My proposal for Raiding guilds and GMs of P1999

[Nizzarr]

I was in the guildmeeting in early may, and Inglorious bastard didnt show up. We discussed raid Timers, which I thought some were not viable. I've also heard IB always wanted to make those rules tighter and harder. Which is ridiculous if you ask me.

I also wasnt in DA when the current raid rules were brought up. I'm sure I would have had a say on those.


It's kinda funny that you brought up that we've been camping dracoliche the past 24 hours, while youve been at nagafen's spawns for the last 96 hours. But I admire you're willingness to troll.

Blaine, I've been in IB 3 months, from the first "legit" nagafen kill to the boring rotation in january. The 24 hour rotation made me quit, It was boring. No point in even showing up. I was often the only cleric on many fear raids in november/december. I went out of my way to help that guild and thats how you remember me? I never had beef with you, and I will not hold anything against you for that post either.

I brought up the new rotation systems because the raiding here is ridiculous. I described it as a soft rotation, knowing well that divinity nor remedy would not show up to kill their targets during the night/early morning. Giving IB and DA a bigger share of the spawns. But I was aware that Remedy would take down their target during the afternoon/early evening. And that divinity would probably go out of their way to take down theirs too in the evenings and probably early night.

but it was all made in mind to cease this ridiculous "undisclosed" rotation between IB/DA. The soon to be 7 days 24/24 camping of spawns, which were getting real close to.

[Aadill]

I'm fairly certain Remedy and Divinity and anyone else wanting to participate in raid encounters would show up for the kill. If time constraints are an issue then that is a loss that sucks, but is a product of the variance timers not working in their favor. Same goes with IB and DA, if you want to continue to make these comparisons.

I would assume IB and DA are more likely to show up in the middle of the night, seeing as how raid targets have been killed in the wee hours of the morning, but thems the breaks.

[Taluvill]

To say the least, <3 you wrei. No hard feelings, please. Was sorta a tad of a bad night for me and I somewhat funneled my anger through you. I do that some times. But lets get back to the bitching, shall we? <3

Originally Posted by Wrei [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I honestly did not "embellish" as much as you think on the series of events. Perhaps some stuff needs clarification but they are all fairly accurate in general. This was all for harmless fun any how seeing how serious this thread was getting.

Lol completely agree. This thread is getting bad and everyone is taking headshots at each other.

I never implied that the inner core of Trans was bad. I just said you guys had a looser recruitment policy. If you want to be specific comparing both guilds we had less weaker links going beyond your crew of 10 (both guilds at their prime). So it's not about your choice of 10 guys but rather your whole guild as a group. I'm not talking "playtime", but rather in game knowledge and applying it. Not sure what your bringing up the whole playtime argument for... how's that relevant to the skilled player base+recruitment thing. The live in mom / unemployed thing is just sarcasm honestly. From what I recall most of us have RL jobs (just as most trans members do). The only thing we're guilty of is putting a greater priority playing this game (even after 10+years) over average Joe.

What it had seemed like you were implieing, was that we lost the battle and trans went casual because they had a no skill playerbase. That much was clear. So i took it like that. Sorry if you pushed it on the recruitment side of things, but yeah. and the Playtime gig comes from the fact that with a variance in place, the members, core or not, (im an exception btw) couldn't wake up to kill shit at 4am. We literally would sit in vent and had a cutoff time where we would stop tracking because although we knew we wanted to (or I would stop tracking... Yeah. Wasn't a "we" thing.) or could, The fact was that if we batphoned at that time, people would just be pissy the next morning.

So we're to believe that you guys getting beat to a boss had nothing to do with it? Wasn't Tibador a GM at the time (yes just like Xzerion), your telling me that NOBODY from Trans whined/petitioned/emailed/chatted on vent or irc to the GMs about getting your ass kicked? Wenai just randomly came in and randomly decided hey let's share the bosses? My memory is sketchy now but as I recall wasn't that whole rotation concocted by allizia and another gm i can't remember in your vent? My point is it's not really about who came up with the rotation (when I really think it was trans) but rather about the fact that you guys must have complained to the GM's for them to get involved to begin with.

Tib was the only GM in the place at that point... unless you count tantalar. *cough* ...... Yeah, joke. haha.

Unless tib or allizia did it behind the scenes, None of us knew about it, and neither did you sitting in ib's chair. No you didnt beat us to the spawn, we sat in king room for like 10 hours or so.

Yes at last we agree on something!!

Yeah man!

You are correct on a technical level, but GC was used as an example of upcoming raiding guilds just like remedy. It was bad enough to share with 1 guild then Div popping = 3 way share... Once it was clear more guilds would be popping up (starting with GC) that's when the whole rotation was getting silly( Naggy once a month yay ).

Now that I'm looking back with a clear head, yeah. GC stirred stuff up in the forums that led to the eventual downfall of the rotation, and divinity stepping up to steal a naggy was just the breaking point really.

Not sure what you were trying to refute here. Or were you agreeing! The pun was rather one of my weaker jokes, you'll have to forgive me it was 5am.

Forgot to edit it out. whoops. wall of text... cant... yeah.

I don't feel like digging up pages of quotes but seriously that whole sentence is true (my sentence). There was plenty of smack talk comparing dick size between both guilds. Once it was established which was the more dominant guild, the focus then shifted towards how being the top guild here is like winning the special olympics (and not just Supreme) into trying to get server sympathy by saying how we're the greedy basterds (for not sharing with every random joe on the server).

Yeah. I was part of the dick comparing festivities. bit ashamed of that, but whatev. I try and keep my nose out of the forums now... (thanks bayer/stanley btw.) But yeah. Supreme, at that point in time, had the worst of it of anyone in our guild at least.

There were more then a few trolls from both guilds but I didn't name names! [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

= D

I know sarcasm is the lowest form of comedy but seriously did you really believe I was a slob living in my mom's basement? Sorry to disappoint, but I think we all got jobs and responsibilities for the most part (yes even myself what a shocker). You make it sound like Trans was the only guild that had members who had shit to do in RL but still somehow managed to raid.... That's funny.

I was playing off the comedy. And I think it's (sadly) more that they did all this shit 10 years ago and were like "Fuck it. I raided fear to gear up 100 ppl on live, now I'm going to raid fear to gear up 50 people on an emu server to relive the bullshit? No thanks." Except in a much nicer way.

Umm.. kinda confused by that. To me mobilizing goes something like this:

1. Tracker tracks! (Best part of playing EQ!) I'm kidding
2. Big red Boss on track zomg! Send out message
3. Raid force logs on goes to X zone trying to beat other competing guild.
4. Gank boss.

So how is that not genuine mobilization? Even if early variance was bugged and the bosses popped more or less at the same time (I can't even remember). Do you think we all slept through? No I assure you, our trackers were busy then just as they are now. You would know when Maestro died if you had a rotation of trackers.. but then everyone of you lead such busy lives that you possibly couldn't do that.

Setting up 1 tracker rotation = ZOMG THIS IS A GAME DUDE we got shit to do in RL!!.

Setting up a whole raid force sitting in Nag's room waiting for the dragon to pop for 14+ hours = Acceptable because we get a guaranteed dragon!!

At least be consistent, if your too busy to raid how the fuck do you have a whole raid force camping for that long? You guys showed the way for future generation on how to go full retard right then and there.

Well, a few points. You think you had trackers there, or at least you know you did. Which you did. Trackers were there, not disputing that, but I personally think that probably about 1/3 of the way into the variance, after hate opened, that the trackers were just a scapegoat to make everyone think you guys were tracking, when in reality you all knew when shit would pop.

It got to the point where we just raided the best possible spot, and if you guys showed up, we batphoned. Yeah, fuckin dumb, huh? But it usually worked. We got to at least see, if not compete for, a few mobs that way.

Why the anger? Geez I thought we were friends... I said for the most part, we do have less though (even in our zerg form).

Most i've seen for a boss fight in DA is 55, and i've seen more or less 50 at different times in the server's life cycles. I think the fact that everyone calls each other zergs is really hilarious haha. Because everyone is so fucking hypocritical on almost everything they say, from both guilds.

It would have nothing to do with DA having a massive guild roster right? Are you saying that Nizzarr would have made that post if DA was dominating the content through camping? Seriously? Can DA keep up camping indefinitely? I doubt it, and if you can't then what do you do? You first play the victim card (anyone who points out that your guild is the problem by camping = trolling), then you go on to get some sympathy votes from Div/Rem by telling them you are out there to look out for their interest (when in reality DA admitted they will keep on camping because it suits DA).

Well, you can put that either way. Can IB keep camping forever? And i dont think its a victim card. I think its more a "fuck. this is getting to be a pita, lets see if we can figure out a way to work this out." And believe me, I know many of your members that are SICK of camping shit. Im sure they are. So it goes both ways tbh.

What i think has happened, is Nizz is trying to get the situation worked out, but Ayen steps up in here and basically brings up the point that if this isn't going to change (which i can tell you from this thread that it's not) then We are fine with camping. Its how we got/get mobs and thats cool. ATM, it's how you get mobs too, so unless we can stop dickwaving at each other as we drive past one another's house, its going to stay camping shit.

Hah. TBH, i cant wait for cleric epic camps. = D

Finally something we totally agree on, and yes I like the potential of that thread.

Make it, and call it Tal&Wrei's badass idea thread! and put his idea in there and lets make it up for discussion. Do it in server chat. andnndndndndnd....

yeah.


Oh. Give him credit for the idea too.

[Taluvill]

Originally Posted by Taluvill [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Most i've seen for a boss fight in DA is 55, and i've seen more or less 50 IB at different times in the server's life cycles. I think the fact that everyone calls each other zergs is really hilarious haha. Because everyone is so fucking hypocritical on almost everything they say, from both guilds.

Whoops. Im really bad at typing = D What i meant to say is what i just quoted ^^^^.

Thanks hah.

[astarothel]

My lawyered up version of Suicide Kings (to stop all you loopholing motherfuckers) will probably be posted today after I get a few more comments and selective pieces of input from individuals.

[G13]

Originally Posted by Alawen Everywhere [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Your guildies have a lot of class, spoolie.

The pot calling the kettle black

[jilena]

Wooo! Thank god this finally got moved to RnF!!

G13 you are the biggest fucking retard in the history of retarded fucking retards. That's like a triple Finawin dickslap for you.

I am going to type this in capital letters so maybe it will be easier to read.

THE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN FUCKING CAMPING AND FUCKING MOBILIZATION IS THAT WITH MOBILIZATION YOU ARE ABLE TO PLAY THE GAME BETWEEN SPAWNS. THE FACT THAT YOU LOG OUT IN A CONVENIENT LOCATION AND SORTA "CAMP THE MOB" WHILE LOGGED OFF DOES NOT MAKE IT THE SAME THING AS SITTING THERE UNABLE TO DO ANYTHING WITH YOUR CHARACTER WHILE WAITING FOR THE MOB TO SPAWN.

I hope that makes it clearer.

<3

[Aadill]

Originally Posted by jilena [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I am going to type this in capital letters so maybe it will be easier to read.

THE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN FUCKING CAMPING AND FUCKING MOBILIZATION IS THAT WITH MOBILIZATION YOU ARE ABLE TO PLAY THE GAME BETWEEN SPAWNS. THE FACT THAT YOU LOG OUT IN A CONVENIENT LOCATION AND SORTA "CAMP THE MOB" WHILE LOGGED OFF DOES NOT MAKE IT THE SAME THING AS SITTING THERE UNABLE TO DO ANYTHING WITH YOUR CHARACTER WHILE WAITING FOR THE MOB TO SPAWN.

I hope that makes it clearer.

<3

What? Don't you have 2 other accounts to play while you claim a raid target? Shows how smart IB is! bahaha I kid I kid!

[Alawen Everywhere]

Originally Posted by G13 [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

The pot calling the kettle black

You're the classiest of all. Ask yourself for a moment what I have ever said about your life outside this game. I have made no references to your career, your family, your health. I have been vocal about a political situation within game and some of the discussions have become heated. You have personally hounded me with a rumor of what you perceive as a vulnerable personal matter. One of your guildmates went so far as to wish death upon me. I try to make light of those remarks because I think that sort of thing can turn very ugly in a hurry. Perhaps even you can see that sort of thing is simply inappropriate.

I question both your judgement and your good taste, sir. When I am not proud of myself, I make it a point to apologize and change my behavior. Can you say the same?

[G13]

Originally Posted by jilena [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

THE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN FUCKING CAMPING AND FUCKING MOBILIZATION IS THAT WITH MOBILIZATION YOU ARE ABLE TO PLAY THE GAME BETWEEN SPAWNS. THE FACT THAT YOU LOG OUT IN A CONVENIENT LOCATION AND SORTA "CAMP THE MOB" WHILE LOGGED OFF DOES NOT MAKE IT THE SAME THING AS SITTING THERE UNABLE TO DO ANYTHING WITH YOUR CHARACTER WHILE WAITING FOR THE MOB TO SPAWN.

I hope that makes it clearer.

<3

You have a different opinion that me, which is fine. Not everyone plays Everquest for the same reasons as you do. Please refer to my original post on the subject, which outlines it quite nicely.

For some people, the end game bosses is the game. Not crafting. Not farming, ect. It's that simple.

If your main focus is to kill raid mobs to gear up your guild, camping is the most efficient way. You still need to mobilize efficiently, coordinate, ect. You just do it in advance instead of right when the mob spawns. Any guild can challenge that, which is exactly what IB and DA have been doing to each other. It's a very strategic game. I don't understand why one guild is talking about mobilization when that is exactly what both guilds have been doing now. Example: IB wipes in Hate and drops below 15. DA ports up within 5 minutes to claim it. That is about as clear cut an example of mobilization as there is. They needed to get to a port and get ported in 3-5 minutes before IB could res back up. I seem to remember the guild that prides itself on mobilization not accepting defeat in that situation and getting a GM involved.

Like I said before, why camp in WC when you can camp in the zone? You still need to buff, kill trash, pull boss, and kill boss within 30 minutes. I understand that some do not like doing this and are vehemently against it. They have every right to their opinion, but there is also a flip side to that coin.

So let's say an idle is put in place where you get auto logged off if you don't move? People will find a way around it. So you track with one druid and everyone just camps out at the preferred spot. Mob spawns, batphone, guild is ready to go. No need to port. Even without the 15 person in zone rule guilds would still do this. They would be stupid not to if they wanted the loot bad enough. People are acting like an FFA train/KS shitfest of chaos is somehow going to be better. It won't be. None of these encounters are designed for that except maybe Fear, and I already explained how that would be a shitfest as well.

It's all one straight line to the targets, where guilds would be leapfrogging each other and doing every shady tactic necessary to get "first aggro". What's first aggro though and who determines it's legit? Especially if guild B is getting aggro from mobs they didn't even pull? The obvious tactic guild A would use it to "accidently" get aggro on B, slowing down their charge towards the boss.

Everquest is a fun game, but it is a very flawed game. These same arguments and opinions have been thrown back and forth since 1999. These arguments are nothing new.