Game Mechanics: Monk ability:Stonestance

[baalzy]

If I understand this correctly.

Previously, mob damage was calculated and then defensive/stonestance were reducing the end number by whatever %.

The way they should have worked (and supposedly work now, if i understand this correctly) is the mobs damage (not counting damage bonus) should be calculated, reduced by whatever % and then the damage bonus for the mob added. This is how much damage you should have taken.

Take a mob with a max damage of 100 and a minimum damage of 21. This means they have a damage bonus of 20 and a variable damage range of 1-80. They perform their attack and the calculation for their damage is performed. Let's say in this instance its a max hit so their variable damage roll is 80. The 80 gets reduced by 90% because you have stonestance up. This is 8. Their damage bonus is then added to this value and the amount of damage you take is 28.

Previously, the damage roll of 80 would have been added to the damage bonus of 20 for a total of 100 points. This 100 points of damage would then be reduced by 90%, resulting in 10 points of damage taken.

I don't know if this is how it should be, but from kanras' explanation this is how its been coded in.

Formula:
(Mob damage roll)*(1-reduction % as a decimal)+ mob damage bonus = Damage taken

Where mob damage roll is calculated using all those other fun formulas based on AC, Mob level ect....

So the math for my earlier example would be
(80)*(1-.9)+(20)=
(80)*(.1)+(20)=
8+20= 28

So in order to test to be sure stonestance is working as intended (provided my assumption on how it should be working is correct) we need to know the following:

Minimum mob damage, Maximum mob damage.

With the minimum mob damage we can figure it what it's damage bonus is. With the maximum mob damage we can figure out what its damage range is.

With this information we can then figure out the damage range you should be taking while stone stance is active.

In Rais' second log it appears that stonestance does little or nothing at all. If his mitigation is high enough that the mob is already hitting in the lower end of its damage range, then you're not going to see a very large difference in the amount of damage you take once activating stonestance, because the majority of the damage being generated by each attack is attributed to the mobs damage bonus which doesn't get reduced by stonestance.

[Azzbad]

Originally Posted by baalzy [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

If I understand this correctly.

Previously, mob damage was calculated and then defensive/stonestance were reducing the end number by whatever %.

The way they should have worked (and supposedly work now, if i understand this correctly) is the mobs damage (not counting damage bonus) should be calculated, reduced by whatever % and then the damage bonus for the mob added. This is how much damage you should have taken.

Take a mob with a max damage of 100 and a minimum damage of 21. This means they have a damage bonus of 20 and a variable damage range of 1-80. They perform their attack and the calculation for their damage is performed. Let's say in this instance its a max hit so their variable damage roll is 80. The 80 gets reduced by 90% because you have stonestance up. This is 8. Their damage bonus is then added to this value and the amount of damage you take is 28.

Previously, the damage roll of 80 would have been added to the damage bonus of 20 for a total of 100 points. This 100 points of damage would then be reduced by 90%, resulting in 10 points of damage taken.

I don't know if this is how it should be, but from kanras' explanation this is how its been coded in.

Formula:
(Mob damage roll)*(1-reduction % as a decimal)+ mob damage bonus = Damage taken

Where mob damage roll is calculated using all those other fun formulas based on AC, Mob level ect....

So the math for my earlier example would be
(80)*(1-.9)+(20)=
(80)*(.1)+(20)=
8+20= 28

So in order to test to be sure stonestance is working as intended (provided my assumption on how it should be working is correct) we need to know the following:

Minimum mob damage, Maximum mob damage.

With the minimum mob damage we can figure it what it's damage bonus is. With the maximum mob damage we can figure out what its damage range is.

With this information we can then figure out the damage range you should be taking while stone stance is active.

In Rais' second log it appears that stonestance does little or nothing at all. If his mitigation is high enough that the mob is already hitting in the lower end of its damage range, then you're not going to see a very large difference in the amount of damage you take once activating stonestance, because the majority of the damage being generated by each attack is attributed to the mobs damage bonus which doesn't get reduced by stonestance.

Exactly. The stonestance disc has historically been the #1 monk discipline. It was & is used to position NPCs in zones like Kael and NTOV (and beyond) into corner positions. Also notice my picture (linked again) of what NPC special attacks are doing when stonestance is active. Stonestance is actually boosting NPC special attack dmg to its regular minimum melee hit unless anyone has ever seen a random blue con in howling stones bash for 46.









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[baalzy]

Looks like stonestance could be causing the NPCs bonus dmg to be added to all attacks instead of just primary hand attacks. This could cause you to get your ass handed to you if you stonestanced against a dual-wielding mob as their off-hand would be getting a damage bonus that it normally wouldn't.

As far as positioning against NTOV and Kael raid mobs. Well, stone stance would be reducing their damage by a huge amount because those mobs are going to be hitting for the high end of their variable damage range frequently against a monk which means the bulk of the mobs damage potential will be reduced by stonestance.

Once again, I'm just interpretting how I believe it's implemented here. This implementation would be based on how Kanras feels stonestance should work. If you feel that stonestance should be reducing total mob damage instead of mob damage before-bonus then you need to find some period specific evidence to prove this.

[baalzy]

from: http://www.monkly-business.net/forum...ead.php?t=8646
"....
So, Cazic Thule can hit for 220, 240, 260, ..., 580, or 600.
....
The way Defensive works is it multiplies DI by 0.5

The Monk Stonestance discipline multiplies DI by 0.1 (too bad it only lasts 12sec eh?)

This puts the min hit at DB + DI *0.5, and the max hit at DB + 20*DI*0.5

So CT could hit for 210, 220, 230, ..., 390, or 400 with Defensive up"

I don't use the same terminology, but according to this post what I described above is how stonestance/defensive SHOULD work. its mob damage bonus + mob damage range(modified by stonestance/defensive %) is the amount of damage you should be taking.

The bug which appears to be manifest in this change is that the mobs damage bonus is being added to mob special attacks when it shouldn't be.

[kanras]

baalzy doing good work here. Only thing to correct:

Originally Posted by baalzy [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

The bug which appears to be manifest in this change is that the mobs damage bonus is being added to mob special attacks when it shouldn't be.

From last patch notes:

Kanras: Fixed NPC kick/bash damage.

Kick/bash damage basically can't be mitigated due to its damage range being DB to DB+10 (for most NPCs)

[Azzbad]

isnt a 46 dmg bash way too much?

[Structures_Fall]

Originally Posted by kanras [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

baalzy doing good work here.

/salute

[Aadill]

Here's a question: Stonestance may be operating correctly but are mob damage bonuses in the correct range? I.E. were mobs tuned to match their original base damage and bonus damage or were the values simply matched to their overall damage? If it's the latter, damage bonuses may be set too high because the base damage is set too low, causing stonestance to appear broken.

[Versus]

Love you Baalzy <3

[kanras]

Yeah, NPC damage bonuses were too high for a large portion of 30+ trash mobs. Should be more reasonable, pending update.