SK Troll/Ogre INT or STA starting stat debate. Confused :(

[Xruptor]

So after a few days of watching me play Everquest on the Green server, two of my buddies want to join and play as well. We all decided to make new toons and just level up together. I'm probably going to go Cleric and one other buddy will be a Caster/Melee. The one I'm having an issue with is my buddy that wants to play a Shadow Knight.

I explained to him the Shadow Knight and he was intrigued and wanted to play one. So he asked me to lookup how he could startup his character. I offered to research that for him and thus this is where my headache all started.

After much research on google, wiki, forums, blogs, etc... the only thing I could tell him. "I have no idea!".

So if you put aside the 5 AGI required for Ogre to get 75. The Iksar or go home speech. The hybrid vs race penalty discussion. The front FSI vs Troll Regen speech.


This is pretty much what I've put together.

• You have people saying go all STAMINA. Int is easy to cap later with gear like skyfire or what not. Stamina isn't easy to cap and honestly having more int isn't going to make a difference. You want to have MORE health. You will regret it later, especially while leveling!
• Then you have the people saying, go all INTELLECT because INT is harder to get later. Stamina you will max out with gear. You want to have more mana to get life taps off and honestly more STAMINA will be negligible later with heals and buffs. The stats say 180hp is going to do much but 200 more mana will. Etc.. etc..
• NO No NO Don't go Full STA and INT, instead go like 10 INTELLECT and 10 STAMINA. Balance it out! Because you will regret dumping it all in one stat later.
• Don't do full STR, INT, or STA! You want to balance it out between STA and AGI. More health and higher chance to dodge!
• Don't put anything in STR and just distribute between STA, INT, AGI

It's so convoluted and contradicting all over the place. Especially folks whom say the stuff found on the following wiki is outdated and you shouldn't follow it.
https://wiki.project1999.com/Shadow_Knight
There seems to be outdated and misinformation everywhere, with folks claiming this and that is outdated.

I believe he wants to go with Troll SK (But I honestly have to ask him again). He is aware of the FSI for Ogre after I explained it to him. He just doesn't like the Ogre that much compared to Troll. We are aware he will level slower but we don't care. We don't mind helping him grind it out. Though he will consider playing Ogre if valid reasons are given.

I just don't know what to tell him at this point. You have people giving opinions all over the place and it's just so confusing. He doesn't want to gimp his character and there will be times we won't be around that he wants to solo or what not to catch up.

Any help or advice would be great.

[Danth]

It should give you confidence knowing you aren't going to break your character no matter which path you choose. People have done all of those things and succeeded. Personally I'm a proponent on INT on Ogre/Troll.

Danth

[Invalid_Bard]

Ogre is awesome due to their high str/sta from the get go. Same with trolls, they just have a little less. Going full int won't hurt at all. By the time the servers life span is over capping str/sta will be easily done. A lot of SK items down the road have a lot of int and more mana never hurt any hybrod.

[Brut]

5agi rest Dex is what em goes with.
Str/Sta get capped easily with later expansion gear, and shm buff you absolutely cap them.

Int is alternative, but imo it's not that necessary. You might want it if you solo a lot, but, why would you roll an SK instead of a necro or something then. Disease Cloud costs 10mana. There's no huge need for a large mana pool.

[Hroth]

Stamina really is not that important for leveling.You really can't go wrong as long as have 75+ agi and don't dump any points into cha or wis. Strength is a strong stat for leveling as it lets you carry more loot and makes you hit for max more often. I personally split mine as a troll across str and int.

In regards to race, go with whatever is more visually pleasing. EQ is a long game, and even if you play in first person you'll still end up looking at your character a lot. FSI may save your life a couple times on the way to 50, but so will the increased regen of a troll. Heck the size of DE will probably save a couple lives on the way to 50 as well due to fatties getting stuck in a door while goblins/frogs/kobolds/skeletons beat on their ass.

Troll SK will level slower, but if you're all grouping together regularly you can help him keep up.

[Xruptor]

Hmm then it seems it's leaning towards the full INT department. I have spoken with a few people in game and some have said full STA. One person regretted going full INT. I haven't come across anyone whom regretted going full STA though. One guy did full INT and said it was worth it for the extra spell casts and that STA wasn't much of an issue. So I suppose it works either way. I don't see what having extra INT would hurt. So maybe my friend should do that.

He also decided to stick with Troll for the SK. So there's that. He prefers the regen in the long run.

[Danth]

Having high innate stamina is nice during the old world and Kunark periods where gear/buffs to cap it are in short supply. Even in full raid buffs an Ogre during this period will often have nearly a 10% total health advantage over something like a Dark Elf. It's not enough to render the Dark Elf unable to do his job, but it's enough that the player should be aware of it. Later on, after Velious opens, it's not such an issue. My Human SK on "Blue" with zero points in stamina (80 base) and only mid-range equipment can reach 235 if he wants to and would cap it if I cared enough to buy a few more pieces of stamina gear. Most of an Ogre's benefit will be wasted by that point. Countering the importance of health to some extent is that Shadow Knights are not usually used as raid main tanks on P1999 and that's where the high health matters most. All tank types have enough innate health to tank any level-appropriate group content.

High intelligence is nice mostly for Shadow Knights who solo a lot. It sucks having to feign out of a difficult encounter because of running out of mana. In normal groups it's generally not an important stat--mana regen is by FAR the more limiting problem. There are some niche situations that can strain a mana bar as well (such as having to feign a great many times in rapid succession) but these situations are relatively few and far between.

Dexterity is a niche choice since there aren't really all that many Shadow Knight weapons with good special effects, but the few there are tend to be REALLY good--most particularly (but not only) the epic. Indeed, when wielding the epic DEX practically becomes the Shadow Knight's most important stat. It may be worth a look if you know you'll be obtaining one of these types of weapons. I'm not enough of a fan of "vampiric embrace"--by itself--to recommend DEX solely for that spell's benefit. It's a nice spell, but not THAT nice.

You want 75 base agility minimum. This effects Ogres and Erudites. You can live without it, but there's no good reason to do so.

When it comes to the large races, as I said before you can't really "break" one. All of these various allocations have been used to great success by various players.

Danth

[Gatorsmash]

Originally Posted by Brut [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

5agi rest Dex is what em goes with.
Str/Sta get capped easily with later expansion gear, and shm buff you absolutely cap them.

Int is alternative, but imo it's not that necessary. You might want it if you solo a lot, but, why would you roll an SK instead of a necro or something then. Disease Cloud costs 10mana. There's no huge need for a large mana pool.

^ this right here.

There is zip dex on SK gear, and later on in the levels mana does become a problem for larger race non-raiding players, but to this day I clearly remember dex being a problem because it's so low.

[Xruptor]

Thanks all. My friend created his character using your advice/opinions and he is happy with it. We shall see how things go. Hopefully he has fun with it. We are going to be an oddball group. DE Cleric, DE Necro, Troll SK.

[Crede]

Originally Posted by Xruptor [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Thanks all. My friend created his character using your advice/opinions and he is happy with it. We shall see how things go. Hopefully he has fun with it. We are going to be an oddball group. DE Cleric, DE Necro, Troll SK.

Solid choice, but if necro isn't sold then switch to an Enc and you have arguably the best trio in the game. SK can be swapped out for a monk but I prefer the SK for snap aggro to give the enc a bit more flexibility to avoid pulling aggro and helping out in those oh shit moments.