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#1
09-23-2019, 10:03 AM
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FWIW here is a discussion about how bards absolutly SUCK in 2000, and not once is it mentioned that they can solo using AoE out of almost 100 complaints about how bards suck, and counterarguments about how awesome bards are.
https://web.archive.org/web/20010124...ML/000262.html the down side is it sounds like mez resist should resist at least 50% of the time on extremely green mobs, and that charm should break often. But dont put those fixes in lol we are just about to get bards that group on green99 lol | ||
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Last edited by Jibartik; 09-23-2019 at 10:06 AM..
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#3
09-26-2019, 04:35 AM
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Maybe they were exaggerating for effect? I doubt there are even 45+ tadpole spawns in the swamp, doubly so with the troll/ogre newbies running around killing them. 3 pulses of damage would be 12 dead tadpoles per cast, probably spectacular enough to boast a bit for a newb. He also says "spells", plural, when he only got one at 24. Also, "at one time" is a phrase one can take some liberties with, and it even makes more sense why he would choose to use "spells", since it could mean he cast multiple.
Edit: For those who don't want to read through, it's some old blog/diary of an EQ player, he/she writes: 5/18/99 . . . After hitting 24th I promptly purchased my new spells, and gathered together every froglok tadpole in the land into one nice big group, laughed as they tried to nibble me as they did oh so not long ago, and basked in the light of self satisfaction watching all 46 of them die at one time to the new improved area effect spells. | ||
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Last edited by DMN; 09-26-2019 at 04:46 AM..
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#4
09-26-2019, 05:48 AM
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Quote:
If you read his review and get past the way he is you'll see it's informative and the guy knew his stuff. Not only can you see it there but you can ask ANYBODY who remembers playing Everquest when it released and we'll all tell you AoE spells had no limits. Also this Kendrick guys comment the one dude keeps linking back to was fired and clearly had no idea how to play EQ if you take the time to read anything he posted not only that but he wasn't even part of the original crew. So basing everything on the words of someone who wasn't even part of the developer team at the time and didn't know how to play at all is just... [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.] 5/18/99 A guy named Ron uses AoE on many mobs. 2001 AoE groups in Seb and mentions of previous Chardok groups, highly possible people were doing these much more than anybody previously thought. https://www.graffe.com/forums/showthread.php?6048/page "Lucky? If done right you can pull chef/bar and everything in between to D2, all this with 3 wizards/1 chanter/1 cleric/1 SK. The only real limiting factor is the newbness of the people you are working with, not the classes you have!" Jun 20, 1999 http://twilight.uh-oh.jp/eq/tips/b_song.html "It is a dissonant music that damages a certain range around you. I can't imagine how to use it clearly. The price is not so high, but I don't think you need to buy it. The only way to say how to use it is to attract a monster to yourself or to take a Yokozuna sumo to help someone who has trained in BB or other places." | |||
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#6
09-26-2019, 06:07 AM
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Classic AoE on video even. This guild only existed from 1999 - 2002 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BUHDRz1Iv_U You keep trying to justify mob limits and changing how AoE works because you're afraid of bards or seeing everyone get zoomed but none of this is how the game actually worked. | |||
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#7
09-26-2019, 08:35 AM
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I suggest you collate all your data, make a succinct post and argument, show the counter points, then show your PROOF that the counter point is wrong. But this mass posting about what you're feeling and repeating yourself and addressing every post you can all at once without giving time to really fine tune your arguments, is only resulting in you losing your battle even harder. I want to know the truth. Just like most players here. You have not once made me think that you had a good argument with the evidence you share. Nor do I think your evidence ever supports your arguments. | |||
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Last edited by Jibartik; 09-26-2019 at 08:41 AM..
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#8
09-27-2019, 11:56 AM
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But I think everyone knows PBAE limits by Kunark/Velious were not a thing, it seems that there were some short lived ones in classic per the evidence in this thread. However while there may not have been PBAE limits I believe there were aggro limits to the number of mobs you could kite around, these weren’t hard aggro limits but you’d run into issues with mobs ghosting, and eventually leashing due to lagging behind. I can only speak to my experience on the Mac server which isn’t exactly Velious era but it was the oldest client we had available in the past decade, and you could pull 30+ mobs and they’d lag a bit but nothing unmanageable. Once you reached the 50-80+ range you were dealing with a huge amount of ghosting mobs, warping and desynching of zones. I think if we are aiming for a more classic experience it’s not PBAE limits to target (except for the classic period as mentioned above which seems to be a timeline fix), but instead a cap on the number of mobs you can keep on aggro before they start ghosting behind you and losing aggro. Cap players on being able to kite or hold aggro on like 40-50~ mobs and that would be a nice balance between classic mechanics and classic experience.
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#9
09-27-2019, 08:55 PM
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There was thousands of players meaning there wasn't many mob to be kited for starters. Up till around level 25 you could find areas to kite many mobs but again you would run into the first problem (too many players not enough mobs) and unless you had some twinked out bard you would get dead anyhow. AoE groups really wouldn't work either because first of all nobody really knew how to do them. They really had no way to learn how to do them either because again there was always too many people in a zone to go screwing around trying out new techniques but even if someone could try to pull off an AoE I know how hard it would be to do. Big AoE and bard kites never were a real thing until after Kunark came out and it wasn't because the game prevented it. Well I guess in a way it did but a really smart person who really wanted to do it could have found a way but again you would run into all the people and train the ever living hell out of everyone just to try and probably fail. I should also note I don't think the original client has a forward auto strafe like when you hit W + D + RMB at the same time to lock it in. It had to all be done by hand pretty much. This is prior to the patch that people are saying bards could only hit 4 mobs. >>>>>>>>>>>>>9/11/99<<<<<<<<<<<<< Extreme Kiting: Killing 6 Reds at once. https://groups.google.com/forum/#!se...Q/DrsSx8vPsE8J Here is something I did last night. Will I do it again? ehhh probably not. I just reached level 18 with my Bard. I got the dischord song. What it does for those of you who dont know is about 30 pts of damage of 10 seconds or something like that to everything around the bard. Has to be played with an instrument. I had kited some things before but found it rather boring and didnt care buch for it. I had used bellow before. 10 pts to one target. Even with the dischord song it took about 10-15 mins to kite something to death. Not really worth it even if it was a red con. So I figured if it takes 10-15 mins to kite something why not kite multiple things at once? So I ran up and down the beach of oasis bellowing anything that was blue or higher. By the time I was done I had about 4 Deepwater crocs on me, and 2 deepwater caimens. The 4 DWC were reds and the 2 caimens were yellows. So I had 6 mobs following me around the zone. I found a relativeley safe place and began kiting with the dischord song. Now in order for this song to hit, you bards all know, you have to be REALLY close to your opponent. IN this case 6 of them. Now DWCrocs hit HARD. LIke for 40 pts vs my bard. If you even let them nip at your heels ONCE you are prety much done for. So i started kiting. A few mins in I got caught by the entire group of them. I took about 275 pts of damage in the span of about 1 second. LUCKILY I wasnt stunned and could keep running. If I had been stunned I would have died for sure. A GM was watching me the entire time as well. He never said anything. Some other characters had seen what I was doing and were watching. I had them all to more than half damage so wasnt worried about kill stealing by that time. Some people were commenting that I was being greedy. When it was all said and done I had taken down 6 crocs, 4 of which conned red and 2 that had conned yellow. I think I gained more than a bubble of xp in about 15 mins. Now I dont know if I would pull another stunt like this again. I was LUCKY not to have died, but this is just an example of what kiting can do in an extreme case. If you were VERY good you could have had 10-12 mobs on you at once ALL RED, and killed them all, IF you didnt mess up. Believe me, this form of kiting with the dischord song, is soooo dangerous. I re-iterate you have to be RIGHT near the mob for it to take effect. One virtual foot to far and nada, one too close and 6 mobs rip you to bits. I assume the upcoming nerf will take care of this tactic as well. Not that I would use it anymore. Frankly kiting is boring but I must say when you have 6 on you its a little more exciting knowing you could be dead at any time if you slip up. And I do many times. As to the risk vs xp reward, I think I was in an EXTREME amount of risk doing this. Hell I tried it once and almost died. BUT I dont think its reasonable to be able to take down 6 reds at once no matter what the risk. Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ Share what you know. Learn what you don't. --------------------------------------------------------------------------------- --------------------------------------------------------------------------------- >>>>>>>>>>>>>September 13th, 9:00am<<<<<<<<<<<<< New Patch Message https://groups.google.com/forum/#!se...A/wYXzrc1eohEJ - A bug in some of the AoE code has been fixed - AoE spells will now effect more monsters. >>>>>>>>>>>>>9/14/99<<<<<<<<<<<<< Wow! The bitching is almost universal now. https://groups.google.com/forum/#!se...I/hyiS2lA-DBcJ Just about the only class not affected are the Bards --------------------------------------------------------------------------------- The game is very old and people have learned many things. You can't MiB flashy thing people so that they get amnesia but it would be cool if you could. There's so much I want to forget just so I can relive it totally fresh like tv anime =/ | |||
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Last edited by Vyal; 09-27-2019 at 09:03 PM..
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#10
09-26-2019, 07:37 AM
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There is nothing to mass AoE like that pre Kunark anyhow it's just to difficult to get any good pulls in the original dungeons trust me I have tried to pull everything. When the game first came out there was no limit to AoE spells this much I am absolutely sure of and I have shown evidence dating back to a month after release confirming this. And it reads from the bottom up. "And what of those changes. I have taken a look at some of the big name EQ sites lately, the best one one being the site at www.gameznet.com/eq/ If any of you now big time EQ players have not taken a look at the site, I encourage you to do so. However, as informative that the site is, they fail to really get a lot of the details on things that actually mean something, and seem to rely on information sent to them by others. I am planning on doing something somewhat like they do, but based more upon my experiences and what I have encountered or accomplished first hand, and do so in a way that only I can muster. Entertaining yet informative. That's my goal." waybackmachine for www.gameznet.com/eq/ Poison Storm This is an area effect poison attack. https://web.archive.org/web/19991111...ls/shaman.html https://web.archive.org/web/19991111...ells/bard.html Fire Flux Fire flux is an area effect spell based on the caster. That means that this spell will damage all monsters in the immediate area of the caster. https://web.archive.org/web/19990508.../magician.html [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.] You can't keep ignoring the fact that everyone including some of the biggest EQ websites of the time all say exactly how AoE worked. They do not say there is a limit to the number of mobs a spell can hit and they don't say that because there was never any limit to AoE. | |||
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Last edited by Vyal; 09-26-2019 at 07:45 AM..
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