I hate this perma-camping shit

[AWOL]

EQ end game content is not supposed to be handed out to you on a plater with a rotation system. It's supposed challenging and competed for by a select few guilds. If you want access to end game content then apply and join the guilds that have access this content if you have what it takes. Otherwise continue to enjoy your family and friends guild but don't come crying to GMs because the big boys won't let you play with their toys. With the release of each expansion more content becomes available and the top guilds will start to lose interest on old bosses and when that happens you will get to try to take down naggy and vox with your pickup raid.

[sidgb]

Originally Posted by AWOL [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

EQ end game content is not supposed to be handed out to you on a plater with a rotation system. It's supposed challenging and competed for by a select few guilds. If you want access to end game content then apply and join the guilds that have access this content if you have what it takes. Otherwise continue to enjoy your family and friends guild but don't come crying to GMs because the big boys won't let you play with their toys. With the release of each expansion more content becomes available and the top guilds will start to lose interest on old bosses and when that happens you will get to try to take down naggy and vox with your pickup raid.

As I understand it, it's the big boys crying to the GM's about each other and trying to lock out the up and coming little guys that are moving in on what they think is their turf.

[Phallax]

As much as we dont want GM intervention, this is needed, and not exactly GM intervention but them enforcing the rules

6. AFK camping is not respected and is frowned upon, if caught afk camping you will be booted to the character select screen.

Majority of raid target campers AFK and this is frowned upon. Lets get active GMs and start char select booting people!

(Posting in all 100 posts about camping!)

[Aadill]

Was that in reference to AFK exping or sitting at a spawn point AFK for hours? Like, how would Hadden work under that ruleset? Could one person watch another at Hadden and call a GM to boot them the moment they don't move after a period of time?

I get what you're saying, but I believe that between player made rules and GM rules we're seeing many conflicts about what's allowable and what's being followed.

I do know I have seen a few guides try to port people out for being AFK, but you cannot prove if someone is legitimately AFK unless you watch them or go deep into logs to check for recent activity. In this situation, people suddenly end up in another zone that they weren't in before due to GM involvement and now you've got people that are pissed because the rules are being enforced but in the wrong manner. That's no good, either!

[Phallax]

Its a GM rule and yea camping Hadden is a prime example and Ive seen it used.

People dont get booted to bind, just to character select. They just have to log back in and be exactly where they were when the GM banned them. If GMs interacted enough that leapfrogging started to happen do to majority of campers AFKing and guilds dropping under 15. The camping would most likely stop, cuz youre not going to get 15+ members to stay at their keyboards 100% of the time doing nothing.

We already have GMs/Guides that willingly hang out at the camps and watch over things, so they could monior this easily.

Send members tells, if they dont respond in a said amount of time /boot

[Taxi]

Originally Posted by Aadill [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Was that in reference to AFK exping or sitting at a spawn point AFK for hours? Like, how would Hadden work under that ruleset? Could one person watch another at Hadden and call a GM to boot them the moment they don't move after a period of time?

I get what you're saying, but I believe that between player made rules and GM rules we're seeing many conflicts about what's allowable and what's being followed.

I do know I have seen a few guides try to port people out for being AFK, but you cannot prove if someone is legitimately AFK unless you watch them or go deep into logs to check for recent activity. In this situation, people suddenly end up in another zone that they weren't in before due to GM involvement and now you've got people that are pissed because the rules are being enforced but in the wrong manner. That's no good, either!

I wont touch FFA for this example. This is how i think it should go, if we stay within the current camping rules.

You sneak on the Lord or Hadden camp. Guy is afk. Lord pops. Hadden pops. Tick tick tick you wait 30 seconds, guy doesnt move. You kill the mob, loot and AFK guy says wtf, you lol and ride into the sunset.

[Aadill]

The time between spawns are the real issue that Phallax is getting at. Camping Hadden for the 8 hours in between spawns technically only requires the kill on him, as that is the player-defined area of the camp. AFK or not the camp is clear by the person claiming it, so is that considered AFK camping? Would he have to sit there for 8 hours?

Camp is being held as appropriate, yet the person is AFK. That's the kind of conflict I'm interested in knowing how it would come down. It's a very specific situation but these are the special cases that you have to add to the rules that are a blanketed attempt to fix other problems. In the end you'd have a long list of exceptions, because you know these will come up.

[Aadill]

Not that I'm trying to shoot the idea down but there are flaws that cannot be accounted for immediately, however the theory exists. Because of that it becomes important to realize the overall repercussions of any rules made.

[Taxi]

Originally Posted by Aadill [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

The time between spawns are the real issue that Phallax is getting at. Camping Hadden for the 8 hours in between spawns technically only requires the kill on him, as that is the player-defined area of the camp. AFK or not the camp is clear by the person claiming it, so is that considered AFK camping? Would he have to sit there for 8 hours?

Camp is being held as appropriate, yet the person is AFK. That's the kind of conflict I'm interested in knowing how it would come down. It's a very specific situation but these are the special cases that you have to add to the rules that are a blanketed attempt to fix other problems. In the end you'd have a long list of exceptions, because you know these will come up.

I think we can be quite general about it. If someone hasnt engaged 30sec after mob is up, hes afk camping.

[Aadill]

Again, I'm not referring to engaging a mob that has spawned, but the time in between mob spawns. Hadden is a great example because of the length of his respawn. Is it AFK camping if the camp is cleared, Hadden is down, and you go AFK while the 5 hours pass that you are waiting for him to respawn? Are you camping the Hadden camp? Yes. Are you AFK? Yes. Does this mean you get kicked to the select screen despite following other rules that are in place on the server? Yes/No?

As for raid encounters: How does that work? Technically you are camping something that isn't up. In essence the camp is cleared and you are holding it. On the flip side, some people are AFK camping.

Which rule do you follow? Which rule does a GM pick to act on?