Player Agreement: Rule Change at the DS Camp

[Jimjam]

Originally Posted by berbax [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I agree, I just have to get them to rally in on the change

No one person can speak for the server, but you can advocate for changes.

[berbax]

Originally Posted by Thiengy [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Urn camp was a bucket list item for me. It was something I never completed on live, and it was something I had hoped to do before I quit p99. It was quite exciting to transition from "this camp feels impossible" to "I understand how to do this, I could probably do solo with consumables, but maybe DS is too strong herself" to eventually feeling really comfortable with each mob type and eventually solo holding the camp for a full day and clearing Drusella solo as well, but no urn during my solo clear, big rip lol.

I enjoy the competitive aspects of p99 and some of the friendly competition I saw at the camp was always enjoyable. Over time I think player expectations have become a bit toxic with the feeling that being asked to clear is "rude" and that somehow there is an expectation to hold a camp with zero effort. I disagree that playing by the outlined rules is somehow toxic in nature. If you are holding the camp you should be expecting to clear it for a significant amount of time.

I don't personally feel that a single group/guild monopolizing the camp is a problem, as long as they have the manpower to clear the camp and have the appetite for 24hr round the clock clearing due to others' desire for the camp. I do find it discouraging that those holding the camp may become offended by others asking them to clear as if it is personal. But in my eyes, this competition is the exciting part of p99. I would hate to see it reduced to a /rand or /list.

There are likely opportunities to improve the camp dynamics by ensuring players are present, box testing, better defined and CSR-supported rules for when a clear has failed, and punishment for those who try to weaponize trains.

I do feel like this camp is likely out of reach for most as a solo adventure and that is an okay thing. It is good to have challenges that are a challenge. Adding 1 or 2 more capable players trivializes the camp; add a few more working in shifts and it's even easier.

I too enjoyed the challenge of holding the camp solo for hours, even clearing a named and killing DS. That feeling was mostly relief, though, and it took me two weeks of constant early (5 am) monitoring to get the opportunity (as shown in my video). So, I understand where you are coming from.

However, I think most people would agree that this particular camp highlights the toxic nature of the server. As you mentioned, adding 1 or 2 players trivializes the camp. The real difficulty lies in not being pushed out by larger guilds with players in different time zones monopolizing it for their own incentives (monetary or otherwise), as illustrated in my video with Mcreary’s explanation.

We are mostly grown adults, and it’s unreasonable to expect people to stay up 24 hours a day to get the urn in a game meant to be fun. The current system creates an environment where a few guilds can dominate the camp around the clock, making it nearly impossible for others to have a fair chance.

While competition can be exciting, it becomes problematic when it leads to monopolization and toxic behavior. Implementing a /rand or /list system would not only provide more players with a fair opportunity but also help mitigate the unhealthy camping practice currently in place.

I believe improving the camp dynamics with better-defined rules and support from CSR would enhance the experience for everyone. Ensuring fairness and reducing the monopolization would make the game more enjoyable and accessible, which is ultimately what we all want.

[Toxigen]

Embrace URN.

[servirus06]

Originally Posted by baakss [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

It's unbelievably easy to train people out of DS, and unbelievably hard to ever have proof that it was you.

Drop mobs on the other side of the painting and they'll parade right through Drusellas camp. Drop an eyeball off the ledge at the zoneline and mobs will parade right through Drusellas camp. You don't even have to get close, and the people camping Drusella have virtually zero chance of catching you do it.

Considering this has happened twice in the last week on blue, maybe that's a good reason.


https://youtu.be/M_KqUCcy_rc


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3bcI-VT5H_w

sorry to say but with fraps and logs it can be caught and the petiton will go in and you will have a beautiful suspension if not ban if its a repeated offense. you can ask mazeril how his suspension went. for doing exactly what you are saying cant be tracked

[Lostfaction]

I bought two urn mq’s with DaP funds. Props to anyone who wants to camp a spawn for 24 hours keep on farming those babies and I’ll keep buying them

[servirus06]

Anyways this thread is senseless now. people have explained to you in multiple ways, that DS cant be like scout/ angry / shady / ring 8 roll, the main reason being that she has around a 40% drop rate of urn, and I'm telling you I have seen it not drop for 7 days straight. there would be no way to track which day and also if people would even care if they won that day, if u won 6 days before and didn't get.

other issue is being a roll, the massive and constant trains just before roll, so only people with FD classes could effectively roll.

Lastly unlike scout/ shady/ angry/ and ring roll, you can literally have nothing done with quest in progression, just have the key to charasis to get in zone, which is super easy to get, and win the roll and you got an urn you cant even use to complete your quest, so I'm guessing its purely for sale and to just keep taking alts to do the same which is what farm crews did to create demand and sell at higher prices, it also give chance for exempted accounts to log more than 1 since its impossible to know if 2 people actually rolling or just one hitting enter on both keyboards. Does that really sound fair to all?

This is my last post in this thread I hope you are able to find something better than URN group to make it more fair but, everything that has been proposed does not work at all for the supposed points you are trying to address, but you also seem stuck on what you proposed, and disregarding working ideas. URN group isn't perfect and changes keep being made to make it as fair and efficient as possible, but its the closest to perfection we have been able to create so that anyone is able to actually get their urn, without having to drop 120k+ plat for each one

Bunch of people complaining of not enough urns to buy, I think I said this before, most people that join urn are to get their quest completion. that means they will work to get their stuff done, which means the urn they got will not go to market. If you wanna buy one you have to wait for people that decide to keep going for profit, you can't be crying no urns selling lol, no one is gonna not finish their quest to sell to you [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

(Number of unique URNers 87) this is last year statistic, when system was put to work, that means that more than 90 people got at least 1 urn last year, since bot wasn't done when it started and it was done with pen and paper, be it for their use or for sale, but I'm sure more than 75% used for themselves and the rest that were gained were most likely used on alts also. not even counting the one Brool gave away just because he is awesome. So yeah there is no doubt urns have been or shortage for sales, because people are getting them for themselves.

[berbax]

Originally Posted by servirus06 [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Anyways this thread is senseless now. people have explained to you in multiple ways, that DS cant be like scout/ angry / shady / ring 8 roll, the main reason being that she has around a 40% drop rate of urn, and I'm telling you I have seen it not drop for 7 days straight. there would be no way to track which day and also if people would even care if they won that day, if u won 6 days before and didn't get.

other issue is being a roll, the massive and constant trains just before roll, so only people with FD classes could effectively roll.

Lastly unlike scout/ shady/ angry/ and ring roll, you can literally have nothing done with quest in progression, just have the key to charasis to get in zone, which is super easy to get, and win the roll and you got an urn you cant even use to complete your quest, so I'm guessing its purely for sale and to just keep taking alts to do the same which is what farm crews did to create demand and sell at higher prices, it also give chance for exempted accounts to log more than 1 since its impossible to know if 2 people actually rolling or just one hitting enter on both keyboards. Does that really sound fair to all?

This is my last post in this thread I hope you are able to find something better than URN group to make it more fair but, everything that has been proposed does not work at all for the supposed points you are trying to address, but you also seem stuck on what you proposed, and disregarding working ideas. URN group isn't perfect and changes keep being made to make it as fair and efficient as possible, but its the closest to perfection we have been able to create so that anyone is able to actually get their urn, without having to drop 120k+ plat for each one

Bunch of people complaining of not enough urns to buy, I think I said this before, most people that join urn are to get their quest completion. that means they will work to get their stuff done, which means the urn they got will not go to market. If you wanna buy one you have to wait for people that decide to keep going for profit, you can't be crying no urns selling lol, no one is gonna not finish their quest to sell to you [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

(Number of unique URNers 87) this is last year statistic, when system was put to work, that means that more than 90 people got at least 1 urn last year, since bot wasn't done when it started and it was done with pen and paper, be it for their use or for sale, but I'm sure more than 75% used for themselves and the rest that were gained were most likely used on alts also. not even counting the one Brool gave away just because he is awesome. So yeah there is no doubt urns have been or shortage for sales, because people are getting them for themselves.

The thread currently has a poll going that seems to be doing decently in favor the change, so I wouldn't say it's senseless in the slightest. If I see overwhelming support for Blue's URN idea, I can start another agreement for that one in particular.

In regards to trains: there's already a pretty decent system (as someone already mentioned) for reporting that type of behavior. Remember, even if you win the roll in this scenario you still have to be able to kill DS, so not sure you're going to see a ton of people sitting there.

I can't really speak to the success/failures of URN on blue, seems like so far it's a lot of mixed feelings.

[Ruien]

Originally Posted by berbax [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

The thread currently has a poll going that seems to be doing decently in favor the change, so I wouldn't say it's senseless in the slightest. If I see overwhelming support for Blue's URN idea, I can start another agreement for that one in particular.

In regards to trains: there's already a pretty decent system (as someone already mentioned) for reporting that type of behavior. Remember, even if you win the roll in this scenario you still have to be able to kill DS, so not sure you're going to see a ton of people sitting there.

I can't really speak to the success/failures of URN on blue, seems like so far it's a lot of mixed feelings.

Just to be clear: Blue's URN system does not require any new rule change or player agreement. You can implement it today without any additional red tape.

There's no need for a new poll- just set it up and go. Brool even offered to provide the bot code for you; that's something that took a fair bit of development work initially.

[Ripqozko]

URN sucks dont make that mistake on green

[PatChapp]

If they implemented a roll it would have to have the same agreement as skargus,you would stay for the kill otherwise only the few classes that can solo dru would be able to do it.
If less than 100 people regularly showed up I would be astounded. No prerequisites at all, small chance at 250k item, people would do it daily.