Aftermath eating a full 10 days raid suspension

[Gimp]

Yikes indeed

[TMBLOW]

Chest gave us the 'OK' sign and unwritten precedent occurred in VP - we're in the clear boys! Thanks for adopting our leader's rule-set Sirken!

- Aftermath

[Batso]

Everyone ran off the line in KC when the earthquake happened after the velious release date was announced.

[VANVEM]

Originally Posted by arsenalpow [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Here's the bottom line, and everyone knows I hate Detoxx, but Aftermath didn't do anything illegal this time. It may have been grimy to ice Tormax after getting FTE but it was within the rules because the rule was shitty. It's perfectly normal to take off the second the ground shakes. I've seen multiple VP footraces under those exact same circumstances.

I don't like the ruling, I don't like Detoxx and his short bus crew, but they are legally in the clear on this one. They just suck as human beings, but I guess being pixel rich is worth it?

I'll take your word on the FTE, but you or anyone of the people here from aftermath please show me where in the "new" kael rules it changes:

Q12: What exactly does the Staff consider a stall?
A: As far as engage stalls, the Staff will grant you one DA, or about that much time on an engage before considering it a stall. So it’s important that guilds do not engage a mob until they are ready to kill it. The spirit of the rule (and what we are looking to do here) is to prevent guilds from locking up a target before they are ready to kill it, just to prevent other guilds that are ready to kill it first/faster. If you stall, you need to drop aggro immediately and concede/forfeit the mob. Any number of players can be considered to be stalling a mob, what we look for is the engage of the kill force. I know some of you want an exact number of seconds, or players, or DPS done, but the fact is that’s just not realistic with guilds being so vastly different in numbers and strength while also competing for the same content. The most important thing here is the statement about the spirit of this rule stated above.

Please do not respond with They didn't answer or they said unlimited time, neither of those addresses the fact that FTE was gained with no intent to engage. Which according to Sirken's raid rule is The spirit of the rule

so with that said, what they did was NOT entirely legal. Again I don't think it warrants a 10 day suspenson, but allowing someone to "teach the server a lesson" by Blatantly breaking the Spirit of the Rule. has to be the Absofuckinglutley worst thing we could do to try and make the server a better place.

[sheepshop]

If you listened at all you would know that the kael race and die idea was adopted to prevent training around mobs that one shot you in a super populated zone.

[Kodim]

I think we need to continue arguing about vague rules, to the guy who created and approved the rules himself.

Might get somewhere.

[Loke]

Never thought I'd say this, but gotta respect Chest for not trying to take advantage of this situation. People trying to turn everything they don't like into a raid suspension are just as bad as people looking for every way possible to bend the rules - both sides contribute to the ridiculous lawyer questing that has developed on this server. This situation was clearly not how the rule was intended to be interpreted, but it also didn't break any rules and could have easily been avoided.

People need to stop acting like children. Instead of looking for solutions half the people in here are just cranky and out for their pound of flesh. I havent been involved with raid disputes for years, but back when I handled GM stuff for DA we never had problems working stuff out because I was dealing with people like Xz, Cyrano and Ektar, who were able to be objective even when they felt they were wronged. When we accidentally trained them, they'd often take us at our word and we'd return the favor when they did it to us. If all youre concerned with is how you can use the present situation to your own benefit, you're never going to be able to work shit out with your competition. Instead of bitching, maybe try working with people - especially when they're openly asking for help clarifying the rule in question.

Or just keep lawyer questing and make things worse. I don't speak for Aftermath in any capacity, but any time a guild I was in got hit with a BS suspension, it just motivated everyone to double down on lawyer questing in an attempt to get their competition suspended for similar BS.

[arsenalpow]

This servers high end raid scene is built with the bricks of shitting on rules, both the actual rules and spirit of the rules. What happened the other day is just par for the course man. Why argue about it?

[Ella`Ella]

Originally Posted by arsenalpow [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

This servers high end raid scene is built with the bricks of shitting on rules, both the actual rules and spirit of the rules. What happened the other day is just par for the course man. Why argue about it?

Because there aren't supposed to be these rules beyond the basics of KSing/Training/Ninja Looting. The game wasn't engineered to have all this player and staff intervention. You're creating an artificial raid environment to try and float more guilds at the top than the game is meant to support.

[ArumTP]

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