sk starting points

[Troxx]

Originally Posted by DeathsSilkyMist [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

A difference between 2% max hits and 4% max hits is still not a large.

Umm the difference between 2.217 and 4.062 is off by a factor of exactly 83.175%

That’s a large difference and that only captures DI 20. There are 19 other DIs that will be similarly skewed. That’s not a small difference. It furthermore proves the point that Mr Turtle is an anomaly and not at all reflective of performance vs level appropriate “normal” mobs … much less normal mobs closer to your level.

Go repeat your Mr Turtle experiment on the same exact solid blue con xp mob with and without 20 extra strength.

We can begin a meaningful discussion of the findings as it relates to having a little bit higher total mana pool vs the damage differences and the ability to carry more weight on a low str race that is hated by vendors and bankers throughout Norrath.

Bonus points if you drop some gear and test 140 vs 160 or 150 vs 170 or 160 vs 180 str values.

[Troxx]

Originally Posted by DeathsSilkyMist [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Please post your formulas. We should be able to see it if you plug in whatever numbers you are using.

The exact formulas for p99 are known only to the creators of p99. They were reverse engineered and estimated because the exact formulas used in EQ live were known only to the creators of Original EverQuest.

What we do know is there is a dynamic relationship between your attack/level and the mobs ac/level in determining the relative chance of a DI 1-20 hit that is furthermore fuddled by the RNG. The RNG fuddling is why large parses are required for quality data interpretation.

When I was running defensive parses on Live back in the day I typically looked for sample sizes of 5000-10000 hits with all other variables strictly controlled to find the most precise data. I’ve been doing these parses for a long time man.

Such large parses are not reasonable. I’d be happy with 1 mob and 10 runs down to 20% health (5 of each str level).

That would at least give us a fuzzy, if not 100% accurate, representation. The more hits the better. I would recommend not clicking slam at all so you can isolate only hits from mainhand weapon.

If you want a partner in crime to help heal you, I can bring my 60 necro to HoT you to avoid any unnecessary down time. It’s a healing class that can likewise FD to allow the mob to reset and regen.

[DeathsSilkyMist]

Originally Posted by Troxx [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Umm the difference between 2.217 and 4.062 is off by a favor of exactly 83.175%

That’s a large difference and that only captures DI 20. There are 19 other DIs that will be similarly skewed. That’s not a small difference. It furthermore proves the point that Mr Turtle is an anomaly and not at all reflective of performance vs level appropriate “normal” mobs … much less normal mobs closer to your level.

Go repeat your Mr Turtle experiment on the same exact solid blue con xp mob with and without 20 extra strength.

We can begin a meaningful discussion of the findings as it relates to having a little bit higher total mana pool vs the damage differences and the ability to carry more weight on a low str race that is hated by vendors and bankers throughout Norrath.

Bonus points if you drop some gear and test 140 vs 160 or 150 vs 170 or 160 vs 180 str values.

Here's the thing. I provided plenty of evidence for you to work with. I gave you turtle data with logs and video evidence, and I gave you 200 kills worth of log data for dark blues.

You haven't explained AT ALL how the DPS difference between 210 STR and 231 STR will increase instead of decrease when taking into account different mitigation values. You haven't even shown how much that difference is. If it's a difference of 0.1 DPS, you aren't getting more kills per hour while leveling.

I am not going to keep responding to you when you fail to do anything but constantly repeat "provide data for my claims".

For those interested, my data is here:

https://www.project1999.com/forums/s...&postcount=105 and https://www.project1999.com/forums/s...&postcount=138 .

Please come back when you can provide anything approaching a salient point, or data for your claims, or the formulas you are using. You just keep posting the same nonsense over and over, and it is getting tiring.

[Troxx]

Ps: you can also get a lot more data out of each run down to 20% by equipping a crappy (I mean newbie level) 1hander and your shield.

The only thing that matters is comparative dps. With a crappy weapon you can beat on the same mob 10x longer or more before you drop it to 20%.

[Troxx]

Originally Posted by DeathsSilkyMist [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Please come back when you can provide anything.

I’m actually offering to help.

[DeathsSilkyMist]

Originally Posted by Troxx [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I’m actually offering to help.

Then please, provide a video with logs showing evidence for your claims, and the formulas you are using, so we can take a look at it. It is not helping to keep asking me to give you more data and videos. You are simply saying "nothing is good enough".

For those interested, my data is here:

https://www.project1999.com/forums/s...&postcount=105 and https://www.project1999.com/forums/s...&postcount=138 .

[Troxx]

I’m offering to log in and sit there with you healing you while we collect the data. I do not have a sk or a tank that can FD to reset the exact same mob to control all variables.

What I can do is heal you and likewise FD to reset the mob.

Geared though you may be, your down time would be significant otherwise if you are testing vs an actually appropriate dark blue con mob. Remember, we’d be trying to isolate your melee dps and casting lifetaps or otherwise doing any damage other than auto attack would provide unwelcome variance.

If you’re interested I can try to help out.

[DeathsSilkyMist]

Originally Posted by Troxx [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I’m offering to log in and sit there with you healing it while we collect the data. I do not have a sk or a tank that can FD to reset the exact same mob to control all variables.

What I can do is heal you and likewise FD to reset the mob.

Geared though you may be, your down time would be significant otherwise if you are testing vs an actually appropriate dark blue con mob.

If you’re interested I try to help out.

You have a level 60 Paladin, according to your signature.

You also agree that Paladins and SK's have the same damage table when you are simply auto attacking. So there won't be any difference in the white damage calculations.

You can make a video with your Paladin, I am sure you can use lull to control the mobs just fine.

That would actually help. I will be happy to admit I am wrong if you can provide hard evidence.

[Troxx]

Originally Posted by DeathsSilkyMist [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

You have a level 60 Paladin, according to your signature.

You also agree that Paladins and SK's have the same damage table when you are simply auto attacking. So there won't be any difference in the white damage calculations.

You can make a video with your Paladin, I am sure you can use lull to control the mobs just fine.

Paladins cannot FD to reset the mob to ensure the same exact mob. Mob after mob.

But whatever - I’ll try to think of a static dark blue mob in an out of the way place where nobody is likely to interfere if you’re not willing. I can always root it and camp I suppose.

[DeathsSilkyMist]

Originally Posted by Troxx [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Paladins cannot FD to reset the mob to ensure the same exact mob. Mob after mob.

But whatever - I’ll try to think of a static dark blue mob in an out of the way place where nobody is likely to interfere if you’re not willing. I can always root it and camp I suppose.

I appreciate it. Thank you!