spirit.

Pet DPS Parse:

Pet Damage: 940 in 42 seconds = 22.4 DPS

Bane of Nife Damage: 150 + (214 x 6) = 1434 for 425 mana in 5 seconds

Ice Strike Damage : 675 x 4 = 2700 for 1000 mana in 28 seconds

======Shaman DPS No Damage Shield======

940 in 42 seconds = 22.4 DPS

4134 in 42 seconds = 98.4 DPS for 1425 mana - 416 mana cannibalized back (Torpor specialization bonus) in 27 seconds = 1009 mana lost in the minute.

5074 in 42 seconds = 120.8 DPS

======DPS Difference without Damage Shield======

Difference without Damage Shield = 165.6 DPS - 120.8 DPS = 44.8 DPS while both the Shaman and Mage spend 1000 mana total

======Damage Shield======

Damage Shield Parse:

======DPS Difference with Damage Shield======

Subtracting 11 from the Damage Shield number. The assumption is there will be an Enchanter in the party, which means you will always have a minimum damage shield of 11 via Feedback.

DPS added by damage shield, assuming Epic Pet is Tanking: (50 - 11) x 24 / 42 = 22.3 DPS

DPS added by damage shield on slowed mob, assuming Epic Pet is Tanking: (50 - 11) x (24 * 0.3) / 42 = 6.7 DPS

DPS added by cast damage shield, assuming Epic Pet is not Tanking: (33 - 11) x 24 / 42 = 12.5 DPS

DPS added by cast damage shield on slowed mob, assuming Epic Pet is not Tanking: (33 - 11) x (24 * 0.3) / 42 = 3.8 DPS

Difference with Damage Shield = 48.6-67.1 DPS, depending on slow/tanking situation.

======DPS Difference in the Four Man Group======

The two groups are going to be Enchanter/Enchanter/Cleric/Shaman and Enchanter/Enchanter/Cleric/Mage.

According to Troxx's data, the average DPS a level 47 charmed pet with Enchanter haste and a Torch was doing 86 DPS.

If two Enchanters are in the group, the DPS is 86 (Enchanter) + 86 (Enchanter) + 120.8 (Shaman) + 6.3 (Enchanter Damage Shield) = 299.1 DPS

If two Enchanters are in the group, the DPS is 86 (Enchanter) + 86 (Enchanter) + 165.6 (Mage) + 18.8 (Mage Damage Shield) = 356.4 DPS with a Shaman.

DPS Difference in the Four Man Group = 57.3 DPS

======DPS Breakpoints in the Four Man Group======

This is assuming the group is killing a mob with 8000 HP. The mob in the Mage parse had 8000 HP when you include the damage shield damage.

8000 HP / 299.1 DPS = 26.75 seconds per kill.

8000 HP / 356.4 DPS = 22.45 seconds per kill.

DPS Difference in kill speed = 4.3 seconds

It turns out both sides were right. At least Epic Mages are doing higher DPS than Troxx's data, but the extra DPS doesn't really matter when looking at the breakpoints.

For reference, Fungi King has 17750 HP according to the wiki. That means a group with a Shaman is killing him in 59.3 seconds, and a group with a mage is killing him in 49.8 seconds. That means you are saving a grand total of 9.5 seconds per Fungi King/PH kill. You would kill Fungi King (1620 seconds respawn / 9.5 second saved) = 170 times in a row to get an extra spawn. That is 85 hours continuously camping the mob.

We don't have raw log data for a focused level 60 water pet, which will be much more common. Therefore I cannot currently confirm the DPS difference between a normal Mage and an Epic Mage. Right now Troxx's data is all we have for the level 60 Water Pet, which is lower than the Epic Pet.

It is up to the reader to decide if they think 4.3 seconds per kill is worth losing all the utility a Shaman has to offer. This is if choosing an Epic Mage over a Shaman in a four man group where you are choosing between Enchanter/Enchanter/Cleric/Mage or Enchanter/Enchanter/Cleric/Shaman.

I do agree with OP's choice of Necromancer/Enchanter/Shaman/Mage. With this combination you have maximum access to all camps via these classes utility, while hitting the DPS threshold. You could level up a pocket cleric for easier resing and CHing if you desire, you only need to level it to 49 for 90% res and CH.

Toxigen · #**3315** 09-17-2022, 09:44 AM

jesus christ DSM

Gloomlord · #**3316** 09-17-2022, 09:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DeathsSilkyMist [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Please ignore PlsNoBan, Troxx, Cyxthryth, Gloomlord, Karanis, Toxigen, Ripqozko, cd288, and Chortles Snortles in this thread. They are just trolling.

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Utter lunatic!

Troxx · #**3317** 09-17-2022, 10:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DeathsSilkyMist [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Please ignore PlsNoBan, Troxx, Cyxthryth, Gloomlord, Karanis, Toxigen, Ripqozko, cd288….

Quote:

Originally Posted by Troxx [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Nah I’m really enjoying this. Every time he copies and pastes that long ass drivel of a post with the preface plea to the silent masses to ignore the all the trolls … followed by the listing of literally all the other people actually reading the thread …

My heart is like …

[You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

… because it reinforces that we have already won.

Toxigen · #**3318** 09-17-2022, 11:07 AM

beep beep boop short circuit copy paste

DeathsSilkyMist · #**3319** 09-17-2022, 11:23 AM

You have lost so completely you have to keep posting that you "won" to reassure yourself. Yikes.

You should win with facts and logic instead. Sadly, trolling is all you have been doing, so nothing has been accomplished on your part. My data still stands.

cyxthryth · #**3320** 09-17-2022, 11:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DeathsSilkyMist [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

You have lost so completely you have to keep posting that you "won" to reassure yourself. Yikes.

You should win with facts and logic instead. Sadly, trolling is all you have been doing, so nothing has been accomplished on your part. My data still stands.

The above Quote is simply an example of you sharing that it is your opinion that another poster has "lost so completely they have to keep posting that they 'won' to reassure themself" and that you believe that they "should win with facts and logic", but you believe that "all they have been doing is trolling" - which you have not provided the definition for - and that you believe that "your data still stands"; which - of course - are simply your opinions hehe. [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

For the sake of civil discussion can you please provide the definitions that you are using for "trolling" and "stands"? [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

You tried to claim:

Quote:

Originally Posted by DeathsSilkyMist [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Assuming your group plays correctly, you will DPS the same way every time, the same as if you were solo.

and then you simply contradicted yourself by subsequently posting:

Quote:

Originally Posted by DeathsSilkyMist [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

in a group setting, there are too many variables out of your control that can skew the data

Quote:

Originally Posted by DeathsSilkyMist [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Once you add in outside variables, that changes the DPS equation NOT because of what the class can do, but because of what other players are doing.

Your post claiming Troxx's data was way different from Allishia's:

Quote:

Originally Posted by DeathsSilkyMist [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Also Allishia's numbers were way different from yours

Your post to Allishia when they provided their initial data:

Quote:

Originally Posted by DeathsSilkyMist [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Thanks for the data! I'll get the logs from you a bit later today. Just looking at it here, the numbers are the same as Troxx's data.

As I have repeatedly stated to you - it is not always clear to other posters what particular position/claim/"argument" you are defending at any given time due to how often you have moved the goalposts & edited your posts. This really isn't hard hehe. [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Which belief do you currently hold/"argue" hehe? [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.] Please elaborate for the sake of civil discussion.