Semi-Classic

[Zithax]

Originally Posted by Jify [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

This is as far as I read, then I went, "This guy has obviously not played on this server since launch."

8(

This.

No offense bro, but this server isn't perfect. It's emu on top of that. I'm sure someone somewhere appreciates this compiled list of known issues, but as Jify said it's obvious you haven't been playing here since launch or else you'd not have wasted anyones time by posting this thread.

[jelatin]

Originally Posted by Haynar [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

If I wasn't a Dev, I would probably tell you to piss off.

But since I do try to contribute to the project, and don't like to get into pissing matches, I won't.

Go kill some frogs or something.

Have a Merry Christmas.

Haynar

Awesome.

[Secrets]

Originally Posted by Icecometus [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Play here till EQC comes out [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

EQC is coming out coincident with the rapture.

True story.

Also, it won't work on modern hardware too well. You need EQ Windows to even get the EQC client to run on Windows 7/Vista.

I'd say stay here forever.

[mitic]

i highly doubt that soe-devs would have done a better job then ours (progression servers some years ago come to my mind) since most of verants staff left long time ago ´

there is no better vision (tm) out there than here.

about EQC i have to concur with a previous poster.... lol?

[Aeolwind]

Originally Posted by MutualofOmaha [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

After having played on the server since its first week back in October, I have some observations, and more importantly, a question for the GM's regarding the server's future.

As others have recently observed on these forums, our server has a number of aspects that are not classic, at all, the most immediately noticeable of these being the global ooc and auction channels.

However, there are many, many other non-classic elements, including:

Originally Posted by MutualofOmaha [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

1. Experience gain - group bonuses and dungeon bonuses have been in effect on the server since day 1, these were not classic; also, pets do not leech experience as they did in classic; also, experience penalties are not shared among group members, as they were in classic. This has made leveling up much, much faster than it should be on a classic server.

Experience is tricky business, classically dungeons did have experience modifiers, we were just never made aware of them.

Originally Posted by MutualofOmaha [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

2. Pets - pets are super-pets, and particularly the magician pets; pets do not draw multiple aggro or generate faction hits the way they did in classic.

Considering the lack of "absolute" data available, they are close. Their min/max hits are correct as are their HP values. Resists are conjecture but don't seem too far out of line.

Originally Posted by MutualofOmaha [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

3. Spells - spell resists for npc's are definitely much lower than they ever were in classic, resulting in fewer npc resists and partial resists; spell resists for pc's are much less effective than they were in classic.

Probably the toughest thing to get correct is resist values. No hard data for this exists anywhere, other than a few scant documents that reveal immunities, actual resist levels are impossible to find. Most every mob had the same resists when we started, about 700 mobs had to be made and several thousand more have been modified.

Originally Posted by MutualofOmaha [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

4. Meditating - meditation does not require the caster to see only the spell-book while meditating, this is non-classic.

Client limitation. Nothing we can do.

Originally Posted by MutualofOmaha [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

5. Factions - starting factions are incorrect for a wide variety of race/class combinations, and they are off on a global scale; merchants are on the wrong factions/no faction, instead of how they were in classic (this is of particular importance for merchants near key dungeons); bankers are on the wrong faction/no faction; faction required to get quests is wrong, making it easier to get certain quests than it should be; faction required to complete quests is wrong.

You should have seen faction when we started [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]. It was a nightmare that was no where NEAR as good as it is now. There are probably holes, but I don't think even for a moment that it is as far off as you believe it is. As far as quests go; I'll agree, there are many quests that are missing faction requirements, I generally try to fix those as I go, but again, with -no- idea what faction rewards should actually be from some quests I have to be careful on what requirements I put down.

Originally Posted by MutualofOmaha [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

6. Item and coin drops - coin drops are substantially higher from npc's than they ever were in classic, more on a par with Kunark drops than vanilla drops; item drops are much more common than they were in classic, too, especially rare item drops (a case in point - I tested two well-known drops in Upper Guk, the squire fork drop and the spider armor drop - 23 squire kills yielded 7 forks and 16 collars, while 18 giant spider kills yielded 6 chitin armor and 12 chitin shields - rare drops like the fork were about 1 in 20 or 1 in 50 in classic, not 1 in 3 on a consistent basis).

What can I say, sometimes things get missed. That is why we have a thriving bug & petition forum.

Originally Posted by MutualofOmaha [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

7. Guards - guard factions and assists are horribly broken, and guards themselves are much less lethal than they were in classic

Honestly, on this point, I think you are smoking crack. We had to actually fix the source code to allow for more factions so that we could get guards to even properly kill newbie mobs.

Originally Posted by MutualofOmaha [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

8. Travel - intercontinental travel was instantaneous from the very beginning of the server, eliminating the need for players to take time to congregate for buying, selling, forming groups, questing, etc.; even the current boat replacement system makes travel much faster than it should be in classic

DX8-9 transition problem. The boats became hollow on the Titanium client. We're working on something to replace the translocators with. Stay tuned.

Originally Posted by MutualofOmaha [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

9. Tradeskills - items and recipes and combines are available from the beginning that were not available until the Gates of Discord era, allowing more rapid skilling up and nonclassic items to be made and used; vendors sell tradeskill items that they never had in classic, and in many locations in Norrath, tradeskill items are available near one another, whereas in real classic players would have had to travel through various zones even to get basic tradeskill goods.

The tradeskill table is a train wreck & an aberration. Starting from scratch would have required us to delay launch for another 3-4 months. As aberrant recipes are reported they do get nuked. As far as merchant inventories go, by and large they should be correct. The only ones that are probably off are the ones that either a) haven't been reported yet, or b) we haven't had time to fix yet.

Originally Posted by MutualofOmaha [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

10. Vendors - besides many vendors being available to hostile factions that would never have had access in classic, there are many vendors with incorrect inventories; some vendors even sell finished tradeskill goods that should never be on any vendor as a standard inventory item, and these finished goods tend to be vital stepping-stone type items for higher-level skillup recipes in tradeskills; some vendors sell items that were strictly foraged or dropped tradeskill items in classic.

Again, this is what the bugs/petition forum is for. If you find something you think is wrong, find data via the wayback machine at www.archive.org and post it.

Originally Posted by MutualofOmaha [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

These are just a few observations of my own. I have no doubt that others could add many other items to this list. The result of most of these aberrations from classic is a greatly accelerated advancement and leveling curve on the server, making things move much, much more rapidly than they would have on a more classic server. Our server really is at best Semi-Classic, or perhaps Pseudo-Classic, at this time.

What is classic on our server, then? Class restrictions, race restrictions, starting cities, zone graphics are all classic; list of available zones is classic, although some zones have been made available to certain members of the server before they actually should have been, if the server was to have been truly classic.

This server is still a lot of fun, that's why we're here playing together.

The leveling curve isn't too far off considering the only data table that is available is one from the post-Gates era. While you may not spend 72 hours in 45 like classic you do spend more time in the other levels. People are far more adept at leveling now than back then as well. Folks know all the right places to go.

Originally Posted by MutualofOmaha [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

The question I would like to ask, however, is this:

Will this server strive to become more and more classic, as it continues to move forward? Will some, or all, of the above-mentioned aberrations be changed to classic, over time?

If so, can we expect a relaunch at some point with a truly classic server, or perhaps a second server to be launched as a truly classic server? I personally feel that a second server might be a better choice, so that those who strive to progress through the server as rapidly as possible can retain the distinctions and advantages for which they have played so hard on the current server, while those who enjoy a more truly classic game could start anew once a classic server is a reality. Perhaps such a second server would not track server-firsts and would not grant titles; in this way the pace-setter types might feel less slighted.

We'll always strive to be as exact as possible.

Originally Posted by MutualofOmaha [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

My observations are my own, but I really would appreciate a response to my question from the GMs, so that we all can know what we might expect from Project 1999.

You have one. And while I think you are a pessimist and can't see the forest for the trees. Your opinions are your own.

Originally Posted by MutualofOmaha [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Thank you GMs in advance for your response, and thank you also for our opportunity to play on this server.

Nice double talk at the end. I see what you tried to do there.

Overall, This is not our primary job in life. All of us have real jobs, families & lives that we have to attend to. My house is still in boxes by and large since I moved due to the fact of the extra time I take on the development of this server. It may not be perfect, but I challenge you to do your part to make the server better. We are certainly doing more than our fair share. We don't actually get to play on the server, so we have little firsthand knowledge of incorrect items, and there will be some. Considering since the start I fixed over 600 broken quests, Nilbog among others made over 700,000 DB changes, several hundred source code improvements and modifications by Rogean, Haynar & Ladoth, we added the pathing files for all dungeons to keep mobs from running through walls, also that thousands of mobs that had incorrect loot (There were 70,000 incorrect "Rusty Daggers" being used as an example), faction was completely incorrect (Ogres could roam around north freeport & high elves in Neriak), we also had to restructure spells from every 2 levels for all classes to every 4 levels, fixed several thousand faces on NPC's, Yes, classic is the target. But when your starting point is so far off the mark, you won't get there in short order. Before we released we developed and changed things for almost a full year just to get it where it was at launch.

[stayne]

No need to nitpick imho. P99 is a damnload of fun and closer to classic than anything else (and probably will continue to be). I spent 1.5 hours last night in EC looking for my corpse and LOVED IT!

[FatMagic]

Here, here Aeolwind - BRILLIANT reponse. This thread should end at his response - it's exactly what is needed to be heard. Thank you for the hard work!

p.s. MutualOfOhama - help us make it a more classic and a better server by reporting these problems in the Bugs area. You will NOT find a better EQ Classic Server out there... go ahead, I challenge you to find one (that is currently running, not in development).

[Jete]

However much I disagree with him, the post is on topic. It is semi-classic, to be near sighted, look at bards, we've been told we won't be able to swarm kite due to its "unfairness" but we get the other "fair" perks of being a bard. I don't mean to nitpick, I love P99 and have devoted much time and money to it. I am just pointing out that he is right- the Devs have done a great job but seem to favor what seems fair over what is classic. This again, is highly opinionated, but true.

Not meaning to oversight things such as fixing raid rotation, continuous quest fixes and a large amount of output by the devs who make zero money for their work- But I completely agree with things like /ooc and /auc being serverwide. It is very easy to say these things are necessary but after a while start to add up and ruin my life.

P.S.- WTB a bucket for my tears, PST.

[Aeolwind]

Originally Posted by Jete [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

However much I disagree with him, the post is on topic. It is semi-classic, to be near sighted, look at bards, we've been told we won't be able to swarm kite due to its "unfairness" but we get the other "fair" perks of being a bard. I don't mean to nitpick, I love P99 and have devoted much time and money to it. I am just pointing out that he is right- the Devs have done a great job but seem to favor what seems fair over what is classic. This again, is highly opinionated, but true.

Not meaning to oversight things such as fixing raid rotation, continuous quest fixes and a large amount of output by the devs who make zero money for their work- But I completely agree with things like /ooc and /auc being serverwide. It is very easy to say these things are necessary but after a while start to add up and ruin my life.

P.S.- WTB a bucket for my tears, PST.

The issue with bards again is a client/server interaction issue. I'm all for quad/swarm kiting. Herein lies the issue: The server/client interaction isn't fast enough to keep track and maintain a classic hit box for mobs, this is why they run so fast. Now, we could increase the area of the bard AE damages but you would drift into the realm of overpowered. They were relatively small AE areas (I was rather disillusioned on live due to this and quickly gave up my bard twink). If the hit box code can be refined then we can slow down mobs and look at bard swarm kiting. It's not that it can't be done, it's just that it hasn't been done yet.

[Jete]

And the instrument modifiers don't work on those songs-

You have a bucket for sale by chance?