Catherins attempt at lawyering

[knix]

Originally Posted by arsenalpow [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

TMO and IB can just swap mobs indefinitely where the class R guilds are painted into a corner because we've created a rotation. We aren't going to break the rotation to avoid punishment because we aren't assholes but it's almost like that's what you want, to sow a bit of chaos.

Rarely if EVER does TMO or IB do anything to each other to intentionally cause a raid infraction, but with pathing, and attempts going for FTE at the same time, shit happens. Also we all have newer players that newb it up and accidentally train the other team. And when that happens, we step up. (remember the FFA VS we accidentally trained trackers?, not only did we give up that attempt at VS (that BDA took down) , but we got the next VS and the loots to the guild we harmed.)

I mean we look at some fraps and say, what were they thinking, but some fraps/screenshots look like Catherine's attempt to disparage us at Sev. I am sure IB feels the same way.

IF BDA wouldn't have jumped in and helped Taken on that naggy, OR Responded to our officer at the time, when we pointed out via tells and OOC that what they were doing Right now was in violation of the rules, you wouldn't have to pretend to take the high road "not going to break class R rotation".

If BDA didn't jump in to help Taken on that naggy to screw TMO who was there waiting, why did they (BDA) join in Taken's fight.

[Anichek]

Originally Posted by Derubael [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

naw we get along just fine, whatchu talkin about?

I was not serious when I made this post:



But since you really, really want to see me totally lose it this morning, I'll simply point out three things:

1) Nothing in your post disproves anything I said. Unbrella's petition was literally ignored for a ridiculous amount of time, at which point it was finally addressed in a Skype call with Myself, Sirken, and Unbrella, where a mediation was requested. i don't know if Sirken was even fully aware of what he was telling you not to worry about during your conversation together - and yes, I can see why having this brought back up months later may have frustrated you - but the fact remains that you had both GM's agreeing to mediate for the TMO dispute against BDA

2) We have few viable options when "forced" to discipline Class R guilds when a dispute cannot be mediated by players, due to the way Class R rotates mobs. If we tak away, say, the next FFA Nagafen.... there's no real punishment there - we have no idea if you would have even gone after that target to begin with. So we are more or less forced to take away a rotation mob if it becomes necessary to address a situation that way. To be perfectly honest I am very thankful that you guys in Class-R rarely have conflicts like this that need to be escalated to that level, as they seem to be more difficult to find a fair and appropriate punishment for a violation.

To close this out, your last statement, while perfectly legitimate from your point of view, lacks the full picture required to truly make that judgement. Any bias that you may have thought was present is a combination of growing pains from the raid scene transition combined with biased perception of events - don't take that to be an insult, almost everyone carries some kind of bias, especially without having access to any of the Class C disputes - where mobs are forfeited all the time to compensate for infractions. I think that over time it will become clear we are really striving for fairness and cooperation as often as is possible in today's raid scene.

Now lets stop trying to make my head explode, ty!

Heads exploding - requesting code changes to implement that into game, please.

[Ravager]

It will be a fun day when Deru loses it, logs on and just starts Deathtouching people at random.

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[Ella`Ella]

Originally Posted by Metallikus [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Why does derubael think class R and class C guilds should be punished differently?

Class C guilds have disputes, forfeit mobs that they may or may not even have gone after.

CLass R guilds do not have disputes with eachother.

When a Class C guild has a violation: dinacarl on orders from umbrella, intentionally trains BDA in fear. clear evidence to support. GMs tell TMO to stay out of fear for 3 days in which an FFA draco spawned.

When a Class R guild has a violation: 16 people from one guild attack a dying dragon for faction hit on a FFA Naggy.

Ftfy

[Aviann]

Originally Posted by Metallikus [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Why does derubael think class R and class C guilds should be punished differently?

Because the reason why we have this stupid raid stalemate is because what is now known as the class C guilds, or a majority thereof, didn't want to let anyone else have fun.


Not saying that is his opinion, but I could definitely feel the logic behind what would be the answer.

[Argh]

Originally Posted by Metallikus [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Why does derubael think class R and class C guilds should be punished differently?

I think his point is that an R guild being suspended for an FFA spawn isn't a real punishment because it is unlikely that the R guild will be successful in getting an FFA mob, whereas a C guild being suspended from an FFA spawn is an actual punishment because they are likely to get that FFA mob as FFA mobs are de facto C mobs at this point.

[FindCorpse]

All I am saying here is seems like same old people interested in personally attacking others rather than constructively criticizing and accomplishing some sort of goal. I am so casual on this server now I am a non factor. Cecily you know I haven't stuck my dirty rotten taken nose in anything that's a generalization. Rants and flames is for entertainment value only, if you want to try to make changes you all know where to make the posts. Your leadership and our leadership can work things out just not in this forum.

[Cecily]

Originally Posted by FindCorpse [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

All I am saying here is seems like same old people interested in personally attacking others rather than constructively criticizing and accomplishing some sort of goal. I am so casual on this server now I am a non factor. Cecily you know I haven't stuck my dirty rotten taken nose in anything that's a generalization. Rants and flames is for entertainment value only, if you want to try to make changes you all know where to make the posts. Your leadership and our leadership can work things out just not in this forum.

I was kidding. I do maintain that the raid scene is fine, it's just the people in it who suck. We all need to grow up and stop hating on one another and trying to screw each other over with petitions. Imagine if all guilds lost the hostile attitude, would be a completely different feel to the server.

[FindCorpse]

Originally Posted by Cecily [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I was kidding. I do maintain that the raid scene is fine, it's just the people in it who suck. We all need to grow up and stop hating on one another and trying to screw each other over with petitions. Imagine if all guilds lost the hostile attitude, would be a completely different feel to the server.

I have literally been saying that for years, look at my old username Deneauth you will see lol. I am an old timer on this server now I have seen some shit and to be completely honest even though its not perfect this is the healthiest I have ever seen the raid scene on this server. I still like the idea of class R class C rotation with a full FFA on repop with a bag limit of some kind. VP personally doesn't interest me at all I truly don't have the time right now to complete my key.

[ManosMan]

Originally Posted by Cecily [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Imagine if all guilds lost the hostile attitude, would be a completely different feel to the server.

No kidding? I'm sure I'm not the only case of a good raider checking out this server, getting close to 60, scoping out the forums to see which guild looks good and then never logging in to the actual game again. What the hell is the point? I could hit 60, apply to a 'class C' guild with a link to a phone app called "Apply to BDA" where you tap around catching flying dicks in your mouth, and get loot handed to me at the price of my soul, or I could apply and join an unambitious 'class R' guild who seems very content eating monthly scraps that fall from the government cheese platter.

I'd rather play red.............