What Green WON'T have to start with

[Kapyong]

Originally Posted by Baler [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Green wont have Hand Holding it's going to be hard. More so than people even think it will be. So hard in fact it will destroy the weaker players mentally. Possibly leaving them scarred to EQ or fleeing back to blue carebear land.

Yup.
EQ's key feature - it's HARD.
And Green will be fully EQ hard - not for everyone.

But oddly, that level of difficulty is what can make it so fun and addictive - the high level of challenge and risk makes the reward much sweeter.

Early EQ experiences were usually failures and stuff-ups and many deaths and mistakes. As a newbie the world was confusing and risky and dangerous.

Even the UI was more enemy than friend; various character limits and world glitches and even bugs had to be fought. Like Rangers rooting themselves, or using a sewing kit for inventory and ... whoops.

Some will spit the dummy and leave, but for some of us that difficulty and challenge lead us on - "OK, I stuffed that up badly, but NEXT time I will carefully do this, then that...". So killing your first level 1 rat is satisfying. Heck, just making it from Qeynos to Surefall Glade alive feels good !

And surviving the mail run from Qeynos to HH after half a dozen attempts is like climbing Everest !

Of course that difficulty made EQ so social because most activities needed help - a good group in a good place was an amazing experience. I spent 25 hours non-stop in HH to level to 20 in that goblin room downstairs - huge fun, so much coffee. Iron group discipline to avoid losing the spawns.

Lost my corpse once in a bad place - high level helped me, kept my things for 3 days and gave me a bonus too. I made sure to shout out how trusty and friendly he was. EQ had a community like no other. Looking forward to East Commons Tunnel trading.

My greatest moment was solo ranger kiting Crusader Zoglic for his regen breastplate - 15 minutes on the edge on my seat, hardly breathing, every sense alert, watching for wandering monsters, counting my spells, as I ran my kiting circle round and round. I got it first time ! So difficult, so proud.

Maybe tell all your (ex) Blizzard games friends about EQ Green [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

[Deathrydar]

Originally Posted by pink grapefruit [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

?

classic eq isn't a particularly challenging game. it requires a large time investment, but i wouldn't call it difficult really.

It is extremely difficult! You can barely solo anything and if you can, it is never easy. You lose experience and your corpse upon death. No fast travel.

What are you comparing it to where you believe its not difficult? Compared to every other MMORPG that ever existed, currently exists, and will exist, it is super difficult!

[Sonark]

Originally Posted by pink grapefruit [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Don't get me wrong, I love EQ. But modern MMO raids are far more difficult than EQ raids from a skill-based perspective. EQ is "hard" in that it requires more of your time when you make a deadly mistake. These seem like very different things to me.

I have said exactly this before, when people were really prone to go out of their way to talk about how easy EQ was now and how p99 is the only real way to play and much harder.

There was much wailing and gnashing of teeth, and no one actually conceded the point by saying "urrite" but I do notice people don't really do that around here anymore.

Thank you for your sanity

[Deathrydar]

Originally Posted by pink grapefruit [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

If ability to solo is what makes a game easy, does that mean every single player game is easy? The game was intended to be played with other people, so I don't see how it being geared toward group play is supposed to make it difficult. xp loss, corpse runs, slow travel... these things are all timesinks more than they are difficult gameplay.

I would say wow pvp is more difficult than anything a pve eq server has to offer. It takes practice and developed skill to work up to a decent level, on top of the usual MMO timesinks.

Don't get me wrong, I love EQ. But modern MMO raids are far more difficult than EQ raids from a skill-based perspective. EQ is "hard" in that it requires more of your time when you make a deadly mistake. These seem like very different things to me.

I disagree. The only point you made was that raiding is easy in EQ. I wouldn't know that as I have never raided in EQ. PvP in EQ is weak, which is why there are less than 25 players on the Red server at any given time. It does require more of your time, but I wish I could record every brand new player starting in EQ with their note and trying to find their guildmaster.

[solidious77]

Originally Posted by Baler [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Green wont have Hand Holding it's going to be hard.

Starting fresh will make it more difficult because the lack of gear. This will force us to all play together rather than one trio owning half a dungeon etc etc. Taking away things like 3rd person view or the ability to re-arrange spells in a spellbook though -- are just non-logical, backward changes.

All the bandwagoners who adhear to pure classic are obviously not realizing that a ton of shit is not classic anymore. All of the exploit and bug fixes they fixed in blue such as invis pulling (obvious exploit for those who knew), AE up to only 4 targets (I believe Chardok AE grps is why they did this), the whole foot-race out of game mechanic rules they forced everyone into for raiding on blue to name a few. I'm sure theres been numerous pathing and los changes over the years -- they've been awesomly busy! I think I've read a few posts too of ppl being curious of how much CSR involvment there will be in the Green server and if VP will be FFA. Regardless, deviations are made for the greater good of everyones fun factor (Side rant: or not in a lot of cases.. i gotta say, being forced to use OBS and log everything so you can tattle-tale on another raiding guild who touched a mob after you touched it.. is fucking pathetically retarded and completly immersion-killing).

Anyway, I'm very in favor of the changes that will increase the skill ceiling, like no pet window or no tab targeting (regardless of classic or not). These will really just be an adjustment and after so long in EQ, it might be neat expierence to not have these and then play through the changes as they're introduced.

Its the no third-person mode though that is a sure fun factor killer for me. Its pretty standard these days that an MMO would use a third-person camera as it does currently on P99 Blue. While it may have been designed at launch to be first-person, as its no longer 1999, I think we can all admit that the gameplay is pretty ugly in first-person -- the left/right turns blasting past massive pixels is surely going to cause numerous headaches after hours of gameplay.

I do see a good counter argument that first-person might increase the immersion, being locked into seeing what only your toon would see, but even then, its just kinda lame to not see your whole posse in action and other people in the world around you

I mean shit, if we want to go true classic then we better be forced to be looking stright-down at the ground and nowhere else; cause i remember my computer exploading if i looked up in classic EQ..

[Kapyong]

Originally Posted by solidious77 [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Its the no third-person mode though that is a sure fun factor killer for me.

Some mis-understanding there I think [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Apparently there WILL be 3rd person view,
BUT only with F9 key, not the handy mouse-wheel scroll-out.

[solidious77]

I dont think mouselook will work though - so no moving left/right or panning around etc.

I think its pretty much just the static F9 viewpoints, or am I misunderstanding? (I hope i am haha)

[kaev]

Originally Posted by solidious77 [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I dont think mouselook will work though - so no moving left/right or panning around etc.

That would be wrong. I learned to use mouselook playing EQ, it was there from the start (or at least from July 1999 when I started playing.) Part of EQ's attraction from the point of view of the friend who got me into the game was it's use of fps-style controls which he was already familiar with.

[stewe]

Originally Posted by Baler [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Green wont have Hand Holding it's going to be hard. More so than people even think it will be. So hard in fact it will destroy the weaker players mentally. Possibly leaving them scarred to EQ or fleeing back to blue carebear land.

Calling people carebears cause they dont think like you is so grade school level but lets get to the point here, if anyone seriously thinks green is going to be hard they are kidding themselves, classic was hard cause it was new, people didnt know what quests to do, what BiS gear there was, what camps to farm, how to break some camps, etc, etc. We have 20 years of knowledge that makes classic pretty trivial, so hard green will not be, but it can still be fun if ppl just enjoy the ride and not expect this is to be as hard as real classic actually was, lets be real there are gonna be high levels with BiS gear in the first month maybe in week of the server til planes open up

[Greymantle]

I read somewhere that Splitpaw with this client isn't a low-level dungeon is this true? I was going to start in Qeynos this time but if true will pass.