Game Mechanics: Rogue hide

[Nubben]

Originally Posted by Nirgon [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Do people forget that sneak + hide behind something should be more effective?

This is 100% due to sneak and has nothing to do with Hide. Nothing in the game should ever be able to see anyone (rogue or not) who has sneak activated and is in the mob's rear arc, regardless of Hide or other invis factors. The tricky part is GETTING to the mob's rear arc without being seen, which rogue hide helps you do.

[Nirgon]

Originally Posted by Nubben [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

This is 100% due to sneak and has nothing to do with Hide. Nothing in the game should ever be able to see anyone (rogue or not) who has sneak activated and is in the mob's rear arc, regardless of Hide or other invis factors. The tricky part is GETTING to the mob's rear arc without being seen, which rogue hide helps you do.

If hide helps you get behind without being seen already, what's the point of sneak having a positional mechanic? I think you guys are wanting hide/sneak to have the "behind the mob" functionality at all times (even when not behind).

Honestly, if Rogean played a rogue for as long as he says he did and during vanilla-Velious... I have to give him authority on the matter (well, I think he has it anyway obvi). He's not a content/mechanic twisting scummy. Except mabe overnerfing drains cuz of Salty hoopin'.





Remove item recharging, revert hoop nerf!

[koros]

Originally Posted by Nirgon [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

If hide helps you get behind without being seen already, what's the point of sneak having a positional mechanic? I think you guys are wanting hide/sneak to have the "behind the mob" functionality at all times (even when not behind).

Honestly, if Rogean played a rogue for as long as he says he did and during vanilla-Velious... I have to give him authority on the matter (well, I think he has it anyway obvi). He's not a content/mechanic twisting scummy. Except mabe overnerfing drains cuz of Salty hoopin'.





Remove item recharging, revert hoop nerf!

Sneaks positional mechanic is very important, in fact the skill is useless without it, other than letting rogues move when hidden.

Take a hypothetical room with 2 mobs facing each other. One sees invis, one does not. A rogue might be able to be invisible to both, by being in the rear arc of the see invis one, and having hide blocking the normal one. A non-rogue wouldn't be able to do this.

If rogue sneak/hide is not 100% at 60 something is wrong. Here's proof straight from Kendrick (Classic dev and official rogue advocate)



http://www.thesafehouse.org/forums/s...ead.php?t=2857

"Faster Sneak Starting at 51st, you begin to move faster while sneaking. By 60th level, you are at a full run, and this combines with any speed spells. SoW sneaking, anyone?"

[Scrubosaur]

Originally Posted by Nirgon [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

If hide helps you get behind without being seen already, what's the point of sneak having a positional mechanic? I think you guys are wanting hide/sneak to have the "behind the mob" functionality at all times (even when not behind).[/B]

If you don't see the difference please stop posting on the subject. Hide normally acts as an invisibility check vs a mob, and sneak always makes you indifferent to anything in the rear 180 degrees (you are sneaking, duh). Rogue is the only class that can sneak and hide at the same time as an ability. This ability is different than the normal sneak or hide that work independently as stated above. This ability is better than normal hide because it should make you invisible vs undead and many other mobs that normally see through invisibility spells or other classes hide ability. The sneak portion works the same as normal sneak; so even IF a mob sees though ROGUE hide but you are in the rear 180 degrees the mob will be indifferent.

[Velerin]

Originally Posted by Man0warr [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Bats detect by echo location, so it makes sense in a real life way [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

hah true. Didn't think of that. Sneaky bats.

[khanable]

Nice

Now we just need a rogue BoTB winner to chime in and we're good

[4WOFURY]

Originally Posted by khanable [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Nice

Now we just need a rogue BoTB winner to chime in and we're good

?

[Scrubosaur]

Originally Posted by khanable [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Nice

Now we just need a rogue BoTB winner to chime in and we're good

R O F L

To 4WOFURY: check out discussion on necro being able to dispell recourse from heal - a BoTB winner necro chimed in with his opinion.

[Scrubosaur]

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In mistmoore - went into hidden wall room first time with sneak / hide on with no problems (didn't pull anything). Went back and same mobs attacked while sneak /hide was active.

[Supaskillz]

logs really better than screen shots so we can verify no one cast spells on you and no bard songs hit you and at least rule out things.

I am no MM expert, but I know wiki says that area has a trap that strips invis spells. Not sure if this trap is active in this time frame, also unsure if it strips hide in addition to invis. If it is stripping hide then there is a problem with it not showing hide has been dropped in a similar way to issue with opening a trade.