sk starting points

[Troxx]

Originally Posted by Jimjam [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Are you certain it would be a similar proportional difference? Obviously str influences the size of the Di component and weights the d20 in favour of rolling higher, but it doesn’t improve damage bonus. Proportionally how much of dps is db for something like a greatspear (excellent) compared to a hate 1hander (good)?

I’m not certain at all. I have suspected you are correct due to the DB being static and favoring 2handers. I was trying to keep it as simple as possible. DSM has a deficiency in basic abstract thought and reasoning. You can’t simply say that two parses “showed almost the same results” when the high DPS weapon from NTOV went up by 3 total dps (up 4%) and the crappy 1 hand dps from hate (which does closer to 2/5 the baseline damage … possibly less) had a 4 raw dps improvement (up 16%).

Those findings were nowhere near the same thing - but DSM looks at 3 and 4 and says “oh gosh-jee golly 3 and 4 are both numbers, small numbers and are numbers next to each other!! Huzzah your parse says the same thing as mine!!’

I would prefer to parse with my 2 hander but fights would have been over 2-3x as fast unless I picked a mob with much higher hp. Additionally it has that nasty 725 dmg dot over 6 ticks - my skeleton (top sekrit area where you hunt VP key piece) would have died. I tried to do the dark blue giants in FM at the bottom of the fort but it was camped by 2 59s.

I honestly think Kael arena mobs might be perfect for this with a shaman/knight duo. If the knight is not hasted there is a good chance the regen on the mob keeps pace with a solo knight whacking away.

Regardless, as previously posted I’m disinclined to believe that any further tests would be productive. DSM so wildly ran in the wrong direction with my very bad data … what’s the point?

… unless the point is that we want another 475 pages lol

[Troxx]

Originally Posted by Lune [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Oh shit, DSM as in DSM-V, I just got it lol

Please tell me it's an elaborate troll

It was a tongue in cheek doctorly jab. I’m glad someone picked up on it lol.

[You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

By the by, I have 2 level 1 female alts named Thelarche and Menarche.

[Troxx]

Originally Posted by Snaggles [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I spent about an hour and a half attacking Bloodmaw and got very little useful information from it.

I have found bloodmaw and Mr turtle exceptionally good for comparing one weapon setup vs another setup - but that’s about it. Even then because of their low level it still doesn’t give you a perfect reflection of what you would expect on high end raid targets with high ac. In those fights damage bonus becomes a lot more important.

For example prior to the 2hand DB update TStaff and dual wield were very similar on bloodmaw but epic fist + a good offhand won on high ac raid targets due to lightening application of that static DB. After the 2h DB patch, TStaff wins all the time as dmg bonus on 30 delay 2hander is superior to DB on even super fast epic fists.

[DeathsSilkyMist]

The meltdown from Troxx has been spectacular, and a little sad. So many paragraphs spouting literal nonsense, instead of simply admitting he was wrong.

He is so afraid to be wrong he cannot even say what mob he was parsing.

For people interested in the topic at hand https://www.project1999.com/forums/s...&postcount=211 here is real data. Thus far +20STR has provided me with 1.5 DPS over 40 minutes of autoattacks.

[Crede]

Originally Posted by DeathsSilkyMist [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

The meltdown from Troxx has been spectacular, and a little sad. So many paragraphs spouting literal nonsense, instead of simply admitting he was wrong.

He is so afraid to be wrong he cannot even say what mob he was parsing.

For people interested in the topic at hand https://www.project1999.com/forums/s...&postcount=211 here is real data. Thus far +20STR has provided me with 1.5 DPS over 40 minutes of autoattacks.

Your constant editing is getting super annoying tbh. I actually saw that edit where you further changed it to bash Troxx even more. It's a bit borderline obsessive, you should really work on articulating your thoughts in full before posting.

Regardless, the fact that you showed 20 STR with a 2h increased your dps by nearly 3 pretty much proves that STR is the best leveling stat for a melee. This is something all should be aware of, and can decide what is best for their situation and how they plan to play their char. Even if you cap STR eventually, it's not really a big deal, because the trade off was you got to enjoy that extra DPS for a significant amount of time vs getting some extra mana at 60 once you cap STR that is unlikely to have any actual impact on anything you do besides the comfy feeling of knowing you optimized end game stats, which again depends on the player and how they want to react to it.

[Troxx]

Do you not find it odd that on Mr Turtle your 24/22 1.09 ratio 1hander was only 3.6% less damage than your 46/44 1.04 damage 2 hander with its massive damage bonus advantage?

Keep in mind that you get a damage bonus of 11 with every 1h hit. At 44 delay you get a DB of 37 with every hit. To break that down further at 34% haste assuming you couldn’t double attack per swing:

1h swing every 1.64 seconds for 11 dmg is 6.7 DB dmg per second potential
2h swing per 3.28 seconds for 37 dmg is 11.2 DB dmg per second potential

With double attack the potential difference is 13.4 and 22.4 respectively.

Your ToV 2hander should be putting out a ton more damage than the 1hander.

My parses used a 27/29 (0.93) and at 34% haste I was clocking well under half the damage output you did. The ratio and dmg bonus difference aren’t off by a factor of being 2.17x less damage man

TLDR version: Mr Turtle is a bad parse target.

[DeathsSilkyMist]

Originally Posted by Crede [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Your constant editing is getting super annoying tbh. I actually saw that edit where you further changed it to bash Troxx even more. It's a bit borderline obsessive, you should really work on articulating your thoughts in full before posting.

Your desire to attack/troll people instead of having civil conversation is a much bigger problem. I am simply defending myself, Troxx started the attacks.

Originally Posted by Crede [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Regardless, the fact that you showed 20 STR with a 2h increased your dps by nearly 3 pretty much proves that STR is the best leveling stat for a melee. This is something all should be aware of, and can decide what is best for their situation and how they plan to play their char. Even if you cap STR eventually, it's not really a big deal, because the trade off was you got to enjoy that extra DPS for a significant amount of time vs getting some extra mana at 60 once you cap STR that is unlikely to have any actual impact on anything you do besides the comfy feeling of knowing you optimized end game stats, which again depends on the player and how they want to react to it.

Thus far my average DPS is 1.5, not 3. This number will probably go down on a lower level character, unless someone can provide evidence to the contrary.

The boost you are getting from STR is small, just like the boost from STA or INT. INT simply gives you it's benefits longer, due to STR being easy to cap.

Originally Posted by Troxx [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

My fight was against a trivial but nevertheless within xp giving range mob.

TLDR version: Mr Turtle is a bad parse target.

You haven't provided any evidence to suggest the turtle is skewing the data in a way that would matter for this discussion. You can't even tell us what mob you are parsing on lol.

Originally Posted by Troxx [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

My parses used a 27/29 (0.93) and at 34% haste I was clocking well under half the damage output you did. The ratio and dmg bonus difference aren’t off by a factor of being 2.17x less damage man.

I keep telling you, your parser is probably wrong, and bad. You could give us the logs so we can parse it ourselves.

[Troxx]

Originally Posted by DeathsSilkyMist [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

You can't even tell us what mob you are parsing on lol.

If you bothered to read, I told you what mob a few posts back.

Do you even read posts fully before commenting?

Edit for Hint: read post 221

[DeathsSilkyMist]

Originally Posted by Troxx [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

If you bothered to read, I told you what mob a few posts back.

Do you even read posts fully before commenting?

You gave a vague description. Mob name and precise location, please. I know what post you are referring to, but I am not sure why you cannot just say the name.

You should have told us in the same post as your parse lol.

[Troxx]

https://wiki.project1999.com/Greater_Plaguebone

I told you why I never mentioned the name. It was not to be secretive… it was because on analyzing the data it became apparent that the whole parse was insufficient to draw any conclusions. In that same post I stated as much. The test showed results so wildly in my favor with a 16% difference in damage between 140 and 160 strength that I knew the data was worthless. Nevertheless I posted my findings complete with an honest breakdown of the flaws and the need to scrap and find a more suitable target. Preferably higher level and where I could grind out a session of at least 2 hours. I was there for a total of a dozen or so short runs - not nearly enough data.

Someone came in and needed the camp for VP key. I chose that particular of the 3 skeletons because it was the highest level of them with the biggest max hit.

I would have needed to gather at least 3-5x more total data to help even out the RNG.