Discussion on R99 vs VZTZ **POSTPONED**

[Nirgon]

Originally Posted by Sirken [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Fri Aug 23 9pmEST - Project1999:PVP Discussion with Rogean, Nilbog, Zade and Sirken

Maybe if Bond of Death icon change is addressed, Lady Lethdar will bestow us with her presence

[Stinkum]

Originally Posted by Agatha [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

if people just stopped being a bunch of ducks and played, and also played better, this server would be thriving.

This post is a lot funnier if you watch Agatha's performance in the BotB.

[Labanen]

There will be no wipe.

"This isnt the end, this isnt even the beginning of the end. It maybe however be the end of the beginning" :-)

We re only halfway through the timeline that is planned, dont give up yet...

[Giovanni]

Going to walk you through my experiences on Red99 versus VZTZ versus Sullon on live:

Experience on Red99
There was a lot of excitement and theory crafting for the launch of red99. We managed to win the beta FFA pvp event with a small crew using even levels and even gear. Everyone was pumped.

The server launched and I was an ogre shaman near Grobb grouping with 3 large race SK's. The low level pvp against other crews was very fun. However, we began to notice exactly how slow the experience was flowing. As of today, over half the people in the video below never made it 50 let alone 60.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eLC_T33duGw

As we reached the 20's-30's, we switched to bard kiting instead of traditional grouping because the experience rate was so bad. Instead of running holy trinity experience groups, all our melee were told to sit on their ass and afk while bards killed everything.

This is still the preferred method of exp today 18-60 with a low hp aggro bard kite.

Not surprisingly melees either:
1) quit playing
2) rerolled casters
3) decided to box and risk everything on a gm ban

Guildmates refused to group with melees as they were useless in groups, and melees could not pvp the random players they encountered as they needed them for groups.

In terms of PVP, there is a plethora of conflag wands and trak teeth on the server. Resists are just weird so enjoy getting blinded, bard snared, and nuked for full with an unlimited range pillar.

Nihilum is good at what they do, and we simply don't have the hours to invest pve wise to compete. One memory which really stands out to me is when we were finally contesting and winning trakanon. The server reset at like 11am on a Wednesday and Nihilium killed every single raid mob by 3pm or so on the same day before I got home from work.

Like most of the players in my guild, I logged off when I heard the news. It was one thing having them plug 2-4 fully geared and buffed toon into zonelines for pvp fights (with trak tooths and soulfires). It was another thing dealing with their recruitment signing bonuses and 24 hour on-call memberbase.

The lesson learned here is that if you want fun pvp, stop leveling at 51. Then, enjoy fights against flowers. I have been a member of the opposition fighting against Nizzar since day 1 on the server. The action at level 60 simply isn't fun, and it isn't worth the time investment.


Experience on VZTZ
I played essentially every eq emu pvp box starting with guildwars. On VZTZ, I was in TDT, No Homo's, Heresy. I even tried pvping on Shards of Dalaya for what it was worth.

What worked well for VZTZ was the focus on pvp and fun. The PVE was an afterthought. Some of the best guild vs guild pvp on VZTZ was in zones where there were no mobs up to contest. In comparison, RED99 feels like we are playing a PVE Skinner box and not a pvp box.

If one guild grew too into too large of a zerg on VZTZ, other guilds would break off or form up to contest. Contesting was possible since we could box, insta clicks were not used as widely in pvp, and resists made more sense. Guilds wanted to be known as having a small elite crew on VZTZ. On red99, it's zerg2win.

Below is a video going into fear with 5 characters to contest a small raid force. We would be very hesitant to try this on red99 with the possibility for exp death due to low hp aggro from mobs, the possibility of getting banned for training, and the difficulty of cring without the ability to box. I can guarantee that if we tried the same on red99, we would have gotten trak toothed and possibly suspended.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cLlsXzaKEJg


Experience on Sullon:
I primarily played on the Neutral team with Tides of Wrath. The Netural team essentially only had one guild capable of fielding a raid force. The evil team always had multiple raid forces such as Hate, Vindictive, etc. Nizzar choose ez street on evil team of course.

Sullon was great from the new player perspective because higher level players were encouraged by the rule set to protect and help their potential low level recruits. On the other hand, the no level limits meant that new players were frequently corpse camped by high level opposition.

There was more of a shared purpose with your team members on Sullon. Even though I did not like many of the other Neutral team members, I took some comfort in the fact that they were pissing off the opposing teams far more than my own. I loved looking at the zone control maps or message board updates on the daily pvp fights.

On Sullon, players were restricted on one character per account. This played a large part in restricted the xteam spies. I can see how RED99 players with too much time on their hands would level up multiple characters on each team if the team restrictions were implemented. Overall though, I think hardcoded teams would help the server.

The exp rate was slow on Sullon. I boxed a cleric and warrior to 60. I also had a bard.

On live, bard kites were never used in the manner they are on red99. A bard named Worry pioneered a lot of the bard techniques and eventually bought a Mustang from all the plat he made. How bards leveled on live:

• Charm a pet and send it into a group of mobs. Break charm when pet is low and then chant it down.
• Charm burn a mob to start two uncharmable mobs fighting each other due to the way faction assist worked.

PBAOE kiting did not see much until Katta or Halls of Honor, and I never saw low hp bard kites used. Does anyone else remember doing this on live? I sure don't.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cYEhb...KUWKv5x7u4JSlQ


Summary:

• Fix resists/basic pvp mechanics (nice progress with the pillar/tsfaff changes)
• Focus more on pvp and not pve
• Allow boxing so melees can level up and smaller guilds can contest. We aren't using holy trinity groups anyway. Making pve hard so we all have to bard kites is retarded.
• Encourage players to form groups through group exp bonuses and teams. The server is currently structured to encourage people to exclude pals (like those who chose hybrids) from groups.

[AmukTZ]

I haven't played Red99. I have only played VZTZ.

I played Rahza or Rahzagul on VZTZ. I played with TZT in the earlier days and then was with Heresy after the second wipe.

[Alecta]

Cant really comment on #1, but points #2 & #3 were pretty spot on.

(And go go team neut!)

[Vile]

are these planned events just going to be circle jerks or what kind of changes could we expect?

actual updates to red99?
another PvP server?

prassss

r99 boring as fuck imo right now

[Agatha]

not even i can put together exp group, times are rough all over. lol

[Potus]

I really don't understand why hybrid exp penalty is on this server because Verant/Sony even admitted later on it was a balance mistake from the beta (where people foolishly thought Paladins and Rangers were better than a Warrior).

[heartbrand]

because it's classic. if trakanon dropped cloth caps for 3 months, he would drop cloth caps here as well for 3 months because it's "classic." Dumb as fuck imo, but that's the vision/goal of the server.

also I don't mind making exp boosts etc., but if you really STILL can't level at the current exp rate then you're not looking for EverQuest anymore, you're looking for CS with elves.