Monk 1hb vs 2hb

[Zemus]

Originally Posted by kjs86z [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

edit: here's a question....were Firfisle and Raev autistically swapping their Abashi's out between swings for fist dmg?

Test was actually between me and Raev in the same group with the same buffs (bard etc), and yes he was weapon swapping but pulled agro when tank pushed out of range and went splat.

Note: Agro on 2h's has gone WAY up. Off topic, but Warrior epic 2h is probably best (in terms of threat) for tanking now (or Palladius for the 80 ac)

[monkeydoc]

Originally Posted by Legidias [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Misses are also way more disastrous on DPS for slow 2H than 1H

Can anyone explain why this is true? Intuition tells me that missing would have the same impact on both (each individual miss being more lost damage, but the same amount of lost damage over time).

[kjs86z]

Originally Posted by monkeydoc [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Can anyone explain why this is true? Intuition tells me that missing would have the same impact on both (each individual miss being more lost damage, but the same amount of lost damage over time).

You're right. People just tend to have negativity bias.

The less data you have, the more it will swing (sorry, bad pun) one way or the other.

You need a really large data set to show people that hits and misses wind up being the same.

This whole dual wield vs. 2HB thing is tough to look at without a vacuum to test in.

[Troxx]

Originally Posted by kjs86z [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

You're right. People just tend to have negativity bias.

The less data you have, the more it will swing (sorry, bad pun) one way or the other.

You need a really large data set to show people that hits and misses wind up being the same.

This whole dual wield vs. 2HB thing is tough to look at without a vacuum to test in.

This.

A more detailed discussion on this topic can be found here:

https://www.project1999.com/forums/s...d.php?t=333411

[Troxx]

I don’t have any super endgame weapons on my monk alt but if you look at ratios:

TStaff raw ratio is 42% better than epic and 33% better than SoM.

Abashi is 37% better than 16/19 and 37.4% better than 15/18.

Regarding these tiers of weaponry, for raw melee (not factoring procs though these should not be discounted), the relative performance differences should be similar. You could reasonably expect that comparisons for the one should be close to the other.

It’s not perfect, but it’s a starting point. Removing the chaos of a raid environment from the comparison should be useful but I’ll be the first to admit that if in fight after fight, raid after raid, and mob after mob one setup always beats the other then that’s just the way it is. This requires honesty and consistency posting every single parse (the good/bad/ugly/flattering/notflattering). Single parses are just the starting point, but at least we have that.

I’ll work on gathering more data with the weapons I’ve got. Differences in ratio 2h vs DW are very similar ... so maybe it will help.

[Bardp1999]

Everything I have heard is the "2h bonus" is lack luster at best but I suppose time will tell (if anyone is actually left on Blue in 2 months)

[Troxx]

Originally Posted by Bardp1999 [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Everything I have heard is the "2h bonus" is lack luster at best but I suppose time will tell (if anyone is actually left on Blue in 2 months)

Everything I’ve experienced and parsed on my 60 warrior, paladin, and monk since the patch is the opposite of what you’ve heard.

The paladin in particular with his shitty knight attack values and tendency to hit lower rather than higher saw a massive increase (percentage wise at least) in his damage with the damage bonus going from 11-12 per hit to 40 per hit with a 46 delay weapon.

[Zemus]

Originally Posted by Troxx [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

It’s not perfect, but it’s a starting point. Removing the chaos of a raid environment from the comparison should be useful but I’ll be the first to admit that if in fight after fight, raid after raid, and mob after mob one setup always beats the other then that’s just the way it is. This requires honesty and consistency posting every single parse (the good/bad/ugly/flattering/notflattering). Single parses are just the starting point, but at least we have that.

Did someone say Vindi?!?

[aaezil]

Originally Posted by kjs86z [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

You're right. People just tend to have negativity bias.

The less data you have, the more it will swing (sorry, bad pun) one way or the other.

You need a really large data set to show people that hits and misses wind up being the same.

This whole dual wield vs. 2HB thing is tough to look at without a vacuum to test in.

The thing is most fights outside of a select few raid fights arent long. So the swingyness in dps of a 2hander will matter if you are just killing a single mob or just killing somewhere for 15 mins or something. Of course if you were killing stuff all night the swingyness would even out towards an average dps.

[skorge]

Why not find a mob that spawns at the same level and does not buff and run the numbers? Kill said mob 100 x. Look at the numbers.

All these parses don't matter if the mobs aren't exactly the same.

Someone has to take one for the team to really do this right.