Would I be stupid to want to roll a second pally?

[Barlu]

What I was getting at is your Tunare High Elf Pally isn’t going to really be any different than your current Pally except worse overall. If you want to roll a second one go for it l, but it will be a redundant experience with a weaker character.

[Loadsamoney]

Originally Posted by Barlu [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

What I was getting at is your Tunare High Elf Pally isn’t going to really be any different than your current Pally except worse overall. If you want to roll a second one go for it l, but it will be a redundant experience with a weaker character.

You just said High Elf is the Min/Max choice though.

[DeathsSilkyMist]

Originally Posted by Loadsamoney [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

You just said High Elf is the Min/Max choice though.

Even though it is the Min/Max choice, it often takes a long time for the Min/Max choice to really matter. Min/Max usually assumes you have Best in Slot Velious raid gear (or close to it). In that case, even a low STR/STA race like High Elf will be maxed out in STR and STA. The benefit to being a High Elf when you have Best in Slot Velious raid gear is that gear tends to give a ton of STR and STA, but doesn't give as much WIS and CHA. By going High Elf, you end up with higher WIS and CHA compared to a dwarf with the same Best in Slot Velious raid gear.

[Loadsamoney]

Originally Posted by DeathsSilkyMist [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Even though it is the Min/Max choice, it often takes a long time for the Min/Max choice to really matter. Min/Max usually assumes you have Best in Slot Velious raid gear (or close to it). In that case, even a low STR/STA race like High Elf will be maxed out in STR and STA. The benefit to being a High Elf when you have Best in Slot Velious raid gear is that gear tends to give a ton of STR and STA, but doesn't give as much WIS and CHA. By going High Elf, you end up with higher WIS and CHA compared to a dwarf with the same Best in Slot Velious raid gear.

Well the odds of me ever having BiS raid gear is effectively zilch. My end-game goals for a character are usually Epic + Thurgadin Armor OR Planar armor.

[Gustoo]

Originally Posted by Loadsamoney [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

If you tally up their starting stats vs Dwarf Pally, they actually have higher stats overall than Dwarf, 572 vs 558. So I think there would be enough separation between HE Pally vs Dwarf Pally to make it interesting.
.

I want to comment on the starting stats thing.

If you remove intelligence, a totally useless stat for a paladin in every way, you have 480 points in the high elf, and 498 points in the dwarf. 325 high elf and 338 dwarf if you also remove dex and agility (dwarf has really high dex)

Just saying, the only thing you really miss is the charisma and if you haven't had trouble with your lulls you probably wont. Some people prefer to be able to use critical lull resists to pull anyways.

high elf is one of the worst paladin race choices until they are end game velious geared. It takes a lot of top gear to make up for having pitiful melee stats.

Even a half elf with all points to wisdom would be better. They can still worship tunare can't they? Way better strength way better dex almost the same charisma, terrible wisdom.

But for normal people, dwarf is arguably the best choice. A lot of people would go human because they have decent melee stats and aren't gimped in charisma or wisdom. That would probably be the race i recommend to you if you did wanna roll a second one.

But id say, only do it for the fun of leveling again, not to change what you can do with your class, which won't happen by changing a few starting stats.

[Loadsamoney]

Originally Posted by Gustoo [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I want to comment on the starting stats thing.

If you remove intelligence, a totally useless stat for a paladin in every way, you have 480 points in the high elf, and 498 points in the dwarf. 325 high elf and 338 dwarf if you also remove dex and agility (dwarf has really high dex)

Just saying, the only thing you really miss is the charisma and if you haven't had trouble with your lulls you probably wont. Some people prefer to be able to use critical lull resists to pull anyways.

high elf is one of the worst paladin race choices until they are end game velious geared. It takes a lot of top gear to make up for having pitiful melee stats.

Even a half elf with all points to wisdom would be better. They can still worship tunare can't they? Way better strength way better dex almost the same charisma, terrible wisdom.

But for normal people, dwarf is arguably the best choice. A lot of people would go human because they have decent melee stats and aren't gimped in charisma or wisdom. That would probably be the race i recommend to you if you did wanna roll a second one.

But id say, only do it for the fun of leveling again, not to change what you can do with your class, which won't happen by changing a few starting stats.

The main reason would be for access to Nature's Defender. No Bash, but 45AC on a weapon is nothing to sneeze at, especially if it's considered shield AC like I've been told, and thus ignores the AC cap. FD still beats it overall, but I've heard ND is the 3rd best tanking weapon for a Tunare Pally.

[Crede]

Originally Posted by Loadsamoney [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

The main reason would be for access to Nature's Defender. No Bash, but 45AC on a weapon is nothing to sneeze at, especially if it's considered shield AC like I've been told, and thus ignores the AC cap. FD still beats it overall, but I've heard ND is the 3rd best tanking weapon for a Tunare Pally.

That’s your sole reason? A bit silly imo. ND is a cool wep with nice stats but garbage ratio

FD looks sweet on a dorf, just farm what pp you need to buy the mqs and enjoy having superior stats over HIE until velious end game which who cares at that point you’ve already won.

[Lampolo]

Originally Posted by Danth [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

How are you stupid for doing what you like? The entire point of the game is to have a good time. I have three paladins on my account, and two shadow knights.

Danth

This explains a lot

[DeathsSilkyMist]

Originally Posted by Crede [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

That’s your sole reason? A bit silly imo. ND is a cool wep with nice stats but garbage ratio

FD looks sweet on a dorf, just farm what pp you need to buy the mqs and enjoy having superior stats over HIE until velious end game which who cares at that point you’ve already won.

The ratio on Nature's Defender isn't that bad. It's a 0.825 ratio, and Fiery Defender is a 0.875. Not a huge gap between the two. Ratio-wise both are meh compared to NToV weapons, which aren't difficult to get. But if your goal is stopping at something like Fiery Defender, Nature's Defender isn't a bad stopping point either.

[Crede]

Originally Posted by DeathsSilkyMist [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

The ratio on Nature's Defender isn't that bad. It's a 0.825 ratio, and Fiery Defender is a 0.875. Not a huge gap between the two. Ratio-wise both are meh compared to NToV weapons, which aren't difficult to get. But if your goal is stopping at something like Fiery Defender, Nature's Defender isn't a bad stopping point either.

I was referring to the context here that he wants to start a new race for an ND when if anything he should just focus on finishing the FD on his dwarf if he wants something with similar stats. Both are pretty bad weapons though ratiowise.