Do you believe in fatalism or free will?

[Lune]

Originally Posted by NopeNopeNopeNope [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

ItÂ’s probably moreso the ASD making you quiet and shy IRL than anything else. ThatÂ’s pretty common. Def some benefits though from ASD in terms of your thinking and ability to dial in

I am also a Christian like you, and one thing you could try is going to Church? In most Christian churches they force us to socialize and greet one another with a handshake and saying “God’s peace” to everyone around you at the start of every congregation

If you want to continue to meet people a lot of Christian churches do a singles group sometimes after their sermons. Or you can do volunteering. For example IÂ’ve built beds for low income families who had kids sleeping on the floor with a church group of about 20 people. It was fun!

Forcing people who actually have ASD to socialize solely on others' terms is counterproductive and leads to autistic burnout. People with ASD never habituate, they simply become better at masking, most uncomfortable situations for them will never become second-nature. This is one of the reasons suicide is the leading cause of "preventable" death for autistic people and why one of the hallmarks for a diagnosis of high functioning autism is cycles of growth and implosion centered around major life milestones. Mask, unravel, decompensate, implode, repeat, often early in college or early in their first 'real job'.

That being said I imagine church would be as good a place as any for him to do some socializing without overloading.

I see a lot of shy, 'introverted', or socially inept people who say "Fuck it, I don't need anyone else, I'm happy being alone and that's what I will do". What they don't know is that no matter who you are, if you have a human brain, lack of social stimulation is as bad for your neurological health as pretty much anything. The neurological and cardiovascular risks of social isolation rival those of smoking, even in the absence of subjective report of loneliness. Additionally, if you subjectively report loneliness, even in the absence of social isolation, the outcomes are just as bad.

Like the rest of our body, our nervous systems are very much 'use-it-or-lose-it', and we devote an immense amount of our white and gray matter to everything that goes into socializing, from fast and accurate interpretation of nonverbal and context clues, to navigating social relationships, all while integrating these things into a robust and accurate theory of mind.

So autistic people in particular are doubly fucked because they are born with a deep flaw in those functions that they can never actually fix. With great effort, the sharp ones can learn to mask and function, but it will always be more effortful for them to function at a level that is normal for non-ASD individuals. And then if they withdraw entirely, their brains atrophy.

[shovelquest]

Now do incels.

[Lune]

Originally Posted by shovelquest [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Now do incels.

p sure the ASD / incel venn diagram is a circle

Though I'm convinced the reason so many neurodivergent people are around, genetically, is because before civilization they could have dialed in and picked a lot of fucking berries, or invented a water wheel or something and thus would have been admitted to the gangbang

[NopeNopeNopeNope]

Originally Posted by Lune [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Forcing people who actually have ASD to socialize solely on others' terms is counterproductive and leads to autistic burnout. People with ASD never habituate, they simply become better at masking

Source? And am I obligated to find many to the contrary? I have a cousin who was very obviously ASD and my uncle his adoptive father forced him to socialize and he went from having no friends to graduating college, working many diff jobs, and now having his first gf and relationship at around 23ish now

God damn that’s some good masking broheim, he has to do it like all day. Or maybe

Just maybe

He got better at socializing and learned how to self-soothe. ASD doesn’t mean socially stunted for life, and maybe telling people that could be seen as very disempowering. But common from people on the left, remember the crusade to convince black people they have no shot because of systemic systems?

[rest I skimmed but agree]

So autistic people in particular are doubly fucked because they are born with a deep flaw in those functions that they can never actually fix. With great effort, the sharp ones can learn to mask and function, but it will always be more effortful for them to function at a level that is normal for non-ASD individuals. And then if they withdraw entirely, their brains atrophy.

With no source cited and again, I’m sure I could find sources to the contrary if you want to go back and forth for a while. Regardless, is is far better to encourage the possibility of growth and participation than it is to disempower with cynical pseudoscience

It is harder, it will remain harder than a neurotypical person. Leave it at that because anything more rigid, like I said, is just cynical pseudoscience pessimism

[Reiwa]

Originally Posted by Lune [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Scientifically, we don't really know yet. At scales larger than subatomic particles, things generally work deterministically, that is, acting in an intricate and unbroken chain of causality stretching back to the Big Bang. Everything you have ever done or ever will do was determined at the instant of creation.

Quantum mechanics revealed some qualities of the universe that appear to behave probabilistically. There was a huge debate between Einstein and the determinists on one side and Niels Bohr and the quantum mechanics/randomness kooks on the other (this is where Einstein's "God Does Not Play Dice" quote came from. Most scientists these days lean toward randomness being real but there are still things like hidden variables theories (the guys who won the Nobel prize in Physics in 2022 won it for dunking on these hidden variables people).

There are still holdouts in the determinism camp, like superdeterminism, which basically argues there is an underlying deterministic godhand behind every supposedly 'random' result. This is probably unfalsifiable and is closer to a religion than a scientific theory.

So if probability is a real quality of the universe, it is very much possible that you actually have free will, that you are actually making your own decisions-- but it feels unlikely and I'll explain a few oblique ways it could be possible:

1. Orchestrated Objective Reduction: Argues that the microtubules in the neurons of your central nervous system bridge our consciousness with the quantum realm, and allow us to collapse wave functions as a singular entity to create our objective reality and essentially act as a quantum computer. Seems like mystical woo-woo shit right? Well consider that 100 years later we still have no fucking idea how general anesthesia works, we can't find a mechanism anywhere in the cells of our brain. But a few interesting studies in the last few years have found a connection to microtubules. Most consider this theory to be bullshit.

2. Allegory of the Cave, or Idealism: We entirely create or singularly experience our own reality, like a stream of data into a receiver. At the instant of observation, when the wave function collapses, and a pixel of the universe transforms from a wave function (data), to a particle (reality), it provides its 'causal history' contained within the wave (in the form of its energy, direction, amplitude etc). Was any of it actually real?

Einstein, questioning the apparent absurdity of quantum mechanical explanations for reality, famously was like "So you're saying the moon isn't there when I'm not observing it?". And the quantum mechanics/randomness people were like "You can't prove that it is". And they were right. Our observations, or at least the objective collapse of a wave function, have the power to ret-con their own history through time. This can also be explained as: they are neither a particle or a wave, they are nothing at all until we create/observe them. Indistinguishable from the fabric of the universe and reality.

In this paradigm, reality is nothing more than a stream of data, and we make real choices with our free will, and the stream constructs a plausible deterministic history. This would have some power in explaining things like synchronicities and the collective unconscious, basically themes in the fabric of the dream. (Interestingly, this idea came from a collaboration between Carl Jung, an analytic psychologist, and Wolfgang Pauli, one of the originators of quantum mechanics, both mystics).

Basically:

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Post war scientists are all on the skooma.

[Reiwa]

Originally Posted by Lune [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I think wage slave more implies non-meaningful work that doesn't bring fulfillment to your life, to some people that even means being a doctor (high suicide rate when they find out what the job actually is, basically a 7 minute assembly line for some healthcare corp).

The complaint is more as follows: Even if you're insanely skilled and competent, and work hard, there are very few paths to financial independence and fulfillment that don't involve being a toadie in some CEO's downline. Yes, if you excel in your work, you are able to leverage a larger piece of the pie for yourself, but as long as you are an employee and not an owner, most of the proceeds of your excellence are just going into someone's yacht fund. Fast forward 30 years, the vast majority of people have spent 10 hours a day 5 days a week carving out enough for themselves that yea, they've been able to kinda enjoy life, go on some vacations, buy a house, have some kids.

When you look in the backend you see that their zeal and drive to carve out a life for themselves was channeled into fuel for capitalism, for someone else's benefit. You were allowed to keep a hefty portion for yourself, but not without kicking up to the guy at the top of the pyramid. Very, very few people have the capacity to subvert this process.

In life, there is no way around having to work to earn your freedom, even if you work for yourself (unless you were born with money). I'm sure there are plenty of dropouts who do so out of laziness or just being too stupid, but I'd also argue that opting out on ideological terms can be a valid and honorable choice. On the other side of it, hustle culture is fucking insufferable.

What would Jesus do?

The valuation and growth of CEO stock compensation has nearly nothing to do with the day-to-day activities of the business. Nothing is stolen.

[NopeNopeNopeNope]

Originally Posted by Reiwa [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Post war scientists are all on the skooma.

Doubt it’s even science

I doubt any licensed counselor who specializes in ASD leads (even to the parent) with “well your socially stunted child will never improve their social skills. But maybe we can teach them to mask their lack of improvement for the rest of their life”

Outcomes you believe, to some extent you can create

[Reiwa]

Originally Posted by SorenVC [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I don't believe in your over-complicated intellect science nonsense! Real enthusiasts know that earth is flat! The proof is all over reddit on globeskepticism.
https://www.reddit.com/r/globeskepticism/

Yes, I am hereby exposing myself, SorenVC, as a flat earther! I have researched this good enough and I am 100% certain that the surface of earth is flat as your eyes can see it. Mountains of evidence are to be found on this subreddit. Even if you don't believe it, just leave a mean comment like a normal person on those posts, or open your eyes and realize the truth that earth is flat.

It is like a GTA map, flat plain surface with some mountains and buildings. All proof is on globeskepticism and I will not debate on this because it is useless. If you are a glober or globie, you will continue to believe the NASA lies. Let me tell you, these lizard people are very real, the lizard peepul are among us, and they are hiding in high positions of government! That's why the world goes to shit right now. So keep believing in your magic free will, or come to the dark side and realize the truth that earth is flat. Your choice. Or is it?

Everyone mainstream is a flat earther bud

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[Reiwa]

Jib should we hit him with Lil' Timmy Boom-Boom's self-elegy?

[NopeNopeNopeNope]

One of the signs that my cousin had (and diagnosed) ASD, until he was in his late teens when he was done talking he was done. You could be in mid-sentence and if he’s done, he’s leaving. And you’d be left trailing off like “welp that’s that then”

It wasn’t that he was mad. Or even disappointed. He was just done. He also used to do the intense out of context ASD stare

Luckily his warped stunted brain learned how to stop doing that. Sorry I mean mask it. And now in conversation most people can’t even spot his mask, because his facial expression and mannerisms have completely changed with a decade of forced daily hours of practice with peers

Maybe we need to euthanize him and put his brain under a microscope, for science. Jk [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]