Raid Scene Poll

[August]

I didn't select 'no poopsocking' because I believe that you're addressing something that has a 'boundary' and you'd just be pushing the boundary back. If you can't log toons out at spawn point, then people will just log toons out at whatever boundary you propose.

This could be negative to casuals in the sense that now you've got people training (maybe not intentionally) to get to where you are. Also, where is that boundary going to be? How far do you extend a 'poopsock' radius? Am I safe @ Juggs for Trak? I'd hate to be killing juggs and teleported out because i'm 'too close'.

IMO the only way to prevent poopsocking is for everyone to have a chance at the mob. Simultaneous repops + time-delayed engagement rules would be great. However, I don't think that making it only for the next spawn would do anything than allow the major spawns to be toggled on and off by the top two guilds.

I'd propose a decay function of time-delay - simple really like 2/n - where n is the number of spawns since last taken down by your group. Hardcode the values so it's not too fine grained but:

So, you kill Trak.

Next spawn: wait 2 hours
Next spawn: wait 1 hour
Next spawn: wait 45 minutes
Next spawn: wait 30 minutes
Next spawn: wait 15 minutes
Next spawn: No restriction

With this methodology there would be 5 guilds 'in-line' for the kill. The time restrictions are such that it would be extremely feasible for guilds to 'lose out' their spot (competition, hooray) because they wiped, or they were slow to mobilize. However, they'd still sit at a low delay and the guild that mobilized more quickly would be bumped back to 2 hours.

This also virtually guarantees that no guild can lock down all the targets. If you're at 2 hours, even 1 hour, your chances of the other 3 waiting guilds (who have proven to be able to get the target previously) and the other un-restircted guilds not downing the mob are pretty slim.

This would still apply pressure to be able to mobilize quickly and down the target in a clean manner, and enforces a kind of 'turn-based' system.

I'd be happy to help implement it as well. I have played on this server for several years now with no real intent on raiding because of how FUBAR'ed it is. Let's hope something good can come of this.

[Daysprung]

Originally Posted by webrunner5 [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Well spoken. But you have to admit TMO has had crap sewed up for a LONG time. Too long.

I don't blame TMO though, content has been stagnant for 3 years, what else is going to happen unless people just quit?

[Scoresby]

Originally Posted by Daysprung [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I don't blame TMO though, content has been stagnant for 3 years, what else is going to happen unless people just quit?

I hear what you're saying, but on live there was certainly a different take on hardcore raiding. Guilds at the top typically backed off lower tier raid targets and at least let the server have some scraps. It would be one thing if TMO was focused on VP (hell, even Trak to lock more people OUT of VP), but they have felt the need to monopolize most of the content all the way back to Nagafen and Vox with an alt army that just isn't a real option for most of the server. Then sell the spoils of this for insane amounts of cash to rub it in our faces.

It doesn't take a genius to figure out this is toxic.

I think the heart of the request from Rogean was for us to quit being dicks to one another across the board though. Empathy goes a long way. Feels good man.

[Scoresby]

Originally Posted by Krissdu64 [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

No. It has never been this way, sorry. Hardcore players were monopolizing the end stuff until the next expansion... but at the time, expansion were released every 6 months, that's the difference.

Stop inventing the past lol, Kunark is out. You can now camp Frenzy and Effreti. You wanna go to VP? Wait for Velious or grow some balls.

Actually, that wasn't the case. On Veeshan and (later Luclin) I never recall top tier guilds stepping back to camp such elite mobs as Dracoliche, Nagafen, and Vox in Kunark. And yes, I played since launch. In fact, it wasn't terribly uncommon to see dragons up for good chunks of time (hours even) while people assembled.

Pump yourself up if you want, but that WAS REALITY!

It has nothing to do with balls...merely time. Again, it's toxic behavior. There's a reason there was so much vitriol against TMO recently. I'm not saying it's right, just explaining where it comes from and hoping one day such egotism and chest thumping (as you apparently have) can be set aside.

I hardly play and don't expect a damn thing because of it. But for the sake of the server, it's worth stating that monopolization of content isn't healthy nor really that classic.

[pharmakos]

Originally Posted by Daysprung [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Too much whining and crying, time for a server split. All you carebears can go into carebear-land and then you'll probably whine when you get out-carebear'd. You get out what you put in. Try harder or settle, its really your choice.

you mean people that enjoy tracksocking for 48+ hours so that they can get FTE on a 45 second fight can have their own server?

k.

[Aaron]

Originally Posted by Daysprung [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Too much whining and crying, time for a server split. All you carebears can go into carebear-land and then you'll probably whine when you get out-carebear'd. You get out what you put in. Try harder or settle, its really your choice.

It appears this entire discussion is over your head.

[TAllen82]

I wish people would just shut the hell up and realize there is no solution to this problem. There will always be someone stronger, bigger, faster, more organized than you. Always. TMO was it...may still be it...who knows. Im glad you guys reorganized...for the record. There are lots of very good TMO members, good people, who I have enjoyed knowing, I dont hate your guild. What you are asking though, in a very very generalized sense, is for our VOLUNTEER, guides, GMs, Devs.....the list goes on......to give up pretty much all of their real world lives, to police the state of our raid scene. Without such policing there will ALWAYS be a top dog, because that's the way things work. It's life, and life in pixel form is still life. Can't be fought, can't be worked around. I read all the posts (god there were so many) on the TMO exploit thread.....and all I could think was....WOW. How do you guys NOT believe this will always be an issue. Reduce variance....zerg guilds just camp harder. Increase Variance....zerg guilds just camp longer. Enforce a rotation? Zerg guilds spread their alts into other guilds, new names, same times, same strategy. There is no viable solution. The people who run this server (and I love you guys, you do a damn good job) are volunteers, they profit nothing from the time they put in. Let....Shit...Be. If you want a raid mob, tag along. If your guild wants to co-raid....ASK.
We are all grown people, I think...most of us. This is just a game, we all..or most of us...want to excel at the games we play, I'm sure. Mediocrity is noones benchmark. However, not all of us will be willing to put in the time and ridiculous effort required to hold that top slot. If you are a casual player, be casual...casually ask if you can raid with someone. If you are a hardcore poop in a sock take liquids intravenous player..more power to you, wish I could live your life. Why is this such a big issue. We SHOULD mostly be adults, with lives that matter, in the real world, with real sun and real shade and real fucking Tequila. Play the game, get as deep as you want. If you want to be as deep as TMO, BE TMO...you have that option. For the love of god though, quit crying, quit trying to "fix" it. It's not broken, it's just hard. Be harder, or don't be. That's just my two cents.

[TAllen82]

Also I'm drinking.....but all that is still valid!

[pharmakos]

Originally Posted by rogean

If we do not see a significant improvement in the behavior of the raiding guilds and how they treat eachother, Velious will be released without raid content. To be clear, we want an enjoyable raid scene for everyone, not just one or two guilds. This means working together to figure out a compromise when racing for mobs, and working with smaller guilds to let them have a chance at mobs you don't absolutely need for gearing main characters.

[TAllen82]

Not classic bro, love the Goatmeister.......but not classic.