Best 4 person all caster/priest group

[DeathsSilkyMist]

Originally Posted by Troxx [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Bolder and highlighted that for DSM. He seems to have stopped reading after the first sentence. DSMs case for shaman is so un-compelling and weak that that the only way viability is possible is if pockets are allowed.

Funny how shamans will need a pocket cleric but clerics do not need (or want pocket shamans).

This entire side debate is even more straightforward than the early arguments where the clerics was guaranteed a spot and we were bickering/dickering about who should be 4th

Troxx didn't read the first sentence, where Bcbrown agrees that no rule exists against pocket characters.

Originally Posted by bcbrown [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Of course there's no rule about when pocket characters can be discussed.

Troxx forgets that his entire argument against pocket characters was based on an imaginary rule agsinst them.

He can discuss groups without pocket characters freely. But he cannot shut down other peoples discussions of groups with pocket characters via an imaginary rule and trolling.

[Toxigen]

maybe if DSM posts 2000 times in this thread someone will be convinced

[DeathsSilkyMist]

Originally Posted by Toxigen [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

maybe if DSM posts 2000 times in this thread someone will be convinced

More people play with pocket characters on P99 than disagree with me in the thread. The side against pocket characters is in the minority, and will promote pocket characters in other threads.

[Vear99]

Originally Posted by Toxigen [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

lol im nowhere near bis

i always went for the budget items spread across alts with my 5% RA

I know, but I always thought you managed to get close enough!

Originally Posted by DeathsSilkyMist [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

This is just a slippery slope argument, and has already been debunked multiple times. Creating a new pocket Cleric in a group purposely starting new characters together is clearly not the same thing as using a stable of existing BiS mains/alts. Those characters already exist. A new pocket cleric is made by this group and they level it up together.

The slippery slope is not a logical fallacy per se; it depends on the probability of the implied events. For example, the wikipedia page for the slippery slope shows a cartoon from 1895 about how weddings would look in 2001 if women got the right to vote with an extremely large woman in a tux and a tiny, feminine man. They are clearly intending to mock the cartoonist - but in our age of 2SLGBTQI+ was he wrong?

In this case the probability of additional steps is extremely high. If you are willing to to add a pocket cleric to a 4 man group, there is no reason not to add a pocket druid for ports, or a pocket necro for corpse summon, and then you might as well get them a little gear so that they can help 'with key encounters'. The probability of these steps is even higher on the forums where no actual effort is involved and the egos of the debaters are on the line!

Originally Posted by DeathsSilkyMist [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

You seem to be ignoring the other posters like Troxx who is so hell bent on winning he will spam the thread, troll, and lie about what other people have said. It is always amazing that people ignore this bad behavior and think it is ok. This thread would have been over long ago without this kind of nonsense.

I don't think Troxx has covered himself in glory in this thread, and he knows it. But you should ask yourself why you are triggering so quite many people.

Originally Posted by DeathsSilkyMist [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

You say I need to provide evidence. I have done a lot more of that than the opposition. Why don't you do this yourself, or ask someone else to do so? Evidence would be great, but it's mostly coming from me and nobody else. This seems one sided don't you think?

When you want to prove X empirically, the best thing to do is to measure X, not measure Y and then claim that Y implies X using Z logic. If you can setup ENC/ENC/CLR/SHM vs ENC/ENC/CLR/MAG groups, even in something like like the Chef/Bar camp and prove that SHM kills more frogs, you will put Troxx & co in a very difficult place. Alternatively, you can type out another 1800 posts.

[Toxigen]

DSM has been staring into walls soaking DKP for too long.

While there were no "rules" stated as no pocket characters, the spirit of the question is surely based on 4 casters with no outside assistance.

Troxx summed it up nicely a few pages ago.

[Keebz]

Pocket characters are not part of this discussion, but if they were, a pocket shaman for the once in a blue moon Malo + pre slow makes the most sense. Them being 60 doesn't mean they can't be "pocketed". The cleric provides its value while logged in and actively piloted.

As for Torpor tanking, you're not doing that for anything actually difficult and in general are better off letting the pets do the work. For example, if you find yourself in a group with 3 charm pets, your job as the shaman is not "tank" and you're just complicating things by forcing yourself into the situtation. If you want to prove us all wrong, upload the torpor tank videos of something mildly challenging. Chardok Royals or epic mobs at least.

Until then you sound like a child shamelessly paraphrasing what Jayya said.

[DeathsSilkyMist]

Originally Posted by Vear99 [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

...

Yes, people do create multiple pocket characters. This group can create a new 55 Mage for CoTH, a new 49 Cleric for CH, and a new 44 Druid for ports. None of these are existing level 60 BiS characters that already exist. Making all three would take less time and money than one BiS level 60 character.

We agree Troxx has been silly. If you've read the forums, there are some posters who attack me in every thread. The pattern of bullying is quite clear. Blaming the person being bullied is silly. You don't have to agree with me, but that isn't an excuse to attack other posters.

I've provided quite a bit of evidence for why a Shaman is great in this scenario. You can check the post history. Follow your own advice and provide something yourself. You are new to these forums and this thread.

[DeathsSilkyMist]

Originally Posted by Toxigen [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

While there were no "rules" stated as no pocket characters, the spirit of the question is surely based on 4 casters with no outside assistance.

Are you suggesting this group can't use mules?

[Toxigen]

The fact that hes even throwing in time considerations to get BiS vs. leveling a bunch of pocket characters for a hypothetical 4 man caster group is a pretty good indicator of how dry his tongue is from licking walls.

[Toxigen]

Originally Posted by DeathsSilkyMist [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Are you suggesting this group can't use mules?

There's a massive difference between having a mule to hold items in EC vs. actively parking a 5th char for a group to aid in combat effectiveness / recovery.

Your inability to make that distinction is mind boggling.