Iksar Shaman - Solo Challenges?

[Troxx]

Originally Posted by zelld52 [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Wait so is Iksar Shaman going to solo as well despite not having JBB? I feel like 89 pages in we didn't get a clear answer.

Yes an iksar shaman will solo well without a JBB. JBB gives a potent leveling advantage for a brief window starting at the level you can click it and falling off sharply by your early 50s when it starts to fall off.

It’s a neat toy to play around with but is not hugely game-changing.

[DeathsSilkyMist]

Originally Posted by Troxx [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Yes an iksar shaman will solo well without a JBB. JBB gives a potent leveling advantage for a brief window starting at the level you can click it and falling off sharply by your early 50s when it starts to fall off.

It’s a neat toy to play around with but is not hugely game-changing.

This has been disproven. JBB is superior to root rotting all the way to 60 when you don't have access to Epic. Please ignore Troxx's continued attempts to refuse to admit when he is wrong.

[Naethyn]

Wait I thought JBB started at 45?

[DeathsSilkyMist]

Originally Posted by Naethyn [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Wait I thought JBB started at 45?

Indeed! Levels 45-60. JBB can take you all the way to 60 once you hit 45. It has generally been a given that JBB is clickable at 45, but clarification is always nice for people who don't want to read the entire thread.

[Troxx]

Originally Posted by DeathsSilkyMist [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

This has been disproven. JBB is superior to root rotting all the way to 60 when you don't have access to Epic. Please ignore Troxx's continued attempts to refuse to admit when he is wrong.

None of this is NOT true:

Originally Posted by Troxx [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Yes an iksar shaman will solo well without a JBB. JBB gives a potent leveling advantage for a brief window starting at the level you can click it and falling off sharply by your early 50s when it starts to fall off.

The leveling advantage 45-51 is not deniable. It is there, and it is real. The only point of contention is to what degree a JBB may or may not slow down (or break even or whatever) leveling from 52-60. "Superior" or "inferior" aside ... an iksar shaman will be just fucking fine without a JBB. Napkin math considered and personal preferences aside you are looking at a relative efficiency of +/- 2-8% in a best vs worst case scenario.

My impression: a mouth-breather or less-skilled player will find success spamming JBB. A more talented player can pass that break-even point from 52 onward and actually end up ahead without a 10-15k "toy". We can agree to disagree on this point but ...

If the OP wants to be an iksar ... THEY SHOULD BE AN IKSAR. JBB is not worth crying a damn river or filtering through 80 pages of napkin math for. It doesn't make or break anything.

Quit being obtuse.

[DeathsSilkyMist]

Originally Posted by Troxx [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

A more talented player can pass that break-even point from 52 onward and actually end up ahead without a 10-15k "toy". We can agree to disagree on this point but ...

You haven't done anything to show this. The math disagrees thus far too. Please stop making stuff up and providing false information. JBB is superior as a leveling tool all the way to 60 when you don't have Epic, even for a skilled player.

Originally Posted by Troxx [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

If the OP wants to be an iksar ... THEY SHOULD BE AN IKSAR.

Indeed. Nobody claimed otherwise. This doesn't change facts about JBB.

[Troxx]

blah blah blah

an iksar shaman will be just fine without a JBB.

Real shamans did levels 1-50 without it.

Skilled players don't need it 51-60.

Sorry you suck?

Edit: good night my sweet prince. I have to go to sleep now because I am a gainfully employed adult.

[DeathsSilkyMist]

Originally Posted by Troxx [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

an iksar shaman will be just fine without a JBB.

Indeed, nobody claimed otherwise.

Originally Posted by Troxx [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Skilled players don't need it 51-60.

You have no evidence to suggest that a skilled player can beat JBB math-wise. Thus far it is the superior leveling tool from 45-60 while you do not have access to Epic.

Your idea that "skilled" players do not need it is simply a fantasy right now. You are just trying to boost your own ego, as you didn't use your JBB all the way to 60.

Originally Posted by Troxx [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Sorry you suck?

Your baseless opinions on other people's skill levels are irrelevant.

[Lament Icarus]

Hi hello I’ve leveled four shamans to 60 in my time playing P99. I’ve also accomplished a good portion of the Solo Artist Challenge on several toons.

Blue - Troll Shaman (no JBB or Epic)
Blue - Barb Shaman (JBB, no Epic)
Green - Iksar Shaman (no JBB, Epic)
Green - Ogre Shaman (JBB, Epic)

JBB felt very useful from 45-52 or so. I saw a drastic drop off in use on both the Barb and Ogre as I gained in levels beyond that. It still had occasional use at 55+ and very marginal use at 60, but it was mostly a neat toy at best.

Regen has felt useful to me at all levels. I really quite like it at 60 with Regrowth effects and Aura of Battle, it feels really substantial when solo farming or soloing hard content. FSI has felt mostly useless in all content, really only showing its value in soloing hard content and even then rarely. I’d say in terms of practical application and certainly in how it feels to play any of the characters, Regen > FSI (stuns are annoying, they don’t inhibit your ability to kill a hard target).

Epic is far superior to JBB in my opinion, and certainly if you have a Fungi. I would always pick Epic for leveling, and considering Epic has broad and far reaching use at 60, and JBB has at best marginal use, I’d say JBB is more of a fantastic leveling item than anything else.

The character I’ve accomplished the most on is the Iksar Shaman. I’ve achieved a huge number of solo artist challenge content on him, and I personally love the look.

All in all, play what you want to look at for hundreds if not thousands of hours. None of the racial bonuses will change your gameplay substantially. I’m partial to regen and I’ve found it the most impactful in feel. Others will argue differently, and that’s okay.

Edit: You need none of the tools to level to 60. Yeah, it’s a bit slower. Leveling is where you build the fundamentals, don’t let an item skip them all for you. Leveling with JBB is mathematically faster. Epic is likely on par, Epic with fungi I believe outpaces JBB with Fungi (hard to test this and honestly who the fuck cares). Pick what’s fun, enjoy the game. You can do it all on any race.

[DeathsSilkyMist]

Originally Posted by Lament Icarus [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Hi hello I’ve leveled four shamans to 60 in my time playing P99. I’ve also accomplished a good portion of the Solo Artist Challenge on several toons.

Blue - Troll Shaman (no JBB or Epic)
Blue - Barb Shaman (JBB, no Epic)
Green - Iksar Shaman (no JBB, Epic)
Green - Ogre Shaman (JBB, Epic)

Hello! Thanks for the post! That's awesome you've leveled so many Shamans.

Originally Posted by Lament Icarus [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

JBB felt very useful from 45-52 or so. I saw a drastic drop off in use on both the Barb and Ogre as I gained in levels beyond that. It still had occasional use at 55+ and very marginal use at 60, but it was mostly a neat toy at best.

I leveled from 45-60 with JBB, and it was faster than Root Rotting. Mathematically this is also the case, as I showed earlier in this thread. I am curious as to why people have this feeling of drop-off in the early 50s. My only guess is people just don't have a good enough feel for how to use JBB for leveling. There isn't a lot of reference for how to level via JBB, so perhaps that is the culprit.

Originally Posted by Lament Icarus [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Regen has felt useful to me at all levels. I really quite like it at 60 with Regrowth effects and Aura of Battle, it feels really substantial when solo farming or soloing hard content. FSI has felt mostly useless in all content, really only showing its value in soloing hard content and even then rarely. I’d say in terms of practical application and certainly in how it feels to play any of the characters, Regen > FSI (stuns are annoying, they don’t inhibit your ability to kill a hard target).

Regen is useful at all levels. But you can math out precisely how much of a bonus it gives you. Sadly with Torpor, Racial Regen just falls off sharply, because you can get back to full HP in 3 minutes or less. Most fights aren't long enough for Racial Regen to save even one Torpor. Racial Regen basically needs a 12 minute fight to give you 1 Torpor back, which is only 30 seconds of recovery time saved per fight. At 60 you generally don't need that small boost to recovery time, as you are fighting big targets with long respawn timers. You aren't fighting waves of easy mobs on a Shaman at 60 as often.

Both FSI and Regen are small bonuses once you hit 60. FSI is simply better due to Regen falling off due to Torpor.

Originally Posted by Lament Icarus [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Epic is far superior to JBB in my opinion, and certainly if you have a Fungi. I would always pick Epic for leveling, and considering Epic has broad and far reaching use at 60, and JBB has at best marginal use, I’d say JBB is more of a fantastic leveling item than anything else.

Indeed. Epic is better for leveling, assuming you can consistently root rot 3+ mobs. If you are fighting 1-2 mobs per cycle, JBB is still going to be faster.

Originally Posted by Lament Icarus [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

All in all, play what you want to look at for hundreds if not thousands of hours. None of the racial bonuses will change your gameplay substantially. I’m partial to regen and I’ve found it the most impactful in feel. Others will argue differently, and that’s okay.

Edit: You need none of the tools to level to 60. Yeah, it’s a bit slower. Leveling is where you build the fundamentals, don’t let an item skip them all for you. Leveling with JBB is mathematically faster. Epic is likely on par, Epic with fungi I believe outpaces JBB with Fungi (hard to test this and honestly who the fuck cares). Pick what’s fun, enjoy the game. You can do it all on any race.

Yes, everybody agrees that you should play what you want. Some people want to play what is Min/Max so they can get the most out of their character. That is why we have these debates, so people interesting in Min/Maxing can get the facts.