Veeshan's Peak

[Autotune]

Originally Posted by Duie [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Link doesnt do it justice Bob. this is the number one reason you had more rotation servers than you had FTE . GMs didnt get involved too often when it came to raiding. you either worked it out or you spent a lot of time CRing

Yes I know...another thread on raiding on p99 and all the bullshit it involves. Sorry

In my opinion,

Seems like the most simple and elegant solution possible, something Devs can implement today which really would bring back that "classic feel", is ZERO gm interference for raid targets.

Guild X is going for CT, Guild Z Trains the shit outta them so they are unable to kill CT.

Normal scenario = Petitions, whining, bitching, GM intervention, suspensions, one guild getting loot over another, RnF posts, whining, bitching. Rinse and Repeat.


In my new perfect world there are no GM interventions. You don't like Guild Z training your shit? Train them back. For awhile its going to be a cluster fuck of trains. RnF will actually be worth reading again.

However, in the long run while this shitstorm is going on the intelligent players are going to realize, "shit man....we haven't killed anything worthwhile in weeks....all we do is train each other"

Once they realize this things should start to change, guild alliances, raid rotations, Big guilds letting small guilds help kill raid targets and getting to pick one item of loot off boss?! PEOPLE BEHAVING LIKE ADULTS!!?

Let the guilds police themselves. 99% of the server doesn't give a shit if Guild Z is Training Guild X in Fear. It does not effect us, we do not give a shit.

Spend your time fixing bugs, helping players with real issues and let the raid scene police its self.

The entire raid scene will deadlock if every time someone gets ready to kill Trak another guild trains them till they give up.

My option will FORCE guilds to play nice and free up DEV and GM time since they wont have to deal with the bullshit.


Not that anyone cares but, I am in Management at UPS. I learned a long time ago that if you treat your employees like children, always involving yourself every time they have the smallest issue, they will behave exactly like children. And I spent more time babysitting them than getting my work done.

However, if you treat them like intelligent adults and make them solve their own issues suddenly they have brains and are able to figure out most issues for themselves. Now a days I could not even show up to work and everything would be done and done correctly because I have a crew of people who think for themselves instead of a crew of children always looking to me to fix things.

I will admit I did not do much raiding Pre Velious and I have done ZERO raiding on P99, mostly due to not wanting to deal with all the bullshit here.

However, I think the P99 staff needs to step back and learn from my mistakes. Treat the players like adults and let the guilds police themselves and I think you will be pleasantly surprised in the long run.

they won't do it. They love being involved, no matter what they say, they want to be involved.

If not, the agreement TR/TMO came to would have held up, there wouldn't "let's put both guilds in VP at the same time and see what happens"

[Deemo]

Originally Posted by Duie [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Link doesnt do it justice Bob. this is the number one reason you had more rotation servers than you had FTE . GMs didnt get involved too often when it came to raiding. you either worked it out or you spent a lot of time CRing

Yes I know...another thread on raiding on p99 and all the bullshit it involves. Sorry

In my opinion,

Seems like the most simple and elegant solution possible, something Devs can implement today which really would bring back that "classic feel", is ZERO gm interference for raid targets.

Guild X is going for CT, Guild Z Trains the shit outta them so they are unable to kill CT.

Normal scenario = Petitions, whining, bitching, GM intervention, suspensions, one guild getting loot over another, RnF posts, whining, bitching. Rinse and Repeat.


In my new perfect world there are no GM interventions. You don't like Guild Z training your shit? Train them back. For awhile its going to be a cluster fuck of trains. RnF will actually be worth reading again.

However, in the long run while this shitstorm is going on the intelligent players are going to realize, "shit man....we haven't killed anything worthwhile in weeks....all we do is train each other"

Once they realize this things should start to change, guild alliances, raid rotations, Big guilds letting small guilds help kill raid targets and getting to pick one item of loot off boss?! PEOPLE BEHAVING LIKE ADULTS!!?

Let the guilds police themselves. 99% of the server doesn't give a shit if Guild Z is Training Guild X in Fear. It does not effect us, we do not give a shit.

Spend your time fixing bugs, helping players with real issues and let the raid scene police its self.

The entire raid scene will deadlock if every time someone gets ready to kill Trak another guild trains them till they give up.

My option will FORCE guilds to play nice and free up DEV and GM time since they wont have to deal with the bullshit.


Not that anyone cares but, I am in Management at UPS. I learned a long time ago that if you treat your employees like children, always involving yourself every time they have the smallest issue, they will behave exactly like children. And I spent more time babysitting them than getting my work done.

However, if you treat them like intelligent adults and make them solve their own issues suddenly they have brains and are able to figure out most issues for themselves. Now a days I could not even show up to work and everything would be done and done correctly because I have a crew of people who think for themselves instead of a crew of children always looking to me to fix things.

I will admit I did not do much raiding Pre Velious and I have done ZERO raiding on P99, mostly due to not wanting to deal with all the bullshit here.

However, I think the P99 staff needs to step back and learn from my mistakes. Treat the players like adults and let the guilds police themselves and I think you will be pleasantly surprised in the long run.

this /agree

[fohkure]

Originally Posted by Duie [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Link doesnt do it justice Bob. this is the number one reason you had more rotation servers than you had FTE . GMs didnt get involved too often when it came to raiding. you either worked it out or you spent a lot of time CRing

Yes I know...another thread on raiding on p99 and all the bullshit it involves. Sorry

In my opinion,

Seems like the most simple and elegant solution possible, something Devs can implement today which really would bring back that "classic feel", is ZERO gm interference for raid targets.

Guild X is going for CT, Guild Z Trains the shit outta them so they are unable to kill CT.

Normal scenario = Petitions, whining, bitching, GM intervention, suspensions, one guild getting loot over another, RnF posts, whining, bitching. Rinse and Repeat.


In my new perfect world there are no GM interventions. You don't like Guild Z training your shit? Train them back. For awhile its going to be a cluster fuck of trains. RnF will actually be worth reading again.

However, in the long run while this shitstorm is going on the intelligent players are going to realize, "shit man....we haven't killed anything worthwhile in weeks....all we do is train each other"

Once they realize this things should start to change, guild alliances, raid rotations, Big guilds letting small guilds help kill raid targets and getting to pick one item of loot off boss?! PEOPLE BEHAVING LIKE ADULTS!!?

Let the guilds police themselves. 99% of the server doesn't give a shit if Guild Z is Training Guild X in Fear. It does not effect us, we do not give a shit.

Spend your time fixing bugs, helping players with real issues and let the raid scene police its self.

The entire raid scene will deadlock if every time someone gets ready to kill Trak another guild trains them till they give up.

My option will FORCE guilds to play nice and free up DEV and GM time since they wont have to deal with the bullshit.


Not that anyone cares but, I am in Management at UPS. I learned a long time ago that if you treat your employees like children, always involving yourself every time they have the smallest issue, they will behave exactly like children. And I spent more time babysitting them than getting my work done.

However, if you treat them like intelligent adults and make them solve their own issues suddenly they have brains and are able to figure out most issues for themselves. Now a days I could not even show up to work and everything would be done and done correctly because I have a crew of people who think for themselves instead of a crew of children always looking to me to fix things.

I will admit I did not do much raiding Pre Velious and I have done ZERO raiding on P99, mostly due to not wanting to deal with all the bullshit here.

However, I think the P99 staff needs to step back and learn from my mistakes. Treat the players like adults and let the guilds police themselves and I think you will be pleasantly surprised in the long run.

haha, get your logic out of here at once! No one wants to hear these ridiculous notions that make perfect sense!

Chris

[john_savage1982]

Originally Posted by Duie [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Link doesnt do it justice Bob. this is the number one reason you had more rotation servers than you had FTE . GMs didnt get involved too often when it came to raiding. you either worked it out or you spent a lot of time CRing

Yes I know...another thread on raiding on p99 and all the bullshit it involves. Sorry

In my opinion,

Seems like the most simple and elegant solution possible, something Devs can implement today which really would bring back that "classic feel", is ZERO gm interference for raid targets.

Guild X is going for CT, Guild Z Trains the shit outta them so they are unable to kill CT.

Normal scenario = Petitions, whining, bitching, GM intervention, suspensions, one guild getting loot over another, RnF posts, whining, bitching. Rinse and Repeat.


In my new perfect world there are no GM interventions. You don't like Guild Z training your shit? Train them back. For awhile its going to be a cluster fuck of trains. RnF will actually be worth reading again.

However, in the long run while this shitstorm is going on the intelligent players are going to realize, "shit man....we haven't killed anything worthwhile in weeks....all we do is train each other"

Once they realize this things should start to change, guild alliances, raid rotations, Big guilds letting small guilds help kill raid targets and getting to pick one item of loot off boss?! PEOPLE BEHAVING LIKE ADULTS!!?

Let the guilds police themselves. 99% of the server doesn't give a shit if Guild Z is Training Guild X in Fear. It does not effect us, we do not give a shit.

Spend your time fixing bugs, helping players with real issues and let the raid scene police its self.

The entire raid scene will deadlock if every time someone gets ready to kill Trak another guild trains them till they give up.

My option will FORCE guilds to play nice and free up DEV and GM time since they wont have to deal with the bullshit.


Not that anyone cares but, I am in Management at UPS. I learned a long time ago that if you treat your employees like children, always involving yourself every time they have the smallest issue, they will behave exactly like children. And I spent more time babysitting them than getting my work done.

However, if you treat them like intelligent adults and make them solve their own issues suddenly they have brains and are able to figure out most issues for themselves. Now a days I could not even show up to work and everything would be done and done correctly because I have a crew of people who think for themselves instead of a crew of children always looking to me to fix things.

I will admit I did not do much raiding Pre Velious and I have done ZERO raiding on P99, mostly due to not wanting to deal with all the bullshit here.

However, I think the P99 staff needs to step back and learn from my mistakes. Treat the players like adults and let the guilds police themselves and I think you will be pleasantly surprised in the long run.

This makes perfect sense. GM involvement is just distorting behavior. It's their sandbox though for better or worse and they want raiding to be conducted in their vision.

Raiding FFA would indeed cause a lot of grief in the beginning because the dominant strategy would be to cause grief to increase chances of scoring loot. However, in repeated games people will realize that griefing one another over and over is just wasting time and not really helping either party. Once this realization begins occurring, players will move towards devising agreements to reduce the unnecessary conflict.

It is a matter of perspective, though. Some players prefer a system where raw time commitment should be the arbiter of loot distribution and these players see this arrangement as the most fair. Others see variations of "whatever it takes" as more fair as without GM interference the game mechanisms are designed such that KS/training is possible (modern MMORPGs, recognizing players QQing, introduced mechanisms to prevent griefing). In an environment of "whatever it takes" guilds are forced to behave as adults and create their own arrangements between one another instead of relying on GMs to play that role.

[Werlop]

Originally Posted by Duie [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I will admit I did not do much raiding Pre Velious and I have done ZERO raiding on P99, mostly due to not wanting to deal with all the bullshit here.

Did Duie sell his accounts? Last time I checked, he was an active member of Taken who has definitely done more than

Originally Posted by Duie [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

ZERO raiding on P99

[Duie]

Originally Posted by Werlop [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Did Duie sell his accounts? Last time I checked, he was an active member of Taken who has definitely done more than

You really think anyone would buy a ranger? Really?

that quote is from Bobs post , although ive given up long ago on accually being able to raid here. Fear and hate are more of Xp camps anymore. Vox and naggy are perma camped by TR and TMO's alt army who will leepfrog you and or Train you if anyone else even trys an attempt. same goes for ct VS and all other kunark dragons.

To raid here you have to be willing to sit at one place for 96 hours with your main, be on call for those 96 hours , willing to log in at any given time of day and just for a chance at the bullshit that happens in the raiding scene for a fight thats over in 15 sec .. no thanks


SO December 20 will be here soon and ill be trying a game that seems to be more casual friendly.I will still log on to help my guildmates even though fewer of them are logging on each week( and i cant blame them) Good luck for those who are planning to put up with this so called compition on this server. Classic for me , it was not .

[Nuggie]

Originally Posted by Duie [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

SO December 20 will be here soon and ill be trying a game that seems to be more casual friendly.I will still log on to help my guildmates even though fewer of them are logging on each week( and i cant blame them) Good luck for those who are planning to put up with this so called compition on this server. Classic for me , it was not .

Isn't every game that's been produced in the last 12 years more casual friendly bro?

[Duie]

Originally Posted by Nuggie [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Isn't every game that's been produced in the last 12 years more casual friendly bro?

I Donno. went from EQ to DAoC

[Shiftin]

On the very first few clears of VP the items were all tradeable. You can see it in the SS forum VP post. That was rectified almost immediately as it was a mistake and I think rogean already said everything is starting as no drop.

[Awwalike]

wait wut