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Old 06-07-2019, 12:43 AM
A1551 A1551 is offline

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Default Lull line -- some empirical testing on CHA and crit resist rates

So between numerous characters of mine who use various lull lines, I've really wanted to put some numbers to the effect of charisma on reducing crit resist rates. Specifically I am always wondering if for example pulling on a paladin, it is worth the effort to switch in a +20 cha item or the like. Looking around the forums, there are many discussions on it, but I couldn't find anyone actually put some real numbers to the topic. If anyone does know of such a thread please let me know!

So I tested as follows on my lvl 60 chanter:

-Found a mob who would always resist, and I could safely then zone away from. In this case it was a yellow con gate guard in nektulos named sergeant c'orm (lvl 61 per wiki).

-used soothe just because I could cast it forever without running out of mana. No idea if different incarnations of the spell would change any of this. Probably not?

-Did two test sets, one at base CHA for my chanter (95) and one right smack at 200. Idea was to maximize differences in the data sets without confounding things with any diminishing returns on CHA over 200 (if that is indeed the mechanic).

-Each test I went for 200 RESISTS, to measure crit resist rate vs resists. Not an amazing data set, but I was fairly confident it would show something. Way more would obviously be better. Anyone who wants to complain is free to repeat this and add to the sample! note for sample size, I originally only did 100 of each, then felt it was inadequate and expanded it to 200. The results were essentially unchanged (literally +/-about a percentage point), so I would say the high level conclusions are at least in line with reality.

Note soothe doesn't work on mobs that high -- it always resists. This was actually a boon as I could get a resist every cast. At first I was worried this might in some way impact the test, ie resists because the spell is ineligible on target would not crit or something, but this was not the case.
Finally, this data doesn't show if crit resist rates are at all level based vs just purely charisma based. Obviously resist rates are level based.

As to my results:
95 Cha, 200 tests -- 71 critical resists (ie 35.5% crit rate)
200 Cha, 200 tests -- 15 critical resists (ie 7% crit rate)
Not surprising, but a very large difference. So roughly speaking, between 4-5x the crit resist rate in this data set. While the sample size *really* isn't big enough to go to this level of analysis, basically +105 CHA saved me 56 crit resists over 200 attempts(!) That would be roughly 0.26% absolute crit reduction per point of cha assuming a linear progression up to 200 CHA.

Going back to the hypotheticals from the beginning of my post, equipping a +20 cha item just for pulling, based on this data set, would be worth something like a 5% absolute reduction in lull crit resists, ie, if a puller got 20 lull resists, one time theyd avoid a crit due to the item. Which honestly ain't bad.

Ok, so some other thoughts, I don't know if CHA over 200 has diminishing returns, I'd assume so, if I am feeling motivated I may run another test at my best cha (which is roughly 250)

Likewise, I wonder if the target level has any impact on crit resist rate. My GUESS is no, but I could be way off. There is a lvl 50 gate guard right next to the guy I used for this test who is also conveniently immune to soothe so maybe if I can find the motivation I'll do that as well!

Finally, I don't know if different classes handle the same spell lines differently, like for all I know enchanter charisma works better for soothe than on a paladin, even though it is the exact same spell scroll

Anyway, this has sort of been bugging me a little in the back of my brain for years to do some testing on, and I finally got around to doing it tonight. I hope some other people find it of use, too!
-Propo Fol, Enchanter
-Adeno Sine, Monk
<Azure Guard>

-Curare, Necromancer
-Vaso, Cleric
Old 06-07-2019, 01:03 AM
Synthlol Synthlol is offline

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Old 06-07-2019, 01:19 AM
bradsamma bradsamma is offline

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This is amazing.
Old 06-07-2019, 01:55 AM
Jimjam Jimjam is offline
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Now do one for critical fails on begging!
Old 06-07-2019, 02:09 AM
saftbudet saftbudet is offline

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Thank you for the time you put in and for posting results.
Old 06-07-2019, 02:23 AM
elwing elwing is offline
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There is a reason my bard on live had 255 cha for ldon... Averaging maybe 4lull resist with rarely agro..
Old 06-07-2019, 04:07 AM
Izmael Izmael is offline
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Amazing job.

Please repeat with 255 CHA [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]
Old 06-07-2019, 08:55 AM
DMN DMN is online now
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Originally Posted by elwing [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]
There is a reason my bard on live had 255 cha for ldon... Averaging maybe 4lull resist with rarely agro..
Cha wasn't anywhere near that effective on live, however.
Old 06-07-2019, 09:00 AM
elwing elwing is offline
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Pretty certain it was, or at least at 255, I rarely had agro on failures
Old 06-07-2019, 09:56 AM
TomisFeline TomisFeline is offline

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awesome awesome
the 250 Cha test would also be super interesting
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