So, just how bad are Wizards pre-60

[Aadill]

Originally Posted by sox7d [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

My main was a wizard, retired at 60 because my excel spreadsheets had just confirmed their worthlessness in traditional groups. Not to say they aren't good on raids, quadding or chardok.


I now main a ranger, and have nothing but good to say about them. Hell, my ranger had more sustained DPS at 40 than my wizard did at 60.

My main is a ranger and I have a wizard alt <3

[Tiggles]

Wizards are good for Raiding in class C if you don't raid then you won't like your wizard.

[Ezalor]

wizards are great for pug groups for when shit hits the fan

a.k.a. unexpected repops/adds/a bad pull. a good wizard will evac to entrance and save your group's ass, or have the mana on reserve to nuke the add/repop into orbit. this has saved me many deaths and a good wizard is 100% worth the member slot.

their sustained dps sucks balls though

[sox7d]

Originally Posted by Ezalor [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

enchanters are great for pug groups for when shit hits the fan

a.k.a. unexpected repops/adds/a bad pull. a good druid will evac to entrance and save your group's ass, or have the mana on reserve to heal the party. this has saved me many deaths and a good anything but wizard is 100% worth the member slot.

their sustained dps sucks balls though

[joran]

I love playing wizard [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.] (Im only level 40)

sometimes its hard to find groups though

wizards have a bad rap because we med so much ... some wizards go afk without saying anything (perhaps for longer than a med as well). this shit makes people say "Wiz are always afk in groups" ... which is only partially true :P


PBAoE is flat out the most kick ass thing in the game imho
Quadding is fun .... but im poor with shitty gear ... so I cant quad without running out of mana

[Vexenu]

Saying that Wizards can contribute to an XP group is like saying that you can eat oatmeal with a hammer. Technically, sure, you could. But why the fuck would you bother when there's no shortage of spoons? In that case it's just an exercise in masochism, which is the same psychology that must be motivating anyone who intentionally groups with a Wizard. Either that or dutiful Christian charity.

I say all this as a guy with a 60 Wizard (who I never joined even a single group with until Chardok).

[Pep]

This topic has been discussed again and again, and the posts before sum it up already, but meh, here I go:

there already exist classes for situations that get out of hand: enchanter (number one choice personally: charm, mez, root), bard (mez and charm) and the rest of the root-classes (druid, cleric, shaman, paladin, necromancer).

They all bring something to the table: heals, haste/slow, stuns, rezzes, lulls, AC buffs, twitches, tanking, and a long list of etceteras. A group has a maximum number of six players, why fill a slot with a sub-par class? To add insult to injury, most wizards will just sit and leech exp. The class has very little to offer to an exp group, and their players know it.

If a wizard is going to be saving mana in case he needs to quickly burn down a bad-pull or cast an evac, we may all as well put in a half-assed effort and save hit-points and heals and what-not for those one bad pulls. Even better, lets pull single mobs and wait for the whole group to hit full-mana before pulling another single mob "in case something unexpected happens".

The server is pretty mature at this point: most pullers are pretty proficient. And even if they aren't, there's usually someone in the group who can provide tips on how to pull the camp. And even then at higher levels pullers will rather die a champion's death during a bad pull than train their group and cause a wipe.

Not even for porting are they a prime choice (Hate/Sky raids excluded obviously), druids can invis evil races just like a wizard, and more importantly they can SoW. This class is fail, Sony/Verant did a fabulous job balancing all classes, wizards are the only glitch.

All in all, wizards may be an excellent class to control 0.5% of the bad pulls that the chanter has no mana to lock. Me, I'd much rather focus my group on performing great on the other 99.5%. And for the record, I'm also one of the people who wouldn't mind (too badly) having yet another hybrid penalizing everyones exp if that player is at least sort-of fun or just needs some exp.

[Kender]

Originally Posted by Pep [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

This topic has been discussed again and again, and the posts before sum it up already, but meh, here I go:

there already exist classes for situations that get out of hand: enchanter (number one choice personally: charm, mez, root), bard (mez and charm) and the rest of the root-classes (druid, cleric, shaman, paladin, necromancer).

They all bring something to the table: heals, haste/slow, stuns, rezzes, lulls, AC buffs, twitches, tanking, and a long list of etceteras. A group has a maximum number of six players, why fill a slot with a sub-par class? To add insult to injury, most wizards will just sit and leech exp. The class has very little to offer to an exp group, and their players know it.

If a wizard is going to be saving mana in case he needs to quickly burn down a bad-pull or cast an evac, we may all as well put in a half-assed effort and save hit-points and heals and what-not for those one bad pulls. Even better, lets pull single mobs and wait for the whole group to hit full-mana before pulling another single mob "in case something unexpected happens".

The server is pretty mature at this point: most pullers are pretty proficient. And even if they aren't, there's usually someone in the group who can provide tips on how to pull the camp. And even then at higher levels pullers will rather die a champion's death during a bad pull than train their group and cause a wipe.
Not even for porting are they a prime choice (Hate/Sky raids excluded obviously), druids can invis evil races just like a wizard, and more importantly they can SoW. This class is fail, Sony/Verant did a fabulous job balancing all classes, wizards are the only glitch.

All in all, wizards may be an excellent class to control 0.5% of the bad pulls that the chanter has no mana to lock. Me, I'd much rather focus my group on performing great on the other 99.5%. And for the record, I'm also one of the people who wouldn't mind (too badly) having yet another hybrid penalizing everyones exp if that player is at least sort-of fun or just needs some exp.

most pugs, the puller will train the group and often end up being the only one to survive

[sox7d]

Originally Posted by Pep [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

This topic has been discussed again and again, and the posts before sum it up already, but meh, here I go:

there already exist classes for situations that get out of hand: enchanter (number one choice personally: charm, mez, root), bard (mez and charm) and the rest of the root-classes (druid, cleric, shaman, paladin, necromancer).

They all bring something to the table: heals, haste/slow, stuns, rezzes, lulls, AC buffs, twitches, tanking, and a long list of etceteras. A group has a maximum number of six players, why fill a slot with a sub-par class? To add insult to injury, most wizards will just sit and leech exp. The class has very little to offer to an exp group, and their players know it.

If a wizard is going to be saving mana in case he needs to quickly burn down a bad-pull or cast an evac, we may all as well put in a half-assed effort and save hit-points and heals and what-not for those one bad pulls. Even better, lets pull single mobs and wait for the whole group to hit full-mana before pulling another single mob "in case something unexpected happens".

The server is pretty mature at this point: most pullers are pretty proficient. And even if they aren't, there's usually someone in the group who can provide tips on how to pull the camp. And even then at higher levels pullers will rather die a champion's death during a bad pull than train their group and cause a wipe.

Not even for porting are they a prime choice (Hate/Sky raids excluded obviously), druids can invis evil races just like a wizard, and more importantly they can SoW. This class is fail, Sony/Verant did a fabulous job balancing all classes, wizards are the only glitch.

All in all, wizards may be an excellent class to control 0.5% of the bad pulls that the chanter has no mana to lock. Me, I'd much rather focus my group on performing great on the other 99.5%. And for the record, I'm also one of the people who wouldn't mind (too badly) having yet another hybrid penalizing everyones exp if that player is at least sort-of fun or just needs some exp.

I was with you until that last line. You know a hybrid exp penalty just means they're treated as ~2 levels higher, right? If a group has a 25 rogue, 22 shaman and a 24 enchanter, if they invite a 23 ranger, they'll have the same leveling speed as if they invited another 25 rogue (per kill).

[NizmerThafen]

A level 60 wizard in Velious with http://wiki.project1999.com/Hsagra%27s_Wrath and http://wiki.project1999.com/Porlos%27_Fury finally gives them a notable edge over all other classes in terms of raid dps. They can easily do 20,000+ damage per raid target assuming the dragons or giants are not immune.

Outside of raid targets, ports to Sky and Hate, and AE groups they are at the bottom of the list in most aspects.