Spells: 100 MR to resist MR nuke. 350 FR to reduce FR nuke.

[Tavrin]

Originally Posted by Nirgon [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

For other spells? Cold mainline nukes should be 120 cold for "immunity" (very rare mid range partial, common smaller partials, uncommon/somewhat common full resist) marker from an even con. I think its scaling should be +/-10 from there. That's for players. 130 cold (and plz someone chime in otherwise with your classic memory) for wizard cold nukes. I had 199 fire resist unbuffed on live and a druid could go oom trying to wildfire me before I died (in Velious raid gear) without dispel etc.
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This looks pretty much accurate from my experience on live. I ran 140fr cr on my druid and would partial or full resist Ice Comets, draughts, and druid nukes. Although I would partial a much greater percentage than full resist.

Actually having to coordinate dispells + tash/malo chains = win for the server.

[Potus]

Originally Posted by Nirgon [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Needs to have a chance to break every tick and on the immediate tick. What I noticed on live test that matches my memory was roots immediately on application had to pass yet another hold check. So:

Resist check
Immediate resist check AGAIN to see if it holds
Check every tick from there for hold

^ I get called a liar on stuff like dis but its true and feel free to test on live on an in town guard or other high magic resist npc (Felwithe p.easy to get to). Have my vintage 60wiz if you want dat info to try it.

Players at even con with 80+ magic shouldn't ever be getting rooted or snared by roots/snares that share the same resist value @ least.. go from there. IE 90+ mr on one with -10 resist check etc.

Would be awesome if this was working. Had like a billion fetters spammed on me in pvp and for some ODD reason the first one would almost always land with 168+ MR. (dafuq)

Root is a DoT that does no damage. I'm pretty sure the immediate break you're referring to isn't another resist check, it's that the 6 second global dot tick from the server is hitting right as someone casts root on a mob. If timed right, you could root something and it could instantly break because the root didn't survive the first tick of the spell and thus broke.

[Potus]

Also Disease/Poison doesn't inherently resist any easier than say Fire or Cold, the reason why people remember resisting Disease/Poison dots frequently is because spells like E-Bolt and Plague have a direct damage and and a dot component, and that was explained by Abashi to be 2 chances to resist before a spell landed. Druid roots work on the same principle -- DD + the spell effect can resist and the spell fails to land.

So if you're running around with say 100 PR you're likely to resist a spell because it had two chances to snag, instead of one like most other spells, plus dots can't partial like nukes can.

[BlkCamel]

Originally Posted by Colgate [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

i believe melee damage also has a chance to break a root

bard stuns in general seem to be much more powerful than they should be, most notably denon's bereavement(point blank poison based aoe stun, DoT, and -MR debuff) and bruscoe's bombastic bellow(single target magic based nuke + long duration stun)

i also recall bard mezzes landing quite a lot when they shouldn't

rogue poisons, most notably the blind ones, also shouldn't be landing as often and at least the blind ones certainly shouldn't be full duration every time(being blinded for 78 seconds is just ridiculous)

the largest problem is with pure direct damage nukes being impossible to resist and requiring very high of the associated resist in order to begin partially resisting them

I didn't play PVP so maybe this was special to those servers, but I don't remember melee damage having any effect on root. I remember having dog tank rooted mobs for extra dps and hate (due to low agro of shaman epic). This wouldn't work if root was breaking early due to his dps, and he was usually hasted.

Maybe you are used to experiencing this because most melee use procing weapons? The procs themselves if they have a DD component should have a chance to break root. In fact root would break quite often when procs went off.

As anecdotal evidence, my JBB doesn't break root very often. I can actually get 4 or 5 casts usually before root breaks (not considering recent root breaking on tick changes, which would cause root to break prior to the damage hitting not right as damage landed). Root should have a pretty high chance to break by the 3rd/4th nuke(due to Random Chance, not some form of diminishing returns). Should essentially never get 5 nukes without a root break(1 in 10000 maybe?)

[BlkCamel]

Originally Posted by Potus [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Also Disease/Poison doesn't inherently resist any easier than say Fire or Cold, the reason why people remember resisting Disease/Poison dots frequently is because spells like E-Bolt and Plague have a direct damage and and a dot component, and that was explained by Abashi to be 2 chances to resist before a spell landed. Druid roots work on the same principle -- DD + the spell effect can resist and the spell fails to land.

So if you're running around with say 100 PR you're likely to resist a spell because it had two chances to snag, instead of one like most other spells, plus dots can't partial like nukes can.

Again I know this is PVP bug forum, but some of these changes might make blue.

This almost sounds/feels right. Poison dots resisted a-lot more often and were costly to use consistently on a higher con mob that wasn't de-buffed. It is a reason we had on the raid a dedicated De-buffing shaman and enchanter, + maybe bard.

Only problem I have is, it seems like it might already be this way(Resist check on DD, then Dot and maybe I am wrong since I can't see/read the code). Poison dots already do resist quite a-lot. Ask any Shaman or Necro leveling,not sure how druid fire dots resist currently maybe Daldaen can tell us, and enchanter dots were resisted a-lot unless mob was tashed first, they can't even use their poison dots for 5+ levels due to resists. Malo/Tash/Mala/Bard resist de-buffs on live went a long way, and most good Sham/Chanter/Mage would de-buff every mob(speaking of blue+ con, Green's should not require de-buffing).

Disease dots would fall into this as well, but most mobs had a low disease resist and so they landed most often without a de-buff. Shaman never used the disease de-buff(outside of pvp servers) until the Disease slows entered the game. It just wasn't needed. Only specific named and undead/plagued mobs should have a disease resist high enough to reliably resist a disease dot.

Again I apologize if all of the changes Haynar is considering making are limited to PVP server, but I have a feeling they are not, so I just wanted to point these things out.[You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

[Haynar]

Resist code i am looking at is specific to pvp. But blue needs adjustments too.

H

[Nirgon]

Originally Posted by Potus [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

it's that the 6 second global dot tick from the server is hitting right as someone casts root on a mob. If timed right, you could root something and it could instantly break because the root didn't survive the first tick of the spell and thus broke.

Ya that never happens here, whatever the cause might be

[Cheesypoof]

I have a lvl 54 almost 55 monk that can crank his FR up to 140 ish unbuffed if u would like to do some field testing on me. Just send me a PM.


Also..

Do you think you could put some work in on necros after you're done with the resist curve. Necros used to be a nice pvp class on live. Here they have several issues that require attention which have already been brought up in other threads.

[Pudge]

Originally Posted by Haynar [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Resist code i am looking at is specific to pvp. But blue needs adjustments too.

H

Alecta did a really good job with his code. He implemented a tiered resist system where during classic resists don't need to be as high as they do in kunark, and then they need to be even higher in velious, to account for the better gear. He also made it so that resists can be scaled on the fly, without restarting the server.

Please be gentle changing resists, and monitor the server for feedback. What we have is already very good, despite complaints. I think it would probablu be a better use of developer time to focus on fixing dispels (which affects both red and blue) before tinkering with the resists again.

[Nirgon]

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