Spells: Low Level Charm

[mmiles8]

Yes, nothing is a guarantee. Just like how I can fail to make a clump of dough with a 15 trivial, with 191 baking.

[Ropethunder]

You can't compare baking to charming..

If you're so certain then please provide your source that it's perfectly normal for a decaying skeleton to instantly break a level 50 charm with 255 cha.

[mmiles8]

You wanted a simple yes or no answer and you got one. These boards are here to dicuss bugs, not sate your personal curiosity. If you don't like my analogy, feel free to do the research yourself.

You've been given the tools to do so.

[Ropethunder]

Originally Posted by mmiles8 [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

You wanted a simple yes or no answer and you got one.

And I clarified for you that I was a yes or no with some proof. I don't need you to be a magic 8 ball for me.

You're guessing and trying to convince me that it's right.

If you don't like my analogy, feel free to do the research yourself.

http://forums.station.sony.com/eq/po...topic_id=59559

1) Enc lvl v. mob level. If the mob is higher level than you it gets a better chance to break charm. You can charm a yellow con, but do not expect it to last long.

2) Mob MR. Since mobs get a resist check every tick, the lower their MR the better

3) CHA. If the mob passes the other checks you get another shot with your cha. Low probability of success.

[Aeolwind]

Thing to remember the most here is that we don't have the original formulas and interactions between charisma and charm durations....hell between anything and anything. It's done on a what feels appropriate scale. While I agree a level 6 mob shouldn't break that fast all the time, occasionally yes it should. Random Number Generation is evil.

I have to agree with what Miles is saying, get us some hard data and if it's more off than what we expect we'll look into it.

[Striiker]

Originally Posted by Aeolwind [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Thing to remember the most here is that we don't have the original formulas and interactions between charisma and charm durations....hell between anything and anything. It's done on a what feels appropriate scale. ...

I do not have any hard data to offer up. I just wanted to point out something which is certainly quite different from what live was in early 2000 when I played my enchanter. This is a qualitative observation I guess more than anything. The feel is way off on the low level charming.
As I had mentioned (and others too) Charming Griffawns and beetles in North Karana was a valid option for a low level enchanter. It is most certainly not an option on P99 as charm drops incredibly fast with great frequency. Perhaps someone will find some logs from long ago or some other information to satisfy the need for solid evidence. It will not benefit me any longer but I thought it should be mentioned for others starting out. Charming is one of our defining abilities and it's horribly broken (compared to what live was) and worth inspection / adjusting.

[Malrubius]

Below is a link to some hard stats (granted from PoP era, but still a lot closer to 1999 than live is now). The quote and link below are from a much more exhaustive post here.

Aeol, the post above has a lot of classic-era evidence beyond the piece below, although it is not hard numbers - more what Verant said they had done and how they had implemented things.

4 - Also, for the following *limited* test, which was unfortunately PoP-ERA :/, the data indicates the following...

With a 305 cha, and then, a 130 cha - and everything else that is relevant unchanged...

1 - Charm lasts ~10% longer with a 305 cha vs. 130 cha.
2 - Charm cast is completely RESISTED, MUCH more often with a lower cha (this surprised me).
3 - The guy's conclusion that #1 above corresponds to "almost no effect" is bogus imo. 10% is huge over time.

http://www.therunes.net/forums/viewt...735fa34e9b4a0f

[guineapig]

Originally Posted by Ropethunder [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

My point was that with those numbers I don't think it should even be possible for a level 6 to break charm before the full duration..

Yes it is possible.

Every mob has a chance for the charm to get resisted.
The mob also has a chance to break free of the charm every tick.
This is regardless of their level. The lower the level of the mob, the less the chance, but they still have a chance.

The reason why stats are important is because those are the numbers being checked.

If your charisma is maxed and the mobs magic resistance is below zero then, yeah in all likelihood charming a level 6 mob will last full duration. But we need to know if this was the case. In other words provide some information and we can provide answers.