Best 4 person all caster/priest group

[DeathsSilkyMist]

Originally Posted by Keebz [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

The fact that you guys think kill speed in Seb is the metric that defines "best" is telling.

I don't think this at all. Sadly people are unwilling to provide Mage data, so the only data I have is from Troxx in Seb hehe. I am comparing apples to apples.

[DeathsSilkyMist]

You were talking about Kael plate house. I never talked about it lol.

Blast of Poison is only useful if you want a nuke against ice immune mobs. In Kael your DoTs will tick longer because the mobs have more HP. I have done plenty of platehouse on my Shaman hehe.

Again, you are assuming the group is pulling mobs non-stop. That is not going to be the case in a higher level area. A Shaman will have time in-between encounters to recover mana lol. You are not going to be killing 70 mobs in an hour in Sebilis with a group, unless you are running from camp to camp and the zone is completely empty.

Your idea of resistances doesn't make sense. If the group is fighting a bunch of mobs with heavy resistances, then your Enchanters may not have any mobs to charm lol. What zone/camp are you thinking of where the Enchanters are able to charm good pets, while the other casters are unable to land any damage spells consistently, while they are killing mobs every 20 seconds?[You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Your DPS number is NOT accurate lol. You need to learn how to do basic DPS calculations.

If you are killing a mob in 24 seconds, you would use 2x Ice Strikes. That is 1350 / 24 = 56.25 DPS for 500 mana. 14 second cast time.

If you are killing a mob in 40 seconds, you would use Bane + E-Bolt. That is 5 ticks from Bane and 4 ticks from E-Bolt for a total of 150 + 110 + 1070 + 584 = 1914 /40 = 48 DPS for 750 mana. 12 second cast time.

The Shaman Pet is doing around 10-15 DPS. A Shaman is easily putting out 60-70 DPS against single targets, and has better mana sustainability than a Mage.

Remember, a Mage is putting out 80 DPS assuming perfect conditions (using nothing but nukes). The real DPS number is closer to the 70s.

If you want to include clickies, a mage is increasing their DPS by 18 if they get Boots of the Bladecaller. A Shaman can easily output that much DPS with JBB/Epic if necessary. There really is only about a 30 DPS gap between Shamans and Mages at best, and at worst it's around 10.

[Zuranthium]

Originally Posted by DeathsSilkyMist [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Blast of Poison is only useful if you want a nuke against ice immune mobs. In Kael your DoTs will tick longer because the mobs have more HP.

No your DoT's won't tick longer most of the time. The number I gave is already for fighting a 12k HP mob. It dies faster than 30 seconds. And again, even with an extra tick, E-bolt is worse than Blast of Poison. How long will it take you to understand?

Originally Posted by DeathsSilkyMist [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Again, you are assuming the group is pulling mobs non-stop. That is not going to be the case in a higher level area.

Yes it is going to be the case, in a group that wants to achieve the most. Aka, "the best 4 person group". There are plenty of zones that have enough content to support continuous killing with high DPS. I suppose it depends a bit on server population, but there are generally underutilized areas anyway.

It's not only about continuous killing, but also factoring in the time that it takes to move around a bit and loot corpses. You're not casting during those times, so it's the same thing of not being able to Canni in those time periods.

Originally Posted by DeathsSilkyMist [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Your idea of resistances doesn't make sense. If the group is fighting a bunch of mobs with heavy resistances, then your Enchanters may not have any mobs to charm lol. What zone/camp are you thinking of where the Enchanters are able to charm good pets, while the other casters are unable to land any damage spells consistently?

Resists happen regardless vs this level of MOBs, it doesn't need to be "heavy resists" to be a factor, you're talking complete nonsense. And in EVERY zone there are lower level things to Charm that you then bring over to another area; why do you constantly say such clueless things like this? Either way, Enchanters can still Charm, particularly with Malosini there. A pet that's a few levels higher will break a bit more frequently, but that is simply something the Enchanter is going to be managing away and is irrelevant to the discussion about Direct Damage resist rates.

Originally Posted by DeathsSilkyMist [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Your DPS number is NOT accurate lol. You need to learn how to do basic DPS calculations.

If you are killing a mob in 24 seconds, you would use 2x Ice Strikes. That is 1350 / 24 = 56.25 DPS for 500 mana. 14 second cast time.

My DPS number is very accurate, you're the one who is clueless and throwing around idiotic numbers like this.

You DO NOT HAVE THE MANA to do Ice Strike x2 every 24 seconds. In that period of time, you'd be able to Canni 3 times. When combined with C2, that's 300 mana you're able to generate every 24 seconds while trying to spam Ice Strikes. It wouldn't be 56 DPS regardless even if you could spam like that, because again, resists.

I will once again state, the best you can do is Bane of Nife + Blast of Poison every 30 seconds.

---

Originally Posted by Keebz [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

The fact that you guys think kill speed in Seb is the metric that defines "best" is telling.

When your group already has the tools to CC and stay alive, then of course kill speed is the metric that defines doing something better or not. Kill speed is inherently a form of defense too. When something dies faster, that means you're taking less damage.

[DeathsSilkyMist]

Karanis still has no evidence, and just likes to insult people when his side loses[You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

[DeathsSilkyMist]

All I can do is repost the actual math. I can't help anybody who doesn't understand it. I am tired of arguing with people who can't add a few numbers together. I am not going to be replying to trolls who cannot do simple math[You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

This post shows a level 60 Mage's average DPS. I will take into account damage shield since it was asked for.

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Average pet DPS: (46 + 60 + 56 + 52 + 75 + 57 + 50 + 55 + 52) / 9 = ~56 DPS.

A Mage with max Meditate and Clarity II is regenerating mana at 31 mana per tick. Let's assume this Mage has 3000 Mana to start with.

Max mana per hour: (31 mana x 10 ticks per minute x 60 minutes) + 3000 = 21600.

Shock of Steel costs 275 mana, so that means you can cast it a maximum of 78 times, assuming that is all you do and you meditate every tick.

Best possible player DPS: (825 damage x 78 nukes) / 3600 seconds = ~18 DPS.

For damage shield calculations it varies wildly based on what you are fighting, if you are using slow, etc.

I let a froglok jin wizard drain all of it's mana and then beat on me for a minute:

[Tue Aug 23 07:04:01 2022] froglok jin wizard was hit by non-melee for 8 points of damage.
[Tue Aug 23 07:04:03 2022] froglok jin wizard was hit by non-melee for 8 points of damage.
[Tue Aug 23 07:04:03 2022] froglok jin wizard was hit by non-melee for 8 points of damage.
[Tue Aug 23 07:04:06 2022] froglok jin wizard was hit by non-melee for 8 points of damage.
[Tue Aug 23 07:04:06 2022] froglok jin wizard was hit by non-melee for 8 points of damage.
[Tue Aug 23 07:04:13 2022] froglok jin wizard was hit by non-melee for 8 points of damage.
[Tue Aug 23 07:04:15 2022] froglok jin wizard was hit by non-melee for 8 points of damage.
[Tue Aug 23 07:04:22 2022] froglok jin wizard was hit by non-melee for 8 points of damage.
[Tue Aug 23 07:04:22 2022] froglok jin wizard was hit by non-melee for 8 points of damage.
[Tue Aug 23 07:04:27 2022] froglok jin wizard was hit by non-melee for 8 points of damage.
[Tue Aug 23 07:04:29 2022] froglok jin wizard was hit by non-melee for 8 points of damage.
[Tue Aug 23 07:04:31 2022] froglok jin wizard was hit by non-melee for 8 points of damage.
[Tue Aug 23 07:04:38 2022] froglok jin wizard was hit by non-melee for 8 points of damage.
[Tue Aug 23 07:04:38 2022] froglok jin wizard was hit by non-melee for 8 points of damage.
[Tue Aug 23 07:04:43 2022] froglok jin wizard was hit by non-melee for 8 points of damage.
[Tue Aug 23 07:04:45 2022] froglok jin wizard was hit by non-melee for 8 points of damage.
[Tue Aug 23 07:04:47 2022] froglok jin wizard was hit by non-melee for 8 points of damage.
[Tue Aug 23 07:04:47 2022] froglok jin wizard was hit by non-melee for 8 points of damage.
[Tue Aug 23 07:04:51 2022] froglok jin wizard was hit by non-melee for 8 points of damage.
[Tue Aug 23 07:04:51 2022] froglok jin wizard was hit by non-melee for 8 points of damage.
[Tue Aug 23 07:04:54 2022] froglok jin wizard was hit by non-melee for 8 points of damage.
[Tue Aug 23 07:04:54 2022] froglok jin wizard was hit by non-melee for 8 points of damage.
[Tue Aug 23 07:04:56 2022] froglok jin wizard was hit by non-melee for 8 points of damage.
[Tue Aug 23 07:04:58 2022] froglok jin wizard was hit by non-melee for 8 points of damage.
[Tue Aug 23 07:05:01 2022] froglok jin wizard was hit by non-melee for 8 points of damage.

That is 25 hits. A Mage's DS is 33, so that would be (33 x 25) / 60 = ~14 DPS. Basically an extra nuke.

This means a Mage is going to be doing around 88 DPS with an unfocused level 60 Water pet, with Clarity 2, with Damage Shield, while nuking at the absolute best. The real number is going to be lower, since a Mage is not realistically going to be using the maximum number of nukes per hour. They need to use mana for other things. The DS damage will probably be lower in a group too, since mobs may die faster than a minute, get slowed, etc. My guess is the real number is closer to 80 DPS.

If you use https://wiki.project1999.com/Boots_of_Bladecalling you will increase your DPS by a further 17, to end up at around 100 DPS, assuming you do nothing but spam the boots.

================================================== ================================================== =========

For Shaman DPS:

My Spells
=========
[Mon Aug 22 08:12:29 2022] You begin casting Bane of Nife.
[Mon Aug 22 08:12:34 2022] froglok jin shaman was hit by non-melee for 150 points of damage.
[Mon Aug 22 08:13:18 2022] Your Bane of Nife spell has worn off.

[Mon Aug 22 08:12:35 2022] You begin casting Envenomed Bolt.
[Mon Aug 22 08:12:41 2022] froglok jin shaman was hit by non-melee for 110 points of damage.
[Mon Aug 22 08:13:24 2022] Your Envenomed Bolt spell has worn off.


[Mon Aug 22 08:13:19 2022] You begin casting Bane of Nife.
[Mon Aug 22 08:13:24 2022] froglok jin shaman was hit by non-melee for 150 points of damage.
30 seconds (6 Ticks)

[Mon Aug 22 08:13:25 2022] You begin casting Envenomed Bolt.
[Mon Aug 22 08:13:31 2022] froglok jin shaman was hit by non-melee for 110 points of damage.
24 seconds (4 Ticks)

Enemy Spells
=========
[Mon Aug 22 08:13:24 2022] Froglok jin shaman feels much better. +270HP
[Mon Aug 22 08:13:32 2022] Froglok jin shaman feels much better. +270HP

Pet DPS
=========
[Mon Aug 22 08:12:21 2022] Xibarer kicks froglok jin shaman for 12 points of damage.
[Mon Aug 22 08:12:21 2022] Xibarer bites froglok jin shaman for 13 points of damage.
[Mon Aug 22 08:12:23 2022] froglok jin shaman was hit by non-melee for 8 points of damage.
[Mon Aug 22 08:12:23 2022] froglok jin shaman was hit by non-melee for 8 points of damage.
[Mon Aug 22 08:12:24 2022] Xibarer bites froglok jin shaman for 19 points of damage.
[Mon Aug 22 08:12:25 2022] froglok jin shaman was hit by non-melee for 8 points of damage.
[Mon Aug 22 08:12:26 2022] Xibarer bites froglok jin shaman for 24 points of damage.
[Mon Aug 22 08:12:26 2022] froglok jin shaman was hit by non-melee for 8 points of damage.
[Mon Aug 22 08:12:28 2022] Xibarer bites froglok jin shaman for 13 points of damage.
[Mon Aug 22 08:12:29 2022] Xibarer bites froglok jin shaman for 47 points of damage.
[Mon Aug 22 08:12:31 2022] Xibarer bites froglok jin shaman for 43 points of damage.
[Mon Aug 22 08:12:31 2022] Xibarer bashes froglok jin shaman for 16 points of damage.
[Mon Aug 22 08:12:33 2022] Xibarer bites froglok jin shaman for 34 points of damage.
[Mon Aug 22 08:12:35 2022] Xibarer bites froglok jin shaman for 17 points of damage.
[Mon Aug 22 08:12:42 2022] Xibarer bashes froglok jin shaman for 18 points of damage.
[Mon Aug 22 08:12:43 2022] Xibarer bites froglok jin shaman for 47 points of damage.
[Mon Aug 22 08:12:44 2022] froglok jin shaman was hit by non-melee for 8 points of damage.
[Mon Aug 22 08:12:45 2022] Xibarer bites froglok jin shaman for 47 points of damage.
[Mon Aug 22 08:12:47 2022] Xibarer bites froglok jin shaman for 39 points of damage.
[Mon Aug 22 08:12:47 2022] Xibarer bites froglok jin shaman for 47 points of damage.
[Mon Aug 22 08:12:49 2022] Xibarer bites froglok jin shaman for 24 points of damage.
[Mon Aug 22 08:12:52 2022] Xibarer bites froglok jin shaman for 41 points of damage.
[Mon Aug 22 08:12:53 2022] froglok jin shaman was hit by non-melee for 8 points of damage.
[Mon Aug 22 08:12:54 2022] Xibarer bites froglok jin shaman for 30 points of damage.
[Mon Aug 22 08:12:54 2022] Xibarer bites froglok jin shaman for 28 points of damage.
[Mon Aug 22 08:12:56 2022] Xibarer bites froglok jin shaman for 43 points of damage.
[Mon Aug 22 08:12:58 2022] Xibarer bashes froglok jin shaman for 20 points of damage.
[Mon Aug 22 08:13:01 2022] Xibarer bites froglok jin shaman for 12 points of damage.
[Mon Aug 22 08:13:03 2022] froglok jin shaman was hit by non-melee for 8 points of damage.
[Mon Aug 22 08:13:05 2022] Xibarer bites froglok jin shaman for 47 points of damage.
[Mon Aug 22 08:13:06 2022] Xibarer bites froglok jin shaman for 30 points of damage.
[Mon Aug 22 08:13:12 2022] Xibarer bites froglok jin shaman for 41 points of damage.
[Mon Aug 22 08:13:12 2022] froglok jin shaman was hit by non-melee for 8 points of damage.
[Mon Aug 22 08:13:15 2022] Xibarer bites froglok jin shaman for 12 points of damage.
[Mon Aug 22 08:13:17 2022] Xibarer bites froglok jin shaman for 47 points of damage.
[Mon Aug 22 08:13:19 2022] Xibarer bites froglok jin shaman for 47 points of damage.
[Mon Aug 22 08:13:19 2022] Xibarer bashes froglok jin shaman for 17 points of damage.
[Mon Aug 22 08:13:21 2022] Xibarer bites froglok jin shaman for 43 points of damage.
[Mon Aug 22 08:13:22 2022] Xibarer bites froglok jin shaman for 12 points of damage.
[Mon Aug 22 08:13:24 2022] froglok jin shaman was hit by non-melee for 8 points of damage.
[Mon Aug 22 08:13:26 2022] Xibarer bites froglok jin shaman for 12 points of damage.
[Mon Aug 22 08:13:29 2022] Xibarer bites froglok jin shaman for 43 points of damage.
[Mon Aug 22 08:13:30 2022] Xibarer kicks froglok jin shaman for 19 points of damage.
[Mon Aug 22 08:13:31 2022] Xibarer bites froglok jin shaman for 19 points of damage.
[Mon Aug 22 08:13:31 2022] Xibarer bites froglok jin shaman for 43 points of damage.
[Mon Aug 22 08:13:33 2022] froglok jin shaman was hit by non-melee for 8 points of damage.
[Mon Aug 22 08:13:33 2022] froglok jin shaman was hit by non-melee for 8 points of damage.
[Mon Aug 22 08:13:35 2022] Xibarer bites froglok jin shaman for 47 points of damage.
[Mon Aug 22 08:13:35 2022] Xibarer bashes froglok jin shaman for 19 points of damage.
[Mon Aug 22 08:13:36 2022] Xibarer bites froglok jin shaman for 13 points of damage.
[Mon Aug 22 08:13:36 2022] Xibarer bites froglok jin shaman for 12 points of damage.
[Mon Aug 22 08:13:38 2022] Xibarer bites froglok jin shaman for 47 points of damage.
[Mon Aug 22 08:13:40 2022] Xibarer bites froglok jin shaman for 47 points of damage.
[Mon Aug 22 08:13:40 2022] Xibarer bashes froglok jin shaman for 15 points of damage.
[Mon Aug 22 08:13:41 2022] You bash froglok jin shaman for 1 point of damage.
[Mon Aug 22 08:13:42 2022] Xibarer bites froglok jin shaman for 47 points of damage.
[Mon Aug 22 08:13:44 2022] Xibarer bites froglok jin shaman for 21 points of damage.
[Mon Aug 22 08:13:44 2022] Xibarer bites froglok jin shaman for 24 points of damage.
[Mon Aug 22 08:13:45 2022] Xibarer bites froglok jin shaman for 34 points of damage.
[Mon Aug 22 08:13:47 2022] Xibarer bites froglok jin shaman for 47 points of damage.
[Mon Aug 22 08:13:51 2022] Xibarer bites froglok jin shaman for 34 points of damage.
[Mon Aug 22 08:13:51 2022] Xibarer bites froglok jin shaman for 47 points of damage.
[Mon Aug 22 08:13:51 2022] Xibarer kicks froglok jin shaman for 22 points of damage.
[Mon Aug 22 08:13:52 2022] Xibarer bites froglok jin shaman for 28 points of damage.
[Mon Aug 22 08:13:52 2022] Xibarer bites froglok jin shaman for 26 points of damage.
[Mon Aug 22 08:13:54 2022] You have slain froglok jin shaman!

6,549 damage over 93 seconds = 70.5 DPS

This is 70.5 DPS to a froglok jin shaman in Sebilis just using a 50% hasted Spirit of the Howler pet and Bane of Nife + Envenomed Bolt. The pet is not max level. He is hitting for 47, so that is a lower end pet (max is 52, each level increases damage by 2). No need to root/rot with this setup in a group, and the DoTs only last 7 or 8 ticks.

A single set of Bane of Nife + Envenomed Bolt costs 745 mana. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HjZxMlJSCDc using this video, it looks like you can Torpor recover mana at around 14 mana per second. If you include C2, it is more like 16 mana per second. This means you can recover the 745 mana in 46 seconds. That is easily the length of a fight if Enchanters are fighting 2 mobs with charmed pets. This means the DPS is generally sustainable too.

If you are fighting mobs that die faster (under 30 seconds), you can use 2x Ice Strikes for 1350 damage. 1350 / 30 = 45 DPS minimum, plus pet DPS to get you around 60 DPS. But if you are in an area where mobs are dying this fast, you can increase your DPS by root/rotting mobs in one area while the Enchanters clear another. Root/Rotting 3 mobs with Epic Dot + Pox is ((1425 + 2088) x 3) / 108 second = 97 DPS. The mana cost is 1300, which is recoverable in 108 seconds based on the video above.

Best case scenario the difference between a Mage and a Shaman is about 30 DPS on average. Depending on how often the Shaman will be able to use Epic/JBB, that gap shrinks to 10 or less.

[Danth]

Originally Posted by DeathsSilkyMist [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

...

Funny enough you're under-valuing your own pet somewhat. You had a terrible one (1 above minimum level) and in our hypothetical group it'll always have much better enchanter haste.

Damage shield in a group like this one is almost as bad to figure as shaman root-dotting. First off you have to cut the magician DS effectively by a third because enchanter has its own weaker one. Second, frequent slow usage cripples those things and a lot of groups are going to do that, certainly against anything hard. Third, ping-ponging charm pet aggro means upkeep cost is higher than average due to having to cast it on more than one recipient. Opposite way, a group that *really* wants to use their damage shields can try to constaintly pull pairs, keep everything active and unslowed, apologize to their cleric for severely over-working him, and gain probably over 20 net DPS from it at the cost of an agitated cleric and more frequent average death rate. Pain in the neck to figure its true value.

Frankly for the DS we probably need to accept a standardized value similar to how aircraft performance charts correct to agreed-upon standardized atmospheric conditions. Discussion falls apart otherwise due to too many variables in stuff like that.

Danth

[DeathsSilkyMist]

Originally Posted by Danth [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Funny enough you're under-valuing your own pet somewhat. You had a terrible one (1 above minimum level) and in our hypothetical group it'll always have much better enchanter haste.

Damage shield in a group like this one is almost as bad to figure as shaman root-dotting. First off you have to cut the magician DS effectively by a third because enchanter has its own weaker one. Second, frequent slow usage cripples those things and a lot of groups are going to do that, certainly against anything hard. Third, ping-ponging charm pet aggro means upkeep cost is higher than average due to having to cast it on more than one recipient. Opposite way, a group that *really* wants to use their damage shields can try to constaintly pull pairs, keep everything active and unslowed, apologize to their cleric for severely over-working him, and gain probably over 20 net DPS from it at the cost of an agitated cleric and more frequent average death rate. Pain in the neck to figure that thing.

Frankly for the DS we probably need to accept a standardized value similar to how aircraft performance charts correct to agreed-upon standardized atmospheric conditions. Discussion falls apart otherwise due to too many variables in stuff like that.

Danth

Yes. Realistically I am undervaluing Shaman's a bit, while strong-manning the Mages. Even then the gap is 30 DPS or less hehe.

[DeathsSilkyMist]

All I can do is repost the actual math. I can't help anybody who doesn't understand it. I am tired of arguing with people who can't add a few numbers together. I am not going to be replying to trolls who cannot do simple math[You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.] Zuranthium yet again is just trying and failing to be smart.

This post shows a level 60 Mage's average DPS. I will take into account damage shield since it was asked for.

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Average pet DPS: (46 + 60 + 56 + 52 + 75 + 57 + 50 + 55 + 52) / 9 = ~56 DPS.

A Mage with max Meditate and Clarity II is regenerating mana at 31 mana per tick. Let's assume this Mage has 3000 Mana to start with.

Max mana per hour: (31 mana x 10 ticks per minute x 60 minutes) + 3000 = 21600.

Shock of Steel costs 275 mana, so that means you can cast it a maximum of 78 times, assuming that is all you do and you meditate every tick.

Best possible player DPS: (825 damage x 78 nukes) / 3600 seconds = ~18 DPS.

For damage shield calculations it varies wildly based on what you are fighting, if you are using slow, etc.

I let a froglok jin wizard drain all of it's mana and then beat on me for a minute:

[Tue Aug 23 07:04:01 2022] froglok jin wizard was hit by non-melee for 8 points of damage.
[Tue Aug 23 07:04:03 2022] froglok jin wizard was hit by non-melee for 8 points of damage.
[Tue Aug 23 07:04:03 2022] froglok jin wizard was hit by non-melee for 8 points of damage.
[Tue Aug 23 07:04:06 2022] froglok jin wizard was hit by non-melee for 8 points of damage.
[Tue Aug 23 07:04:06 2022] froglok jin wizard was hit by non-melee for 8 points of damage.
[Tue Aug 23 07:04:13 2022] froglok jin wizard was hit by non-melee for 8 points of damage.
[Tue Aug 23 07:04:15 2022] froglok jin wizard was hit by non-melee for 8 points of damage.
[Tue Aug 23 07:04:22 2022] froglok jin wizard was hit by non-melee for 8 points of damage.
[Tue Aug 23 07:04:22 2022] froglok jin wizard was hit by non-melee for 8 points of damage.
[Tue Aug 23 07:04:27 2022] froglok jin wizard was hit by non-melee for 8 points of damage.
[Tue Aug 23 07:04:29 2022] froglok jin wizard was hit by non-melee for 8 points of damage.
[Tue Aug 23 07:04:31 2022] froglok jin wizard was hit by non-melee for 8 points of damage.
[Tue Aug 23 07:04:38 2022] froglok jin wizard was hit by non-melee for 8 points of damage.
[Tue Aug 23 07:04:38 2022] froglok jin wizard was hit by non-melee for 8 points of damage.
[Tue Aug 23 07:04:43 2022] froglok jin wizard was hit by non-melee for 8 points of damage.
[Tue Aug 23 07:04:45 2022] froglok jin wizard was hit by non-melee for 8 points of damage.
[Tue Aug 23 07:04:47 2022] froglok jin wizard was hit by non-melee for 8 points of damage.
[Tue Aug 23 07:04:47 2022] froglok jin wizard was hit by non-melee for 8 points of damage.
[Tue Aug 23 07:04:51 2022] froglok jin wizard was hit by non-melee for 8 points of damage.
[Tue Aug 23 07:04:51 2022] froglok jin wizard was hit by non-melee for 8 points of damage.
[Tue Aug 23 07:04:54 2022] froglok jin wizard was hit by non-melee for 8 points of damage.
[Tue Aug 23 07:04:54 2022] froglok jin wizard was hit by non-melee for 8 points of damage.
[Tue Aug 23 07:04:56 2022] froglok jin wizard was hit by non-melee for 8 points of damage.
[Tue Aug 23 07:04:58 2022] froglok jin wizard was hit by non-melee for 8 points of damage.
[Tue Aug 23 07:05:01 2022] froglok jin wizard was hit by non-melee for 8 points of damage.

That is 25 hits. A Mage's DS is 33, so that would be (33 x 25) / 60 = ~14 DPS. Basically an extra nuke.

This means a Mage is going to be doing around 88 DPS with an unfocused level 60 Water pet, with Clarity 2, with Damage Shield, while nuking at the absolute best. The real number is going to be lower, since a Mage is not realistically going to be using the maximum number of nukes per hour. They need to use mana for other things. The DS damage will probably be lower in a group too, since mobs may die faster than a minute, get slowed, etc. My guess is the real number is closer to 80 DPS.

If you use https://wiki.project1999.com/Boots_of_Bladecalling you will increase your DPS by a further 17, to end up at around 100 DPS, assuming you do nothing but spam the boots.

================================================== ================================================== =========

For Shaman DPS:

My Spells
=========
[Mon Aug 22 08:12:29 2022] You begin casting Bane of Nife.
[Mon Aug 22 08:12:34 2022] froglok jin shaman was hit by non-melee for 150 points of damage.
[Mon Aug 22 08:13:18 2022] Your Bane of Nife spell has worn off.

[Mon Aug 22 08:12:35 2022] You begin casting Envenomed Bolt.
[Mon Aug 22 08:12:41 2022] froglok jin shaman was hit by non-melee for 110 points of damage.
[Mon Aug 22 08:13:24 2022] Your Envenomed Bolt spell has worn off.


[Mon Aug 22 08:13:19 2022] You begin casting Bane of Nife.
[Mon Aug 22 08:13:24 2022] froglok jin shaman was hit by non-melee for 150 points of damage.
30 seconds (6 Ticks)

[Mon Aug 22 08:13:25 2022] You begin casting Envenomed Bolt.
[Mon Aug 22 08:13:31 2022] froglok jin shaman was hit by non-melee for 110 points of damage.
24 seconds (4 Ticks)

Enemy Spells
=========
[Mon Aug 22 08:13:24 2022] Froglok jin shaman feels much better. +270HP
[Mon Aug 22 08:13:32 2022] Froglok jin shaman feels much better. +270HP

Pet DPS
=========
[Mon Aug 22 08:12:21 2022] Xibarer kicks froglok jin shaman for 12 points of damage.
[Mon Aug 22 08:12:21 2022] Xibarer bites froglok jin shaman for 13 points of damage.
[Mon Aug 22 08:12:23 2022] froglok jin shaman was hit by non-melee for 8 points of damage.
[Mon Aug 22 08:12:23 2022] froglok jin shaman was hit by non-melee for 8 points of damage.
[Mon Aug 22 08:12:24 2022] Xibarer bites froglok jin shaman for 19 points of damage.
[Mon Aug 22 08:12:25 2022] froglok jin shaman was hit by non-melee for 8 points of damage.
[Mon Aug 22 08:12:26 2022] Xibarer bites froglok jin shaman for 24 points of damage.
[Mon Aug 22 08:12:26 2022] froglok jin shaman was hit by non-melee for 8 points of damage.
[Mon Aug 22 08:12:28 2022] Xibarer bites froglok jin shaman for 13 points of damage.
[Mon Aug 22 08:12:29 2022] Xibarer bites froglok jin shaman for 47 points of damage.
[Mon Aug 22 08:12:31 2022] Xibarer bites froglok jin shaman for 43 points of damage.
[Mon Aug 22 08:12:31 2022] Xibarer bashes froglok jin shaman for 16 points of damage.
[Mon Aug 22 08:12:33 2022] Xibarer bites froglok jin shaman for 34 points of damage.
[Mon Aug 22 08:12:35 2022] Xibarer bites froglok jin shaman for 17 points of damage.
[Mon Aug 22 08:12:42 2022] Xibarer bashes froglok jin shaman for 18 points of damage.
[Mon Aug 22 08:12:43 2022] Xibarer bites froglok jin shaman for 47 points of damage.
[Mon Aug 22 08:12:44 2022] froglok jin shaman was hit by non-melee for 8 points of damage.
[Mon Aug 22 08:12:45 2022] Xibarer bites froglok jin shaman for 47 points of damage.
[Mon Aug 22 08:12:47 2022] Xibarer bites froglok jin shaman for 39 points of damage.
[Mon Aug 22 08:12:47 2022] Xibarer bites froglok jin shaman for 47 points of damage.
[Mon Aug 22 08:12:49 2022] Xibarer bites froglok jin shaman for 24 points of damage.
[Mon Aug 22 08:12:52 2022] Xibarer bites froglok jin shaman for 41 points of damage.
[Mon Aug 22 08:12:53 2022] froglok jin shaman was hit by non-melee for 8 points of damage.
[Mon Aug 22 08:12:54 2022] Xibarer bites froglok jin shaman for 30 points of damage.
[Mon Aug 22 08:12:54 2022] Xibarer bites froglok jin shaman for 28 points of damage.
[Mon Aug 22 08:12:56 2022] Xibarer bites froglok jin shaman for 43 points of damage.
[Mon Aug 22 08:12:58 2022] Xibarer bashes froglok jin shaman for 20 points of damage.
[Mon Aug 22 08:13:01 2022] Xibarer bites froglok jin shaman for 12 points of damage.
[Mon Aug 22 08:13:03 2022] froglok jin shaman was hit by non-melee for 8 points of damage.
[Mon Aug 22 08:13:05 2022] Xibarer bites froglok jin shaman for 47 points of damage.
[Mon Aug 22 08:13:06 2022] Xibarer bites froglok jin shaman for 30 points of damage.
[Mon Aug 22 08:13:12 2022] Xibarer bites froglok jin shaman for 41 points of damage.
[Mon Aug 22 08:13:12 2022] froglok jin shaman was hit by non-melee for 8 points of damage.
[Mon Aug 22 08:13:15 2022] Xibarer bites froglok jin shaman for 12 points of damage.
[Mon Aug 22 08:13:17 2022] Xibarer bites froglok jin shaman for 47 points of damage.
[Mon Aug 22 08:13:19 2022] Xibarer bites froglok jin shaman for 47 points of damage.
[Mon Aug 22 08:13:19 2022] Xibarer bashes froglok jin shaman for 17 points of damage.
[Mon Aug 22 08:13:21 2022] Xibarer bites froglok jin shaman for 43 points of damage.
[Mon Aug 22 08:13:22 2022] Xibarer bites froglok jin shaman for 12 points of damage.
[Mon Aug 22 08:13:24 2022] froglok jin shaman was hit by non-melee for 8 points of damage.
[Mon Aug 22 08:13:26 2022] Xibarer bites froglok jin shaman for 12 points of damage.
[Mon Aug 22 08:13:29 2022] Xibarer bites froglok jin shaman for 43 points of damage.
[Mon Aug 22 08:13:30 2022] Xibarer kicks froglok jin shaman for 19 points of damage.
[Mon Aug 22 08:13:31 2022] Xibarer bites froglok jin shaman for 19 points of damage.
[Mon Aug 22 08:13:31 2022] Xibarer bites froglok jin shaman for 43 points of damage.
[Mon Aug 22 08:13:33 2022] froglok jin shaman was hit by non-melee for 8 points of damage.
[Mon Aug 22 08:13:33 2022] froglok jin shaman was hit by non-melee for 8 points of damage.
[Mon Aug 22 08:13:35 2022] Xibarer bites froglok jin shaman for 47 points of damage.
[Mon Aug 22 08:13:35 2022] Xibarer bashes froglok jin shaman for 19 points of damage.
[Mon Aug 22 08:13:36 2022] Xibarer bites froglok jin shaman for 13 points of damage.
[Mon Aug 22 08:13:36 2022] Xibarer bites froglok jin shaman for 12 points of damage.
[Mon Aug 22 08:13:38 2022] Xibarer bites froglok jin shaman for 47 points of damage.
[Mon Aug 22 08:13:40 2022] Xibarer bites froglok jin shaman for 47 points of damage.
[Mon Aug 22 08:13:40 2022] Xibarer bashes froglok jin shaman for 15 points of damage.
[Mon Aug 22 08:13:41 2022] You bash froglok jin shaman for 1 point of damage.
[Mon Aug 22 08:13:42 2022] Xibarer bites froglok jin shaman for 47 points of damage.
[Mon Aug 22 08:13:44 2022] Xibarer bites froglok jin shaman for 21 points of damage.
[Mon Aug 22 08:13:44 2022] Xibarer bites froglok jin shaman for 24 points of damage.
[Mon Aug 22 08:13:45 2022] Xibarer bites froglok jin shaman for 34 points of damage.
[Mon Aug 22 08:13:47 2022] Xibarer bites froglok jin shaman for 47 points of damage.
[Mon Aug 22 08:13:51 2022] Xibarer bites froglok jin shaman for 34 points of damage.
[Mon Aug 22 08:13:51 2022] Xibarer bites froglok jin shaman for 47 points of damage.
[Mon Aug 22 08:13:51 2022] Xibarer kicks froglok jin shaman for 22 points of damage.
[Mon Aug 22 08:13:52 2022] Xibarer bites froglok jin shaman for 28 points of damage.
[Mon Aug 22 08:13:52 2022] Xibarer bites froglok jin shaman for 26 points of damage.
[Mon Aug 22 08:13:54 2022] You have slain froglok jin shaman!

6,549 damage over 93 seconds = 70.5 DPS

This is 70.5 DPS to a froglok jin shaman in Sebilis just using a 50% hasted Spirit of the Howler pet and Bane of Nife + Envenomed Bolt. The pet is not max level. He is hitting for 47, so that is a lower end pet (max is 52, each level increases damage by 2). No need to root/rot with this setup in a group, and the DoTs only last 7 or 8 ticks.

A single set of Bane of Nife + Envenomed Bolt costs 745 mana. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HjZxMlJSCDc using this video, it looks like you can Torpor recover mana at around 14 mana per second. If you include C2, it is more like 16 mana per second. This means you can recover the 745 mana in 46 seconds. That is easily the length of a fight if Enchanters are fighting 2 mobs with charmed pets. This means the DPS is generally sustainable too.

If you are fighting mobs that die faster (under 30 seconds), you can use 2x Ice Strikes for 1350 damage. 1350 / 30 = 45 DPS minimum, plus pet DPS to get you around 60 DPS. But if you are in an area where mobs are dying this fast, you can increase your DPS by root/rotting mobs in one area while the Enchanters clear another. Root/Rotting 3 mobs with Epic Dot + Pox is ((1425 + 2088) x 3) / 108 second = 97 DPS. The mana cost is 1300, which is recoverable in 108 seconds based on the video above.

Best case scenario the difference between a Mage and a Shaman is about 30 DPS on average. Depending on how often the Shaman will be able to use Epic/JBB, that gap shrinks to 10 or less.

[Zuranthium]

Your numbers are not accurate, stop spamming the idiocy.

A Mage can do 100 DPS, whereas a Shaman can 40 DPS in full offense mode in a group like this, and while receiving Cleric heals in order to Canni enough.

[Troxx]

Originally Posted by Zuranthium [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Your numbers are not accurate, stop spamming the idiocy.

A Mage can do 100 DPS, whereas a Shaman can 40 DPS in full offense mode in a group like this, and while receiving Cleric heals in order to Canni enough.

[You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]