Best 4 person all caster/priest group

[Gloomlord]

Originally Posted by DeathsSilkyMist [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

None of this is true, but that is par for the course with a troll.

You can argue, idiotically, that since it is subjective why Shaman is useless in this group, that it isn't "true".

However, people did show you Mage DPS metres. That was objective. You're outright lying here.

This is why I insult you, DSM. You know you deserve every harsh callout coming your way.

[Toxigen]

I love how DSM is talking about Sham vs Cleric for monk duo in a 4 person all caster/priest thread.

[Gloomlord]

Originally Posted by DeathsSilkyMist [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

And I am not saying Clerics are bad either. People are simply overestimating them for the content this group will be doing. You aren't CHing a warrior discing.

Torp + Slow will keep up with whatever a Monk/Cleric duo can do. I would be happy to discuss specific camps if you had some in mind.

You're CHing a charm pet. Isn't that obvious? CH is far more mana efficient than Torpor, and does not slow the healed target.

It's a no brainer which is better here.

[DeathsSilkyMist]

Originally Posted by Toxigen [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I love how DSM is talking about Sham vs Cleric for monk duo in a 4 person all caster/priest thread.

Crede brought that up, not me. I was simply responding.

Originally Posted by Gloomlord [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

You're CHing a charm pet. Isn't that obvious? CH is far more mana efficient than Torpor, and does not slow the healed target.

It's a no brainer which is better here.

It is obvious the Cleric is CHing the pet.

It is also obvious the Shaman is Slow + Torpor tanking. The pet is not tanking, so it doesn't need CH, and it doesn't get snared.

Torpor is a 6 HP to 1 Mana heal, with the possibility of 7.5 HP to 1 mana on a good server tick. Certainly not a bad ratio. The reason why a Shaman is more mana efficient in the long run is because you can cannibalize from low HP/Mana to full in 3 minutes. Raw mana efficiency is offset by extremely fast mana regeneration. CH is best when you can't slow, or just need an immediate full heal.

[Gloomlord]

And why the hell would I want a Shaman in this group tanking...?! We've got 2 charm pets to do that, and we have one of the Enchanters to cover the slows.

You are insane! You're seriously reaching now.

[cd288]

Originally Posted by Crede [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Nobody is saying shamans are bad. They are just simply not as needed in this state of velious with gear and especially in this composition. As I stated, Most monks would rather just duo with a cleric because you don’t have to risk torp not keeping up or with dispells and what not. Having a cleric is just safer, just toss in cheals as needed with aego. Rez if shit hits the fan. Paci bracer through dungeon. Double da, etc. blur. Just more tools than a shaman.

On a Monk with a fungi I would rather duo with an Ench honestly. Way better than duoing with a Shaman. If I was a human monk with no fungi, then sure Cleric or Shaman. But otherwise I'd rather have the ench, I'll never need the heals really.

[DeathsSilkyMist]

Originally Posted by Gloomlord [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

And why the hell would I want a Shaman in this group tanking...?! We've got 2 charm pets to do that, and we have one of the Enchanters to cover the slows.

You are insane! You're seriously reaching now.

Because a Shaman can Torpor + Slow tank basically all of the content this group will do, and the Charmed Pets will do more damage by hitting the mob from behind.

With the Shaman Slowing and Maloing, the Enchanters are saving mana by not slowing and having less pet breaks.

I think you simply don't understand how a Shaman works. The reason why they are the second best solo class is because of how well they can tank difficult mobs that don't need a Warrior.

[Gloomlord]

Originally Posted by cd288 [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

On a Monk with a fungi I would rather duo with an Ench honestly. Way better than duoing with a Shaman. If I was a human monk with no fungi, then sure Cleric or Shaman. But otherwise I'd rather have the ench, I'll never need the heals really.

Iksar at it again with their P2W bullshit.

[cd288]

Originally Posted by DeathsSilkyMist [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

That argument is silly, because 2x Enchanters are also completely redundant in terms of spells. But you aren't arguing that people shouldn't take 2x Enchanters[You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Nobody would say 3x Enchanters and a Cleric is a good combination if redundancy was a problem.

You cannot actually define why the redundancy is bad. Somehow having slow on 2x Enchanters is good, but slow on 1x Enchanter and 1x Shaman is bad. What is the logic here?

Using this logic Clerics are bad too, because they have Stuns/Root/Lull, which also overlap with an Enchanter.

I am amazed people seem to forget that Shaman/Enchanter/Monk is a very strong trio that has been used for years. What is the logic that has invalidated this trio?

Yet again you missed my point (or as usual you're twisting words to fit your own argument). It's not that redundancy is a problem. It's that everything the Shaman can offer, another class does BETTER. Better haste/slows, better CC, better healing and buffs overall.

So, yes, I'd much rather have 3 Enchanters all with hasted charm pets and a Cleric mowing through shit in like 5 seconds. That is likely the top 4 person combo in this argument. There's no real combination that can be legitimately argued as better here. A Shaman brings nothing to the table in the optimal combo.

[cd288]

Originally Posted by DeathsSilkyMist [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Because a Shaman can Torpor + Slow tank basically all of the content this group will do, and the Charmed Pets will do more damage by hitting the mob from behind.

With the Shaman Slowing and Maloing, the Enchanters are saving mana by not slowing and having less pet breaks.

I think you simply don't understand how a Shaman works. The reason why they are the second best solo class is because of how well they can tank difficult mobs that don't need a Warrior.

You don't even need to slow when you have three geared and hasted charmed pets lol. It's a blender. I've done it before, slow becomes a waste of mana.