When are they Implementing the Charm Nerf?

[loramin]

Originally Posted by Jibartik [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Ok so you are saying you could solo clear and camp tranix on your shaman?

Why is there not one person in history that did that on during p99s timeline on live?

No I am not. Loramin started in Velious, so he wasn't even 60 back then.

But again, people doing crazy stuff at the end of the game (when we have way more time than live people did) is very different from one class (and only one class) being played differently their entire leveling life.

Originally Posted by PatChapp [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I played on rallos so my memory is going to be skewed. I was regularly ganked on my human sk by charm pets,or shaman and their op dots on classic
. I really don't think this box emulates every class perfectly other than enchanters.
Druids could dot kite, necros would dot kite with a pet chasing the mob. Lots of examples of things that are different on p99 than classic eq, if that's your current argument.

I'm not talking about any of the https://wiki.project1999.com/Non-Classic_Compendium stuff (ie. the known/acknowledged unclassic stuff) or stuff like mobs taking full damage from DoTs while moving ... for the first X months of the server.

I'm talking about the game overall. We have a really, really good emulator: it feel just like the original in almost every way. There are undoubtedly some minor details off, but for the most part the game plays the same as it did over 20 years ago ... except with charm (and the one class most heavily tied to it in particular, although again Druids, Necros and Bard are impacted too).

[DMN]

Originally Posted by loramin [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

No I am not. Loramin started in Velious, so he wasn't even 60 back then.

are you saying you started playing EQ during velious?

[loramin]

Originally Posted by DMN [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

are you saying you started playing EQ during velious?

Yes, right at the start.

[DMN]

Originally Posted by loramin [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Yes, right at the start.

Do you have any idea of how much this damages your credibility when you make such broad sweeping claims about "how things were in classic" when you knew virtually nothing about it?

[commongood]

Originally Posted by loramin [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

It doesn't matter if they are OP are not; what matters is that they weren't OP in classic. Anyone who played in classic remembers Enchanters as a grouping class: they cast haste and C2, they mezzed adds, and maybe (if they were bored) they got hit to have their animation attack (although honestly I don't even remember them doing that very often).

Originally Posted by DMN [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

are you saying you started playing EQ during velious?

Originally Posted by loramin [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Yes, right at the start.

[loramin]

Originally Posted by DMN [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

the typical population of enchanters for most of classic was around 5-7% percent of the server, in vanillla on some servers it was as low as 2-3%. The population on p99 is, what? 30%? which is to say relative to classic you will be seeing enchanters doing anhything and everything from 500% more often to 1000% greater frequency.Mystery explained.

To me, that reads like an argument that our server is highly unclassic! In other words, because our emulator emulates Enchanters poorly, lots more people choose them than they would if our emulator was accurate. Thank you for the support [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Or, like I keep saying:

Originally Posted by loramin [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

All I know is that a Street Fighter II emulator where no one wants to Dragon Punch with Ryu is not a good emulator. You don't have to know anything about how damage works in Street Fighter II to know that: if you played the arcade game back in the day, you know Ryu players want to Dragon Punch.

(Only your point is reversed, so it's more like, if 3% of players played Ryu, and now 30% do on the emulator, that suggests the emulator made Dragon Punch too powerful.)

Originally Posted by DMN [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

But the real question in all of this as I've asked you many times before and you conveniently ignore it, if you are so concerned about non classic RATES of behaviors, why do you have no issue with torpor soloing shaman or bard swarm kiting. anywhere around 10-15% of enchanters in classic were playing just as they do on p99 by mid kunark, while the percent of bards that where swaming dozens of mobs or shman torpor soloing high end obs : 0.0000000000000000001%. Why the bias, bro?

Originally Posted by loramin [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

But again, people doing crazy stuff at the end of the game (when we have way more time than live people did) is very different from one class (and only one class) being played differently their entire leveling life.

[Jibartik]

well once again loramin you have outlasted me and I shall return to my own lands ive given it all i got.

[loramin]

So you're saying that in this thread I'm talking about Enchanters grouping, but my experience with that subject is invalid because ... I only spent a year grouping with Enchanters in classic? [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Meanwhile, my own personal experience has nothing to do with the wealth of classic evidence that also shows Enchanters were considered a group class in classic. You don't like my message, so you're shooting the messenger ... but it doesn't change the veracity of that message.

If you want to attack the message, post classic evidence that shows most Enchanters were charm soloers ... don't shoot the messenger for "only" playing a year of classic, and remembering how Enchanters were back then.

[-Catherin-]

Originally Posted by loramin [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

my own personal experience has nothing to do with the wealth of classic evidence that also shows Enchanters were considered a group class in classic.

Except it's been made pretty clear that your evidence is not actually evidence. You put yourself out there as a pretty knowledgeable guy, so surely you understand what evidence actually is. You have also implied time and time again that your own experiences validate your arguement. They don't.

[loramin]

Originally Posted by -Catherin- [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Except it's been made pretty clear that your evidence is not actually evidence. You put yourself out there as a pretty knowledgeable guy, so surely you understand what evidence actually is. You have also implied time and time again that your own experiences validate your arguement. They don't.

I consider both my year of playing during the classic era and the various guides and Allakhazam posts I've listed to be relevant, yes.

If you don't, well ... I'd just point out that you have a dog in this fight (you don't want your class to get less powerful), whereas I don't: I'm purely arguing for the point of this place, ie. to make it as classic as possible. But look, if all I provided was a single Caster's Realm guide with a single player saying anything to the effect "you should group because charm is risky solo" ... I'd still have provided more evidence than you have to this conversation.

But I would love to see you provide some! If I'm wrong, it should be easy to find tons of posts of Enchanters (and Druids/Bards/Necros) shouting from the rooftops "hey, charm is easy and safe, it's the way to level in this game". You can absolutely find tons posts for Necros saying "soloing beats grouping" right? Because Necros did solo a ton in classic! If Enchanter solo charming (or even group charming) was such a common thing in '99-'01, there should be lots of people saying as much back then.

And yet ... I expect you won't (just like you won't find people talking about combat bind wounds in classic). You'll certainly find examples of Enchanters charming, but not that that most Enchanters in classic thought charm soloing was the fast way to level, or that charming in groups was a reliable thing you could do all the time ... because (again) charm was not easy and safe in classic. As a result, most Enchanters grouped, and only charmed rarely when they did.