Discussion: Play Nice (Training, Bind Camping)

[lethdar]

Originally Posted by Envious [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Nobody told you? Sullon was where all the social rejects that nobody liked ran off to. TZ had zero rules that I ever saw, except dont use racial slurs on the GMs... that got Bolaris banned. =/

I'm sure you never saw any TZ rules, being in a mid level guild you probably never were even important enough to be trained. There have been multiple examples posted by people in this thread about GM intervention on TZ. Considering the people who posted that aren't anonymous and hiding their identity while claiming to be a part of various "endgame PVE and PVP" guilds, and their stories collaborate each other...

well i guess what I'm saying here is you're probably just a lying newbie.

[lethdar]

Originally Posted by Envious [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

And VZ/TZ week no-rules for what? 1 week? Lol

Hoho zinger, you sure got me there, the months on occasion when vztz had no rules in addition to my years spent on sz, I guess the mid level guild you were in on tz certainly had more experience with a server with no GM intervention.

[Envious]

I can remember some VZ/TZ GM stating that they tried no rules, and after a week (maybe a month? Its only been a couple of years and I was not playing at the time? Lol) and all the QQ they brought them back.

I can recall people speaking of 1 guys alt monk getting banned after training PDM... which bred some of the most impressive forum and game trolls ever, as witnessed on these forums and VZ/TZ forums (Nobody forgets TZT).

And as far as hiding my name, I'm not~ Envious was the name of one of my alts on TZ, and my main on Tich, as well a char I had on the VZ/TZ emu (I dont remember which char).

Maybe this conversation we are having now is the point, I dont need to stroke my own ego. I gamed with (arguably) the best players from TZ when we moved to Tichondrius for WoW. And gamed with some of the best in Vanilla EQ. So not going into detail about guilds I was in, or what we have done, and having you babble on and on about how it somehow makes my posts less relevant doesnt really bother me at all.

Whereas you... well, you need some stroking pal. Find a woman?

[Envious]

Originally Posted by lethdar [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

well i guess what I'm saying here is you're probably just a lying newbie.

I'm kinda like KBTrader in this sense... I have stories so fantastic they gotta be lies. But arent. Lol

And go to the TZ server post, I knew as many if not more people in EQ Vanilla than most of the people posting in that thread. Save for Searyx / Xant, I'm sure those 2 could flood a list of PDM members. But the people I listed are, for the most part, (well, were) pals.

I just dont have to validate myself with your opinion, unlike you need to do with other people's opinions and YT~

[lethdar]

You see the problem here is pal, you've mentioned your high end guild pve / pvp experience multiple times throughout the thread, and now are adding in garbage wow and fantastic stories. It sure looks like you just tried to validate yourself loololol.

But keep on telling yourself that somehow I'm the one trying to give meaning to my opinions by referencing your past guilds and that you've "gamed with some of the best in vanilla EQ," "~".

It looks like to me that you've realized your arguments don't make sense and that your only hope is to try and distance yourself from the actual arguments. Again, in an easy format because I realize you may have some difficulties with this:

-Training is policable, intent isn't impossible to derive unless you're an autistic video game nerd, it's actually laughably insulting to GMs that you don't believe they couldn't figure out whats going on when a bard and cleric come selo da training a raid zone.

-No Rules about training murders populations, see the periods of vztz where training was legal and all of sullon zek.

-Any time TZ's "player self enforcing" broke down, PDM or whoever would only need to mass petition to get a GM to ban the offender, meaning you actually have had no experience with a ruleless server.

-Unlike VZTZ, p99 has a much better code when it comes to pulling up logs on who agroed what, this coupled with widespread knowledge of fraps makes it fairly easy to catch train situations

-The mere existence of a rule putting a character in jeopardy is enough to deter many situations that would otherwise devolve into a train fest. Again, you may fail to understand this due to an austism spectrum disorder.

-Training does not promote PVP, your belief that guilds will evacuate rather than fight unless they get trained seems fairly naive, though it probably does stem from your past experiences in shit guilds.

[vinx]

Originally Posted by lethdar [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

-Training is policable, intent isn't impossible to derive unless you're an autistic video game nerd, it's actually laughably insulting to GMs that you don't believe they couldn't figure out whats going on when a bard and cleric come selo da training a raid zone.

-No Rules about training murders populations, see the periods of vztz where training was legal and all of sullon zek.

-Any time TZ's "player self enforcing" broke down, PDM or whoever would only need to mass petition to get a GM to ban the offender, meaning you actually have had no experience with a ruleless server.

-Unlike VZTZ, p99 has a much better code when it comes to pulling up logs on who agroed what, this coupled with widespread knowledge of fraps makes it fairly easy to catch train situations

-The mere existence of a rule putting a character in jeopardy is enough to deter many situations that would otherwise devolve into a train fest. Again, you may fail to understand this due to an austism spectrum disorder.

-Training does not promote PVP

^^

[Rushmore]

Originally Posted by lethdar

You see the problem here is pal, you've mentioned your high end guild pve / pvp experience multiple times throughout the thread, and now are adding in garbage wow and fantastic stories. It sure looks like you just tried to validate yourself loololol.

But keep on telling yourself that somehow I'm the one trying to give meaning to my opinions by referencing your past guilds and that you've "gamed with some of the best in vanilla EQ," "~".

It looks like to me that you've realized your arguments don't make sense and that your only hope is to try and distance yourself from the actual arguments. Again, in an easy format because I realize you may have some difficulties with this:

-Training is policable, intent isn't impossible to derive unless you're an autistic video game nerd, it's actually laughably insulting to GMs that you don't believe they couldn't figure out whats going on when a bard and cleric come selo da training a raid zone.

-No Rules about training murders populations, see the periods of vztz where training was legal and all of sullon zek.

-Any time TZ's "player self enforcing" broke down, PDM or whoever would only need to mass petition to get a GM to ban the offender, meaning you actually have had no experience with a ruleless server.

-Unlike VZTZ, p99 has a much better code when it comes to pulling up logs on who agroed what, this coupled with widespread knowledge of fraps makes it fairly easy to catch train situations

-The mere existence of a rule putting a character in jeopardy is enough to deter many situations that would otherwise devolve into a train fest. Again, you may fail to understand this due to an austism spectrum disorder.

-Training does not promote PVP, your belief that guilds will evacuate rather than fight unless they get trained seems fairly naive, though it probably does stem from your past experiences in shit guilds.

Game Set Match

[raptorak]

Whilst we are busy changing the classic rules please get rid of hybrid exp penalty :P

[Arshis]

Training has never been accepted on the live servers or any server as far as I know. I don’t see how it could be acceptable in the case of p99 red. What’s more important would be the consequences for training offenders. Because, regardless if training is made illegal or not someone will do it whether on accident or purposely. Does anyone remember the term ‘flagged account’ it meant you were at repeating offender, trains, exploits, foul play, griefing, and etc. If you had too many flags a ban was imminent.

[Envious]

I dont recall ever saying training promote pvp... post a link where I did? You could maybe infer it from some things I have said, maybe. I do recall saying that GM interaction based on PnP never helps because it brings in human error and the typical GM favoritism / corruption routine?

Training is not enforceable. There will always be people running into mobs on accident from PvP, people aggro'ing without knowing, and then in raid situations the "fuk it, just bring it with us we have to engage now" which should be valid imo.

As far as "player enforced" rules on TZ breaking down and someone getting a ban, there has been 1 name tossed around that I have seen. 1 guy, out of the 1500+ that played over a 4 to 5 year span. I'm sure there were more, but that does not mean that banning or even getting a warning for training was the norm.

Nobody gives a fuk about SZ, you and Macken fail to get this. That server was where all the disfunctional social rejects had to go because nobody on RZ/TZ/VZ wanted them anymore. I know 1 guy that went from TZ to SZ, and he was a bad, and could not get into any guilds because everyone knew of such. And that was after Kosta gave him a fucking RFS and he was still rejected.

Maybe your right, maybe the people that will be on R99 wont be half the community that TZ and VZ had during Classic / Kunark. Actually, you prolly are right and the R99 players will not be capable of policing themselves.

Too bad you kids need baby sitters. Thats the whole reason EQ PvP is great, the game mechanics are so open.

Who knows, maybe Uthgaard will come hold our hands for R99. Considering you caught a ban on VZ/TZ for jacking someone's gear, while my only blemish was CC'ing Roadblock and his brother / son / uncle / father / sister (whatever the fuck it was) for 5hrs and catching a 2 or 3 day suspension.