Someone Translate this wall of text from Omni

[Nibblewitz]

Let's do a rotation.

AoW is gateway mob.

[loramin]

Originally Posted by Gatordash [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I like P99 because it rewards you for your time and effort spent playing more than a lot of other games. It feels pretty good getting an item after spending a ton of time on it. Putting the best equipment P99 has to offer on a rotation system means you don't have to spend all that time and effort to obtain it which lessens the reward, and therefore would make P99 worse imo. And that is why the current system we have is better than a rotation system.

I <3 this post. And I also agree with a lot of it.

OF COURSE it should take time and effort to obtain top equipment. But nothing about rotations changes that: you still have to kill the dragons!

As far as EverQuest, the actual game we are all here to play, is concerned, everyone still has to "put in the work" to get the treasure by killing the dragons, regardless of the system that allocates the dragons.

Furthermore, for all your claims about the "time and effort" put in, the vast majority of members of the top guilds don't have to put in that time and effort. Yes the trackers have to stare at nothing for hours, and a few other members have to put in effort, but 95% or so of the guild is putting in no more effort than anyone else on the server ... so why is it better to have a server where only they get to kill the dragons?

[enjchanter]

Originally Posted by loramin [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I <3 this post. And I also agree with a lot of it.

OF COURSE it should take time and effort to obtain top equipment. But nothing about rotations changes that: you still have to kill the dragons!

As far as EverQuest, the actual game we are all here to play, is concerned, everyone still has to "put in the work" to get the treasure by killing the dragons, regardless of the system that allocates the dragons.

Furthermore, for all your claims about the "time and effort" put in, the vast majority of members of the top guilds don't have to put in that time and effort. Yes the trackers have to stare at nothing for hours, and a few other members have to put in effort, but 95% or so of the guild is putting in no more effort than anyone else on the server ... so why is it better to have a server where only they get to kill the dragons?

Because killing the dragon is the easiest part

Tracking it and pulling it before another guild does is the hard part.

If I just show up ... and kill the dragon (on my turn) .... then I'm just waiting till the item.i want drops.

Maybe this week im a warm body just pressing 1 to heal the tank and maybe next week im tracking for 10hrs to fill roles.

[Erati]

Originally Posted by Dagner [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

The elusiveness of not knowing what raid mob each guild is going to get every week, the ability to contest and attempt to kill each raid mob every week, the opportunity to potentially get that one item each week, is what keeps the majority of p99'ers logging in each week. Its what differentiates EQ from most games.

[bthomsen0312]

Originally Posted by loramin [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I <3 this post. And I also agree with a lot of it.

OF COURSE it should take time and effort to obtain top equipment. But nothing about rotations changes that: you still have to kill the dragons!

As far as EverQuest, the actual game we are all here to play, is concerned, everyone still has to "put in the work" to get the treasure by killing the dragons, regardless of the system that allocates the dragons.

Furthermore, for all your claims about the "time and effort" put in, the vast majority of members of the top guilds don't have to put in that time and effort. Yes the trackers have to stare at nothing for hours, and a few other members have to put in effort, but 95% or so of the guild is putting in no more effort than anyone else on the server ... so why is it better to have a server where only they get to kill the dragons?

I think you seriously don't get what makes the upper echelon of raiders sign in every week.

If you want mobs that you can login and just kill TLP and P2002 both will let you do that. You try to justify that instances != rotations but they effectively are (you are 100% going to get a shot at every mob in the zone)

if you want to kill TOV loramin, join an actual competitive raiding guild (AG CORE AM), or put in a HUGE amount of effort to get the tools necessary to make anonymous competitive.

[Gatordash]

Originally Posted by loramin [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I <3 this post. And I also agree with a lot of it.

OF COURSE it should take time and effort to obtain top equipment. But nothing about rotations changes that: you still have to kill the dragons!

As far as EverQuest, the actual game we are all here to play, is concerned, everyone still has to "put in the work" to get the treasure by killing the dragons, regardless of the system that allocates the dragons.

Furthermore, for all your claims about the "time and effort" put in, the vast majority of members of the top guilds don't have to put in that time and effort. Yes the trackers have to stare at nothing for hours, and a few other members have to put in effort, but 95% or so of the guild is putting in no more effort than anyone else on the server ... so why is it better to have a server where only they get to kill the dragons?

The competitive aspect and the teamwork involved of getting the dragon to your camp adds a layer of difficulty to killing the dragon and is something I find enjoyable and would not want to get rid of. To be fair, I'm relatively new to tov dragons, but different situations due to some variance along the line of a pull happens every week that make each pull different. So even though we are re-playing the same content, chances are I'm going to see a new situation on one of the pulls that I haven't seen before. This makes the game more fun imo and would be something I would not get to experience with a rotation system.

As far as time and effort go, I disagree with you that being a "warm body" or whatever in a raiding guild is the same amount of time and effort to get pixels as you would put forth in a rotation system. Try apping to Core/AM/AG (don't actually cause I know you love anon =P). Put in the time to get your character to meet their raid requirements, and put in the time on raids and earn the dkp until you can bid and upgrade an item on your shaman. And then tell me thats the same as scheduling Anon's ToV time slot for March 22nd @5 pm pst or whatever it would be.

[loramin]

Originally Posted by bthomsen0312 [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I think you seriously don't get what makes the upper echelon of raiders sign in every week.

I'm so completely out in left field that I don't think that what's desired by the upper echelon of raiders is necessarily what is best for the server overall [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Originally Posted by bthomsen0312 [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

If you want mobs that you can login and just kill TLP and P2002 both will let you do that. You try to justify that instances != rotations but they effectively are (you are 100% going to get a shot at every mob in the zone)

"If you don't think P99 is perfect go play somewhere else! ... don't, you know, try and make P99 better" [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Originally Posted by bthomsen0312 [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

if you want to kill TOV loramin, join an actual competitive raiding guild (AG CORE AM), or put in a HUGE amount of effort to get the tools necessary to make anonymous competitive.

Again, this has nothing to do with me wanting loot or the size of the current guild I'm in. In case I haven't been clear by repeating it over, and over, I'm (literally) not talking about what's best for Loramin or Loramin's current guild: I'm talking about what's best for the server.

[Fifield]

Originally Posted by loramin [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Again, this has nothing to do with me wanting loot or the size of the current guild I'm in. In case I haven't been clear by repeating it over, and over, I'm (literally) not talking about what's best for Loramin or Loramin's current guild: I'm talking about what's best for the server.

Whats best for the server is whats currently going on, guilds working together on disputes rather then the Tempest way of going straight to GM's.

We all fuck up, we just make it right between guilds and all is good. Feels good raiding right now on P99. A simple tell goes a long way.

[Fabby]

ah man I wanted to post but this went to shit so fast. <3 Omni, good post, won't solve anything sadly, still <3 ya.

[bthomsen0312]

Originally Posted by loramin [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

"If you don't think P99 is perfect go play somewhere else! ... don't, you know, try and make P99 better" [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

again - you are taking the context out. You can play both. no one told you to leave, but if you think you "should be able to kill all the content" at your leisure

If you want to play a casual game that lets you do that there are plenty of other options, please stop trying to turn classic everquest (one of the original "hardcore" games) into a casual game