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  #121  
Old 04-02-2015, 01:44 PM
koros koros is offline
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Originally Posted by azeth [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]
Since when does AoB stack?
Since always. As long as it was (worn)
  #122  
Old 04-02-2015, 01:48 PM
azeth azeth is offline
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Originally Posted by koros [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]
Since always. As long as it was (worn)
gotcha.
  #123  
Old 04-02-2015, 02:09 PM
Daldaen Daldaen is offline
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Originally Posted by Treats [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]
Yeah, casted Avatar didn't count.

The 250 ATK cap may be achievable during Velious, it depends if STR-ATK was included and if Aura of Battle was stackable.

Avatar - 100 ATK
255 STR (520-150)/3 - 120 ATK
3x Aura of Battle - 30 ATK

250 ATK cap
Ranger Swiftwind and Rogue Ragebringer are each 40 ATK as well.

But I would love to see the sources/discussion in era on the worn ATK+Spell ATK being hard capped at 250 total addition. Cause... I have never heard of this before. I only had heard of 250 ATK WORN Cap in PoP.
  #124  
Old 04-02-2015, 03:05 PM
Treats Treats is offline
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Originally Posted by Daldaen [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]
Ranger Swiftwind and Rogue Ragebringer are each 40 ATK as well.

But I would love to see the sources/discussion in era on the worn ATK+Spell ATK being hard capped at 250 total addition. Cause... I have never heard of this before. I only had heard of 250 ATK WORN Cap in PoP.
Only Avatar Proc on Primal goes into the 250 Worn ATK, no spell that is casted is counted into this cap.
  #125  
Old 04-02-2015, 03:43 PM
wycca wycca is offline
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I believe the atk cap was added later. Someone should probably do some serious research - fairly sure Velious had no caps aside from 5x AoB (which doesnt matter here) given that the itemization provided its own limit.
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  #126  
Old 04-02-2015, 04:30 PM
koros koros is offline
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Originally Posted by wycca [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]
I believe the atk cap was added later. Someone should probably do some serious research - fairly sure Velious had no caps aside from 5x AoB (which doesnt matter here) given that the itemization provided its own limit.
Can anyone source that 5X AoB cap? You couldn't even get 5 AoB items in Velious afaik.

Also I'm unaware of any mentions of the 250 cap in Velious, especially since it couldn't be reached. It was definitely around in Luclin, as I think they realized they done fucked up giving people practically irreplaceable weapons w/ Primal.
Last edited by koros; 04-02-2015 at 04:33 PM..
  #127  
Old 04-02-2015, 06:07 PM
Treats Treats is offline
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Originally Posted by Buriedpast [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]
Str is not relative to raw atk, on live str based atk was worth about 10% of worn atk of the same figure.
I thought this for a long time also but it wasn't right.

Raw ATK only refers the actual number, the client displays ATK as 4/3.

100 ATK = 133 ATK displayed in client

You only get ATK from STR over 75

((STR*2)-150) / 3)
  #128  
Old 04-02-2015, 06:22 PM
Arteker Arteker is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by koros [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]
Can anyone source that 5X AoB cap? You couldn't even get 5 AoB items in Velious afaik.

Also I'm unaware of any mentions of the 250 cap in Velious, especially since it couldn't be reached. It was definitely around in Luclin, as I think they realized they done fucked up giving people practically irreplaceable weapons w/ Primal.
you are 100% right that was one of the main reasons ac scaled so big in luclin , pop, for mobs . and it was kinda controversial , and why aow challange in luclin by vexthal guild was kinda a gimp

i know my english is bad so will copy paste a better english explanation of how worn effects worked, note than FT underweared a full rework unlike other worn effects.

Most everyone knows that flowing thought stacks up to 15. However there are a lot of other equipment effects that I have no idea if they stack, if ones of the same level stack, and if there is a limit similar to the ft15.

Off the top of my head:

Vengence (+5 to attk)--I believe there is a limit to how many but no idea what it is.

Aura of Battle (+10 to attack and 2hp per tick regen)--I know for this one that the clickable ones give a buff icon so only one of those works but that the worns ones supposedly stack with this and with each other--any limit though

Regeneration (1 hp regen a tick)--since there are these new numbered regeneration effects I assume they work similarly to flowing thought but I assume there is a limit as well. Also how about stacking with other regen effects, both pure regen like fungal regrowth, the effect called simply regeneration that is 5hp a tick, etc and mixed effects like the above mentioned aura of battle?

Aura of Health--I thought there was an effect named this but now I don't see it in lucy

Aura of Courage (+10 attk and 1hp per tick)

Aura of Daring (+20 attk and 2hp per tick)

Aura of Bravery (+30 attk and 3hp per tick)

Composure (3hp per tick and 3 mana per tick)

There are probably more that I am not thinking of with worn effects. Anyone know about stacking issues with these or limits to how high they stack?

Also a related question--SoE has stated that skill mod items for trade skills don't stack but what about having two items with +% dodge modifiers for example?
Palarran
10-18-2003, 02:56 PM
All worn effects stack (in the sense that they don't block each other due to stacking rules, although specific types of effects like haste won't add together--think of a pre-vallon haste spell and the monk epic for example; the two effects will take hold but only one haste will work). There are limits on worn effects though:

35 hp/tick regen
15 mana/tick regen
250 atk (oddly the avatar proc from a primal weapon counts towards this total).

Focus effects and skill modifiers are not covered by the above. Skill modifiers do not stack, whether for tradeskills or not. Focus effects follow normal stacking rules (though a spell will stack with a permanent focus effect and AA's). Supposedly the special plane of time effects (avoidance, strikethrough, etc.) all stack.

Note at this momment eq still keep names to worn effects wich later was changed to xxx atk xxx regeneration.....

for the FT discussion this thread show you some

https://www.project1999.com/forums/a...p/t-79881.html
  #129  
Old 04-02-2015, 07:07 PM
wycca wycca is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by koros [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]
Can anyone source that 5X AoB cap? You couldn't even get 5 AoB items in Velious afaik.

Also I'm unaware of any mentions of the 250 cap in Velious, especially since it couldn't be reached. It was definitely around in Luclin, as I think they realized they done fucked up giving people practically irreplaceable weapons w/ Primal.
I was going to source it, but there aren't 5x AoB items in Velious, so there is no point.

The first mention of the 250 cap was post-velious, and when it went in there was a ton of discussion about how proc'd primal was now part of that cap whereas cast was not.

Up until that point, I don't believe there was an ATK cap (it was limited by the items available).

Not sure it matters on P99 at this time unless we discovered there is a cap that can be hit. Spells were never part of that, so you'd have to find 251atk worth of worn items to prove it - it simply isn't out there. You're limited to like 170 at best I think.

3x AoB = 30atk
Rng/Rog = 40atk from epics
Avatar = 100atk - (this never counted during Velious, I'm simply including it because even with it, it doesn't matter if we have a 250atk cap on p99 because you can't hit 250)

No str attack never counted.

The 250atk cap should be irrelevant on P99 whether it is coded or not at this time - you can't hit it. The only thing that should be checked is to make sure FT is not stacking and AoB is stacking.
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  #130  
Old 04-14-2015, 06:15 PM
Treats Treats is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Raev [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]
I'm not sure what you mean when you are talking about the normal distribution. I don't see why ATK vs AC is even a probability distribution; its just a function of two variables returning either the average hit or a distribution over hits.

I guess what Treats is trying to say is that the incremental value of ATK should be higher when the AC of the target is higher, i.e. Avatar will give you +15% dps vs trash mobs (say 85 -> 100) but +30% dps or whatnot vs bosses (say 50 -> 65).

Of course, its still a dumb argument because even if Avatar + Vulak Weapons + 3x Aura of Battle was 2x damage, we'd still just bring 2x the rogues. Because the Avatar of War has no AOE, he's extremely vulnerable to being zerged.
Armor Class = AC Mitigation + AC Avoidance
Attack = ATK Accuracy + ATK Efficiency

Atk Accuracy vs AC Avoidance
Atk Efficiency vs AC Mitigation

I'm not sure what is used for both of these:

Atk Accuracy = Weapon Skill + Offense
Atk Efficiency = STR(atk) + ATK spells + Aura of Battle etc

If this were the case Avatar would effectively double your ATK efficiency, even moreso if you did not already have max STR. Comparing a BiS Velious vs BiS Kunark geared raid force, you would most likely need to triple the numbers of the Kunark force to achieve the same DPS.
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