Let's talk CLASS BALANCE

[epicentre]

I usually stay away from bitch fighting, whiners, and sterile talks about who has the bigger balls, why, and what should be done to solve the issue, but I'm a bit drunk atm.

My 2cp:
1/ a possible solution to the class balancing problem would be to create a mix of SK, ROG, CLR, WIZ and shaman and remove all other classes;
2/ there is a chinese proverb saying: "if you're an ass in the game, you'll be an ass on the forums";
3/ I wish there would be some mecanism similar to Windows GPO to enforce some user names in ignore lists;
4/ never post when drunk, you could regret it.

[Extunarian]

Originally Posted by epicentre [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

3/ I wish there would be some mecanism similar to Windows GPO to enforce some user names in ignore lists;

not sure if you're saying you want a 'forum user ignore' function, but if so it is already available. http://www.project1999.org/forums/pr...?do=ignorelist

[ryandward]

Even as a Wizard, the most crapped on class in this thing, I would still be happy if they implemented two or three things; Harvest, Wizard Critical Hits and/or Breeze.

[guineapig]

Originally Posted by ryandward [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Even as a Wizard, the most crapped on class in this thing, I would still be happy if they implemented two or three things; Harvest, Wizard Critical Hits and/or Breeze.

Well wiz crits should not be in the game yet but I agree with you about Harvest. It's been over 2 months so going by the Everquest live timeline it should be available now.

[Tarathiel]

Its not about balance its about being skilled... People need to think outside the pixel a little bit. One of the best players I've met was a ranger... You know why? Because he knew his strengths and limitations and utilized himself to become more than sub par dps. What it comes down to is a) are you a good player b) can you play your class within the bounds of what's expected and c) can you adapt to new or unforeseen encounters in ways that are unexpected... If you answer yes to all of these questions then you will excel in this game no matter what class you play. No amount of balance arguments can explain away being a shitty player

[Zuranthium]

Oh soup, such irrelevant comments as always.

Most great film directors don't know how to actually build a camera. Does that mean they don't know how to make good movies? You don't need to know how to write computer code to know how to design a game.

Originally Posted by Tarathiel [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Its not about balance its about being skilled...

Except that if a game isn't properly balanced, then skill becomes less meaningful. If one class is always inferior to another regardless of skill, then it's imbalanced.

[Nagash]

Originally Posted by Zuranthium [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Oh soup, such irrelevant comments as always.

Let me summarise the situation to make sure I got it correct:
- you appeared out of nowhere on the forum of a very successfull server (welcome to you)
- but you did it only to rant and whine about how you don't like what is being done (because it could be so much better in a completely irrelevant way)
- doing so you showed a complete lack of respect towards the designers who work their arses off to keep the thing going the way they want it,
- You compare yourself to people who are experts in a field after having done very lengthy studies. Sorry for being blunt, the only thing you proved being an expert at is making yourself look like the organ hanging between a man's legs

So in light of this summary and coming back to this quote of yours, we can clearly say that it is a situation of an idiot calling someone elsse an idiot. I'd take that as a compliment if I were Soup.

Nagash/Petitpas

[soup]

Originally Posted by Zuranthium [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Oh soup, such irrelevant comments as always.

Most great film directors don't know how to actually build a camera. Does that mean they don't know how to make good movies? You don't need to know how to write computer code to know how to design a game.

You probably are thick headed enough to truly believe the comparisons you're making are accurate. As if somehow your aspie rantings here make you qualified to comment on game design the same way years and years of medical school make a doctor qualified to comment on health. You tout how awesomely smart you are, yet can't even comprehend the point of the server, a purpose so incredibly simple to understand that you stretch the limits of obliviousness by not getting it.

[Nagash]

Originally Posted by soup [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

obliviousness

Don't use complicated words mate, you'll only get him to moan some more [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Nagash/Petitpas

[Zuranthium]

Originally Posted by soup [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

[Why can't you] comprehend the point of the server, a purpose so incredibly simple to understand that you stretch the limits of obliviousness by not getting it.

Since you have failed to read what I've written yet again, I will repeat that this thread was created to discuss ideas. It doesn't matter if the developers of this server don't care about making a better EQ game, and only want to recreate it letter by letter, the topics I've brought to the table are still worth talking about on this forum. This is the proper community to be discussing such things. It even might be directly beneficial for the developers within their current goal, as talking about these kinds of classic EQ topics may remind the developers about some detail they have forgotten to code or possibly had overlooked altogether.

Now, that aside, when you go to the main page of the p1999 website it specifically says the goal here is to recreate the classic Everquest experience. Hence, my argument that you can't recreate the classic Everquest experience without modifying the game such that people must play it as it was intended to be played and as it actually was played when first released. Moreover, I also argue that part of why the "classic EQ experience" was so memorable for all of us was because of how groundbreaking it was. The flaws of the game weren't as detrimental back then because (A.) we simply didn't understand the game as well, and (B.) even when we did find out about the flaws it wasn't like we were going to stop playing the game, given how it was one-of-a-kind. To create a gaming experience now that is on the same level of immersion as what the classic EQ experience was, the problems must be fixed and extra depth and/or unpredictability needs to be added as well, so that the game can be approached in 2011 as it was in the past.

And, make no mistake, there were certainly a large number of players who did indeed get fed up with the horrible class balance post original-EQ and stopped playing. When you put hours upon hours upon hours into a character, and then come to find out that you are actually rather useless later in the game and/or that you can't even play the majority of the content without very specific setups, it greatly sours the experience. The power of classic Everquest is that we look back upon it as a first love and/or a "what could have been". Nostalgia wields great power.

Anyway, apologies if it comes off as being a know-it-all (or unsupportive towards the developers). I don't know it all but I do know what I know about this, which is a large amount. Perhaps game theory and learning from history is not interesting to you and all you care about is EQ exactly as it was coded, and not EQ as what it represented, but I believe the latter is much more important than the former.