How much do Clerics need CHA?

[Danth]

Originally Posted by Zuranthium [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

It can also be helpful to prioritize CHA if you're playing the character for a specific small group purpose. But again, that's not what most Clerics are trying to do in the game.

That's the most important bit. Yes, charisma is useful to a certain subset of players. No, it is not and never will be the primary statistic for the large majority of clerics. As such, wisdom should be recommended, rightly, as the class's primary attribute. No single recommendation can encompass all individuals, especially not in a game as loosely-tuned as this one where quite often multiple tactics can achieve success. Excceptions always exist and that is a strength of this game, not a weakness--we don't need to be cookie-cutter. Charisma is a fine secondary statistic that can be of primary importance to some players.

[sajbert]

Gnomes are badass BUT terrible, terrible stats (low wis, low str, low cha) and no useful clickies. Wallhack is a convenience, but halflings can do pretty much the same thing and so can most other races if they sit down a bit. It's not like we lull as much as chanters do.

Originally Posted by Vexenu [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

No one is saying that CHA is useless, or that Clerics can't do a lot of cool stuff with their spell line. We're just saying that CHA is literally ONLY useful in the following circumstances:

1) When you are casting Lull in a situation where a crit fail is guaranteed to kill you.
2) When you are trying to CR yourself naked.

Uh.. no?

Lulling is useful in situations where a failed lull COULD kill you. It's useful in situations where a failed lull could set you back a significant amount of mana and time.

[Vexenu]

Originally Posted by Vexenu [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

https://wiki.project1999.com/Kobold_Jester%27s_Crown
https://wiki.project1999.com/Crude_Stein
https://wiki.project1999.com/Matchless_Dragonskin_Mask
https://wiki.project1999.com/Cat_Eye_Velium_Necklace
https://wiki.project1999.com/Seahorse_Spine_Bracelet
https://wiki.project1999.com/Froststone_Stein

+87 CHA from 6 cheap items (one's even free) . Throw them on when you're in the rare situation where a failed lull is guaranteed to kill you. Keep them in the bag the other 99.99% of your playtime when you aren't that worried about it, and prioritize much more valuable stats like WIS, HP, mana, AC, etc...

CHA is not a dump stat but it's extremely overrated in importance for Paladins and Clerics given how cheap and abundant +CHA gear is and how rarely you actually NEED to maximize it to survive.

Quoting a post I made in another similar thread awhile back. +87 CHA in 6 very cheap items. Put them on in the rare instance where you really don't want a crit lull fail.

Solist seems to have a really weird playstyle (and seems like a really weird dude in general, no offense, but not many people re-roll two level 60 Clerics for such trivial reasons) so maybe CHA is useful for him. Most people roll Clerics to raid, group or duo with an Enchanter. In all three of those roles you are very rarely well-served by stacking CHA, and in those rare cases you do need it, see the post I quoted above about how easily and cheaply you can acquire +CHA gear.

[Tethler]

Just bag half a set of charisma gear and put it on when you need to lull, use regular gear otherwise. No need to dedicate your permanent gear set to charisma.

[PabloEdvardo]

Dont (Solist) and Bayleigh were inspirations on Green when I was leveling my Cleric in classic.

They did a lot of crazy shit.

My Human Inny Cleric was not max CHA, and I never ended up needing it with my play style, but for those who prefer the duo/solo style of cleric, it makes a big difference.

Later on (Kunark+), I would say it's more irrelevant because it's trivial to carry a strong CHA set for when you need it. Those who already rolled max CHA for Classic weren't screwed, but it wasn't as relevant.

In regards to the chanter versus the cleric breaking camps... you're both right. I'd much rather send a cleric in with 2 DAs to break a room full of HT mobs and have the chanter peel them off with AE CC, etc. than risk a crit pull on the chanter and a lengthy rez/reset.

However for breaking non-HT rooms, the chanter is the no-brainer choice for most clerics. I would say that since Solist already had the CHA it just made more sense for them to jump into that role since they were comfortable with it, but it's definitely not "objectively the better way to do it" -- depends on your play style.

[tadkins]

The original intent of this thread was regarding CHA and halfling clerics, namely pairing sneak with lulls.

I remember a while back a halfling cleric helped my wizard get through Lower Guk to pull out the rod for the Staff of the Wheel from deep inside. He lulled a lot of things and helped me get through most of the mobs. The reason I considered going with a halfling cleric is that they seemed like they'd be able to travel seamlessly through a lot of places, which could be useful if, say, a group is deep inside a dungeon, needing a cleric, but unable to get to me to bring me over.

[Snaggles]

With a decent CHA set you can lull walk blues with high success. Worst case unless you pull like 5 on a crit fail you have options. Root, atone, gate, PE/Pacify/camp or DA bomb to the zone.

I think it’s a bit worse on a pally without a blur or a long duration root which is why I’ve always had a serious lull kit in the bag.

[Toxigen]

Originally Posted by Snaggles [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

With a decent CHA set you can lull walk blues with high success. Worst case unless you pull like 5 on a crit fail you have options. Root, atone, gate, PE/Pacify/camp or DA bomb to the zone.

I think it’s a bit worse on a pally without a blur or a long duration root which is why I’ve always had a serious lull kit in the bag.

Rocking 210 buffed CHA on my paladood. Been splitting rats in hole with ease at level 54 for my trio.

Clerics and paladins really can't get enough CHA.

[zelld52]

Originally Posted by Toxigen [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Clerics and paladins really can't get enough CHA.

Imagine how fun it is being group puller and healer simultaneously as 200CHA cleric with a mana-free Pacify. And then mama-free mark of Karn:

[Snaggles]

Originally Posted by Toxigen [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Rocking 210 buffed CHA on my paladood. Been splitting rats in hole with ease at level 54 for my trio.

Clerics and paladins really can't get enough CHA.

Yea a CHA set just expands your mobility and pulling ability. Usually if the stakes are low I just swap in a Jester crown, Crude Stein, and a couple overseer rings. Proc the Glamor sword and you are fairly functional stat wise. It’s nice to have more though, for trying to crawl to a group etc.

Worst case a crit resist puts like 4 spawns on the tank. Not a horrible outcome if your CC’s are there to help.